2148f4 No.593547
Anyone ever use a club or make one? I guess you could lump batons in here too. How did you make your club? And if you didn’t make it, what club do you use?
I’m thinking about maybe getting a shillelagh, but I’d like to get something more wieldly, any club recommendations? I think for home defense or a fight against niggers in the bad part of town, a club would be a great weapon, especially if you’re dumb enough to look for a fight.
28a6d5 No.593555
You gotta be a fuckin' idiot to use a club. Ever hear that humans are 75% water? Go beat a puddle of water with a club, see what happens asshole
2148f4 No.593560
I forgot to ask in the OP, what improvised blunt objects could you use as a club, mace or street fighting implement?
2148f4 No.593561
>>593555
I’ll use a blow dryer, then.
28a6d5 No.593569
A club would be great in an area like London where fucking butter knives are illegal (for whites) but, and I speak with many nightly walks in the ghettos of Tennessee as experience, a good knife or a tomahawk will suit you alot better than any sort of club cause they have that initial scare factor that a blunt instrument simply can't deliver. Even the dumbest nogs'll think "oh shit, I could fucking die here" upon seeing a bigass tomahawk, but a club everybody just half-assedly assumes can only hurt and not kill, not true obviously but, the best way to protect yourself is to avoid fighting in the first place so of course you're gonna want that initial scare-factor.
This is all assuming said nog doesn't have a gun of course. Give a nog the shittiest 50$ hi-point you can find and he'll think himself invincible.
2148f4 No.593580
>>593569
Training isn’t bad, but I was thinking a blunt object (not simply any club, which I didn’t put in the OP) that basically requires no training, just common sense and power.
2f017e No.593581
I use a mace to dispatch opossums. Not sure if that counts for this.
2f017e No.593592
OP do you want to kill the person you are hitting with the bludgeon? Because that makes a big difference in the type of bludgeon you would want to use.
2f017e No.593601
OP I own and use clubs and maces. To give you a good answer I would need to know if you plan to kill the person or animal, and if you plan to carry this object in public? also this may not be useful but will the person be wearing armor of like really heavy coats or something?
2148f4 No.593607
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>593592
>>593601
Say I was in a Gangs of New York style street fight, I’d want something that’s light but powerful enough to knock some asshole on his back with one hit, and maybe kill if I hit them with retard strength or repeatedly.
Vid related is an extreme example
2f017e No.593613
>>593607
Well you are right in thinking in you would want it to be light and easy to swing. With a mace you really should be aiming for the man's head. From all my reading like all one handed maces from any where in the world are just around two feet in length.
2f017e No.593616
The head of the mace should be made of steel and have "spikes" or knobs on the end. All the weight of the mace should be at the head of the mace. The head does not need to weight that much to kill. I find one pound to be a good weight. This is what you should be looking for imo
2f017e No.593617
Flange maces were made for plate armor so would only be helpful if the guy was wearing a super think coat of something.
2f017e No.593619
This shape of mace head was used around the 11th century against chain mail. It is the best shape imo as it will hit a target wit a spike no mater the angle or side you strike them with. It is what I use to club opossums.
2f017e No.593620
2f017e No.593625
I like using maces as they are just fancy killing clubs. I mean when in real life would you have or be near a sword? But if you are used to fighting with say a mace you can always pick up a piece of wood and have some idea what you are doing.
2f017e No.593628
Bronze heads are a little heaver but a bit softer than steel
2f017e No.593630
>>593607
The mace on the left would be what I would choose for a "Gangs of New York style street fight"
000000 No.593631
>>593569
>A club would be great in an area like London where fucking butter knives are illegal
You really think that if you bashed someone's head in with a club, the courts wouldn't find you guilty of assault with deadly weapon? Like, they'd just shrug and say "well the rules don't say club so he's got us there lads"?
2f017e No.593632
This picture shows a lot of different types of mace heads side by side
2f017e No.593637
>>593631
In case OP lives in the UK I will say this again. A metal mace will kill someone if you hit them with it. But I live in America so its fine.
599b36 No.593638
Coin cosh by Greenmanleather [dot] ca
German trench club, WWI
35d6c0 No.593641
In (current year) all clubs are for baton purposes, really. For those grey areas between empty hand and deadly force. A nigger-be-good stick. Perhaps don't neglect the flexible stuff - they genuinely respect the sjambok, and there is zero hesitation in using it. I'd say much less than throwing a punch.
ffeed6 No.593645
>Be Baltimore police department in 1987
>Decide that billy clubs are just breaking too much when you powder people's bones
>Adopt fucking shaved table legs as your nightstick
aa0f2e No.593655
>>593547
Anon I recommend you getting a high quality fishing bat. They are not really expensive.
2f017e No.593657
>>593655
This mace head cost around $25
aa0f2e No.593658
2f017e No.593659
>>593658
http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=MHW1110&name=12th+%2D14th+Century+Mace+Head+ this site has them every four months or so and sells out really fast. I ordered mine form the Netherlands. It is made with really hard steel, like what they make hammers with if i had to guess. You could bash just about anything with it and it would be undamaged. I own other maces that cost more and it is better than those. they sell it on a few weapon sites around the world. I think it is called the "Marshal Historical Norman Mace Head"
2f017e No.593660
2f017e No.593661
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlnwRT9w2l8 this video shows you how to attach it to a handle if you don't know how to.
4a457d No.593666
>>593616
>>593619
>>593630
>>593657
>>593659
Spiky and flanged maceheads were made to stop the hits from glancing off helmets and other plate armor.
Warhammers are a lot more versatile bludgeoning weapons.
2f017e No.593670
>>593666
True about the glancing blows, but I can tell that when you smack a opossum in the head it crushes in the head. I also tested a spiked mace on a butternut squash and a milk jug and it puts more of a hole in them than crushes them. Also warhammers only have one side to strike with, maces can hit on all sides of the head.
40dea3 No.593717
>>593670
A carpenter's hammer can cave skulls in. I've used one to dispatch injured/dying animals before. I used the hammer side of a hatchet the other day and it didn't just kill, it tore a big fucking chunk out of the skull. I got blinded from the blood spraying in my face and had blood spatter all over me, with the exception of my jocks, socks and soles of my boots. The extra weight on the head seems to increase lethality exponentially, especially when the impact is focused on a small point. I'll be sticking with the hammer from now on. Heavy heads are far too messy.
2f017e No.593751
>>593717
Your post is making me think I made the right choice going with mace instead of a mallet or war hammer (I thought about using both) I have never been sprayed yet I have killed everything with one blow. I have killed over a dozen opossums with zero problems, hell I hit one so hard once his skull went flat like Wile E. Coyote. Again this is the mace type I used, light enough that it is easy to wield but heavy enough it kills. I thought about using a hammer like this but the weight made it to hard to swing repeatedly. Plus it was too short.
2f017e No.593752
>>593666
Also to warhammer guy these are stone mace heads from Central America where as far as I know they never had plate armor. So that comment about glancing blows was kind of pointless (yes that was a pun).
da6be6 No.593758
>>593666
they are to focus the impact on a smaller point my dude.
c68985 No.593761
>>593751
Why are you clubbing opossums?
2f017e No.593762
>>593761
Because my neighbor feels the need to throw birdseed everywhere which brings rats. So I set out traps which also catch opossums and skunks (mostly opossums). Shooting them will piss everyone off. So I thought to myself how often do you have a reason to use a medieval close combat weapon? So I ordered a mace. I was using a tomahawk before but I had to resharpen it every time because it went through the damn things flesh and bone right into the dirt. So I now use a mace.
cf8979 No.593763
>>593617
You don't think they would work just fine on an unarmored person too?
2f017e No.593765
>>593763
They would work great on an unarmored person. But I would tell you use a small battle axe for an unarmored person. A flanged mace is like a can opener on a stick used in the 13th century to fight people in full plate armor. A flanged mace head is like having 6 dull axe heads on the end of your stick. They were made to bash cunts wearing a soup can over there body not flesh.
40dea3 No.593777
>>593751
I had a roo tangled up on the back fence. They tend to go under, but once they get to a certain size, or if they're in a hurry, they'll jump over. Only they tend not to see the top wires or misjudge their height, because they fuck up their clearance all the time. Normally that just spoils their landing, they pick themselves up and continue on their way. The one in question had got it's foot caught on the top wire and was tangled up badly. By the time I found it it was on it's way out and bull ants were crawling all over it. It had either torn it's leg half off trying to get free, or tried to chew it off. So I was putting it out of it's misery. Normally I just give them a solid whack on the back of the head and that's it. All I had in the truck the other day was a hatchet. So I pulled it off the fence and it immediately started twitching, probably due to the change in blood supply after hanging upside down for half a day. Foot on the neck to hold it still and put it down with one quick shot, only the extra weight of the head pushed the hammer side right through the skull, resulting in blood spraying everywhere. I got blood splatter all over me due to leaning over it, but I imagine something similar could happen in a 'realistic melee' scenario.
2f017e No.593781
>>593777
Yeah that is why I brought the opossums. I am guessing that most people will never have used a real weapon in a real way before. It takes a lot less to kill something that people seem to think. My friend was surprised when he saw how small my mace head was. It is 3 inches long with the spike part being only 2 inches. It is modeled after some real one that was dug up in somewhere in England.
2f017e No.593782
27698f No.593793
>>593752
>El Monstruo Americano thinks blunt weapons are useful to hit anything other than the head.
>Thinks Injuns didn't know about helmets
Reminder that your education is literally designed to make nogs feel clever.
2f017e No.593800
>>593793
As I went to an American school would I be mistaken in thinking that Hungarians where ruled be the commies of the Soviet Union?
cc7c90 No.593803
>>593800
> that Hungarians where ruled be the commies of the Soviet Union?
what?
2f017e No.593805
27698f No.593837
>ITT homicidal psychopaths discuss their favourite animal abuse methods
>>593751
Commercially available tools make very unwieldy weapons.
My attempt was stuffing a falling axe handle into a small hatchet head to make an almost Dane-axe, but it was still on the clumsy end.
>>593670
Unless you are tenderizing meat, that doesn't matter much. They are meant to bite into hard targets, not soft ones.
Even so, you can't really strike hard from too many directions, and a hammer is also useful at hooking and parrying.
On a sidenote, does anyone know how the kanabo were supposed to be used? Was it just a reinforced quarterstaff? Because the truncheon-like ones look ridiculously unwieldy for a weapon.
33d61e No.593838
>>593793
>americans should learn spic history
How about no
2f017e No.593846
>>593837
Have you ever hit a soft target with a mace or war hammer? The points, spikes or nubs help concentrate the force to help break both bone and flesh. If you hit a man in the head with a mace or war hammer it puts a hole in the skull. I am really starting to think you are talking out your ass. Because even the "roo" smacker told you it punched a hole in the things head and he was covered in blood because of it. All I am trying to do is give OP the best club to do what ever the hell he plans to do with it. This is the type of thing that a mace does to someones face, It kills them.
2f017e No.593848
I have been looking for a round mace head like in these pics. Does anyone know where I can buy one?
40dea3 No.593849
>>593837
All the demonstration's I've seen of tetsubo and kanabo are using them like a staff or two handed club. The studs have a habit of coming loose, especially in dense wood like oak. Soaking it will tighten it up slightly, but nowhere near as much as a softer wood. If you want an iron club, then just get yourself a light bar for weightlifting.
>animal abuse
I'm pretty soft hearted. I only bash animals because I feel guilty about leaving them to die slowly. I can't even skin a rabbit without psyching myself up first. If they weren't so delicious, I wouldn't hunt them at all.
40dea3 No.593851
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>593850
In terms of an improvised bashing stick, that's pretty good. I think I'd prefer a bat or something with reach for a mobile target.
27698f No.593870
>>593846
>skulls are soft targets
I forgot it's summer break again.
b9e050 No.593889
>>593853
Is this the warrior instinct manifest in modern man? Truly, it must be a sight to behold a /k/ommando in his natural habitat.
27698f No.593956
>>593853
Apparently Oceanian hardwood warclubs looked more like wooden falchions than bats.
I wonder if this is a throwback to using actual oars as improvised weapons I know Musashi used one in a duel, an attempt to make an axe or sword in absence of metal or useable stone, or a genuine refinement of the design.
278c47 No.593964
>>593956
It's a refinement of the weapon in the same way as flanged maces developed from round ones. Focusing force over a smaller area while still retaining the same mass.
89f59b No.593995
>>593837
I'm sure these are also "meant to bite into hard targets"?
27698f No.594211
>>593964
>>593995
They also used helmets.
And even then, not everybody's skull is as soft as yours seem to be, packed with all that GMO-infused lard.
sage for OT
89f59b No.594222
>>594211
Mátyás Rákosi with his "Hungarian war hammer". Why do people like you come to boards like this when you clearly have no real idea what you are talking about? If you just read what the people here write you can be better informed when you save enough money in your piggy bank to buy a real weapon. OP even asked how to make one. You too could make one instead of shitting up this thread. I have an idea. Write your lame posts in what ever language they speak in Hungary instead of my native tongue so none of us have any idea what the hell you are talking about.
278c47 No.594239
>>594211
What about my post was so antagonistic to you that you needed to take a shit on me? All I did was say that the polynesian wooden clubs took that form because they were following the same evolution in design principles as european-style maces.
e5cc54 No.594298
>>594239
>>593964
>Focusing force over a smaller area
>on a weapon with no edge indexing
>focusing
Hungary is right. It's the summer break.
89f59b No.594304
>>594298
Do you understand how weapons work? if you hit someone in the head with something like a baseball bat the force will split the skin open. So if you out the same force on a small area it is MORE effective. Swords are not as sharp as say a kitchen knife as you are smacking something with it not cutting a tomato.
89f59b No.594305
>>594211
>>594298
Riddle me this, if you hit someone with a wooden ruler which part hurts more the EDGE of the ruler or the flat part?
40dea3 No.594332
>>594298
Do you sharpen bullets, anon?
8debe3 No.594334
>>593793
>El Monstruo Americano thinks blunt weapons are useful to hit anything other than the head.
Yeah, because you could fight through a shattered ribcage.
24f1a5 No.594337
>>594305
The flat part, but only because of the flexibility of the ruler causing a force-multiplying "slap."
If you scale it up to the size of a piece of lumber or something, the edge has far greater wounding capabilities.
6d5e47 No.594367
Is it illegal to modify your baton with a spiked cap?
ff8dee No.594373
>>594367
Well with America you have different rules in different states. In my state you can carry pretty much any thing as long as you don't plan to hurt someone with it. It is strange. If you walked around with a sword and the police stopped you and asked why you had a sword and you said "self defense" you could get into trouble, but if you said "to ward off dragons" you would be fine. Every one here just carries guns so not a lot of people are swinging battle axes at each other.
6d5e47 No.594374
>>594373
That's cool, but I would like to hear tales of less-free states.
ff8dee No.594379
>>594374
Yeah we try to keep the Californians from telling us anything so inviting them to speak is a bad idea.
ef8474 No.594400
>>593837
>On a sidenote, does anyone know how the kanabo were supposed to be used?
