328db9 No.508408
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/08/05/breaking-7-62mm-rifle-replace-m4-carbine-interim-combat-service-rifle-solicitation-released-us-army/
http://archive.is/Yl7cM
>The US Army has released a solicitation for a new 7.62mm infantry rifle to replace the M4. The Interim Combat Service Rifle program, known to be in the works since April of this year, would replace M4 Carbines in use with combat units with a new weapon in the 7.62x51mm caliber. The new solicitation requires companies to submit 7 weapons plus ancillaries for testing, and includes the promise of up to 8 Other Transaction Agreements (OTAs, non-contract transactions), leading to the eventual selection of 1 weapon for a contract of 50,000 units.
>The primary justification for the ICSR program are improved ceramic body armors that are resistant to existing forms of small arms ammunition. The logic goes that the Army’s new 5.56mm M855A1 round cannot penetrate these new armors, and therefore the service must switch to a new round. However, this is misleading, as current 7.62mm M80A1 is incapable of penetrating these body armors either – and specialty tungsten cored ammunition in both 5.56mm and 7.62mm calibers are capable of penetrating armor of this type. The US Army seems to be banking on its yet-undescribed XM1158 ADVAP round to bridge this gap – however Chief Milley himself admitted in testimony to Congress that the ADVAP’s design could be applied to either 7.62mm or 5.56mm ammunition.
>These facts leave us with very little justification for the move to 7.62mm. It’s difficult to ignore the picture that a move towards a larger caliber infantry rifle has been lobbied for by manufacturers for over a decade, as it would give whoever won a toehold on a highly lucratic exclusive contract. Sadly, all this program will do is take a load off Chief Milley’s back, and put it on the backs of our troops. One wonders if General Milley is willing to write to families of the dead when ICSR-equipped units run dry of ammunition and are overrun by 5.45mm-armed foes.
Maybe they want to play in Korea in the near future?
5001d4 No.508417
>>508408
>One wonders if General Milley is willing to write to families of the dead when ICSR-equipped units run dry of ammunition and are overrun by 5.45mm-armed foes.
Who the fuck writes this shit
875330 No.508421
>>508417
Some fat autist. He posts on this forum:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/autogun/
Which is actually quite good. But he really lets the autism run wild there. Holy shit. He does the *teleports behind you* type shit with asterisks and everything. Starts talking about things he doesn't understand and than has a tantrum because someone-in-the-know puts him in his place.
15b2ea No.508425
>>508408
>Maybe they want to play in Korea in the near future?
they do want that but considering that in korea most fights would take place in urban enviroment they would be fine with a caliber they already have.
it would be more suited to fighting in afghanistan… or syria
328db9 No.508426
>>508421
My favourite part is how he's obsessed with disproving the idea of a general purpose cartridge. He wrote who knows how many pages of text in this subject, but it's always about the weight an individual rifleman has to carry, and never touched the improved logistics. Which is -in my opinion- the essence of this whole idea.
>>508425
Actually, they mostly speak about body armour, and how they want to rebarrel these rifles for a new 6.5mm cartridge later. Which means that either they will abandon the LSAT/CTSAS program, or that these rifles will be completely useless when they switch to cased telescopic ammunition.
79e017 No.508427
>>508408
>replace M4 Carbines in use with combat units with a new weapon in the 7.62x51mm caliber
Good. 7.62x51 is nice, and the recoil is, despite what every little weakshouldered faggot claims, not bad at all. Especially when you are in urban situations, being able to punch through a stone wall, or just scaring the shit out of the enemy by making the bricks around him burst one by one, is a valid strategy with 7.62. Not so much with 5.56.
7.62x51 also has insane range, which is required in more mountainous terrain, such as a lot of the middle east.
The Bundeswehr already switched some of their riflemen back to the G3ZF, just to be able to perform better at medium-long ranges, and have something that can kick through a shed without much trouble. I honestly wish the rifle we adopt this or next year will be 7.62 too, but judging by the fact that HK only plans to produce 7.62x51 later on for the HK433 we will probably be stuck with the 5.56 version, and later move on to the 7.62 in limited numbers.
328db9 No.508429
>>508427
Let me quote that document:
>The 7.62 M80 (the standard NATO ball round) is an old design which is effective but not very efficient. It is not efficient for two reasons. First, because the bullet does not usually yaw very rapidly on impact. Second, it has an unimpressive long-range performance for its calibre due to the mediocre aerodynamics of the bullet which sheds velocity quite quickly. It is effective simply through the size and power of the bullet which delivers considerable terminal effectiveness and barrier penetration, but that power has a serious cost in weight and recoil.
What we truly need is a rimless 6.5mm Arisaka employed like how the Brits wanted to use their .280 cartridge.
15b2ea No.508432
>>508429
6.5 or 7mm is perfect but we will never get it since infrastrocture ffor it doesnt exist, you would need to change tooling in all ammoplants
f5c0ed No.508434
>>508408
>return to 7.62x51 for standard issue rifle
Why no .45-70? Rifle is so insignificant right now that Americans can just develop new penetrator round for 5.56x45 or give 6 trillion shekels to MIC to give every ZOGbot automatic grenade launcher. You call 2mln $ worth airstrike if you face DShK emplacement anyway.
9ee990 No.508439
>>508408
maybe they want a round that actually has distance, penetration, and stopping power?
lmao
2cd1ff No.508440
>>508434
>45-70 makes a comeback as a standard round
Don't make me break my desk with my dick anon
9ee990 No.508441
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>508427
exactly this
If you complain about 7.62x51 recoil in a semi-automatic, then you really don't know what recoil is, and you're an actual pussy.
Everyone who complains about .308 recoil in semi-autos should be required to shoot a 300 win mag in some light synthetic bolt action repeatedly for three months to cure them of their pussification, not even joking.
>>508429
>yaw
vid-related proves you're wrong
>muh sectional density
165 grain nullifies "muh sectional density" fedora-ism
all that leaves is your "the recoil is too strong for my pussy" argument, which is a non-argument because there is no recoil. The problem with recoil is caused by you, not the round. Not our fault you can't shoot and limit yourself to midget rounds your whole life and so have no idea as to what actual real recoil is.
7125b2 No.508445
>>508425
Ammunition usage isn't that much of a issue in urban combat for americans as they usually have a robust supply system in place, or atleast had.
What is needed is range, penetration and good terminal ballistics. Atleast in Hue city, it was sharpshooters, hand-grenades, mortars, artillery and tanks that ended up being most useful. Basically anything that either had good range or caused things to explode.
