/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

Delusional hypothesis teir, mental instability. To the pyscheward or to the exorcist.

>>758051

I think it's an interesting moral question.

>>758052

Oh, and before people try to paint me as an abortion/infanticide defender - I am not pro-abortion/infanticide. The purpose of the question is - if you had a time machine and could go back in time, would it be good to kill people like Hitler/Stalin/Mao and try to change history to save people from dying?

Catholics don't believe dead babies go to heaven

>>758054

Thinking about doing the impossible and usurping Gods will is sin

Murder is a mortal sin which damns you straight to Hell.

>>758077

But is letting others murder people a good thing?

>>758081

Evil can never justify good; this would be utilitarianism or relativism, which is Satanic.

Hitler made his choices to be wicked, and God, out of His love for His creatures, afforded him the freedom with all the consequences – including Hell at the end of it.

>>758090

>relativism

How would it be relativism? Utilitarianism, sure.

>>758093

Also, on another note, why is utilitarianism evil? Isn't life one of the most cherished things by Christianity? Why is saving lives bad?

>>758093

Because it is to say that, relative to the intended aim, murder can be good.

Let us reframe the issue. Let us suppose Hitler was an adult being tried for his crimes. Indeed, then, he would deserve the death penalty in order to satisfy justice because he violated humanity totally willingly. As an infant or child, however, he is not responsible for his future actions – and, technically, could avert them; free will exists, after all. This is the issue.

>>758096

Utilitarianism, like relativism, is evil because it is the claim that goodness is not absolute. God, who is the source of goodness, and good by His very nature, is unchanging. Therefore what is good must follow the same nature. This means that what is good is fundamentally static; its essence cannot change. Hence Christians, moreorless, have held to the same morality for two thousand years, and cannot, if they are honest, ever deviate.

>>758058

They don't believe they go to hell either :^)

>>758102

Ok, but if you could kill adult Hitler, let's say in 1939, after he already told people what he thought about the Jews, would you?

>>758106

No

>>758106

Thoughts and feelings are not actions.

Cringe and newfag

>>758109

If he personally told you he would go and 100% kill someone, you still wouldn't stop him?

>>758112

>>758110

>questions terrify me!

>>758113

There are typically plenty of variables you're overlooking in order to get me to say "I'd kill Hitler." Fact is, I am no murderer. If, regardless, I had to neutralise a threat to myself or others, it would be done, whether or not that person's name is Adolf.

>>758115

>quoting my post when I've been answering your pointless questions

>>758050

Based and chabadpilled.

>>758050

>kill the man who destroyed Germany

Why would you, unless you're German?

The claim about the holocaust have been greatly exaggerated. Although the concentration camps were immoral in themselves, rounding up thousands of jews and taking away their ill-gotten gains might seem fair but it actually wasn't. Sorry /pol/

>>758157

how is it immoral to remove evil people from society?

>>758054

>Hitler/Stalin/Mao and try to change history to save people from dying

It's futile because Satan would use some willing vessel to carry out his evil agenda. Technically, on a daily basis, we are all micro-vessels of Satan every time we sin, such as when we rise up against a fellow brother (especially on this board), neglect loving God, or neglect loving a fellow neighbor.

Unfortunately, I think Hitler gets too much attention. The world has been distracted from paying attention his financial backers and enablers (who basically played both sides of the fence in WW2.. or WW1.. or others). Is the mad dog they inflicted the world with more evil than they themselves are? I don't think so. And they're still here, carrying out further atrocities. Or their successors are.

If you could change the outcome by killing him, you could change the outcome by educating him differently. Or perhaps a light maiming.

>>758050

I think what you are getting at is 'Is it okay to kill someone you know will become an evil dictator when they're a baby', Unfortunately the question of whether Hitler was evil is somehow a point of controversy here. We don't need to debate the holocaust, his promoting euthanasia should be enough to settle the matter. But Ben Shapiro is right, we shouldn't kill babies.

>>758170

or you could convince to become catholic so he would've had God's favor and then maybe he wouldn't have failed at saving the white race so hard

>>758179

>and then maybe he wouldn't have failed at saving the white race so hard

What makes you think that was his purpose to begin with? Look at the world because of him. The Jews are more powerful than they ever were in history.

Nor did he even uplift Germany through some financial miracle. That was mostly American banks and industry who helped build the infrastructure. The same ones who financed the Allied forces.

To answer the OP's question though, I would still save baby Hitler. Predestination is valid, but trying to figure out the mind of God is not. We should all behave AS IF Predestination doesn't exist. Why? Because we're all retarded humans. And trying to think you understand divine mysteries or can even break it down to some theology or science is the height of retardery. Be happy with simply acknowledging predestination – and then simply moving on, and not killing kids.

Hitler's wickedness has been overblown by media due to the holocaust lie. From a baby, he grew up to become an artist, then became conscripted in the war, then got redpilled on how the Jews screwed over Germany in WW1, then got involved in politics to try and fix things. He murdered people in his rise to power (or so I've heard).