You grab the handle with both hands and the you beat a motherfucker with it.
fb69b8 No.594454
>>594400
Generally speaking you hit him once, maybe twice.
ef12c4 No.594533
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>594304
>>594305
>muh focusing force
They had these things called "axes" and "swords" literally for that purpose.
And that's because none of the blunt studs face in the direction of the strike.
Riddle me this: why the flying fuck are you sperging over what is a feature of cutlery in a thread about bludgeoning weapons? Mental retardation?
4c9279 No.594535
>>594533
Because it is a thread about clubs and maces. OP wanted a club, and the ones with knobs and spikes work BETTER. If I was "sperging out I would be calling people names like the retard from Hungary. I just want the people of /k/ killing with what works best. Also some pics to make us all right as that is what you feel the need to be. You do get in a battle a person would fight BOTH armored a unarmored opponents?
1cfa1f No.594542
>>594535
>Why the flying fuck are you sperging over what is a feature of cutlery in a thread about bludgeoning weapons?
<Because it is a thread about clubs and maces.
Mental retardation it is.
4c9279 No.594545
>>594542
This was OP question
>Anyone ever use a club or make one?
And I have both made and used so I can answer his question, about 15 years back I clubbed some one in the head. He went down and COULD NOT stand back up. Not everyone on this site is a 12 year old that has no life experience.
6db216 No.594571
>>594542
Maces are more efficient at focusing force than a sword, both in terms of strength needed, and in terms of materials costs.
4c9279 No.594574
>>594571
Yeah, a lot of maces used were made of cast bronze because all you need to make them was a mold and in the past iron was not easy to come by. Also like the crossbow it took little training to teach a solider to fight with a mace.
6db216 No.594575
>>594574
And you didn't need to train some blacksmith that could make several feet of flat steel both soft enough not to shatter and hard enough not to bend when it hit something hard.
2148f4 No.594731
What are some other blunt objects you could use in a particularly bloody street battle? I know BB bats are popular.
6d5e47 No.594734
>>594731
Oak wooden sword i.e. boken is best.
e84954 No.594735
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>593851
>>593853
Bats are terrible weapons.
One hand - mace (hammer from hardware store as substitute).
Two hands - Quarterstaff.
5f7aa0 No.594741
>>594735
I've been thinking recently - how good would a telescopic quarterstaff be as a self defense weapon nowadays?
3f20f3 No.594845
Vimeo embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>593547
You can build this "Murica" spiked club even after passing airport security, your flight crew and fellow passengers will certainly appreciate the ensuing lulz.
b1a0b1 No.594880
>>594731
You can try to make something like these.
b1a0b1 No.594882
>>594735
Hammers (and really any thing with a flat face like baseball bats) suck as weapons. Because they were not meant to be used as weapons. There is a reason war hammers almost never have a flat face, and that reason is not just to stop "glancing off plate armor".
ef8474 No.594888
>>594882
So does that mean that unadorned bats and hammers make good "less than lethal weapons"?
b1a0b1 No.594891
>>594888
Not really, a hammer will kill just not well. Bats are heavy so a good swing will kill too. I you are trying to kill get something go with metal with "spikes". If you just want to hurt someone (not sure why you would) use truncheon like the police use
5a61fc No.594896
>>594882
What shape should a hammer head be then?
b1a0b1 No.594899
>>594896
Anything other than flat and smooth really. Though if you were on horseback a smooth face could be a good idea I guess. I don't use war hammers because no one around here is walking around in full plat armor.
17c4bd No.594926
>>594211
This mongol rape baby is just jealous he has no gunz. Maybe its for the best, he seems like a hothead. HAHA laughing at you now. Nogunz.
ea1a54 No.595027
>>593837
That first pic reminded me of the breaching tools used by firemen to tear hinges of metal doors.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vLDCJk3wNk
I'd take a grinder to this to remove the bottom jaw. Maybe sharpen it.
>>593850
>>594880
There's a better variant of the adjustable dumbbell mace. Get a cheap full size barbell that comes in three pieces to have a 2 foot long piece with a little less than half of it being knurled and the rest threaded. It can be used with two hands with or without a weight at the end but is small and light enough to use one handed. If I can find the collars I'll take a picture.
ea1a54 No.595038
>>595027
Here it is on a standard picnic table.
5a61fc No.595229
>>594899
I see, you would think the best shape for a hammer head would then be just a singular point in the middle, as you then focus all the energy of your throw into one point, as opposed to what is in your pictures
5a61fc No.595230
>>595229
Note that this is for unarmored targets, I do not know what the ideal shape is for penetrating armor, why would you use multiple points?
69e965 No.595239
>>595229
Is this about what what you were thinking? Otherwise I am not understanding what you mean.
5a61fc No.595241
>>595239
I meant pic related kind of shape
b5bbc4 No.595243
>>595230
>>595229
I imagine having four points in a "square" spike configuration is supposed to allow for better distribution of force. If you have too much focus in one point, it defeats the whole purpose and you might as well use a spear/pickaxe/guisarme/etc. By distributing the weight into four points while keeping the center-of-mass at the middle of those four points, you create a weapon that will cause quite gruesome damage, especially to bone and other hard objects while smashing holes into flubbery soft objects. Basically the four points would rip and tear while the bludgeoning force of the impact would be at the center mass of those four points, causing a "shockwave" sort of effect to shatter bones damaged by the pointy part's impact. At least that's what basic physics courses would lead me to believe.
69e965 No.595245
>>595243
Someone understands, where were you days ago when that retard form Hungary was shitting up this thread? Thank you.
69e965 No.595246
>>595230
The points, spikes or nubs help concentrate the force to help break both bone and flesh. The spikes will cut into flesh. And will concentrate the force on a smaller area will help break bone underneath. As I was saying a mace will go through a mans skull yet a hammer will bounce off. If one wished to put the weapon deeper int a mans body that person should use an axe or say the spike on the back of a war hammer. A mace is a "Jack of all trades, master of none" kind of a weapon. I myself use BOTH axes and maces.
c722a1 No.595569
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>595243
>>595245
>>595246
>all that bullshit made-up physics
>whining about contrary facts "shitting up the thread"
Y'all niggers don't have the faintest clue what you are talking about.
>>595229
Those would be warpicks, not hammers.
69e965 No.595574
>>595569
I own maces and have killed with them. Hell I'm reading a 90 page thesis someone wrote to get his masters in medieval studies on maces for fun as we speak. I also I watched a video of that brit where his "toy" mace bent because it was never meant to be used in real combat. You are right about the horse-men's picks. Here have some pics of picks as a consolation prize
69e965 No.595583
>>595569
And as I have stated I also use axes, but axe heads have so much god damn force behind them that they cut all the way through flesh and bone of whatever I am striking that if I were to miss I would damage all of the meat on the animal. So I USE a MACE and it works perfect. One blow to the head and it goes into death throes. Not all of us play make believe. I don't use swords as there is not any reason is real life where I would use a sword over the gun and knife I carry. Also functional swords cost about as much as a handgun so I see it as a waste of money. See pics for how I am living life, you do what you want but I love my maces.
50cc1b No.595600
Tell me why this mace is good or bad:
http://kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=600652
69e965 No.595602
6db216 No.595605
>>595569
Can you stop posting british larpers they are invariably wrong about everything.
69e965 No.595628
>>595569
https://hooktube.com/watch?v=6NQqbgNSPTM Fake and gay. He even was forced to admit it was a "cheap" British toy made because they are not allowed to own real weapons. Bested by a water bottle.
>>595605
This guy gets it.
5889b1 No.595653
a nice fighting cane, or shillelagh would do the trick. with the fighting cane, you want the end to taper down to about the size of your little finger. do some research/training into fencing for thrust technique, and youre away. if you live in bongistan or surrounds, go to ireland and find a good bataireacht or boiscín instructor, should you pick the shillelagh.
69e965 No.595656
>>595653
Better yet, try a mace cane.
5889b1 No.595658
>>595656
eh, you really dont want small moving parts on something youre going to be smashing into a hard target like a skull. just make that ridge a little more pronounced though, and it would fuck your day right up, without being clearly a weapon.
69e965 No.595660
>>595658
I agree you you. But it is rare you have a reason to post a picture of a mace cane. It is pretty neat. Have you ever seen the crazy thing Henry the viii carried?
5889b1 No.595663
>>595660
holy shit, that thing is fucking savage. anyway, i had an idea for a home made mace, all you need is pocket change, a drill, and a dowel of sufficient width. then you can probably get away with carefully drilling out the slots required.
5889b1 No.595664
69e965 No.595666
>>595660
This maybe it, I think his had three gun barrels. It was said he would walk around at night with it betting the shit out of people that were up to no good.
69e965 No.595667
ef8474 No.595687
>>595660
>>595656
>>595666
10/10 Would hunt werewolves with.
02d958 No.595698
>>593547
Better to learn to use one rather than to just buy one outright. It'll take you a lot further and open your options considerably with just about anything you pick up, since you already have a framework and method in play. You could buy a Louisville Slugger and go for the Quest For Fire approach, sure, but the former will get you further.
>>593645
Can you blame them, though? It's fucking Baltimore. Shithole that it is, if I had to take a beat there I'd want something like that as my strong right arm.
92c593 No.595794
>>593645
>table legs as your nightstick
58f771 No.595985
>>594571
>blunt weapons are more efficient at focusing force than something with an edge and point
Idiot.
>>595574
I bet you are trained in gorilla warfare too.
>>595605
You have only heard of Lindybeige, I see.
>>595583
>spergs about blunt weapons focusing force
>disdains axes that actually focus force into an edge
Sounds legit
>>595628
Too bad he explicitly mentions in the vid you apparently didn't even watch, that actual flanged maces in the museum are even more thick and blunt, and his wallhanger was made by mall ninja retards like you.
But no, keep clinging onto the illusion that an imageboard-dwelling weeb's ignorance is just as good as an actual HEMA instructor's knowledge. Because self-esteem.
7e0be2 No.595991
>>595985
I use axes and maces, I don't like swords. And I own a real flange mace. But as I have said it is more or less a blunt six sided axe, So I just use one of my axes. And how the hell am I a mall ninja? I really use them. Not just talk about them. Did you even read what I wrote?
67c2c8 No.596006
>>594571
>blunt object with an effective striking area of between 1 to 4 centimetres, maybe more
>more effective than a sharpened edge with much less than a centimetre of effective striking area, even over six inches of blade that is likely to be in contact with your target
>even ignoring increased mechanical efficiency through a curved blade
Maces are good for breaking heads and joints through armour. They arent all that great against soft targets like the belly or mid thigh unless you have a spiked mace, or really smash it into them. Swords however, are very versatile weapons, that are good against soft targets, pretty good against joints, and depending on type, can even be reasonably effective against harder areas. In addition to the fact that swords dont need to even be swung to do damage, you can be right on top of someone with the sword in between you and just start sawing it back and forth, and still fuck his day up. In this day and age, very few people wear any armour at all, let alone hard armour, like loricated plate, or jack of plates. Realistically, outside of a gun, a sword is easily the best option for personal self defense, ignoring legality and levels of training and whatnot. Theres a reason why swords were in such wide use over such a long period of history as both personal protection and as a battlefield sidearm. But as the op asked for maces and clubs, thats what weve been providing. Not because its more effective, but because its easier to make an excuse for if effective self defense isnt all that legal in your country.
7e0be2 No.596010
>>596006
>But as the op asked for maces and clubs, thats what weve been providing.
I keep saying that and they don't seem to get this is a thread about clubs. As I stated I use axes AND maces. I think axes are better weapons than a mace (I just don't like swords but I have stated that). But I said against the ferocious monster know as Didelphis virginiana I think my mace is better suited. Good armor makes swords almost useless. That is why we have maces and war hammers and things like them. People carried MORE than one weapon. Note that these two have a sword PLUS a mace or axe. I'm not sure what answer these people that are butt mad are looking for. As you said "Maces are good for" not the only weapon should be maces and swords are useless.
67c2c8 No.596022
>>596010
They are also in full battle gear. Some cunt walking around by himself isnt going to want more weight to carry.
064ea6 No.596023
>>595794
Aussies would like to have that!
6db216 No.596076
>>596006
>>595985
A sword is basically thousands of little hammers, most of which are useless.
A hammer is one big mass, which is more efficiently accelerated into a centripetal motion, and deposits energy more efficiently.
It's more efficient you're not wasting energy on maneuvering a hammer, a guy swinging a hammer for a half hour is going to be far better condition than a guy swinging a sword of equivalent length for half an hour. Most battles were won not through who was the better warrior, but who had the least tired people at the end to finish the other side off, or give chase after a rout.
ignore the piece of shit fanatsy sword it was the first image in bing
6db216 No.596077
>>595985
>>596006
Oh, also, maces aren't blunt. Not sure why both of you opted to use the exact same terms.
>blunt weapons are more effici
>blunt object with an effectiv
You almost even got me doing it.
A mace, axe or hammer can all have sharpened parts that focus force. In fact it's a shitty mace that doesn't have a focused part.
If you've ever seen any of these weapons being used against a sword, you would notice how much faster they are, and better at dealing damage.
49bc26 No.596097
>>596076
>>596077
Is this new mace fag?
A sword is lighter, has better range, and can thrust and slash, is better balanced and not top heavy.
There's a reason hammer and mace are specialized weapons and not common issued.
b5bbc4 No.596103
>>596097
A billhook is lighter, has better range, can thrust, slash, and hook into enemies to pull them off their horses, and is better balanced to focus like a speer.
There's a reason swords are specialized weapons and not common issued to peasants.
6db216 No.596104
>>596097
>lighter
Wrong. A sword is 100% metal, a hammer, mace or axe is 10% metal and the rest wood. Way lighter.
>has better range
Wrong. Hammers, maxes and axes can increase their range arbitrarily, leading to things like poleaxes which are 2m long and still lighter than the average sword of the time.
>can thrust and slash
Image related.
>better balanced
This matters for fencing, when two unarmored people are facing off. This situation is hard to find outside of city fighting…. it doesn't matter very much in the kind of war practiced during the period, when you're trying to use minimal energy to focus maximal force against armored enemies or their shields.
>not top heavy
This is a drawback, not a positive. The better balance means you're moving twice the mass for half the result. Imagine a hammer which had two heads, perfectly balanced - now imagine gripping it in the middle and trying to swing it to deal damage to the enemy. That's a sword's level of efficiency.
>There's a reason hammer and mace are specialized weapons and not common issued.
???
Other way around bro, hammers, maces and axes were the routine weapons issued to 99% of infantry. A king could easily provide 10,000 hammers maces and axes to his troops which required low metal content and could be made by trainee blacksmiths and carpenters, whereas providing 10,000 swords which had high steel content and had to be made by master blacksmiths was quite a bit more pricey.
Swords rarely got issued outside of horseback (where the majority of the energy is provided by horse) and outside of very short swords (daggers really) in specific situations where two shield walls were too tightly interlocked for use of other weapons. It's a rich mans toy, not a real weapon.
92c593 No.596105
>>596076
Good luck trying to stab someone or cut their head off with a hammer.