09abb3 No.508451
>>508408
>One wonders if General Milley is willing to write to families of the dead when ICSR-equipped units run dry of ammunition and are overrun by 5.45mm-armed foes.
This reads like that old /k/ cod wiki fanfiction where a special forces unit killed a bunch of enemies because they were armed with 1911s and the bad guys had M9s.
6946f8 No.508452
>>508432
I bet Lake City could have production lines going in less than two weeks, especially if it was based on an existing case.
04b3b5 No.508455
>>508417
>>508408
>Who the fuck writes this shit
Some guy with an actual brain, that has realized that 5.56mm on a short barrel is fucking useless past 400mm because it doesn't have the energy to tumble properly and the average engagement in places like Afghanistan are at 700m.
It's dubious NATO in Afghanistan ever seriously injured ANYONE in 16 years of war with a short barreled carbine or a minimi… unless it was in some unusually close distance engagement or a lucky straight bullet.
The minute burst and full auto have been out of the picture (with the end of military service/conscription:AKA spray and pray. All rifles with burst mode are literally designed counting on whoever is using them to miss what he's shooting at…) is the minute it made sense to go back to semi-auto larger caliber weapons.
3ad131 No.508457
>>508441
A better cartridge can still be designed, so this move is really a waste on their part. Especially because they've got not one, but two cartridges already ready, they'd just have to do the testing. Therefore this move only makes sense if they suspect that a war against armed forces that issue body armour en masse will start before they can actually adopt those cartridges…
>>508455
You got it wrong, the writer is famous for autistically screeching about how adopting anything that's heavier than current 5.56x45mm is suicidal, because it means people will run out of ammunition after about 3 seconds in a firefight. One of those cartridges is this LSAT/CTSAS one. It weights 15g compared to the 12g of 5.56, and it's in a case bigger than necessary, so the weight will most likely be reduced close to 12g anyway. And it's better than 7.62x51 or 7.62x54. I suppose I don't have to explain to you how a PKM-like machine gun with lighter and more powerful ammo would be a miracle of the universe.
9b402c No.508458
>>508445
>What is needed is range, penetration and good terminal ballistics. Atleast in Hue city, it was sharpshooters, hand-grenades, mortars, artillery and tanks that ended up being most useful. Basically anything that either had good range or caused things to explode.
we dont have to look this far to know how modern urban combat looks like. I believe that this will be closer to estimate how new korean war will work out. Where once were mudhuts there are skyscrapers now
so yeah still mostly correct but tanks will be useless thanks to rpgs and all other shit, but i believe that current calliber will work without many problems.
7a2d38 No.508491
Why don't they use soft point ammo as well for humane killings? Snack bars didn't sign a treaty.
2854fe No.508492
It was my understanding that most of the nations that sent soldiers to Afghanistan (alongside the Burgers) had squaddies repeatedly telling anyone who would listen that the 5.56mm shekel round I'm going to call it that until you Burgers apologise, formally, for muh EM2 & muh .280 British was underpowered, couldn't deliver lethal force at the ranges they needed, and was just shitty all around. Even Britain is in the process of swapping out the poor old L86-LSW (an LMG that desperately wanted to be a DMR) for the L129A1 sharpshooter rifle. Is this just the burgers catching up to everyone else? If it is then we should all remember that a few years behind the rest of the world is not bad by their standards.
540c2d No.508493
>Bongistinian .280 Brit screeching intensifies
2854fe No.508494
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>508493
Motherfucker, I will screech until you apologise.
79e9b5 No.508499
>>508492
That was because they were still using M855. When they fielded Mk 262, those complaints disappeared.
7a2d38 No.508503
>>508427
Why can't they make they install recoil pads in armor?
e10cd2 No.508504
>>508439
b-but muh tumbling rounds muh .223 muh bigger rounds are heavy
>>508494
>apologize for not adopting a meme
2854fe No.508505
>>508499
>[new version of our product] completely fixes all the problems you're experiencing.
>Honest.
>And you get all that for only 3 times the cost!
>Just don't stop buying our [product]
Pic related.
>>508503
The pentagon is concerned about the effects of American GIs becoming 'too classy'.
>>508504
>not adopting a meme
A meme that could have fixed all the problems with the 5.56, before that round was even developed. That's some meme right there!
7a2d38 No.508506
>>508505
Well if they're downsizing they might as well clean out the trash.
Imagine the military going on the hunt for illegal migrants who're crossing the border.
e10cd2 No.508509
>>508505
>still a meme round with no benefit beyond "oi'm bri'ish and this round is also bri'ish pls no bully"
>reddit impact font image macro
>memegenerator.net
79e9b5 No.508511
>>508505
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/mk262.htm
http://www.pro-patria.us/designated_marksman
https://web.archive.org/web/20110915075030/http://archives.gunsandammo.com/content/evolution-ar
>Designated MK 262 Mod 0, this load quickly earned an enviable reputation in Afghanistan for excellent accuracy and superior terminal performance. Kills were made with this load out to 700 meters, and in one engagement two SF operators armed with SPRs killed 75 Taliban with 77 rounds. Upgraded to become the current MK 262 Mod 1, this load features a 77-grain Sierra MatchKing with a cannelure for reliable operation in full-automatic weapons.
Mk 262 is the basis for the Marine's Mk 318 which can go through barriers, which is what the Army should have adopted.
2854fe No.508512
>>508506
Well, if you're going hunting you might as well do it properly.
2854fe No.508514
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>508509
>Hey Bubba!
>Dem Brits say they've gotta round that has the high points of .303 while lettin' 'em carry, like, a lot more.
<Huh. Is it made in 'Murrica?
>Nope
<So it must be crap.
<Let's adopt this round that we made, yes everyone who uses it hates it, yes it's shit in every way, but the company that sells it makes HUGE contributions to all kinds of politicians, so it must be great!
<What do those dumb grunts even know about rifles anyway?
I know I started with the autistic screeching joke, but your post basically is vid related.
3c8bf4 No.508515
>>508503
I take it would be too easy of a solution for a problem they currently don't experience. If they will ever have problems with recoil, then they will start a program for a few billion dollars to come up with something that has computers in it and requires a battery to work.
>>508509
>what's the point of adopting a round suited for automatic fire from a shoulder-fired weapon that has a decent effective range when you can just go with a slightly shorter version of a cartridge from 1906 and later adopt a varmint round, only to abandon the .22 NATO and go back to the shortened 30-06 while you had a range of better options available for decades
Really makes me think…
2854fe No.508516
>>508511
Interesting claims. I'll accept them when they come from a source I can trust.
