[ / / / / / / / / / / / / / ] [ dir / 4am / asatru / cafechan / hikki / imouto / leftpol / sw / v4c ][Options][ watchlist ]

/k/ - Weapons

Salt raifus and raifu accessories
You can now write text to your AI-generated image at https://aiproto.com It is currently free to use for Proto members.
Email
Comment *
File
Select/drop/paste files here
* = required field[▶ Show post options & limits]
Confused? See the FAQ.
Expand all images

There's no discharge in the war!

File (hide): 638e10a68bb8438⋯.jpg (36.2 KB, 198x228, 33:38, 1224688376076.jpg) (h) (u)

[–]

28230f (1) No.539793>>539815 >>539820 [Watch Thread][Show All Posts]

When different branches of the Armed Forces compete for budget, when a captain decides to defy orders from a general and sends his units to battle and so on. That's what I mean by unit pride. Why is it allowed? Isn't it a bad thing? Why can't the many men in leadership positions of the military understand that working as a whole is more efficient and important than earning your unit some glory?

b54e95 (1) No.539815

>>539793 (OP)

Dick-waving is extremely motivational in armed groups and competition tends to increase competence up to an upper limit threshold after which it catastrophically backfires.

t. Artillery loader conscript who's Arm's pride was severely demoralized by special-ops muhdickery


938053 (1) No.539820>>539854 >>539875

File (hide): f5abe75f92d8e7e⋯.png (503.19 KB, 430x739, 430:739, Japanese_soldier_poses_wit….png) (h) (u)

File (hide): 1981c949a14f335⋯.jpg (190.94 KB, 760x1024, 95:128, Japanese_troops_and_an_ele….jpg) (h) (u)

File (hide): 286a2ad9744ee98⋯.jpg (294.75 KB, 1251x851, 1251:851, Japanese_soldiers_with_cap….jpg) (h) (u)

>>539793 (OP)

The best example is the rivalry between the army and navy in Japan up until the end of ww2. There is a story about the army purposefully drafting experienced dock workers only to make the life of the navy harder. The reason of this rivalry was mostly due to the lack of a high command that could keep them in order. But it was also because the political influence of both forces dependent upon their influence. If Japs were waging land wars in mainland Asia, then everybody had to kowtow to the army, and the navy was just a glorified taxi service. But if they were fighting for all those Pacific islands, then it was the navy's time to shine, and the army only had to mop up some enemy resistance and police the occupied lands.

Now, in the 1930s had Korea and the Manchukuo, and they were fighting in China. It looked like they will eventually conquer all those lands, and it was all a question of time now. So the army turned its attention towards Mongolia and the USSR, only to end up with a humiliating defeat at Khalkhin Gol. Then it was the navy's turn to shine, and they started conquering all the European colonies, which was quite easy when Europe was busy with the second world war. But of course it threatened American interests, and that resulted in sanctions first. Then the navy had the bright idea of Pearl Harbour, which was a politically retarded idea to begin with. Then it turned out that the navy's tactics and strategies were all wrong to begin with, as they didn't prepare for a war of attrition where the new starts of the show are the air force.

They should have been thinking in terms of logistics, wage a submarine war and use carrier groups to destroy the formations of the US Navy. That way they could have dominated all shipping in the Pacific for enough time to entrench themselves in their new territories, and maybe even let the will of the public of the USA erode. The later is quite unlikely though, but we are already in the land of pure speculation, so I better stop here.

The important lesson to learn is this: war is a political tool, therefore you must force your generals and admirals to serve the political interests of your country, not the other way around. If you can keep them in line, then you also have the force to do away with this inter-service squabbling.


3fbf50 (1) No.539854>>540222

File (hide): 8cf7913c6f9db10⋯.png (522.65 KB, 750x537, 250:179, very nice desu ne.png) (h) (u)

>>539820

High quality Hungarian post, as always. You make your nation proud.


f7d9c6 (1) No.539875>>540222

>>539820

I disagree with the second half of this post. Japan estimated that the US had a 5:1 industrial advantage over them, they knew they could never win a war of attrition it was closer to 10:1 in 1941, 20:1 by 1944, so they prepared instead for the war they thought they might be able to win and never got a chance to fight it. The Kido Butai was the strongest air wing afloat in the world until late 1942 but Japan didn't have the resources to make good on its losses, let alone expand and modernize it to keep pace with the USN's carrier fleet. The IJN aggressively committed submarines to hunt Allied ships but their codes were cracked, and the only real Allied shipping that was happening in the Pacific until the island hopping campaign began in 1943 was to Australia and any hopes of interdicting that ended with the Battle of the Coral Sea and the Battle of Midway.

A better leadership could have done better, but an Imperial Japan with leadership wouldn't have been Imperial Japan.


c10ff1 (1) No.540222

>>539854

Well, thank you.

>>539875

As far as I understand their whole idea was to bait the US into attacking them, and then constantly harass the attacking fleet until their own navy can take it on and win. The subs were supposed to be part of this strategy and take out ships from the single US Navy fleet coming for them. I'm thinking of a purposefully dragged out war where they aggressively mine all parts of the Pacific frequented by allied ships, and use subs to keep the minefields there. Maybe this could have given them the time to simply besiege and starve out all US outposts (even Hawaii). But then again, even I doubt it would have worked.

The important lesson here is that the whole conflict between Japan and the USA could have been solved with diplomatic deals and brinkmanship, but that simply wasn't in the interest of the IJN. And there wasn't a political force to keep them in line. There wasn't even a political force with a long-term plan, just oligarchs and the military all doing their own thing. Of course I admit that I'm hardly an expert of this subject, and so I might be missing some key elements here.




[Return][Go to top][Catalog][Screencap][Nerve Center][Cancer][Update] ( Scroll to new posts) ( Auto) 5
5 replies | 2 images | 6 UIDs | Page ?
[Post a Reply]
[ / / / / / / / / / / / / / ] [ dir / 4am / asatru / cafechan / hikki / imouto / leftpol / sw / v4c ][ watchlist ]