92c593 No.596107
So were these things real or not?
6db216 No.596110
>>596107
Yeah they were, they belong to a whole family of weapons designed for somehow getting around or over a shield instead of bashing at it until the persons arm gets tired.
Kopis try to do that, although their main goal is to give a sword some of the advantages of an axe. There is also the thracian (people serbs mixed with) kopis called a "sica", which curves forward a lot more, and gives a lot better ability of getting behind a shield.
Later hammers and axes got so good at bashing or hooking a shield away that there's no point in engaging in these tricks.
ea1a54 No.596152
>>596076
There are swords that are maces though like the chinese sword breaker sword.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SykZHMsCIfU
http://www.mandarinmansion.com/chinese-sword-breaker-jian
You get to smash, stab and parry. Slicing is possible but very difficult similar to an estoc sword.
>>596107
This book provides tips on making your own and training with them.
eeb83c No.596177
How the hell is /k/ this uneducated about melee weapons? A sword was by no means uncommon, however its a more common weapon in areas and time periods where people did not have advanced armor. Its also rather difficult to manufacture in comparison to the best weapons of the ages, polearms. The most common, and most effective weapons through any time period or place are polearms and spears. Swords are much more effective against lightly armored or unarmed opponents. Even mail, which was common even back before the 11th century, prevents the majority of unspecialized blade shapes and fighting techniques from harming the user. The joints of European plate armor are not as suseptable as people think. You will notice that swords in europe became more and more thrust oriented, as armor technology advanced. In areas where plate did not develop, swords are much more cut oriented. Things like smallswords, rapiers and dueling swords became more common for self protection in the renaissance period where hardy armor was less common in day to day life, and duels were more common. The amount of people you would find using a sword that were not nobility or high up was very low. Most everybody on the battlefield used spears or polearms.
Now, where hammers and clubs come in. What was found to be much more effective against armored men was heavy thrusting ability and blunt impact. Halberds were among the epitome of medieval anti-armor weapons. Thats not to say they aren't very good against unarmored people as well. A mace that can reduce the effective protection of a helmet will absolutely crack a skull, break some ribs, and rupture some organs.
Also, those if you talking about weight and handling, are actually retarded. A sword and a mace will weigh pretty much the exact same, maybe 1 or 2 pounds. The difference in handling comes from how its weighted. A sword is weighted so the majority of the weight is next to the hand. This makes it so the upper third of the blade, the most effective portion to cut with, moves nimbly and quick. A hammer or club has all of the weight possible at the head of the weapon, for maximum kinetic force. Of course it handles differently.
Seriously, the arguments and "facts" being spouted here are some reddit/4chan tier shit.
eeb83c No.596182
>>596110
Morningstars and flails were wierd and dumb. They are dangerous to the user, because part of the handle you can't grip because of the ball and chain. You have to have the chain and handle at specific lengths so you dont take a finger off. And the kopis absolutely was not for getting around a shield, its curved for delivering more effective cuts same as a kukri. Its an amazing chopping shape, not a anti shield weapon. And I have no idea what your talking about with the last bit, there's always been ways of getting around shields, usually waiting for the enemy to fuck up.
eeb83c No.596183
>>596107
Yeah, those are real, but that on has way too long of a chain.
7e0be2 No.596184
>>596177
The problem is that one retard comes in and says something dumb and than we are forced to explain what they said was wrong in a few lines of text. The problem is we are talking about over 1,000 years of weapon and armor styles. So after we explain how what they said was wrong they say three more stupid things and again it would take pages of text to fully explain why these things are made and what they are used for. One stupid person can fuck it all up with one sentence. See how our Hungarian friend fucked it all up and started calling people names?
7e0be2 No.596189
>>596183
>>596182
Yeah chains had like three links at most and were used on pole arms to knock people off of horses
eeb83c No.596191
And, barbed wire/nails through a baseball bat is a meme. Its bad at both clubbing and cutting. Its more liable to get caught in someone's clothing than do any nonsuperficial damage in a fight. Get a length of wood/pipe and fit a plumbing adapter on the top with a cap on the end. 3/4 much to 1 1/4 inch is what's commonly available I think. Either fill the head or leave it hollow, weld it or lock tite it together, and you have a very sturdy mace/club. Add a handle for grip and your good. Similar to the image, but more like a mace shape than a hammer. Cheap and easy.
7e0be2 No.596195
>>596191
Yeah bats are not real weapons. It can never be said enough times. See pic for the type of person that thinks a bat is a weapon.
7a43af No.596199
I got bored one evening and busted out the welder and made this barbaric thing out of barbed wire, a timing gear, and a gear from a Harley gear box.
be9ab8 No.596213
>>596195
Yeah, I mean technically you could kill someone with a sharpened butter knife. Doesn't make it a good weapon. weighting and purpose of design make so much difference. Its a sporting implement, not a weapon for cracking skulls.
6db216 No.596234
>>596182
He asked if it was real… chigger you gotta stop jumping on people like this.
6db216 No.596240
>>596191
Buy a thin rolling pin, 85cm, they have good strength dowels. Then just attach an ice hammer head to it. Weapon done.
>>596213
Bats are tools for launching small balls very far, as part of bat and ball games.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bat-and-ball_games
Claiming they're weapons is as retarded as the old billiard ball in a sock joke it's really good for getting around shields!
41099b No.596252
novice blacksmith / welder here, some of the shit I've made
eeb83c No.596265
>>596234
I'm not jumping on people, leaf. I'm correcting information that some dumbshit is going to read and think that its factually correct. For some reason theres a bunch of people who have never done any kind of research into historical arms giving complete bullshit answers. And besides, my response directly to the guy was way more tame, that ones to the guy talking about morningstars with a chain long enough to reach around a shield.
92c593 No.596267
>>596252
I really like the second one.
eeb83c No.596269
>>596252
Those are actually pretty cool, my dude. Can you tell us about the metals you used? That ax actually look pretty cool, like a proto-bearded ax kinda look.
6d5e47 No.596279
>>596103
>Wrong. A sword is 100% metal, a hammer, mace or axe is 10% metal and the rest wood. Way lighter.
Except the sword blade is way fucking thinner, and the handle is made of wood as well.
>Wrong. Hammers, maxes and axes can increase their range arbitrarily, leading to things like poleaxes which are 2m long and still lighter than the average sword of the time.
You are confusing polearm with fucking mace and axe, fucker, I might as well say a sword is a dagger so it's still the lightest.
>This matters for fencing, when two unarmored people are facing off
Unless you are fucking robot, you are gonna waste more energy swinging and battling someone with a hammer/mace than with a sword.
>This is a drawback, not a positive. The better balance means you're moving twice the mass for half the result.
You are wasting more energy that way, that's the opposite of energy effiency, while you move very little with the sword, because its sharpness already kill.
>Other way around bro, hammers, maces and axes were the routine weapons issued to 99% of infantry.
Proof? Swords are mass-produced as weapons for soldiers.
I have yet to see evidence whole army armed with mace or hammer.
>It's a rich mans toy, not a real weapon.
God imagine the arrogance, every soldier have a goddamn sword, even your "maceman".
>>596104
Billhook is not a peasant's weapon also, a polearm soldier will always have a sword as sidearm.
6d5e47 No.596280
>>596177
>The amount of people you would find using a sword that were not nobility or high up was very low.
Can people stop with this actual bullshit?
Swords are common weapons in every army, every pikeman have a sword. Imagine that.
4de6cc No.596281
>>596280
Maybe a commie gook is not the best person to tell us about the weapons we used in are history?
6d5e47 No.596282
>>596281
Swords are used by vietnamese too, retard.
4de6cc No.596284
>>596282
Yet you are posting in a thread about CLUBS and MACES. Not whatever farm tools you backwater fishermen are swinging ate each other.
6d5e47 No.596285
>>596284
I find that funny because club is a fucking archaic weapon.
What are you a fucking caveman?
a533bd No.596286
>>596285
>What are you a fucking caveman?
No, he's a mutt who's salty that fishermen armed with shitty bamboo sticks beat his country 45 years ago.
4de6cc No.596288
>>596285
>>596286
I own and carry guns, as I am American. Its called freedom, you should get some. Its pretty great.
6d5e47 No.596289
Again, I have nothing against club and maces, they are fine anti-armor weapons.
But the misconception about sword needs to be addressed.
>>596288
Yeah, next time try to skin your fish with a gun too, retard.
a533bd No.596291
>>596288
>muh funs
We're supposed to be talking about maces you sperg.
4de6cc No.596292
>>596291
I own four maces AND GUNS. So much freedom I just don't know what to do with all of it.
4de6cc No.596294
>>596291
Can you even own a mace?
6d5e47 No.596297
>>596294
Holy shit, not even a hammer?
Goddamn.
4de6cc No.596298
>>596297
God only knows the death toll that a madman could cause with something so evil as a hammer.
eeb83c No.596304
>>596280
No, I will not you gigantic sperg. I will clarify, that the sword in general is a sidearm. Nobody in their right mind in a battle will use a sword first. There are plenty of cases where pike formations carried a Short sword, but as a sidearm. Also, imagine that, a PIKEMAN takes a PIKE into battle first, and his katsbalger second, I wonder why. Same deal with a dagger. Besides, a proper sword is not a cheap or easy thing to make. Theres a lot of skill that goes into a good one, and that means you need money.
Also, in places like Asia where swords remained a very prevelant weapon, armor developed way differently. There was a lot more room for swords to thrive. Look at Filipino weapons in comparison to Japanese and Chinese, even Vietnamese weapons. Swords were, again, in most cases a sidearm to a spear or polearm, and are much more cut oriented.
1a1542 No.596305
>>596304
This, though i might add an exception of 2 handed swords such as zweihanders, claymores and flamberges, but they are so huge they can be treated as polearms.
6d5e47 No.596306
>>596304
>No, I will not you gigantic sperg.
How am I a sperg for speaking the truth?
>I will clarify, that the sword in general is a sidearm.
A sidearm doesn't mean it's not used, sidearm means way fucking more in actual melee combat due to how fragile polearm are, and how polearm are useless in CQC.
>Nobody in their right mind in a battle will use a sword first.
Unless they are cavalry, or a sword-armed infantry, or a longsword-man, keep talking out of your ass.
>Also, imagine that, a PIKEMAN takes a PIKE into battle first, and his katsbalger second, I wonder why.
And why do you think the pikeman carries a sword? Why? Because of fashion? Are you retarded? They carry a sword because they are expected to use a sword, when the pike breaks, or the enemy comes too close.
>Besides, a proper sword is not a cheap or easy thing to make.
Yes they are, yes they are, they are fucking mass-produced for infantry and cavalry.
>>>596305
>This, though i might add an exception of 2 handed swords such as zweihanders, claymores and flamberges, but they are so huge they can be treated as polearms.
How in the fucking hell are those polearms? They are fucking greatswords, their techniques are all based on longsword techniques.
It seems internet hipsters hate swords so much their mind go into freeze mode when a sword is mentioned.
4de6cc No.596307
>>596306
>It seems internet hipsters hate swords so much their mind go into freeze mode when a sword is mentioned.
Or maybe you keep talking about swords in a thread about clubs and maces, start a sword thread if you want to go on about them
>Nobody in their right mind in a battle will use a sword first.Unless they are cavalry
OR maybe they used a mace as it was great for use on horseback
6d5e47 No.596308
>>596307
> Or maybe you keep talking about swords in a thread about clubs and maces, start a sword thread if you want to go on about them
People are saying wrong things, I need to address them.
>OR maybe they used a mace as it was great for use on horseback
Or that as well.
4de6cc No.596309
>>596308
I doubt you have ever handled a mace in you life. So maybe you should take the word of the people that are talking out of experience.
4de6cc No.596310
2374b5 No.596327
>>596306
>how fragile polearm are
if you are using a fucking lance to charge down troops or a pike to protect yourself against cavalry it might break, sure, but just because a halberd is made out of wood it does not mean anime swordsman will cut the halberd in half
>and how polearm are useless in CQC.
why won't this meme fucking die, unless you are talking about some hardcore medieval SWAT CQC in tight rooms polearms have no problems holding their own in close combat, I'm not sure if you realise, but unlike in vidya games long weapons can be gripped any way you like, if an opponent gets too close you just shorten your fucking grip and voila - you've just shortened your axe/sword/hammer on a stick
3f3da8 No.596333
>>596327
Yeah, sure m8, show me how you use a 3m pike in CQC, or a poleaxe in a small room.
I am waiting.
49bc26 No.596343
>>596327
And again, nobody says the swordsman is gonna cut the halberd in half, all I'm saying is that wood are weak and easily shatter in the battlefield.
That is why every soldiers who are worth their shit carry a sword in case their main weapon is broken or lost.
>>596309
A mace is a fucking club, I think even chimpanzee can fucking handle it.
I have a wooden sword though, so best of both world.
eeb83c No.596399
>>596306
>being this adamant that swords didn't become antiquated in battle
Listen, if were going to argue, then we have to remember the place and time period were talking about. Is this hypothetical battle in ancient Greece or a 15th century germanian province? How about even 15th century Japan? In pretty much all of Europe, the sword became an antiquated weapon in real battle because of armor advancements. It became a redundant, less powerful thrusting weapon. By this point in time, the sidearm of a pikeman would be a mace or hammer simply because a Shortsword, which is closer to a big knife in my opinion, wasn't an effective tool anymore.
>A sidearm doesn't mean it's not used, sidearm means way fucking more in actual melee combat due to how fragile polearm are, and how polearm are useless in CQC.
How in the hell are polearms fragile? Did you watch too many anime? Just because its wood doesn't mean some dickhead with longsword training can chop it in half. People didn't use weapons and armor that didn't work in historical fights. If a polearm was fragile, it wouldn't have been used. And the whole point is to keep the enemy at striking distance. If you fail at that, then you were supposed to have a sidearm and a dagger. If you can grab it in time. That sidearm changed depending where you were and when.
>Unless they are cavalry, or a sword-armed infantry, or a longsword-man, keep talking out of your ass.
Cavalry at what point? Why the hell would cavalry use a weapon with such short reach? All I think of are those sabers used by the cavalry of the later renaissance period until about the American civil war, when ARMOR bgan to fall out of fashion, and sabers became an effective tool again. You are insinuating that the a average infantryman used a sword, which is hard to Defend, because, in the 11th century? Sure! By the 15th, 16th century? When full plate was in much more common use? Nope. Swords were less effective at keeping you alive. Also, status symbol.
>>Also, imagine that, a PIKEMAN takes a PIKE into battle first, and his katsbalger second, I wonder why.
>And why do you think the pikeman carries a sword? Why? Because of fashion? Are you retarded? They carry a sword because they are expected to use a sword, when the pike breaks, or the enemy comes too close.
Sure, and what happens when the enemy was in full plate? Short swords didn't do dick, they started carrying clubbing weapons and such as well.
>How in the fucking hell are those polearms? They are fucking greatswords, their techniques are all based on longsword techniques.