04b3b5 No.508518
>>508511
>First pic.
>Breaking NEWS: Using an optic on a gun gives better groupings.
>Up next: Water is wet.
It's even more blatant that the typical change of scale for wound channels from M193 to M855…
813c52 No.508521
Ceramic armor that can stand up to 7.62 is code for powered exoskeletons.
773bd4 No.508526
>>508492
We're adopting .264 USA soon, don't worry :^)
7a2d38 No.508529
Why not implement quick change barrels and 260 rem?
6946f8 No.508539
>>508529
After what they did to their .300 Win Mag rifles, I could see them trying to load a .260 to the point you're getting >1k barrel life.
11e87d No.508543
>>508432
If the military and bureaucracy had a brain of course it is. They would deal with the retooling and the extra cost that would come from it.
But people have gotten cold feet because we have been fucking around in Afghanistan for 10 years. Then of course I am sure the old fucks in brass yelling about STOPPING POWA.
The true biggest downside to 7.62x51 is training. I think people forget that the average hobby shooter probably shoots twice as much as the standard infantryman.
9ee990 No.508548
>>508457
sorry but there really isn't much of a difference in weight between the 147 grain m80 and a 120 grain 6.5 Grendel. Considering the amount of firepower you're getting in the return, the point is meaningless. The only way to really save weight is 5.56, and that means making big power sacrafices.
>muh sectional density meme
>le 6mm meme
Good luck, but I'll laugh when soldiers start complaining that the epic 6.5mm doesn't solve the long distance problem but is also way heavier than 5.56. It really is the worst of both worlds. Intermediate cartridges were a mistake.
ab1e6b No.508549
>nobody mentions .280 until the brit shows up
Face it, nobody else gives a shit.
>>508526
I can not imagine a greater slight to them.
3c8bf4 No.508550
>>508548
>post about 6.5mm CT and .264 USA
>burger starts babbling about the Grendel
I think there is some kind of a "material-technological conservatism" in some aspects of the culture of the USA. You get attached to certain guns and cartridges for no good reason other than some mistaken historical value. It's quite similar to some Chinese mandarin dismissing Western bureaucracy as some barbarian hocus-pocus that is clearly inferior to their ancient ways. Expect that at least the mandarin's ways were indeed perfected over centuries, while you are attached to 7.62mm and 11.43mm simply because they equal 0.30 and 0.45 inches, respectively.
So let me just quote myself:
>One of those cartridges is this LSAT/CTSAS one. It weights 15g compared to the 12g of 5.56, and it's in a case bigger than necessary, so the weight will most likely be reduced close to 12g anyway. And it's better than 7.62x51 or 7.62x54.
7125b2 No.508567
>>508458
They had plenty of rpg's in Huè too, and it was not the tanks that blew up as much as it was tank crews becoming combat inefficient. Funnily enough, they did not lose a single Ontos during that battle due to shoot & scoot tactics being used with those vehicles.
Now atgm's are a whole different issues but I think abrams with TUSK package should be able to deal with it. I mean a T90 could deal with TOW-2's in Syria, TUSK package probably offers atleast the same degree of protection as the era bricks on T90.
Either way, small arms immune, tracked fighting vehicles capable of delivering high explosive shells are extremely useful and outright necessary in eliminating enemy strongpoints as the other options are either having to rely on limited air assets or in-direct fire artillery that may or may not be effective or available, or just having infantry to expose themselves and eliminate that enemy strongpoint with more costly measures.
3c8bf4 No.508573
>>508567
>or just having infantry to expose themselves and eliminate that enemy strongpoint with more costly measures
Or how about giving the infantry some more firepower?
7a2d38 No.508575
>>508567
Would an Abrams be able to survive modern warfare where the US didn't have air supremacy?
67979d No.508580
>>508575
what tank can survive a lack of air supremacy? furthermore, if we lose air supremacy were just gonna start launching nukes
7a2d38 No.508581
>>508580
What makes you think that?
67979d No.508588
>>508581
because if shit were to be bad enough that we lose the backbone of our entire military strategy, which is air superiority, the nuclear option would look mighty good
ae0d60 No.508590
>>508588
I don't think we'd resort to nukes just because the chinks set up some decent SAM defense.
9ee990 No.508591
>>508550
No, my Hungarian friend, I am attached to the .308 caliber because I've been using that bullet for years in various iterations, .308, 30-06, 300 win mag, and I have witnessed over and over again it's dramatic superiority in power compared even to a .270 wsm or 7mm Remington, let alone an actual intermediate cartridge, even if it is a 30 caliber like the 7.62x39. That little difference in diameter makes a tremendous difference downrange. It's ironic though because that's exactly what you "muh sectional density" fedoras argue so bitterly, but when it comes time to admit to the fact of the difference in terms of energy/power, oh, no, that's a pure coincidence, or it is "overkill."
>were perfected over centuries at least
that's basically what happened to the 30 caliber over the last 150 years or so, which can be considered "centuries" due to the time conversion caused by modern technology.
>let me quote myself
except what you said is meaningless. The weight issue is a non-issue considering that the 6mm and 6.5mm hype rounds are only about 30 grains lighter than the 7.62x51 and are of similar dimensions but considerably weaker. If you want a meaningful difference in performance and logistics, it really comes down to 7.62x51 and 5.56, everything in the middle is a military-industrial complex jackoff trying to justify the next inflated budget and its inability to admit the 5.56 is a failure and that the entire history of intermediate cartridges was a mistake.
09abb3 No.508593
>>508567
>Funnily enough, they did not lose a single Ontos during that battle due to shoot & scoot tactics being used with those vehicles.
Could it be that the Ontos is just full on terrifying? Six 106mm howitzers firing at the same time is a whole lot of "fuck everything in this grid reference".
>it's official designation is "Rifle, Multiple 106 mm, Self-propelled, M50"
9ee990 No.508595
>>508591
>>508550
forgot pic-related. I embrace my burgertude.