He definitely did bad things, but I'd say that Churchill deserves justice as well for his bombing of Dresden and for getting America involved, Mao deserves justice for his artificial famines that killed millions in China, and Stalin/Lenin would be in my list the most wicked out of all of them due to the countless people they killed in their own famines inflicted upon Russia

>>758050

The only thing Hitler did wrong was winnie the pooh with Holy Mother Church.

>>758063

>genocide was, and always is, God's will

Not surprised considering the OT

>>758166

Jesus never wanted brothers to fight. That was the center of his last teaching in John during the Last Supper. That we all become one.

"Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; that they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me."

In fact, that was his last and greatest wish.. and the ultimate witness of his church to the world. That we become one. And he also pointed out many times on how to get started on that. By his example of the "greatest becoming the least" and becoming like children and humbling ourselves.. and even washing each other's feet, as he did for us.

The sword he's referring to is unbelievers against believers. Not within the church itself. How a father will be against his son (because of the gospel) or daughter against mother.. it's the sword that witnesses to the world and leads to persecution for the gospel's sake. Not some approval of the evil of the world and it's often stupid reasons for wars.

>>758189

What has been done in time past is the will of God, we are not to play God

Catholics believe in free will. Baby Hitler could have become totally normal adult Hitler.

>>758201

heretics are barely a step above heathens. even 98% of catholics use birth control, sorry but im not buying the hippy crap. its not me who doesn't want to be one with christian brothers, its all the heretics and lukewarms who refuse to fully submit to christ and just follow the teachings that are convenient for them at any given time.

>>758163

Their definition of evil was arbitrary and made no sense. There are laws already to jail people. He didn't wait to jail jews who were guilty of crimes, he thought merely being born a jew was sufficient to be imprisoned and have your stuff confiscated.

So that's retarded and actually evil in itself.

>>758209

99% of all protestants use birth control

>>758105

Limbo is in hell

>>758233

100% of Christians sin, nearly every day.

>>758051

This, we've left the possessed and mentally ill to roam free and "their" opinion is respected now.

>>758209

Well, I don't want to unite with heresies either and don't want to be a hippy. Not sure about that estimate with Catholics though. They are current leaders in the present March for Life, as we speak (in fact, this is one cause we can all show a little unity on, I hope). I'm sure many still hold traditional views on birth control as they do abortion. I have larger issues with their leaders than the average (practicing) Catholic.

>>758050

Hitler didn't become Hitler because he was born that way, it was the terrible circumstances that preceded him. There were other people who thought like Hitler - who in the absence of Hitler, could have done the same things he did. The role of Hitler was a niche, created by WW1 and the Weimar depravity, waiting to be filled. It could have been filled with a more upright man, or a man like Hitler. And your chance either way is probably 50/50.

Against: Hitler had potential for greatness and squandered it; yet, as an unborn child, he had a right to live like every one of us.

The Kaiser was actually a Christian, just saying.

>>758237

>everyone sins, bro, so just don't even try to not sin! just winnie the pooh sin, bro, its fine!

>>758620

Never said it was okay to sin, don't misrepresent and lie online, that's pathetic.

I said every Christian sins nearly everyday, so it's disingenuous to act as if Catholics sin more than Protestants or vice versa. The regularity of sin doesn't make it okay to sin, your either a liar or horrible at logic.

>>758648

protestants do sin more than catholics, they're freakin heretics for frick sake

Would time travel be sinful?

Adolf Hitler was a dispatch runner. If he didn't rise to power then the spirit of socialism would have just found a different figurehead.

Comedians and political cartoonists knew the second world war was coming as a direct result of the way the first one ended. "Baby Hitler" is just the usual kind of stink the media kicks up when they want the public to stop paying attention to real current events.

>yellow vest protestors forcing their way into global elite banks

>George Soros' private army trying to storm USA's southern border by force

>China is using ocean engineering in an attempt to redraw the world map

>UK's internationalist "lords" from India and Pakistan are quashing democratic votes in favor of forced internationalism

>global elite bankers are raising centralbank interests rates to deliberately crash boom economies around the world

Ask the average firstworlder what's important in the world right now, they'll respond with celebrity gossip and the invisible boogeyman of the day. Priorities matter.

My stance is that Shapiro is a kike and he does kike things.

>The purpose of the question is - if you had a time machine and could go back in time, would it be good to kill people like Hitler/Stalin/Mao and try to change history to save people from dying?

Umpf no. You cannot do that. Once the history is settled, it is part of eternity.

Shapiro's point is justify murder.

>>758081

By this wicked logic - kike shapiro's logic - you could even justify genociding an entire people…because X or Y was born. NEVER AGAIN.

This is truly disgusting. But the patience will eventually run dry with liars.

>>758090

He wasn't wicked.

>>758105

Limbo is the outer layer of hell, it is a natural paradise. Gehenna is the pit of fire that you go to if you enter into mortal sin.

>>758672

Talk for yourself, I’m Catholic and most Catholics I know consider themselves not any better than Protestants and Orthodoxes, just like everyone else sinners.

Gotta do what you gotta do 👍💅🇩🇪