Have you ever seen a HEMA fight with a greatsword? Techniques from longswording, because its shaped like a giant fucking longsword, applied to principles of polearms. Keep them at a distance, large sweeps, big movements, etc. The historical use was typically as infantry anti-pike weapons, very similar roles to what a polearm could do.
6e9120 No.596404
>>596333
Shorter spears exist and are damn good at what they do.
420288 No.596414
>>596298
>straight claw
Is that the shoulder thing that goes up?
49bc26 No.596454
>>596404
And do pikeman carry short spear as sidearm in battle? Lol nope, they carry a sword.
e5cde6 No.596456
Oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy I love these threads and I fucking love being a caveman. I plan on making an extending baton some time in the near future with some spring detents and square tubing.
49bc26 No.596457
>>596399
>Listen, if were going to argue, then we have to remember the place and time period were talking about. Is this hypothetical battle in ancient Greece or a 15th century germanian province? How about even 15th century Japan?
In every period starting from the Greek states civil war to the Napoleonic war, swords have been present.
>By this point in time, the sidearm of a pikeman would be a mace or hammer simply because a Shortsword, which is closer to a big knife in my opinion, wasn't an effective tool anymore.
And proof of this shit? I challenge you to provide proof that a pikeman carries a fucking mace or a hammer as sidearm as common issue lol.
>How in the hell are polearms fragile?
They are made of wood, and wood are easily broken upon impact such as cavalry charge.
>People didn't use weapons and armor that didn't work in historical fights. If a polearm was fragile, it wouldn't have been used.
Or people carry them, but also carry a sidearm, which is a sword, because they know they have to rely on the sword when the polearm breaks.
>Cavalry at what point? Why the hell would cavalry use a weapon with such short reach?
Cavalry at all point, the lance is fucking unusable after the charge, and especially if the lance is broken, the cavalry have to use the sword. And the sword still has better reach than a mace or hammer or axe (which are also used by cavalry).
>You are insinuating that the a average infantryman used a sword, which is hard to Defend, because, in the 11th century? Sure! By the 15th, 16th century? When full plate was in much more common use?
It's funny because that's exactly what happen, in the 15th and 16th century with munition plate and advanced smithing techniques, all soldiers be the pikeman, halberdier or musketeer carry a shortsword as sidearm, because they fucking work in CQC.
>Sure, and what happens when the enemy was in full plate?
There are techniques that are good against full plate that you can use with a sword, ironically a shortsword is pretty good against full plate because it's pretty much a long dagger.
>they started carrying clubbing weapons and such as well.
SOME sections carry club and mace, in particularly medieval knights, but they do it uniformly. When weapons become mass-produced, you will not see people carrying mace.
>Have you ever seen a HEMA fight with a greatsword?
Have you seen them?
>Techniques from longswording, because its shaped like a giant fucking longsword, applied to principles of polearms. Keep them at a distance, large sweeps, big movements, etc.
Nigger what the fuck are you talking about? So is a longsword a fucking polearm too because you do large sweep with it?
>The historical use was typically as infantry anti-pike weapons, very similar roles to what a polearm could do.
No, it's not fucking very similar roles to what a polearm could do, polearm is never known to be an anti-pike weapon, that's what a sword does, starting from the roman legionnaire vs the phalangites.
And again, why do you hate sword so much that you can spew retarded, unverified bullshit like this?
49bc26 No.596458
>>596404
I also find it funny that the polearm-fag will retort to muh short spear at every turns when it comes to CQC.
Short spear is good for CQC, but we are talking about the common-used polearms such as spear, pike, poleaxe, halberd, lance, these weapons are not good at CQC, which is why combatant carry two fucking weapons.
eeb83c No.596460
>>596457
I dont hate the sword, I just don't think I was a perfect weapon like you seem to. And I am trying to make counterpoints to the unmitigated bullshit YOU are spewing, claiming that some of the most effective and revered battlefield weapons of all time were god Damn fragile! Medieval battles were not nearly like the movie depictions with everyone and their grandmother out there swinging a sword! There were plenty swords on the battlefield, but farmer john the infantryman probably didnt have one. He probably had his family's axe, a spear and some mail.
And how the fuck is a regular sword an anti pike weapon? Do they just hack the points off? Seriously, god Damn dude. Go start a sword thread if you want to argue with autists about the use of swords in the Napoleonic wars.
49bc26 No.596463
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>596460
>I dont hate the sword, I just don't think I was a perfect weapon like you seem to.
Nobody says it's perfect, but it's versatile, that's why everybody uses it.
>YOU are spewing, claiming that some of the most effective and revered battlefield weapons of all time were god Damn fragile!
Because they fucking are, it's easy to break or lose a polearm in battle, that's why people carry multiple weapons instead of just one, polearm is also easily replaced.
And I can prove it, it's totally possible to chop the shaft off with a cutting sword. Very unlikely, but possible.
>Medieval battles were not nearly like the movie depictions with everyone and their grandmother out there swinging a sword!
Nobody said that.
>There were plenty swords on the battlefield, but farmer john the infantryman probably didnt have one. He probably had his family's axe, a spear and some mail.
Not every infantry is a fucking levied farmer, you have professional infantry since the fucking 14th century and before that you have men at arms.
>And how the fuck is a regular sword an anti pike weapon?
Study actual roman and pike and shot tactics, they exploit the gap when the phalanx is in disarray, move in and kill the phalangites when they are at their weakest, CQC.
49bc26 No.596464
>>596463
Also, sword are very common upon actual peasantry in the 15-16th centuries when they become civie weapons.
4de6cc No.596466
>>596460
>I have a wooden sword
He lives in a communist shit hole were you can't carry any weapon. He comes on thew board to play make believe. Keep that in mind when talking to him.
49bc26 No.596467
>>596466
Well, I have a shaft and a knife, so I can combine it and make le short spear, /k/'s favorite weapon.
Or with an axe, and get a Dane axe.
I have a machete as well.
4de6cc No.596469
>>596467
So no real weapons. Who could have guessed? I'm shocked. Oh wait I knew that because it was obvious from talking to you.
49bc26 No.596470
>>596469
Yeah, because a spear is not a real weapon.
I will remember that next time in argument.
4de6cc No.596471
>>596470
You don't own a real spear though. You sad little man.
49bc26 No.596472
>>596471
Oh but I do.
inb4 shaft + knife is not spear
4de6cc No.596474
He will post something like this. Calling it now
49bc26 No.596477
>>596474
I haven't took the time to make it yet, but that's a fucking polearm right there.
4de6cc No.596479
>>596477
You have no idea how hard I am laughing at you right now. Thank you for proving my point.
49bc26 No.596481
>>596479
I don't see why but carry on.
eeb83c No.596483
>>596474
Kek, for real. He should not ask if he considers it a weapon, but if his commie police force does.
Seriously though, if that's what his idea of a polearm is, no wonder he thinks they break.
4de6cc No.596484
>>596481
Yeah you don't seem to understand anything. That is our point. Keep playing make believe. It suits you.
49bc26 No.596487
>>596483
I have provided proof to the whole fragile polearm thing.
>>596484
Well, OK?
eeb83c No.596492
>>596487
Holy shit, that video is actual crap. And did he say what type of wood they were using? Because it looks like a broomhandle. I couldn't hear them for 75% of it. Also, look at that! You have to bind it and then whack it like a motherfucker to break a 3/4 inch broom handle. Of course if you trap it and remove the normal energy dispersal it can be broken. Unbound, theres no fucking chance. And I'm sure your an absolute expert in how polearms were developed to get around these shortcomings? Langets? Rivets? Anything? Again, your delusional to think that the single most common type of weapon in historical combat was in any way fragile. Guess what, swords broke too. In fact, it happened a lot. Its just way harder to do on purpose. Abuse any tool enough and it will break. There are a number of examples of knives that were originally swords that broke, and they didnt want to waste materials.
ca78c7 No.596510
>>596492
The longer polearm such as pike is even easier to break or lose due to how unwieldy they are, polearm is known for efficency, not durability.
And swords break, sure, but they are harder to break than polearm.
4de6cc No.596516
>>596510
How the hell would you know you no weapon having commie?
eeb83c No.596524
>>596510
Yes, a pike simply due to the increased length of the haft is going to have a much easier time breaking. Its just how wood is, when its a 20 foot long piece that you can still hold. However, polearms, in particular the later iterations, had something called langets; these are bands of metal that run down the shaft from the head of the weapon. Common in warhammers and in polearms, these reinforce the haft, and can be quite large. Now swords cannot cut it, and even if the wood splits its still perfectly usable. Not fragile.
4de6cc No.596529
>>596524
Ho Chi Minh is just going to tell you that you don't know what you are talking about. It is a waste of time explain to a commie that will never own a real weapon this info.
eeb83c No.596530
>>596529
Yeah, but maybe I will be able to help another anon, educate the willing, you know? Someone will find this in the catalogue, read it and might actually learn from my efforts.
6d5e47 No.596535
>>596524
Except that is not the pikeman is issued with, and that's why they carry swords with them.
You are using examples of reinforced polearms, except those are not the polearms that are commonly used by 90% of troops.
4de6cc No.596537
>>596530
I told you Ho Chi Minh would say something stupid.
>>596535
41099b No.596539
>>596269
The spikes on the black mace are stainless steel, the bars came from an old grill surface, I cut them to length, sharpened them on a bench grinder, heated and quenched them in oil, then epoxied them into the club which is a piece of ash firewood.
The ax is my most recent project, it started as a large carriage bolt that I cut the head off of, I flattened the whole piece, bent it on the horn of my anvil, then folded the socket around one side. lastly, I beveled the blade. I used a stick welder to add material and make it solid. I heated the blade to the shoulder and quenched in oil, then filed the surface clean. the handle is a one inch dowel I had lying around and I added the copper pipe cuff to help prevent the handle from splitting.
I started with the handle on the trench club, I lathed a piece of ash firewood round and cut in the grip lines, the metal cuff around the top was a piece of 1/4th inch wrought iron strapping. I bent it round then cut off the excess with an angle grinder, slid it over the handle, and hammered it tight. the top spike is extra from the black mace, I nailed a strip of old leather to the bottom for a lanyard, and stained the wood with homemade black walnut stain (walnut husks + water)
I make knives out of railroad spikes and 'trench daggers' out of rebar too, but those dont really fit the thread.
6d5e47 No.596540
>>596537
How is it stupid?
It is actual fact that pikeman are not issued reinforced pikes.
4de6cc No.596541
>>596540
You are taking about pikes in a thread about bludgeons you weaponless Marxists. Please make and post pics of your "spear" so we can laugh at you some more.
6d5e47 No.596543
>>596541
I fucking hate Marxist, but OK, as you please.
45f659 No.596752
>>596543
Starting to think the Gook Cheka shot him for speaking against Marxist-Leninist ideas. All's well that ends well, I guess.
e6a7ac No.597316
>>593547
So OP did ever make your club? Some ideas (not all of them good)
b12c45 No.597548
HookTube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>593547
This e-celeb made a video making an ebin two-handed flail.
Don't forget to like and subscribe!
0e755d No.597624
>>597548
The chain is too long and the staff is too short.
See posts above
>>596182
>>596107
>>596183
>>596189
eeb83c No.597655
>>597624
From what I can see, if he made the handle longer, reinforced it, and reduced the length of the chain he would have something. Abiding by the conventions of historical weapon design when making homemade weapons is a big deal, because those designs are created around the idea of being as effective as possible. Honestly, I think a regular club or conventional mace(round or knobbed, not just flanged) would work just as well if not better as a hand to hand weapon. No swinging dick to worry about getting to close to your head. They are pretty situational weapons.
eeb83c No.597658
>>597316
…. Is that a tin can with bolts running through it in number 4? How do you think that holds up? Also, I just realised I can post about the shitty club I made a while ago.
abfc7d No.597674
>>597658
Not long I'm guessing. It is filled with concrete.
5889b1 No.597689
heres half an idea, what about using the last foot, foot and a half of a star picket as a bar mace? shave it down on one end until you can fit a pipe over it for a handle, and sharpen the point and edges.
abfc7d No.597694
>>597689
You could try this, probably the best homemade mace I have seen.
eeb83c No.597700
>>597674
Wow, a tin can filled with sand quikrete. Thats astounding. It it a friction fit, with that nail acting as a peg you think? Either way that will hurt, but its longevity is… Questionable, for sure.
5889b1 No.597725
>>597694
ticks the boxes of being stupid cheap and easy enough to make that a 4 year old could do it. probably the best home made mace in this thread.
c9962a No.597726
>home made mace thread
>right after I misplaced mine somewhere
Fuck.
It was just a basic pipe, though, so, I guess it wasn't super fancy anyway.
a2b236 No.597730
>>597726
Well OP asked if people used clubs/maces. And if they were homemade how were they made. He wanted recommendations. Not sure if OP ever made up his mind, I would like to hear what he decided on. But if you find yours post it.
c9962a No.597736
>>597730
Will do. It was nothing particularily complex. A heavy pipe with a tape grip, a lanyard, and a screwed on head, which is just an adapter for a larger pipe.
008c2b No.598100
This could be a useful chart.
bb42d7 No.598123
>>598100
I get that jamming a baton up someone's ass would probably be severe, but in what situation could that be done both reliably and necessarily?
5c118e No.598155
>>598131
That would probably do it… and you just happened to have those…
6e6ae1 No.598161
>>596279
>sword handles are made of wood
<what is balance
I think spergook is confusing measuring tape with a sword, or something.
6d5e47 No.598163
>>598161
Sword handles are made of wood though.
That's why they are actually the weakest part of the sword and the most easily replaced.
79946d No.598165
>>598163
>>598161
They are both wood and metal. So no need to go on about this off topic thing in a thread about bludgeons.
278c47 No.598588
>>598579
Kind of looks like an unvarnished and smoothed shilleleigh. What's the wood?
051585 No.598598
>>598579
Head pattern looks like a frog/snake.
fc68ce No.598613
>>598588
>>598579
>>598598
Sorry I have no idea what wood was used to make that. It was a pic form a thread some years ago. All I can recall was he said it was for catfish, but that is not a secret as he wrote it on the club. I can tell you about my maces if you want. This is the mace I use to take out the evil opossums that tips over our garbage cans. The flange mace and the other yet un-hafted mace head I bought because I just wanted them I guess, or if the need for crusade arises.
77c4fc No.598628
>>594211
>thinks GMOs are inherently bad
Hungarian science education must be even shittier than America's
67442e No.598875
>>596294
Body armor is a prohibited weapon?
529f53 No.598887
>>598875
I recall a thread where it was said that slingshots were illegal in Australia so they were selling grading tools with the sling on it and you cut of the middle part which was a loophole. That is how sad these people are.
NSW: Slingshots are illegal in NSW and can't be sold (with exception for Pocket Shot Slingshot as it is not 'y' frame). ACT: Slingshots are currently available for sale, however you must be over 18yrs of age to purchase. VICTORIA: Commercially made complete slingshots are considered a prohibited weapon.
a1058c No.599227
>>593555
Yeah but all the watery bits are usually hidden under the bony bits.