>caseless ammo
it's a meme.
f6e0c1 No.508620
>>508492
just get a scar-h and put a heavy suppressor and heavy scope on it. complaining it was too light and that it lost the sight picture a lot makes me think they're trials for a DMR was extremely vanilla. yet The L129A1 is definitely better than our crappy ebr's which I think have only recently been fully replaced by the 20 DMR replacements we've got going around. I have no clue why we can't decide upon one, I think we just like having lots of toys.
b75596 No.508633
>>508514
Says the guy who repeatedly goes into threads just to cry about the EM2.
ab1e6b No.508634
>>508633
>he thinks it's one guy
Anon, you don't understand. We collectively traumatized them with .308 and 5.56 I'm certain these are different bongs.
Not that it should matter to them with their complete lack of weapons.
58cee5 No.508635
>replacing 5.56 with 7.62 NATO
Oh good now you're down to 4 mags in a ripped up chest rig and the rest hauled around on your back.
Not to mention the average grunt can't shoot to save his life with 5.56 and they want him to develop a flinch that turns him into AA support on semi-auto.
Who the fuck thought this was a good idea
2854fe No.508639
>>508549
>nobody else gives a shit.
I'm not contesting that point. It's also not my fault if you're all fucking retards who don't give a shit about using shitty ammunition that was only developed as a way to transfer your tax dollars into the pockets of businessmen with close relationships to your elected 'representatives'.
>>508620
>I have no clue why we can't decide upon one, I think we just like having lots of toys
Or as a way to keep your military budget inflated and your arms companies profitable and happy. It's much easier to do that by buying large numbers of different tools for the same job and funding lunatic corporate prototypes that definitely do not serve as a handy way to embezzle public money.
>>508634
Or maybe it's that the lack of guns gives me so much more time and motivation to shit post on /k/ as it's a way to fill the time I would otherwise have spent on the range or innawoods.
ab1e6b No.508640
>>508639
>Or as a way to keep your military budget inflated
Seems like we'd best keep it inflated lest we end up like you
>Or maybe it's that the lack of guns gives me so much more time and motivation to shit post on /k/
<Have no guns
<shitpost on a firearms enthusiast board
f6e0c1 No.508642
>>508640
that's what I've never understood.
the most you can own anywhere in Britain is a sport rifle right?
even imitation guns can't be owned unless your 18?
3c8bf4 No.508644
>>508591
>cased telescopic
>lighter than 7.62x51
>has more energy at long ranges than 7.62x51
These are all simple facts.
>that's basically what happened to the 30 caliber
So that's why 7.62 NATO is an oversized round pushing obsolete projectiles. Because it's so perfect. I see. By the way, 150 years ago was in 1867, quite a few years before the invention of smokeless powder, and just after the American Civil War.
Honestly, you've kind of proved my point. "It's old, I've always used it, this is the best, everything new is inferior."
cacc67 No.508648
>this thread
Nice to see this /k/ hasn't been brainwashed by the military industrial complex into shilling for the 5.56. Truly the worst fucking round ever conceived, glad to see the US military finally admit that they've been duped and kill that meme round once and for all. Now, if only we could get them to admit that 10mm > literally every other pistol caliber.
773bd4 No.508649
>>508550
Sentimentality is a big thing in the US.
db0851 No.508652
>>508425
Any war on the Korean peninsula would be fought almost exclusively in the territory of North Korea. Does NK have plenty of Urban areas? Sure, but it's Urban areas are hardly larger than they were in the 1950's.
Go read up on the Korean War and tell me how much the war was dictated by fighting in the cities. Combat in NK wasn't Urban, if anything it was identical to the long range mountain combat of Afghanistan, except much colder. A 7.62x51 service rifle would be perfect for a war against NK for the same reasons it makes sense for Afghanistan.
2d32c7 No.508655
>>508635
If you develop a flinch with 7.62 in a semi auto, you shouldn't even be in the military
2d32c7 No.508656
>>508644
Lol caseless ammo is a meme, and will never happen
So now what you've got? You've got no points left besides muh caseless. You know I'm right, butthurt Euro-cuck. I don't want my military pussified like Europe.
2d32c7 No.508657
>>508644
>Obsolete
Read my post again
You know why you can't tell the difference in 30? I forgot that Euro-cucks can't shoot guns for fun lmao.
9b402c No.508659
>>508656
vulcan and telescopic
>>508652
>Any war on the Korean peninsula would be fought almost exclusively in the territory of North Korea.
lets just say i believe in incompetence of your army more then into incompetence of norks
cacc67 No.508661
>>508659
Not even burgers can fuck up as bad as commies can.
3c8bf4 No.508662
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>508656
>caseless ammo
I have to constantly remind myself that the USA is filled with mystery meat, hence all these retarded comments. It's not caseless. Let me repeat myself, it's not caseless. That means it's not caseless. Just to clarify, by not caseless I mean it has a case, therefore it's not caseless. Vid related.
>So now what you've got?
I've got these:
<lighter than 7.62x51
<retains more energy at long ranges than 7.62x51
>I don't want my military pussified like Europe.
Which military pushed for 5.56x45? Which military is full of trannies and stronk wymyn? That's right, yours.
>>508657
I can read it as many times as you want, it doesn't change anything. I bet you'd argue that 7.62 Tokarev is more powerful than 6.5 Arisaka, because muh .30. Also, different rounds with completely different cases that are sent through a barrel of the same calibre aren't "iterations" of each other, and ".30" wasn't "perfected" over more than a hundred years. It's just the diameter of the hole running through the barrel. Therefore going on about .300 Winchester Magnum is completely besides the point when we discuss 7.62x51mm. By that logic 6.5x55mm and 6.5×25mm CBJ are closely related to each other.
9b402c No.508664
>>508661
>implying burgers arent commies too
norks will be succesfull at an early push, before yanks arrive. After that everything will be a clusterfuck.
7a2d38 No.508665
Is the retooling of ammo factories REALLY that difficult for switching calibers?
Why are expanding bullets considered inhumane when people flip out over you using FMJ on Deer? I would rather have someone die than be severely disabled,or suffer for hours.
7a2d38 No.508666
I hear 260 rem has the same ballistics as the legendary 7.5mm Swiss or was it 6mm Swede which is also great…
cacc67 No.508668
>>508664
I think it's more plausible that Trump will make the first move. He has already stated that the Obongo policy of strategic patience is over. Fat Kimmy talks a big game, but even he can't be delusional enough to think he can start a war against NATO and come up on top. He's trying to game enough time to build a working intercontinential nuke, and the white house has stated that ain't happening. Not to mention they have pretty much their entire artillery supply pointed at SK ready to fire, if Trump MOAB's the shit out of them they can't repel a land invasion. When we start talking about tanks, APC's, planes, choppas, ships etc it's not even a competition. The Norks are going to be absolutely slaughtered.