>>593560
Depends on what you mean by "improvised" crowbars, pipe wrenches, tire irons, and hammers are all great clubs/maces, but I wouldn't call them "improvised" more like "re-purposed." Basically anything that's hard and heavy will work, if you're old/injured enough to warrant using a cane, do it. People underestimate how much damage a stick to the face can do.
If you want something a little jankier, just look at some of the shit that comes our of US prisons. Seriously, google "improvised club, US prison" and you'll find plenty
eeb83c No.599260
>>599227
I mean, they work, but a purpose built weapon, while more conspicuous, work even better.
bba47b No.599276
Do trench shovels count? Feldspaten, saperka, etc. Hand grenades and a shovel are the best cqb method. Prove me wrong. On that topic, is the cold steel shovel any good?
48d7e4 No.599280
>>599276
They are more axes than shovels, especially if their edges are sharpened.
>is the cold steel shovel any good
Not tactical enough, need rubber grip and picatinny rail attachment. Or you could go to a nearest hardware store and buy a normal shovel and put in on a shorter handle.
48d7e4 No.599281
eeb83c No.599283
>>599276
More of a funky axe, honestly.
Cold steel is not a brand I trust. They make decent knives from what I know, but beyond that I haven't bought their more esoteric stuff. I've seen reviews of things like cold steel swords that did not put the quality in a positive light, and I handled some of their machetes, not a fan. The shovel I wouldn't because that's a specialised item, and the wierder it gets the easier it is to fuck it up.
bba47b No.599288
>>599283
I'm gonna take the chance anyway, if it turns out to be trash I'm only out $20. I've never heard a bad thing about it, and I'd hardly consider a shovel a specialized item. I'm sure its easier to make than a sword. I'll go ahead and bite the bullet and tell streloks if it's worth it or not. I mostly want it so I can larp as a stoßtrupp. Onto clubs though. I'm probably gonna try and make a few trench clubs. I love the variety. I'm also looking at a model 38 smith and wesson. Not exactly WW1, but revolver/club/shovel combo is the coolest shit.
bba47b No.599290
>>599288
>model 38 smith and wesson
I mean 28.
7a4d68 No.599316
>>599288
I just ordered these. One was German"ish" if you care. It has no top spike and the knobs are not round. But is about as close as I have seen for sale. They should be here in 2-3 days if you have questions.
7a4d68 No.599319
>>599227
>>593560
All of those "improvised" tools suck as weapons though. Pipe wrenches are very heavy and the handle is way to thin to get a grip on. Tir4e irons handles are even thinner. Crowbars swing like shit and hammers are too short. That is because they were never meant to be weapons.
7a4d68 No.599320
>>599276
>>599288
Shovels were not designed to be used as weapons. But as nothing went how it was planned in the great war and people were forced to use what they were issued to defeat the enemy. They turned out to be ok weapons, but I don't see why a person would choose a shovel over say a tomahawk or something. also this is a fun video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOaEjJz-6jg
ad3331 No.599324
>crtl+f "rebar"
>one result about making knifes about of rebar
>not going clubbing with a standard piece of rebar, wrapping one end with cloth + duct tape
7a4d68 No.599325
>>599324
I clubbed a raccoon this morning with this mace if that makes you feel better >>598613
ac8079 No.599326
>>599276
>On that topic, is the cold steel shovel any good?
Its a high prize copy of a soviet shovel which is sold for cheap as military surplus all over europe.
ad3331 No.599331
>>599325
makes me feel a little better but rebar is the raiding man's club of choice
>hard as fuck
>strong enough to be used as reinforcement material
>relatively light weight
>can be salvaged by breaking shit
>won't deform easily
>can use to knock holes and punch strategic areas with the addition of a rounded tent stake cover to the handle end
look at it as a demolitions tool but fi it had to be used as a weapon there's no dropping of your sledge hammer to pick up your tool name here
you're ready to go from one swing bashing structural supports and punching fire holes to bashing raccoons and commies in another swing
ad3331 No.599332
>>599331
can also optionally cast different heads with molds from limestone, roman concrete, and plain old concrete without all the hassle of being stuck with a wooden stick left after it breaks
7a4d68 No.599347
>>599331
But the striking area is very small with rebar. That is why mace heads got larger as time went on. The Chinese used something like that for their "police" forces in the past, but it was not meant to kill. Maces have "heads" for a reason.
eeb83c No.599423
>>599347
Thats not quite correct, but I understand how you got to that conclusion. Rebar is not an optimal club because it is an equal weight throughout. Its balancing point is in the middle, not forward. A mace or club with a narrow striking surface, and the forward weighting of a traditional weapon is devastating, due to all the force being less spread out. The head of a mace is to increase the force being applied by having a hard striking surface and by placing all the weight as far forward as possible. And Rebar is not actually that good, to be honest. Its designed to reinforce buildings by providing a skeleton for concrete. It bends way, way before it breaks because its very soft steel. Its optimised to take energy, impacts and transference, and not transfer it to other parts of the building. It absorbs a ton of energy in a strike, instead of transferring as much as possible.
Its still a chunk of metal, but there are better designed chunks of metal.
7a4d68 No.599568
>>596543
>>596541
So are we ever going to see your "spear" you made?
7a4d68 No.599608
>>599423
I'm confused, did you think I ( >>599347 )
was saying rebar was a good idea? Because it is not. That is why I said the Chinese used them to NOT kill people.
45f762 No.600180
Does anyone on this board actually own any bludgeons? Be it clubs, maces or war-hammers etc? Also still waiting on the pics of the Vietcong spear. And did OP ever choose one?
115dfa No.600205
>>600180
Yeah, I have a homemade one. Also, I doubt he wants to incite the wrath of the commie police just to feel like he won an argument on the internet.
8bc33d No.600209
>>600205
what is it like? any pics? Well no one would dare cross him when they know he has such a mighty weapon as a knife tied to a stick.
a8fe21 No.600213
best i could make in 30 minutes
8bc33d No.600214
>>600213
I have to say that may be one of the gruesome looking weapons I have ever seen. What is it made out of? I looks like the spikes are from something but I can't tell what it is from.
115dfa No.600215
>>600209
Yeah, I've been meaning to post them but didn't until now. 3/4 iron pipe with endcaps and fittings. Two couplings, two 3/4 nipples and a end cap make up the head. Wrapped in electrical tape for grip and as a cheap anti rust measure. Weighs a fair amount, and while not balanced like I would like it to be, its still fairly top heavy. About 20 bucks in material because I bought it new. Locktite together and use locking pliers to wrench closed, its pretty sturdy. Would like to weld it together, but I don't have a welder.
a8fe21 No.600218
>600214
spikes from my field tiller
753905 No.600220
My other two maces came, I like the top one. It is a bit larger and heavier that my others. The second one down is 2 feet long and the handle is one inch in diamiter (for a size reference).The guy that I bought the top one from is selling another one on Ebay if any one cares. >>600218 Thank you for saying what is was made from, I would have drove me insane trying to guess where the parts came from.
753905 No.600228
>>600215
I thought about making a flange mace but I too don't have a welder. The ones that are soldered on seem to break off if struck too hard. I have read that real medieval flange maces used copper solder, which I have no idea how to do that.
115dfa No.600231
>>600228
Yeah, welding is a lot easier, in my experience. A used mig or even just a stick welder will do you just fine, and have potential applications in the future. Obviously the medieval techniques held up just fine, but I think modern welding technique and technology can make them even better.
a8fe21 No.600245
>>600222
final improved version with metal crossbeam pounded through and welded in
753905 No.600258
>>600231
>medieval techniques held up just fine.
That is not really true tough. There a lot of examples where flanges are broken off. That is why I use solid cast mace heads. >>600220
115dfa No.600269
>>600258
Well, use anything harshly enough and it will start to break down. They weren't fragile or anything, but they did break. They had to use inferior techniques just because thats what they had. I've said it before and I will say it again, historical peoples didn't use things that didn't work.
0fb5ac No.600288
>>600269
That's not necessarily true, plenty of historical people did shit that made no sense and didn't help, or even made things worse
>treating nausea or fevers by cutting veins open and letting "bad blood" drip out in Tudor England
>killing owls/cats/black dogs on sight because they were believed to be witches or malevolent supernatural beings in disguise all across the world
>crafting military strategies based on how the guts of a cow look like after being strewn about in Ancient Rome
>The invention of circumcision
095765 No.600289
>>600288
Thou doth seem to know much of witchcraft and pagan demonry. Thou may be in league with the Devil!
115dfa No.600293
>>600288
Those are some VERY good fucking points, however I refer to things that people rely on every day. Things like weapons, buildings, tools, etc. At the time, those things you talk about seemed perfectly reasonable. I genuinely believe they had a very good grasp on the physical, but at that time the esoteric; strategy, religion, philosophy, superstition, everything was an unknown, people were uneducated unless they were upper class, and many of the things we take for granted today that influence how we perceive the world were generations away. Plus, at the time of the Romans a lot of conventions in military practice were still being developed.
095765 No.600301
>>600293
No, people were pretty strange back in the day. These are all real mace heads
115dfa No.600302
>>600301
I have reservations about those actually being used in combat, because those look more like art/parade pieces than an actual weapons for ghe most part. But true, they were wierd then.
095765 No.600305
>>600301
The devil head maces were known to make a whistling noise when swung to scare the enemy in battle.
2148f4 No.602211
What’s a type of shillelagh/mace I could concealed carry in my coat? Maybe one that folds out? I need something that would be good for fighting south East Asians with machetes
2148f4 No.602212
>>602211
I’m talking handheld, good for close quarters perhaps. Maybe something like what Monk has in this scene:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WLKbcrC0krQ&t=105s
48d7e4 No.602219
>>602211
Maces greatly benefit from additional mass, so the smaller you go the more effective a bladed weapon will be. If you want one anyway, a collapsible baton like 1st pic in OP is the way to go, though it might be a bit too weak against a machete, as it takes quite a lot of effort to break bones with it. What would be great against even multiple of them is a quarterstaff. it's amazing all around weapon, just do not use it in a small room with low ceiling. Can also be disguised as a trekking stick if carried in pair, though it would be a bit short, pic related.
2148f4 No.602222
>>602219
That might be a good idea. I’m a fan of blunt weapons, as bladed weapons can get messy and can get you in further trouble. With stabbing someone, which is more lethal than slashing, your weapon is in their body. With a blunt object, you swing, knock them down, and hit the next guy.
af47bd No.602226
>>602222
>>602211
Are you trying to kill them or not trying to kill them? Really you would have to explain the context of what you are doing? Like are you just trying to murder someone, walk around with something that would kill someone but is in plain sight of say the police if they stop you or to defend yourself and not kill the attacker? These things make a big difference in the answer I would give. Also I would need to know why you are not using a gun?
48d7e4 No.602228
>>602222
Bladed weapons are better for fencing and are more mobile, as well as more deadly for the same amount of force applied, but blunt ones are easier to wield for untrained and harder to kill with, yes. Stabs do not create as much opening as you might think, they are a lot faster than swings and offer more range. Still if you want direct stopping blunt is the way to go, while blades are more scary and benefit greatly in a longer fight, as they wound easier and their wounds are more dangerous due to bleeding. Go with what you want, but if you are in actual need to defend yourself caring about life of the enemy is not a good priority.
af47bd No.602231
>>602228
Anecdotally everything I have killed with a mace has died a lot faster than when a knife was used. Most people don't know how deadly maces are because they don't cut so people just assume when the mace "bounces off" the target and there is not a gash or blood that nothing happened.
48d7e4 No.602235
>>602231
Nay weapon can be deadly in good hands, i just said that you need to apply more force to wield a mace effectively compared to a blade, and that maces are more about stopping power than killing, though these two often go along.
48d7e4 No.602236
>>602235
>Nay
Any*
Though, nay weapon fits too.
af47bd No.602239
>>602235
I find (again anecdotally) maces much easier to swing than swords so I could fight faster with a mace. I think way to often people assume swords are the best weapon, when there are good reasons other weapons are used on the battlefield or in single combat.
48d7e4 No.602240
>>602239
There's no just "best" weapon, only one more fitted for the task. Maces cannot stop in mid swing as easily, are top heavy and weight more, in turn dealing more blunt damage, defeating armor easier and easier to swing for untrained person, as aligning the blade is not an issue. Maces and especially clubs are a lot easier to produce as well. Still, most maces' benefits fade or even turn into a disadvantage such as weight and size when used as a sidearm during peaceful life, where swords had their rightful place.
af47bd No.602242
>>602240
Well people just traded maces for walking sticks for everyday life, that is the reason they metal heads most of time.
af47bd No.602243
2148f4 No.602244
>>602226
Something that isn’t too short range like a knife but can knock someone on their ass, maybe kill them if I hit them hard enough (which isn’t too specific, even beer bottles can do that) but also with decent range. Enough to “Rufio vs Antifa” someone. Something that deals damage but doesn’t require ambush like a bikelock, good enough to kill but also just to inflict serious damage to put someone out. A knife is too short in my opinion. Blunt objects are easier to use and easier to kill with if untrained.
af47bd No.602246
>>602244
So you are trying not to kill the target? Again this makes a huge difference.
af47bd No.602249
>>602244
What is the scenario. Like you plan to murder someone, random street brawls you want both sides to walk away from, full plate armor battles?
2148f4 No.602317
>>602246
>>602249
Two hypothetical and completely insane scenarios: if I was with one of those Proud Boys style groups, I’m not because I think they’re cringey, but if I was and we got in a fight with some antifags, I’d want something nice and good to pack a wallop. Like a shillelagh. Sure, you could beat up an antifag with your fist, they aren’t tough, but you could also use the weapon I’m looking for to:
Fight off nigger thugs
And if you were part of some vigilante group that beats up the machete wielding Cambodians known to start fights with people near you, you’d want something with a little bit of range over a knife, easy to use, hard hitting, that knocks them on their asses or kills them if you hit them enough or in just the right spot.
af47bd No.602321
>>602317
First off there is nothing insane in wanting to beat commies to death. But that is not the real issue. The problem is you are trying NOT to kill the person you are fighting. This is strange for me to choose a weapon that does not kill so I would kind of have to give you the opposite of good advice. A good club would have a heavy head that is spiked in some way, Also the larger the head the better. But if the head is too large or heavy it will be hard wield. TBH my best mace to fight with would be my smallest and lightest (one pound head on a two foot shaft). So anything that is like a real mace is out. No wood clubs with large heads or any metal headed weapons. I could really only think of collapsible batons, wood walking sticks or canes, leather blackjacks or hell maybe you could use a fishing priest. Three major problems. 1st black jacks and fishing priests are too short (as you said knives have too short of a range so knuckle dusters would be out as well) 2nd blackjacks and collapsible batons are prohibited weapons in a lot of places. 3rd you said you wanted it in your coat so a walking stick or cane is out. Not going to lie I'm not sure I have a good answer. I mean maybe you could use a cane with a smooth round head and not strike the person in their head.