2d32c7 No.508670
>>508662
Caseless meme is a meme
You don't even know because you can't fucking own firearms lmao Euro-cuck. You pull Google images out your ass all day and have never even shot the rounds I mentioned, because you're not allowed to shoot by your cuck government. You don't know shit because you never used shit.
>Muh energy at long range.
Except it doesn't
>The diameter is just the hole
Lmao you're a moron
2d32c7 No.508671
>>508662
And that stupid fucking Google image you keep spamming used fucking 130 grain 7.62. No one fucking uses 130 grain 7.62x51, the standard is 150 grain you godamn idiot.
You know why they used 130 grain? To fucking cherry pick their caseless meme, bc if 150 were used the caseless meme would have lost lmao dumbass
2d32c7 No.508674
>>508662
And as for pussy military, Europe cuckery is the reason why we had to abandon the 30-06 in the first place. And Europe kept complaining about how big, powerful, and subliminally Nazi the 7.62x51, bc postwar Europe is filled with mewling limp wristed anti Nazi faggots that think anything big and powerful is Nazi, so burgers capitulated and did 5.56 so you would shut the fuck up.
Yeah, modern us military is pozzed as shit, and it deserves the caseless meme for that reason, but apparently someone still has balls, and just because the army is filled with faggots doesn't mean I'm not going to stop shilling the manly .30
3c8bf4 No.508676
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>508670
>Caseless meme is a meme
I'd like you think that you are just shitposting, but I'm not that optimistic. Now click on this image from jewgle.
>>508671
The M80 projectile weights 9.7g, or 147 grain. The new M80A1 weights 7.4g (114.5 grain). By your logic they actually made those charts look better for the 7.62 version, because it has a heavier projectile than either the 6.5mm or the M80A1.
>>508674
I don't have an animu girl confused and angry enough for that post.
Also, this isn't a fucking live chat, you can take your time to write a reply. Not that it would improve the sheer QUALITY of your posts.
0654db No.508679
>>508575
Infantry always ends up bringing everything that has even remote possibility of making things blow up and that wasn't welded down to the floor or deck whenever infantry ends up fighting in a city and that fight lasts longer than a single day. And you need firepower that can collapse buildings from a distance. And unless you are going to send infantry to throw satchel charges at enemy strongpoints, I don't see how infantry is going to be able to carry necessary amount of firepower.
Japanese ripped the autocannons and smaller cannons off of their ships in Mannilla, and if I remember correctly, in Huê someone ended up using super-bazooka to the point where it could no longer be reloaded as the rocket would just end up falling off.
09abb3 No.508680
>>508652
>A 7.62x51 service rifle would be perfect for a war against NK for the same reasons it makes sense for Afghanistan.
Gee I sure like having 20 whole rounds on tap when I'm being rushed by 200 screaming gooks with AKs blazing.
Might as well get the M1s out of storage, dat fuddy ought six will go right thru 5 uh dem chinamen.
58cee5 No.508681
>>508655
You don't get to pick and choose who gets in, asshole. These are people who think their gun's broken when it runs dry. They're the people who walk in front of friendly MG fire between bursts and plant themselves there. These are guys who think Iraqi troops will actually watch their back.
2854fe No.508682
>>508640
<Have no guns
<shitpost on a firearms enthusiast board
If it helps think of it like this.
>Firearms enthusiast, living in what is effectively a nofuns country.
>Try every opportunity to change the legislation, but a politician trying to even raise firearms once is enough for them to be blacklisted as a 'fringe lunatic'.
>Develop severe firearms blue-balls.
>Find the closest thing you can get to a fix that doesn't involve taking the air-rifle out into the back garden (or after rabbits in the spring).
>Dive in and occasionally get annoyed when people push nonsense on the board that is directly contradicted by even basic research on the subject.
>shitpost after learning that nobody gives a shit about anything else here.
2d32c7 No.508693
>>508681
This wasn't a problem 60 years ago. I shouldn't have to rely on an objectively I inferior round because liberals turned our country gay. Kill the fucking liberals, not 7.62.
58cee5 No.508694
>>508693
You put too much faith in random people, Anon. That's your own fucking fault.
09abb3 No.508699
>>508693
Whoa, we have a badass in the thread. The recruiter who visits your high school must be so proud.
ab1e6b No.508701
>>508676
>Hungary complaining about quality
>A man near universally thought of as a chronic sperg
9d1aec No.508704
>shilling some 6.5mm meme round
>when a superior round like 6.5x55mm exists, and can be readily adapted to use polymer cases or whatever gimmick they're pushing this month
>>508701
Even when Hungary is in full autism mode he never shitposts this hard.
0654db No.508714
>>508680
Getting rushed by 200 screaming japs or koreans in the dead of the night wasn't a problem earlier, why would it be a problem now? It's not like you are getting rid of the squad fire-support weapons now are you?
58cee5 No.508715
>>508714
>wasn't a problem
it kinda was
just a bit
09abb3 No.508716
>>508714
>wasn't a problem
About that….
Look I know you snowniggers had beginners luck against the Russians but the Chinks learned to do things like attack at night and not quarter men on an unfrozen flowing river because orders are orders. Having automatic weapons also helped their cause.
93d3b2 No.508719
>>508716
And attacking at night they still lost a retarded amount of warrior peasant ants. Korea was to the point of lopsided it made the Pacific look like proper 1:1 odds.
6244a3 No.508720
>>508633
I'm pretty sure it is the primary reason he is on /k/, to defend the last good thing the British ever did
6b710c No.508721
>>508720
.270 British was probably a better choice for a military round. .280 was on the slow side, just like Grendel.
0654db No.508734
>>508715
>>508716
>Chinks learned to do things like attack at nigh
So? That's exact same shit that japs did. Except it wasn't cold. And generally speaking US forces managed to deal with it japs coming to say hello at night by prohibiting troop movement during night-time.
The Korean mess can largely be explained due to lack of proper training and preparation on US part due to.
>MUH NUKES
>MUH ETERNAL PEACE BECAUSE OF WW2
>MUH AIRFORCE
9ee990 No.508742
>>508699
>>508680
10 extra rounds of 5.56 isn't going to save you in that situation
a few M60's will.
speaking of the M60, how much of a failure was the m249? Because the whole point of 5.56 was increased mobility and precision, yet that is not what you need in a support role
f4f98e No.508744
>>508742
>Has to be able to feed from an M16 mag for no fucking reason
>Refuse to allow usage of the softshell 'nutsack' belt bags in lieu of the hardshell boxes that have constant problems in the field.
>Don't bother with rebuilds, we'll just get a new SAW in a year or two. No wait, an Automatic Rifle. No wait, an entirely new LMG. No wait, we'll get nothing. Why the fuck are these guns worn out now??
M249 wouldn't be half the shitshow it is without the DoD's fuckups.
67979d No.508745
>>508744
>the US Armed Forces wouldn't be half the shitshow it is without the DoD's fuckups.
ftfy
9d1aec No.508746
>>508742
Minimis work great.
M249s are shit.
73135c No.508798
>zerg rushing
>still this much of a meme on a military oriented board
7f9148 No.508800
>single source
>meaning no mil-spec AR in 308
Meh.
232218 No.508806
>>508746
>Minimis work great.
>M249s are shit.
Minimis are utter shit, M249 are a bit less shit.
127460 No.508809
>>508806
But I thought Minimis were the best-engineered machine guns in the world. Is it just the round it's chambered for that you have a problem with? What about the MK 48?
232218 No.508813
>>508809
MK48/minimi 7.62 are fine, the gun was actually designed for 7.62, and since it removes the ability to feed from stanag mags it fixes most common feeding problems (not that they are many… if they're not old. It's not a gun that age gracefully, like most MGs).
European armies tried to phased out 7.62 totally out of the infantry in the 90's, including all the machineguns, because how great the minimi para were (on paper) and simplify logistics (only vehicles kept theirs). Then Afghanistan came in and everyone pulled out from storage all the older 7.62 infantry machinegun because combat experience returned that there was one slight problem with the minimi:
IT'S NOT A MACHINEGUN.
As in it cannot and will not be able to suppress targets and chew through cover and pass a few hundred meters it can't even chew what would normally only considered concealment because the round is far too anemic for that. It's a "CQC machinegun" which is about as useful as tits on a bear trap because it's tactical niche is "a full-auto assault rifle with more bullets"…
The M249 is a bit better because it has a much longer barrel so the round has a bit more punch.
That's the reason why all those countries that never adopted them before are buying FN MAGs.
8c3709 No.508840
>>508716
>attack at night
we have optics now it isn't 1950 anymore.
3d661b No.508921
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>508408
>Army said they wanted a new battle rifle
>OMG this means they are replacing the M4
Why are people this retarded?
74ed42 No.508954
>>508573
>>508408
Just go back to the FAL, you can shoot rifle grenades and shiet.
770123 No.508965
>>508679
>And unless you are going to send infantry to throw satchel charges at enemy strongpoints, I don't see how infantry is going to be able to carry necessary amount of firepower.
Or use a modernized Goliath. Give it a camera, make it resistant to small arms fire and use a cable instead of radio waves. Of course you'd have to keep them in reserve and only bring them forward when you actually locate a strongpoint.
>Japanese ripped the autocannons and smaller cannons off of their ships in Mannilla
Well, those were actually Japanese muhreens. Still, do you happen to have some good sources on the subject?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manila_massacre
>The Bayview Hotel was used as a designated "rape center".[2] According to testimony at the Yamashita war crimes trial, 400 women and girls were rounded up from Manila's wealthy Ermita district, and submitted to a selection board that picked out the 25 women who were considered most beautiful. These women and girls, many of them 12 to 14 years old, were then taken to the hotel, where Japanese enlisted men and officers took turns raping them.[3]
>>508680
20 cartridges are actually quite a lot against a human wave if you use all 20 of them to fire rifle grenades.
>>508921
https://archive.is/ygCvl
>The Army has identified a potential gap in the capability of ground forces and infantry to penetrate body armor using existing ammunition. To address this operational need, the Army is looking for an Interim Combat Service Rifle (ICSR) that is capable of defeating emerging threats. The Government has a requirement to acquire a commercial 7.62mm ICSR to field with the M80A1 Enhanced Performance Round (EPR) to engage and defeat protected and unprotected threats. The ultimate objective of the program is to acquire and field a 7.62mm ICSR that will increase Soldier lethality.
>7. 20-30 round magazine to support a 210 round combat load
It just doesn't sound like a DMR.
>>508954
Some say the requirements were tailored so that the SCAR-H will win. It's also rumoured that they will also rebarrel it for a new cartridge. So instead of the FN FAL in .280 British they will adopt the FN SCAR in .264 USA. More than 60 years later, but close enough, eh?
ae553d No.508966
>>508441
I've spent my entire life either as a civilian or in the military putzing around with .223/5.56 semi autos or bolt action hunting rifles chambered in whatever 30 caliber strikes your fancy.
I was in Vegas last week and took the opportunity to fuck around at their various gun ranges and fired everything from a SCAR-H to a G3 to an FAL. I was doing double taps and failure to stop drills like it was nothing. I was lead to believe that .308/7.62 was near impossible to control with any sort of rapidity unless you were some Ricky Recon operator with thousands of rounds of experience. It was easy as fuck, and it blows my mind that we ever bothered to even consider the idea of 5.56.
d570d7 No.508967
>>508966
What is the best bullet to use?
ae553d No.508969
>>508967
Use for what? If we're talking combat, 7.62 NATO all fucking day, now that I've been able to fuck around with both that and 5.56. Maybe keep 5.56 LMGs for automatic rifleman and let actual machinegunners keep on with their 7.62 guns.
The cost/benefit of 5.56 is heavy on the cost side for a normal rifleman that either doesn't have automatic or doesn't use it. The extra rounds don't make up for lack of lethality or accuracy at range. I don't care if I'm being Zerg rushed by gooks, I want every round to put a man down, I don't need those extra 10 rounds per mag if it takes three of them just to incapacitate someone.
Lets just napkin math it. Assuming perfect accuracy, 30/3=10 people I can incapacitate (Not necessarily kill on the spot) per mag. With 7.62 NATO I can incapacitate with every single one of my rounds, and reasonably likely kill outright with maybe a third of them. And all I have to do is put one more magpouch on my flak.
d570d7 No.508971
>>508969
for long distance.
7a1d27 No.508979
73135c No.508991
>>508679
Truer words have never been spoken.
5cd3bd No.509006
>>508965
>Storming the City- US Military Performance in Urban Warfare from World War II to Vietnam
Ofcourse I was a gigantic faggot and listened it as a audiobook, so I have no primary sources to give.