5d895a No.602360
>>602321
I like the idea of a walking stick, like a shillelagh. Say I was trying to kill my target, what would you recommend for that?
ad3331 No.602414
>>602321
>best mace to fight with would be my smallest and lightest (one pound head on a two foot shaft). So anything that is like a real mace is out. No wood clubs with large heads or any metal headed weapons. I could really only think of collapsible batons, wood walking sticks or canes, leather blackjacks or hell maybe you could use a fishing priest
or a piece of rebar
>blackjacks and fishing priests are too short
rebar can be cut to any length
>blackjacks and collapsible batons are prohibited
rebar is a construction material
>want it stashed in your coat
rebar can be fit into almost any spot
not trying to push thre rebar meme but I am pushing the rebar meme for cheap, disposable, lightweight, nonlethal commiebashing tools
>>602360
>say I was trying to kill my target
rebar them in the knees then punch the flat rubberized tent stake protector handle end of your rebar into vital spots
bd7b9a No.602529
>>602360
Well after all my reading, looking at pictures of real maces used and using maces I find this shaped head to be the best design. You want the shaft to be two feet long (almost all real maces seem to be two feet in length, longer ones were used on horseback). The head should weigh around one pound and be around the size of say a door knob. Now I know this seems too small and light, but it is not. You can swing it really fast and have total control of it.
f4bb9a No.602545
>>602529
Maces are for dealing with armor. You're better off with a simple rounded knob since its less conspicuous easier to get and more comfortable to hold (assuming you're going for some kind of walking stick.)
bd7b9a No.602562
>>602545
First off maces are not for armor, as about every culture has used them pre-armor and post-armor of every type. It is more like swords suck ass against armor (they are better for flesh than say a mace but harder to use, make or maintain). Second, he asked what I would use to kill a person, not LARP make believe bullshit. I carry a knife and a gun. I use maces/fish priests to take out animals. I have also pointed out that I have used a club in a fight before and the person I hit went down after the first blow and could not stand back up for about five minutes. The question I was asked was >Say I was trying to kill my target, what would you recommend for that? And my answer was >>602529. If anyone has used or owns a bludgeon feel free to chime in. People on this board seem to think real weapons don't actually kill people. They do and if you are trying not to kill a man don't hit him with a weighted club. I just want everyone to make the best choice in whatever they are doing. Also here are some other good designs imo.
fd54a1 No.602592
>>594304
A good sword is sharper than any kitchen utensil and holds its sharpness longer. The purpose of the cutting edge of all swords is to carve though flesh and bone very quickly however the effectiveness of a sword against armor is usually low which is why they were often used as sidearms.
fd54a1 No.602593
>>602562
Those weapons you posted there are not maces they are clubs. A mace is a specific kind of club from the European medieval era designed from damaging through armor. Those weapons you posted also saw use defeating armor the helmets of the time. Largely trench clubs were used because they were easy to use and cheap to create.
bd7b9a No.602594
>>602593
You are wrong on all points, those are maces made and used in the great war. Trench clubs were made in the field than the maces were issued by the military. Maces were used for thousand of years before the medieval period. All maces are clubs, not all clubs are maces.
bd7b9a No.602596
>>602593
I mean are you too lazy to even got to wikipedia to know just how wrong you are before posting? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mace_(bludgeon)
Contents
1 Prehistory
2 Antiquity
3 European Middle Ages
4 Eastern Europe
5 Pre-Columbian America
6 Asia
7 Modern era
53c8f3 No.602598
>>602592
What about a thrusting sword like an estoc or a tuck
My kitchen knives are hair poping sharp
fd54a1 No.602613
>>602594
I suppose we are using the term mace differently. I am using the term mace in its historical usage. It comes from Old French and refers specifically to a flanged not spiked steel club for striking through armor. In modern times the term mace is commonly used to refer to any club with an uneven striking surface which is redundant but I guess that is how language works. It is like how swords longer than 2 1/2 feet are often referred to as longswords despite experts using the term exclusively to refer to a two handed European sword type developed in the 13th century. Does popularity make a misnomer correct?
fd54a1 No.602616
>>602596
For fuck's sake I said usually. Obviously there are a few European can opener sword that are effective against armor but the majority suck at it. Of course your knife is sharp because it is not shit but does your life depend on it being sharp? A sword's cutting power is often a life or death matter.
fd54a1 No.602617
>>602596
You should neither place faith in Wikipedia's historical accuracy nor its ability to explain stuff in an etymological context.
48d7e4 No.602635
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>602598
Even thrusting weapons like rapiers often have edge to offer option of non-lethal but painful cuts which you would not be able to do otherwise, as well as to prevent opponent from grabbing your blade with his hands. There actually have been flamberge rapiers that could cause devastating wounds if you tried to grab them even with gloves/cloak, basically shred the skin on hand to pieces.
Also, knives work different than swords, swords have a lot more leverage, flex and offer plenty of blunt force to break bones, especially if it's a cutting dedicated sword(i.e. more top heavy). Here's a video on the subject, it might help.
bd7b9a No.602718
>>602613
Yet all the knowledgeable people from museums and auction houses with degrees>>602594 in the subject of weapons all call these objects maces. Also you are wrong about the old french usage. Origin of mace1
1250–1300; Middle English < Old French (compare French masse) large mallet < Vulgar Latin *mattea; akin to Latin matteola kind of mallet; compare Sanskrit matya harrow
Middle English, from Anglo-French, from Vulgar Latin *mattia; akin to Latin mateola mallet
[1250–1300; Middle English < Old French (French masse) large hammer, mace < Vulgar Latin *mattea]
Maces have been used in combat for over 5,000 years. It is painful how wrong you people are. And for >>602617 it is why I provided evidence in post >>602594. And fuck off with this how sharp are swords shit, If you want to go on about swords make a new thread (which I would apply read) Also have this fun pic of a mace head that is a head shaped head.
c7b0ce No.602728
>>602718
Obviously the term has changed in its usage even by some scholars but I suppose there is no need to be a nazi about the definition. You seem to have confirmed what I said about it being Old French and the mace was first invented around the 9th century though it might have been earlier. If you read medieval texts a mace refers to a specific kind of weapon not just a whole bunch of steel clubs and there is no reason to
change that definition as the term club already exists. Like I said just because a misnomer is popular does not mean it is correct. Modern misuse of the term assault rifle is comparable.
d01359 No.602731
>>602728
Mace is an English word not French. Middle English, from Anglo-French. Mace is the white people word for any weighted club with a solid head. They have been used for thousands of years before the word "mace" was spoken. You are wrong.
c7b0ce No.602733
>>602731
You can keep screaming wrong like an autist all you want but a mace is a Frankish invention. It is common in history that a word once used by one culture with a specific meaning gets expanded to mean something far more general. The term musket once referred to a very specific kind of weapon but later came to refer to any smoothbore muzzleloaded longgun. The problem with using the term mace to refer to war clubs in general is now there is no term to refer to the class of medieval weapons. It is like if the Japanese changed tetsubo to refer to all long clubs in history.
d01359 No.602736
>>602733
I like how you still have not provided one piece of evidence. We are just supposed to take you word for it, yet I'm the "Nazi Autist". Maybe I will name my next mace that. I kind of like it. Do you own any maces or are you just a LARPer fag that talks nonstop about things he has no understanding of except what he reads on the internet?
d01359 No.602755
>>602733
What still no evidence? I'm shocked, it is almost like you are wrong. Speaking o wrong I was told a while back by a certain Vietcong I was going to be shown a masterfully crafted spear. What happened to that?
>>596541
>>596543
8fb8cf No.602808
>>602733
He is not acting like an autist, he is just right.
A Mace is specifically a stick with a weighted head, meanwhile a club is usually just a stick that is made thicker at one side.
d01359 No.602810
>>602808
What is strange to me is you would have thought he would have posted a pic of the "real mace". He did not even describe the attributes of the mace. All he said is >medieval era designed from damaging through armor. I think he is talking about a flange mace of some sort (of which I own one). But no one on this board ever explains anything or shows proofs of any sort, they just dig in their heels and call you names. ==I still want to see that spear==
d01359 No.602812
>>602808
Do you know of any sites selling reproductions of German trench maces? I would like one but I can't seem to find anyone selling them. Seeing you are German you may know a site.
e3d338 No.602813
I had a neat little knocker I made from a steel bar the width of a pencil and a shitload of 550 cord and superglue. Even had a thumping head on it as well. That was a nice one. I wonder which shithead NCO is keeping it, these days.
d01359 No.602816
I am planning on making a mace out of large hex nuts. I was thinking of using three of them, they are 2" wide. I got the two and they seem to be a good size. I ordered the 3rd nut to be a little larger than the other two so it sticks out in the middle of the other two. Or if someone wanted that could use one huge nut like these pics
fd54a1 No.602830
>>602810
I think you largely misunderstood my point. I was being stingy about the term mace because there is a clear differentiation in purpose between the many types of war clubs in history and the European medieval maces developed for defeating armor. If you look at when the equivalent of the term mace developed in Old French it coincides with the wider availability of mail and more effective use of heavy cavalry negating the disadvantages of a steel headed club. I think and so do some scholars that mace in the medieval ages referred to a specific kind of weapon. In addition there seem to be no known medieval references to something as a mace without it meaning a flanged or studded armor piercer with the possible exception of a few encountered middle eastern weapons that looked like maces.
It is true that many modern well educated scholars refer to most round headed war clubs as maces though some of them only refer to armor piercers of that group as maces and some refer to only European steel war clubs but also include morningstars. You see the mess here. This sort of naming clusterfuck irritates me because the medieval people who used these weapons probably had far more consistent ways of naming their weapons. Whenever feasible I prefer to use historically accurate names for things.
Also I never called you a nazi I called myself a nazi.
fd54a1 No.602831
>>602830
The problem with understanding the medieval European mace is for it to make sense you have to understand the context in which it was used. I suggest Oakeshott's A Knight and His Arms if you want a guide on that sort of thing.
8fb8cf No.602839
>>602812
>Do you know of any sites selling reproductions of German trench maces?
I don't know any and I doubt you will find one, because while melee combat did happen in the trenches of WW1, the German war experience we got out of WW1 is that close combat is decided with the pistol.
What is remembered was reduced to the use of field spade/E tool as a weapon, hence why it was trained by the Wehrmacht and during the early years of the Cold War by the Armies of West and East Germany.
So if a German WW1 reenactor is interested in the melee fighting, he is good just with the basic infantry gear he buys because it includes the field spate/e tool.
And those that really want a trench club or mace build their own, just like the soldiers in the trenches.
65b224 No.602872
>>602816
Gotta remember to keep weight in mind, anon. A mace was good because it was small and quick, making it heavy tires you out and slows your swings.
8bc33d No.602900
>>602839
Are these not German trench maces? I get they did not see a huge amount of use. But I am not doing WW1 reenactment, I just want one of that design for use, or in my collection. The wood hafted one. I don't want one of those strange spring ones they had.
8bc33d No.602902
>>602831
>>602830
You posted a pic with three distinctly different types of mace heads, which is the "real mace" you spoke of? And of course in the middle ages they only took the time to write about well made maces made of metal, that would be like if the US army had a manual on how to shoot a rifle and left out how to shot a match lock smooth bore. It would make no sense to train people in a old fire arm they would never see like teaching them to use a stone mace would be retarded. Post the exact "true old french mace" or whatever the hell you are talking about or just except the fact you were wrong. == Post the exact thing you are talking about, pictures and a written description ==
8bc33d No.602903
>>602902
Also am I doing red text wrong or something
or does it not work on this board or what? Works fine on other boards?
8bc33d No.602950
So am I ever going to get a picture of the Vietnam spear or the "true old french mace"?
And have some axe mace hybrids
fd54a1 No.602965
>>602902
I posted two types of mace heads not three. Those are Russian maces but they are identical to Western maces. There are two basic types of European maces either with conical or pyramidal studs or flanges however both protrusions serve the same purpose. If you interested in details read some Oakeshott I am not an expert but an enthusiast.
58ee0a No.602978
>>602965
>I posted two types of mace heads
So which is the "real mace"?
>a mace is a Frankish invention
So post the fucking picture you are telling us about not Russian maces (which under you definition are not maces). You can't because you are not correct. You still have not posted evidence of you claim, you just keep talking in circles. Show us what the hell you are talking about or for the love of god just save us all some time and say you were wrong.
>There are two basic types of European maces either with conical or pyramidal studs or flanges
I know that as I own both types. Yes I am interested it is why I keep asking you to "Post the exact thing you are talking about, pictures and a written description"
c355eb No.603014
as a britfag I don't too much choice for weapons, I recently bought an aluminium bat and that I feel can help me, but I want it more lethal.
I've considered attaching a steak knife to the end of it, so I can swing and cut streak through flesh. Is this retarded or genius?
626a12 No.603017
>>593555
Pretty much this. You are hurting your wrist almost as much you are hurting your opponent. There's a reason that all the way from the copper age (before adding tin to it was invented) bludgeons only became militarily relevant for the short time when full body metallic armour became a thing.
2b1bdf No.603044
I wrapped barbed wire around a stick with a forked end and superglued it together, does that count?
58ee0a No.603102
>>603017
>You are hurting your wrist almost as much you are hurting your opponent
Once again we have a person that has never used a weapon. I have wrists like a 10 year old girl and I can bash my mace into a tree for an extended period of time and not feel anything in my wrist. It is one of the reasons I prefer a mace over a sword.
Did you not see all the people explaining the fact a mace used less metal and was less labor intensive to produce? Or the fact it was mace easier to train a solider in its use, or repair in the field? It was also used on horseback. Do you have any idea how much wars cost?
58ee0a No.603173
>>602613
>>602593
>>602728
>>602733
>>602830
>>602965
Does anyone understand what he is talking about? I really want an answer but he seems incapable of giving a clear answer or a simple picture of the "true mace that is the only thing that can be called a mace".
fd54a1 No.603180
>>603173
>>602831
None of this makes any sense if you do not know anything about European medieval combat. I already gave you a good reading suggestion. Check it out and some other books from expert medieval archaeologists if you want to cease your confusion. Like said already most experts do not care about the terminology all that much.
58ee0a No.603185
>>603180
Or you could post evidence form one of these books, or a picture, or any kind of evidence. You are acting like a fucking child. You are claiming that there is one thing that should be called a mace. WHAT IS THAT THING?
CLAIM
[klām]
VERB
state or assert that something is the case, typically without providing evidence or proof.
NOUN
an assertion of the truth of something, typically one that is disputed or in doubt.
8bc33d No.603186
>>603180
Why can't you post a picture of this mace?
d0360d No.603188
I really need your help. Can you use your awesome clubs and maces and stuff over here, please?
Muchly appreciated in advance.
8bc33d No.603189
>>603180
GET FUCKED YOU RETARD.
2148f4 No.603190
I think a trench club is what I’m looking for. That, or one of those round headed Indian war club. Is cold steel good for clubs or just a meme?
8bc33d No.603192
>>603190
These are the MACES I own, If you have any questions about these feel free to ask. But I am still waiting for this fag >>603180 to answer my question or tell us he is wrong. So if you call tell him that he is wrong it would save me some time.
8bc33d No.603193
>>603190
Or did you want a all wood one? It was wrong of me to assume you would want a metal one. It is just the metal headed ones work WAY better.