>goliaths
Yeah I guess that could work. Bringing them in to a half ruined city in large quantities could be a bit of a pain in the ass though, but those could work quite nicely in areas too small for tanks but too disgusting for infantry.
ae553d No.509010
>>508648
We need to bring back necked pistol rounds to common use. In foot lbs 9x25 Dillon is basically 16 rounds of 44 magnum in your hand. 10mm and derivatives/cousins of 10mm, like the Dillon, .40, and .40 Super or fucking nothing.
cc9741 No.509015
>>508979
Spoken like a true slav.
And out of this whole thread, that is indeed the correct answer
a8fdc4 No.509033
>>509010
10mm would solve all pistol problems, alas.
770123 No.509036
>>508648
Pistol rounds are just a waste of weight most of the time. If anything, they switch to 7.62 Tokarev. That would go well with a 7.62 rifle.
>>509006
And they had some even bigger vehicles. The biggest one was designed to place 450kg of explosives to the target then roll back before it detonated.
>Bringing them in to a half ruined city in large quantities could be a bit of a pain in the ass
I'm sure we could make smaller and lighter vehicles today. The lighter Goliath had a weight of 370kg and carried 60kg of explosives. For comparison, this Sword robot weights between 27kg and 45kg, depending on the version. Now, if you bring down the weight to 20kg, then 2 people could carry it in the city with relative ease. Also make a thermobaric charge that weights 20kg and you can quickly attach and detach it to the vehicle, and have 2 more people carry it. The operator needs security anyway, and 4 people for one robot doesn't seem to be that bad. And imagine rolling down this into a window that leads to the basement of a building full of enemy combatants. Surely, 20kg of thermobarics should have some effect on them.
73135c No.509039
>>509036
20kg of thermobarics is equivalent to 120kg tnt. In an enclosed space it would only ignite partway, worst case 60%. However gasseous explosives can fill spaces, nooks and crannies more efficiently, so when they go up their effect on a structure from inside is magnified many times over, because the pressure is focused on weak spots.
tl;dr Yeah it would level a fair sized building.
5cd3bd No.509066
>>509036
Yes, I suspect that idea would have some merit, especially if it had some devise it could use to drop the explosive package to it's destination, and back off before detonation. No point in wasting the delivery vehicle.
If that thing was scaled to be able to carry 40kg explosive load securely, and was immune to 14.7mm of fuck you I think it could work extremely well as a company or if the commander was insane enough and hated logistics, platoon level weapon.
Problems that come to mind are ofcourse weight and width. I think everyone agrees that such a miniature nazi-amazon-jihad mobile would be useless if it could not get through a open door.
Wasn't fighting in Aleppo more or less based around strongpoints overlooking important intersections? There were quite a few underground mining charges used.
cf0607 No.509181
>>509066
>I think it could work extremely well as a company or if the commander was insane enough and hated logistics, platoon level weapon.
I'm of course not an expert, but every battalion should have a pioneer or engineer (or how you want to call them) company with them. You know, people who have the knowledge and equipment to set up a bridge or clear a minefield while the enemy is way too close to feel comfortable. What these drones would do is just a form of demolition after all, so they'd be perfect for the job. In a city they can't really help with clearing roads for the vehicles, so you could might as well keep them in reserve and entrust those toys on them. Then you can attach a platoon of them with these drones to a "line company" that has to destroy a strongpoint.
>weight
Well, if you make them significantly bigger and armour them up to be mobile covers, then you could might as well add a small platform for 2 soldiers to step on and control the vehicle from there. Then they travel to the destination that way (slowly, and surrounded by friendly infantry), then hop down and use the cable while they sit in a well-hidden foxhole. That way you don't have to make them light enough for the infantry to carry. And I think keeping the weight under 0.5-1t is hardly unrealistic.
>width. I think everyone agrees that such a miniature nazi-amazon-jihad mobile would be useless if it could not get through a open door.
You could ask the infantry to blow a wide enough hole on a wall. That way you don't have to worry about doors at all. Or try to use the vehicle as a battering ram.
Of course, you should still try to make them simple and cheap enough, so losing one or two isn't a problem at all. And an other thing is that 40kg isn't really that much, I think a battery of 120mm mortars could deliver a lot more explosives a lot quicker.
429cad No.510908
7.62x51 is the best and no amount of fedora BC Google images will change that
f26e23 No.511442
>>508505
>>508492
>5.56 was underpowered
Uhh, no. The issue was having 14.5" barrels and a soft (or mild, don't remember) steel core tip round that failed to fragment at certain ranges due to the reduced velocity from a short barrel (Along with it being a 62 grain and not a heavier 77 grain projectile). Secondly, 5.56 does what it's supposed to do in the required effective ranges of 300-400m. Pic related are exit wounds from 5.56 and its successful fragmentation. Two of them are of the same suspect who got his thigh fucked. One of them is from a Beaner-Narco shootout. My only concern about 5.56 is it's too goddamn light of a round that can be easily influenced by wind speeds over long engagement distances (This is mostly for SAW gunners, since infantry usually wouldn't be engaging hostiles with their carbines).
Tl:DR M855 fucking shits, short barrels will impede the fragmentation effects of 5.56, heavier 5.56 projectiles tend to fragment reliably out of short barrels, leave anything beyond 400m to Designated Marksmen and machine gunners
>>508499
>>508505
M855A1 also fixed the issues, for less of the cost, and with better penetration capabilities
4e95aa No.517814
>>508512
SWAMP ASS
W
A
M
P
A
S
S
>>511442
>M855A1 also fixed the issues, for less of the cost, and with better penetration capabilities
Do you have the source? Because that would mean gov't didn't fuck up and we are in the wrong timeline.
>>517757
Never mind.
we'll just be using a new type of upper when fighting ayy niggers with energy weapons
377e8b No.517842
>>511442
>62 grain, not 77 grain
the lighter, faster bullet is the one that will fragment, not the slower heavier one, or at least it will fragment more than the slower heavier one.
I think the whole issue is that people forget what intermediate cartridges were intended for: intermediate range. 300 yards is not intermediate, it is long range. Intermediate is 100-200, and the 5.56 is fine there.
Instead of converting over wholesale to the 7.62, deployment should be specific to the environment. If guys are going around in afghanistan with vast open terrain, just make them all carry 7.62. The whole one or the other thing is dumb.
and I think the current two round system works well. All the grendel and caseless stuff is dogshit meme.