6f9c1d No.603196
>>603190
Polypropylene is pretty tough but looks like shit. It is what Cold Steel's clubs are made out of.
6f9c1d No.603199
>>603180
I'm still waiting.
6f9c1d No.603206
>>603180
>I suggest Oakeshott
Yet Oakeshott said you were wrong. How can you explain this?
fd54a1 No.603208
>>603206
This is the third post in which I have said this I will say it one last time. Most scholars use the term mace very loosely because the term has changed its meaning. Oakeshott goes into great detail in his books specifically on the medieval that they are excellent antiarmor weapons which differentiates them from the maces of other cultures which were used for other purposes and often not as graceful. Like I said before your usage of the term mace is not incorrect in a modern context but you need to understand how European maces were different from apparently similar weapons from other cultures. If you want to learn anything more about do your own research because I am not going to keep repeating myself. Language is very fluid when it comes to historical weaponry and if you get too argumentative about it you will just get into a clusterfuck like the glaive/bill/hook/guisarme debates you see all the time.
Good Lord it is like you are ignoring 70% of what I am saying.
6f9c1d No.603213
>>603208
>Language is very fluid
Yet the word WRONG is quite clear. Post the part of the book you are using as you proof, or post a picture. Once again you are talking in circles to avoid the fact you are wrong. Even the man (Oakeshott) you site as proof of you claim call these maces. AS THE ARE FUCKING MACES. you are making this whole board stupid by wasting their time posting things that are wrong.
fd54a1 No.603217
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>603213
You seem to convinced that we disagree on whether or not those objects in your post can be called maces. We do not. I have no idea what you are on about at this point. The problem seems to be that you do not understand how the fuck a mace is used thus my explanations of my terminology preference make no sense. If you will not listen to me then maybe you will listen to an expert. Here is a good video to get you started. Also please do not read just one passage of a book and leave it. Read the book I suggested earlier if you want a reasonably comprehensive understanding in context.
6f9c1d No.603218
>>603217
You post a British LARPer that used a toy maces as your expert. LOL you are an idiot. You are a child that has never used a weapon in his life. Do you really believe that a mace would not kill a man? Still waiting for you to provide a single piece of evidence. That video had nothing to do with the topic of what a mace is. AND IT WAS POSTED BEFORE AND WE LAUGHED AT IT FOR BEING SHIT. I Fucking found your book to prove me right. That is why you talk in circles and provide NO PROOF.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NQqbgNSPTM He even was forced to admit it was a British toy bested by a water bottle.
6f9c1d No.603222
>>603217
They are used to hit people, you simpleton
fd54a1 No.603230
>>603222
Yeah like an assault rifle is just used for shooting people. Technically true but such a massive oversimplification that you look like an idiot saying it. The knights of Europe in the Medieval era were not neanderthals slapping together blunt objects out of some vague sense of need for a killing tool. Weapons in the period were often designed with specific tactics purposes in mind. Falchions were used for cutting through flesh and padding from horseback, warhammers were used specifically for defeating plate armor, and maces were general armor killers which changed significantly with the advent of plate armor. A mace has no advantages over a sword against an unarmored opponent in that situation it is a completely inferior weapon but the more armored the opponent becomes the more relatively powerful the mace is.
6f9c1d No.603231
>>603229
Again you talk in circles. I have asked you many times post a picture of a true mace, or even a description in words. YOU REFUSE TO. Also kings carried stone maces dumb dumb. They were not slapped together. YOU WILL NEVER POST ANY EVIDENCE BECAUSE YOU HAVE NONE.
6f9c1d No.603232
>>603230
Sharur, which means "smasher of thousands" is the weapon and symbol of the god Ninurta. Sumerian mythic sources describe it as an enchanted talking mace. It has been suggested as a possible precursor for similar objects in other mythology such as Arthurian lore.
Even Gods used Maces
6f9c1d No.603236
>>603230
You have never used a weapon to fight a human being before have you? Because it is clear form your posts you only have a theoretical understanding of weapons which you have gotten form reading things you do not understand.
7d7725 No.603237
I want to discipline my future wife with the belt.
6f9c1d No.603238
>>603237
No idea what you are talking about, but go on….
6f9c1d No.603239
>>603237
And tell this guy >>603230 he is wrong and a fag
6f9c1d No.603242
>>603237
Also a mace would work better than a belt. Just a thought.
fd54a1 No.603243
>>603232
>>603231
>>603236
>>603239
Jesus. Weapons grade autism. I think I have an idea now why full/k/ is so slow these days.
7d7725 No.603244
>>603238
It’s a accident because I wasn’t supposed to post on /k/.
b48d62 No.603245
>>603243
Its slow because retards make claims with no evidence bringing threads to a standstill. It has happened a few times in this thread alone, first the retard for Hungary, then the retard form Vietnam that has still not posted pics of his spear, and now we have a guy form America saying that a flange mace is the only thing to be called a mace (or so am guessing as he will not answer a simple question by posting a pic of what he is talking about). The fact is everyone on this board are a bunch of man children that try to sound cool on the internet talking about things they will never do or own.
b48d62 No.603246
>>603243
Do you own a bludgeon? Plan to own a bludgeon? Have a story about a bludgeon? Have some fact about bludgeons? Or are you just going to make snarky posts? Or better yet if you could tell me what the hell that guy is talking about, because for days I have been asking him to post a picture of what he was talking about and he can't seem to.
6d5e47 No.603247
>>603245
What's with the necessary evidence for my makeshift spear again?
b48d62 No.603248
>>603247
Because it was going to be funny to laugh at you. And I knew you were going to never do it as no one on this board does anything they talk about.
6d5e47 No.603249
>>603248
I left my bayonet back in my hometown, anyway, the task is as easy as attaching a fucking broomhandle to a kitchen knife.
b48d62 No.603250
>>603247
Easy yet undone. Like I said all talk. All I want to do is learn about new and better maces I could own. But no one on this board even owns any weapons as far as I can tell so I doubt I will ever gain anything from this. There was a time on the chans that people wern't full of shit. I miss those days. But I keep trying to help people in owning a bludgeon. I like them.
7d7725 No.603251
>>603250
You can make your own mace by putting the rock on the top handle.
b48d62 No.603252
>>603251
I want to make a stone mace but I have no idea on how to bore a hole through stone. I just bought the maces I own. I put a handle on one myself. Which took forever as I did own any wood chisels. Since I went out and bought chisels (after I need them) I had an idea on on how to make a mace out of large hex nuts I was going to try at some point.
6d5e47 No.603256
>>603250
Just get a fucking telescoped baton and install a strike cap.
You are fucking american, you can buy and do just that.
b48d62 No.603260
>>603256
I own a telescoping baton (a short one) and I bought a used LAPD police tonfa style baton because that is something that has a cool history behind it. Those cop batons are not meant for killing though, they are light in weight. these are mine, I have posted this pic like 3 times but as the is anonymous you don't know who it is you are talking to
6d5e47 No.603262
>>603260
What's the problem? These look functional, particularly the 3rd one.
>they are light in weight.
That's a boon tbh, lighter weight means more blows.
b48d62 No.603263
>>603256
Speaking of that. What weapons can you own in Vietnam anyway? I tried to look it up and the answer seemed like almost none.
6d5e47 No.603265
>>603263
Legally, you can own some knives, some sticks (so you can make a spear), wooden sword and a double barrel shotgun (but never see anyone legally owning one).
Carrying a knife on you and being discovered by the police means you are fucked tho, same for mace and telescoped baton. Nowadays I do carry tactical pen.
b48d62 No.603266
>>603261
Thank you. I don't have a drill press though and I doubt it would be that easy to do with a hand power drill. Also those diamond drill bits tend to cost a lot and seeing how i would never use them again it seems like kind of a waste. Also where to get the right stone. Its a whole beg deal.
b48d62 No.603268
>>603262
Light is good but I mean they are too light. That is the point though. Batons are meant to get a person to stop fighting you to get a pair of cuffs on them. We just shoot people in America, and the cops love to pull out those fucking tasers so they don't uses batons much these days.
b48d62 No.603271
>>603260
>>603256
>>603262
>>603268
I was talking about these. I own one of those that was used buy the LAPD (they sold off their old used ones for their department) and a telescoping one too. Plus those maces
6d5e47 No.603272
>>603268
As said, that's what strike cap is for.
b48d62 No.603273
>>603271
I like to hold it and think of all the hippie skulls it cracked. May be the best $15 bucks I ever spent.
>>603272
Yeah those are to light that are made of aluminum and are hollow inside. Hell even Rodney King was not that hurt. I wonder If my baton was used in the LA riots. That would be so cool. I checked the dates and it was old enough if i recall.
fd54a1 No.603275
>>603265
Is there some way to disguise a telescoping baton as a common item? If you are disguising a knife as a pen you might as well try to disguise a telescoping baton as it would probably be more useful for self defense than any knife you could disguise.
6d5e47 No.603277
>>603275
You can have one of those pen-size baton, but that's fucking useless.
I prefer a piercing tool like a tacticool pen.
b48d62 No.603278
>>603275
Those selfie sticks
7d7725 No.603287
c0dded No.603307
>>593555
Are you fucking serious? With the right amount of force in the right locations you can do serious damage. Thanks for the laugh though.
fd54a1 No.603310
>>603307
Of course you could plenty of damage but in a country in which combat knives and telescoping batons are illegal which is a policeman more likely to believe? That you cut an attacker up with your fists? Or that you knocked him out with your fists?
c0dded No.603314
>>597548
This guy works WAY TOO CLOSE to his unprotected hands. One fucking slip and his shit is gone. There are like 20 different times I saw something he has drilled or cut that could of been set up differently in a more safer manner. I hope he kills himself for being that retarded.
2148f4 No.603462
>>603192
Your maces are exactly what I am picturing. Where did you acquire them? Or if you made them, what did you do?
b48d62 No.603464
>>603462
>>603462
First I will say I prefer wood handles because a lot of metal shafts are hollow to make them lighter. This makes them easier to swing but they seem to bend it whacked to hard. Wood while not being a good looking if it breaks can re-haft it myself. Just a thought. I numbered them and will put links for each mace. And here is a video of how to haft a mace head
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlnwRT9w2l8
b48d62 No.603466
Number 1 was sold by a random guy on Ebay under the name wunder556 He had two of them but I don't see the 2nd one listed. You could email him and ask. It and number 4 are heavy so they are harder to swing and the handles are thicker. https://www.ebay.com/usr/wunder556?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2754
b48d62 No.603469
>>603464
Number 2 is the "Marshal Historical Norman Mace Head" It is the one I use to whack small mammals. Took out a raccoon In one hit. It is the best design IMO. It is lighter so you can sing it very fast and I can stop it mid swing with ease. It also costs the least of all of them but you have to haft it yourself (its not hard to do)
https://www.celticwebmerchant.com/en/norman-mace-head.html
http://www.kultofathena.com/product.asp?item=MHW1110&name=12th+%2D14th+Century+Mace+Head+
https://www.outfit4events.com/czk/product/8581-mace-head-with-pyramidal-spikes-1100-1300/
b48d62 No.603471
>>603464
Number 3 as far as I can tell was made by some blacksmith in the Czech Republic. It is also light so you can swing it faster than the other heavy ones. I takes like 8 weeks for you to receive it after you order it. Mine ended being a bit different than pictured. The ends of the flanges were pointed when the were blunt in the pics and there was no makers mark stamped into the flanges.It was a reproduction of a mace head dug up in a riverbed in England if I recall. A lot of flanges on maces are to thin, this one seems legit.
https://www.celticwebmerchant.com/en/european-six-pronged-mace.html
https://www.outfit4events.com/czk/product/4399-mace-with-six-plates/ this site lets you choose what type of haft you want
fd54a1 No.603472
>>603469
I want to see what that raccoon looked like after you hit it. I understand that they are slow but holy fuck.
b48d62 No.603473
>>603464
Number 4 is a trench mace (but not a 100% authentic in shape) It is heavy but as it is shorter you can control it. It is on sale as the time I am posting this which it was not when I bought it a few weeks ago so I am kind of upset
https://www.atlantacutlery.com/wwi-trench-mace
b48d62 No.603475
>>603472
It went into a death spasm and blood started pouring out is nose. It was dead in like 10 seconds. I did not bother to look at the damage as I tomahawked its head off so I could skin it. Later that day Iooked outside and saw there was a squirrel in one of the traps. So round two. It keeped jumping around and as I only go for head-shots I missed him twice. Third swing was dead-on. Its eyes popped out of his head and it died instantly. I ran my fingers over its skull and I could feel the shape of the pyramid in its skull (I swung pretty light as he was jumping around so fast) It had a square shaped dent. That is why the people that claim that knobs on maces are met for armor can eat a dick because they fuck bones up.
b48d62 No.603478
>>603475
A lot of blood from the nose. None out the skin though. As I have said I have flattened opossums heads before. I mean it can't be called a head afterwords.
b48d62 No.603483
>>603472
There are thing you can learn that they don't tell you in books. Like you can feel what a tomahawk cuts through or a maces smashes. When you strike some thing in the teeth you feel a click run through the handle of your weapon that feels like nothing like bone of flesh
b48d62 No.603488
>>603483
Same goes for knives. You can feel it cut though ribs like one at a time, it feel almost like zipping up a metal zipper on a jacket. Killing is kind of a strange sensation that no other medium can feel like. Even butchering a dead animal feels nothing like it.
b48d62 No.603489
>>603488
I wounder how people on this board would feel about posting all these weapons if the really hacked something to death. It nothing like using a gun you can feel it dying, and I assure you they try their best not to die. I had a squirrel almost wrench a knife out of my hand once with its teeth. It really puts some of these thing in perspective. I must be have been troubling to end a mans life on a battlefield while he is screaming for you to stop.
6d5e47 No.603490
>>603489
I guess this contributes to the mentality that americans fucking fears melee combat.
b48d62 No.603491
>>603490
I assure you I am not bothered by it at all. It is just people seem to forget these are tools of death.
fd54a1 No.603493
>>603475
No one intelligent says that maces can not fuck something up nicely. It is all about speed. Maces are unbalanced and and heavier than swords spears or war axes. A sword will always be faster against an unarmored opponent and less tiring to use. The nice thing is with a mace you do not even have to penetrate an opponents armor the force is strong enough that you crush bones without even splitting chains.
b48d62 No.603494
>>603490
We just have always had guns for the birth of our nation. We have used melee weapons, they are just kind of seen as a last ditch weapon. For fucks sake I carry a shot gun at times. So why would I pull out my knife when I could put a load of buckshot in his chest or five 158 grain slugs?
b48d62 No.603495
>>603493
Maces are not heavy though. My maces weigh less than my friends swords. I fucking can assure you of this because shipping was priced per pound and we split the cost 50/50 yet his cost WAY more to ship and I got fucked but to be nice I did not bring it up
b48d62 No.603496
>>603493
have you ever handled a real mace or do you take this shit from fantasy movies and videogames. They weigh about the same as a battle axe of the same size. I know as i switched for axes to maces. Also I find the weight in the head to make it easier to control, but that is my deal. My lightest mace weights like 2 pounds. That is why I keep making these points as I think you guys are not really sure how these things really work. It will give you a better understanding.
b48d62 No.603497
>>603493
That is the other reason people used flanges or Big hollow maces heads. to have a larger head to hit the enemy with yet light enough to swing fast.
If you notice maces have little solid heads or huge hollow heads or flanges which leave a tone of empty space
maces are no heavier than other weapons, they are just a different shape
b48d62 No.603499
>>603493
Another point to address is that maces are balanced in a sense as the are "round" at the head. The are not front heavy like say a war hammer or battle axe.
fd54a1 No.603500
>>603495
How heavy is your friends sword? How heavy is your comparative mace? Where is the point of balance? How much reach do they each have? Get your self a ballistic dummy with bones buy some historically accurate weapons and learn. Just because you killed a few small animals with some maces does not mean you know the way they were used in man on man combat 700 years ago. Listen to people who have read the historical manuals who know the archaeology and have spent hundreds of hours testing those weapons in simulated combat.
b48d62 No.603501
>>603500
I have clubbed humans too my good man. The heaviest mace is like 3 pounds (it is a monster), the lightest is below 2 pounds. His sword was at least 4 pounds and had a longer reach but I could swing one of my real maces much faster. Listen swords are great, I am just saying people have misconceptions about maces. Maces are kind of the forgot weapon in time, they were always used but never took the main stage like a sword. I have said I would use an axe on an unarmored person as it cuts. I have addressed all these point if you read what I wrote in previous posts. Maces are kind of the jack of all trades master of none kind of a weapon. Again maces are not as heave as you think they are and are wast but weaker than say a warhammer.
b48d62 No.603503
>>603500
Have you ever fought a person with a weapon? I have. Hell my dad was a crazy bastard in his day and used to take people on with a homemade knuckle duster and sent people to the hospital two different times with those. He hit a guy with a garden how in the chest once. They go down and stay down, it is why people took it upon themselves to cover themselves head to to in metal.
b48d62 No.603504
>>603500
And real combat does not play out like in books.
b48d62 No.603505
>>603500
Two of my maces are copies of real weapons. I even said that. The real ones are light and fast. Do you own any maces? I would love to hear form someone else that has used them.
>>603469
>>603471
b48d62 No.603507
fd54a1 No.603509
>>603501
Four pounds? Four fucking pounds? For a one handed sword? Medieval fully two handed long swords were rarely heavier than three pounds and your friend's was four fucking pounds? I assume it was one handed because obviously you would not compare a one handed mace to a two handed sword? What kind of giant ass joke of a chopper does your friend have?
Okay look. It is very simple. In order for a one handed mace of equivalent weight to a one handed sword, let us say one and one fourth pounds, to do competitive damage it has to concentrate most of its weight into a small area at one end. That imbalances the weapon and increases the torque needed to change its speed so now the weapon needs be shortened to be more agile. What you get here is a weapon that is much shorter than a medieval arming sword has poorer balance but is less damaging to both flesh and bone. It is not very difficulty with a medieval arming sword to cut someone's hand completely off but if you hit their forearm with a mace you may crush bones but their arm will likely rebound dampening the blow. An arming sword is also capable of being used as a thrusting weapon to split mail thus making useful enough against armor. In order for a mace to be significantly damaging enough to justify taking it over another one handed weapon it needs to be heavier probably around two pounds. I can see maybe two and a half pounds for a one handed mace if you are mounted but no more.
Can I see some pictures of your mace? Is it historical or customized?
8bc33d No.603511
>>603509
I have to go to sleep but you can look these and the links. Yeah my point has been for a long time is real weapons are pretty light. I am just telling people all I can so they can make a better informed decision for whatever they are doing. I don't recall exactly what he bought. It was like a hand and a half sword and a saber. It does not mater as they will just hang on his wall like every other sword bought in modern times. What are you guy doing with these swords and stuff? My answer is get a gun, I carry revolvers (let the low capacity talk begin!)
>>603464
>>603466
>>603469
>>603471
>>603473
7b664a No.603513
>>602900
>Are these not German trench maces?
They are, but all German trench maces were makeshift weapons made by the soldiers themselves, there was never a model that was officially distributed like the British and French did it and the majority of German soldiers used knifes, spades, pistols and grenades for trench fighting.
>I just want one of that design for use, or in my collection.
Then build your own, one of the most common ones was just a wooden handle with hobnails hammered into it and lead poured into the top.
You can get wooden handles and lead in every hardware store and hobnails can be ordered online from various shops.
fd54a1 No.603518
>>603511
>What are you guys doing with theses swords and stuff?
Learning our ancestors' history. Why else would we fuck around with weapons that have been obsolete for five hundred years?
97c63c No.603568
>>603518
Tell that to the men that fought in the trenches of WW1. Maces never go out of style. No idea why you do what you do. It seems a bit strange to me you spend your time learning a useless skill. It is also kind of insulting to your ancestors to use objects they fought and died with like toys. But to each their own, I guess.
04b394 No.603569
>>603568
>Your ancestors would want knowledge of their martial arts to die out, goy!
Sure they would
97c63c No.603581
>>603569
Says the people that admit they would never use their weapons. You might as well be swinging light sabers as they are just toys to you. Have you ever used a real weapon in combat? I would like to hear not everyone here is playing make believe like children. Hopefully some stand up against the wicked and tyrannical.
04b394 No.603603
>>603581
I don't even own a sword. Or a club, for that matter. I'm just glad there are people who still give enough of a shit about historic weapons and martial arts to preserve and practice them.
Just because we have something better now doesn't mean we should throw away everything old.
e2e061 No.603634
>>593555
This. Most organs, including bones, are more or less spongy, like Spongebob.
97c63c No.603693
>>603634
You really believe if someone struck with a real bludgeon in the guts you would not fall over in pain?
97c63c No.603694
fd54a1 No.603695
>>603693
A gutshot is the stupidest place to hit someone with any blunt weapon they may be temporarily incapacitated but the likelihood of death is very low. If they have plate or padding they may not even be incapacitated. Stab them in the guts and that is it they are out of the fight and dead in a few hours.
97c63c No.603696
>>603695
Disemboweled does not stop a person per se. But obviously would not be good.
97c63c No.603698
>>603695
Being stabbed does not hurt that much tbh. I have been twice. My dad knew a guy that was shot and stabbed on two different occasions. He said being stabbed did not hurt much but being shot was horrible.
e2e061 No.603751
>>603693
Yes. Have you seen the episode where Spongebob absorbed all the punches of the bully for days at a time? That's, generally, how organs work.
fd54a1 No.603754
>>603696
Rupturing the abdominal wall is not the important part. The intestines are a large target that is unprotected from the front with bone. If your intestines are ruptured you will likely be incapacitated and will almost certainly die in hours. The Romans liked to decrease the populations of their enemies so their legionaires would aim their stabs at the intestines to cause that which would be nearly certainly lethal damage in a preindustrial world.
97c63c No.603805
>>603500
>Listen to people who have read the historical manuals who know the archaeology and have spent hundreds of hours testing those weapons in simulated combat.
>Yes. Have you seen the episode where Spongebob absorbed all the punches of the bully for days at a time? That's, generally, how organs work.
I can't tell if you are all morons or trolls anymore.
076192 No.603822
>>603695
>Hit someone in gut
>They are momentarily distracted by pain
>Hit them in more lethal area with them unable to guard
97c63c No.603839
>>603822
Yes this, it is like people here have never seen a real fight before. I'm shocked by the fact people have no idea how combat works. But you should change "momentarily distracted" to "agonizingly incapacitated".
e2e061 No.603841
>>603695
You need to experience a direct gut shot, just a punch, let alone an actual blunt object you sheltered shit. If you're in a genuine combat situation and you get hit there, you might not die from the hit alone, but your chances of survival just dropped severely due to the fact that you probably just entered mega panic mode from the loss of air.
fd54a1 No.603947
>>603841
You are making a lot of assumptions about me. I know what I gutshot with a hard and heavy blunt object feels like and I would rather take it there than on my face or on my shoulder or in my groin or on my shin or almost anywhere else.
10b123 No.603950
>>603947
>I might be going into hypovolemic shock but at least they didn't hit my shoulder lol
fd54a1 No.603953
>>603950
You will get a lot more blood loss from shattered bone than bruising. The reason the shoulder is such a nasty target is the unprotected bone that can not rebound much from an impact as well as the massive blood vessels that can be rupture because of bone shards. If I had to pick a place to be hit with a mace it would be the buttocks however that would not be a likely place. With blunt weapons you want to be hit in a place without bone and with a lot of cushion which is what the gut has. With cutting weapons you want bone to minimize rapid blood loss. That is not to say you can not cut straight through bone with a sword.
85dad7 No.603959
>>603696
Seeing your insides fall out and make a splat around your ankles tends to be an extremely good way to stop a person. Unless you're on meth or another way to completely filter your perception of reality your response isn't going to be wanting to continue to fight. You're going to want to get the hell away from whatever did that to you and find some way to repair it.
e2e061 No.603985
>>603953
That's assuming you actually shatter a bone, which is definitely not guaranteed, because chances are you're swinging towards the shoulder from the side, which is dense with muscle, thus heavily protected (muscle is designed to absorb blows).
If you, however, you get hit hard in your solar plexus, you're done kid, even if you don't die from that hit (which you might). You're probably disoriented and struggling to breathe, which leaves you vulnerable to whatever else.
fd54a1 No.604018
>>603985
I have no idea why you would strike at the shoulder from the side either strike at the front or from above. Effecting the celiac plexus will only happen if the force carries through the abdomen it is likely to be absorbed by fat muscle and intestines. The gut is an excellent target for nonlethal attack with a blunt weapon but you should not bother with lethal attack unless you see an opening.
97c63c No.604026
>>604018
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFiIDl_mt2c
This short clip does a pretty good job giving a explanation of why you hit people in the side of their body.
e2e061 No.604116
>>604018
Man you need to actually stand in a fight or take some kind of combat (I'm in boxing). Your primal instincts will quickly kick in during a fight, and you'll learn when the chips are down your mind doesn't care about your shoulder but for your vitals, and there's a reason for that. You will literally find yourself blocking blows with your hands and your shoulders without even thinking, and you'll also learn, the hard way apparently, that LIFTING up your ARM to land a blow is extremely dangerous to you and yields little benefit even if you land. This is not Hollywood. With a blunt object, facing down an opponent, side blows are all you got unless your opponent in on the floor or literally directly below and in front of you.
tl;dr the shoulders should not be your primary target when facing an opponent lol
I aim towards the nose, solar plexus if it's practical, or ear if I can get to it, broadly the face but not the skull.
I'm not expert by any means but your shoulder? Come on dude don't get yourself hurt thinking that
776e38 No.604122
>>604116
>not breaking his kneecaps with a baseball bat
>not proceeding to break all the bones in his limbs while he's on the ground
>not proceeding to t bag him
ab7b9b No.604140
776e38 No.604143
>>604140
>needing a fucking wheel to break bones
LOL if you can't fuck up an unrestrained man you're a pussy
>tying a man to a pole to shoot him
>blindfolding him because you're too much of a bitch to look him in the eyes
>not letting him run across a field under fire with the promise of a full pardon if he can get to the other side alive
<needing gallows to hang a man
<not strangling him with your bare hands
>needing a chamber to gas jews
>not having your fattest ss officer sit on their faces and BRAAAAPPP
<needing a guillotine to behead your deposed king/politicians
<not facing him in a sword duel, with a line of people waiting their turn if you fail
The electric chair and lethal injection do not get an alternative because they are too gay
ab7b9b No.604151
>>604143
You fail to see the point of them being tied down, It is so you can watch them suffer for days until they die for whatever reason in agony.
Pardon is forgiveness, and forgiveness is the true weakness.
The survival time after being "wheeled" or "broken" could be extensive. Accounts exist of a 14th-century murderer who remained conscious for three days after undergoing the punishment.[3] In 1348, during the time of the Black Death, a Jewish man named Bona Dies underwent the punishment. The authorities stated he remained conscious for four days and nights afterwards.
776e38 No.604226
>>604151
How about execution by school shooting?
>take criminals and lock them in an abandoned school
>"school shooter" enters and has one hour to kill as many as he can
>anyone who survives is free
e2e061 No.604231
>>604122
I was just telling this dude who thinks a hammer fist to the shoulder is a good idea, that it ISN'T a good idea. I mean, yeah, a baseball bat is a proven weapon, if not a bit too heavy and clumsy compared to other ACTUAL combat weapons like batons.
776e38 No.604235
>>604231
Anything is an actual combat weapon when it's applied to the kneecaps
e2e061 No.604237
e2e061 No.604242
bc4c5f No.604295
>>604143
>>604226
Why would you let a criminal go free?
>>604228
Ever allowing the use of drugs in a moral society. Thou seemeth to be a dastardly scoundrel!
fd54a1 No.604544
>>604116
>Man you need to actually stand in a fight or take some kind of combat
You are really making a lot of assumptions.
Having experience sport boxing does little to help you understand medieval combat. In sport boxing there is little chance of a shattered clavicle but if that happens during a medieval fight you lose usage of an entire arm. You are applying principles you have learned to things you know nothing about. Overhead strikes with a mace can be performed faster because of gravity and if you have a shield you can use it to prevent an interrupting blow. Overhead attacks are the most effective way to hit the most vulnerable target to blunt weapons the opponent has which is the head.
9ead7c No.604627
>>604544
Do you own a mace? Have you ever been in a real fight with a bludgeon? Because I own maces and have clubbed someone in the head before with a cudgel and I can tell you that the head is not the fasted place to strike someone, if anything it would be the left thigh. Also I can tell you his boxing experience means WAY more than what you have read.
d7effc No.605257
>>593666
>>593837
Poleaxes>single handed warhammers. Poleaxes rape the shit out of swords. The halberd is the contrarian's katana, but the poleaxe is the contrarain's halberd. The best pre gunpowder age army compositions are
>Oriental steppe horse archers
>the english army at agincourt
513425 No.605281
>>605257
as much as people hate it, the zulus were a pretty good irregular infantry. if they could have had modern training and equipment, i reckon they could have been a continental power. at least until the usual nigger shit happened and it all fell to pieces. those short spears they had were fantastic weapons.
513425 No.605283
>>605281
and by modern, i mean right before gunpowder started being a thing. they were still on the zerg rush train, with a little bit of tactics thrown in for fun.
77e809 No.606209
>>593837
I'd imagine they'd be used much like a greatsword, a.k.a area-denial tactics - just very large swooping swings to fight multiple opponents, or rather make them want to fuck off, say if you were defending a bridge or a doorway or something like that. I can't imagine they'd be good for anything other than keeping opponents at a distance and or breaking bones if they have the balls to get close.
6d5e47 No.606434
>>605257
Poleaxe is literally a little shorter halberd, retard.
It's the halberd's predecessor.
01a17d No.606473
>>606434
Maybe a baby that can't own a real weapon may not want to throw around insults. Still waiting on that spear.