>>517757
stupid faggot
de26f7 No.517858
22f987 No.517868
>"lol mall ninjas with their black AR and unnecessary rails"
>"I got this mosin nagant"
>"the superior weapon of all weapons"
>"come and get"
>expends ammo firing at a distant blurry shape 600 yards away
>exhaust ammo by the time they close in to 150 yards
>dinner plate sized temporary cavity in your midsection
>"but… muh glorified .22"
:(
f7abe7 No.517878
>>517842
>Instead of converting over wholesale to the 7.62, deployment should be specific to the environment
this. i already argued for that and its noice knowing that someone thinks same way i do.
f73111 No.517879
>>517842
>I think the whole issue is that people forget what intermediate cartridges were intended for: intermediate range. 300 yards is not intermediate, it is long range. Intermediate is 100-200, and the 5.56 is fine there.
The whole issue goes back to "assault rifles" being a surprisingly vague term. Originally Germans wanted a handy automatic rifle that could be used as a(n extremely) light machine gun if needed. They just limited the range to 300m, because most firefights (in their experience, which I suppose means ww1, chiefly the trenches of the western front) happened closer than that. And they also had a MG42 in every squad. Also, ww2 was a proper war, so they were fighting in big formations that had everything from light mortars to howitzers.
Meanwhile the soviets wanted an universal light cartridge for their platoons, and sothe RPD was a machine gun, the SKS was a rifle, and the AK was a submachine gun. They just later realized that the AK can do the job of the SKS just fine, and it just needed a relatively minor redesign to replace the RPD in the form of the RPK. So this is a submachine gun doing the job of a rifle.
Then the US switched to 5.56x45 during Vietnam, because it was perfect for the jungle. The soviets followed fashion, and went with 5.45x39. Then came Afghanistan, and they started giving PKs and even AG-17s and later AG-30s to their squads. Since then they came out with a Pecheneg, which is a PK turned into a SAW. So at this point we could say that every squad has glorified submachine guns that work in concert with a proper machine gun. Kind of like how the Germans did it in ww2, but they ended up here by going through a completely different route.
The US doesn't seem to want to do that, so instead of just replacing every M249 with something that has a lot more umpfh, they are just giving DMRs to more and more soldiers. I think the idea here was to turn everybody into a designated marksman. Which is funny if they don't also replace the M249, because the end result would be the exact opposite of what both the Germans and Russians were/are doing.
76d367 No.517892
>>508505
Mk262 was, as I recall, a 77gr load that had a "match" tip that tended to cause the stuff to fucking explode like a varmint round.
I've seen before and afters of a similar civilian 77gr load that was fucking evil. It wasn't the exact same ammo, but it was extremely close. If it was expensive it would be my go to ammo. But since I can get fiocchi loaded hornady varmint bullets on quality .223 brass for less than the price of generic ball ammo if I shop around enough, I don't have a real need to spend the cash on that extra performance when I can just score a few more hits instead and then spend the difference on shitty training ammo.
>>517879
TBQH the idea of having an entire squad of DMs with DMRs that have the capability to function up close too is actually probably just hilariously effective, if well executed. I mean, by some standards, a very well built 16" rifle is an effective DMR, and that can still function perfectly fine in a close quarters setting most of the time.
f73111 No.517895
>>517892
>TBQH the idea of having an entire squad of DMs with DMRs that have the capability to function up close too is actually probably just hilariously effective
Even better, imagine if they all have GPMGs that can work as DMRs and SMGs. With the CTSAS ammo it might be possible, as the cartridge is a mere 15g and in theory should be effective up to 1200m. That's why I'm so obsessed with it.
c3b96d No.517897
>>508661
>that swastika at the beginning
WHY DID I NEVER NOTICE THIS?
c8e4a0 No.517903
>>517842
You also nerfed the round by going with the carbine, which lowered barrel length from 18 to 14 inches. Now nothing fragments…
fff2ed No.517907
>>517895
>Still pushing the caseless meme
f7abe7 No.517908
>>517907
but its not caseless, its telescopic
fff2ed No.517915
>>517895
>>517908
No one uses 131 grain 7.62 tbh
5cbcad No.517923
>>517915
t. uses 114.5 grain
a2cac1 No.517924
>>517907
>Still pushing the caseless meme
cased telescoped
>Still pushing the caseless meme
cased telescoped
>Still pushing the caseless meme
cased telescoped
fff2ed No.517925
>>517923
If you use anything under 147-150, your opinion doesn't matter
c8e4a0 No.517940
>>517915
I had a box of 180 grain .308 for meese. Mooses. Moose'.
Sold it long ago because I'm not made of money.
5cbcad No.517953
>>517925
t. uses a 114.5 grain loading
fa173d No.517966
I wish they would move to 260 or 243.
cb5323 No.518008
>>517975
>Claud
/intl/ did nothing wrong
c8e4a0 No.518012
>>517975
t. is from yilautia or whatever that imageboard is called
it stands for tulula or something in finnish, which means "regards"
ece4f2 No.518025
>>518008
tfw still get my trainroll.
e84966 No.518026
>>517975
>still clinging to the /inl/ boogeyman after years
Nobody gives a shit about them anymore, fag.
b30114 No.518187
>>517975
intl lost any support they had after they voted to allow CP spam on their 8chan knockoffs since it interfered with free speech.
7da7da No.518638
>>508426
So, what material are these plastic cases made of?
a739bb No.518642
7b3f8f No.518658
>>518642
I mean the specific type of plastic you fuckler
c8e4a0 No.518694
>>518638
high density polyethylene in a proprietary binder.
how is this of any help to you?
e3096b No.519092
If we are going this route then why not just go back to the M14?
f7abe7 No.519094
>>518658
Black plastic
aka. assault plastic
4c0057 No.519173
>>517975
>MUH /INT/ BOOGEYMAN
Fuck off, Imkikey, "t." isn't even from /int/
29dea4 No.519384
>>518638
https://archive.fo/7zfrg
>KP: Actually, part of the technical testing we did for TRL 6 or 7 is a whole series of environmental testing, hot, cold, sand, dust, ice. One of those tests is chemical compatibility. We were nervous, I gotta tell you. There’s this whole list of like 20 different chemicals that you have to expose them to, one of them is DEET, bug repellent, which is incredibly corrosive. Another one is tropical bleach, which is nasty stuff. So we went through all the chemical compatibility testing, and we actually passed it all. We didn’t have any problems. This polymer that we selected is a very resilient polymer, it’s a medical-grade polymer, so it can be sanitized, it can be bleached, and it still continues to function. It’s a really good material.