/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

As long as you brlieve your saved by faith alone it doesn't matter

>>711815

So that excludes Calvinism then?

>>711820

Calvinism is ubiquitously considered a meme here. That's the one thing every single poster can agree on, save for that one guy that's probably just ironically shitposting in the meme threads.

>>711824

>Calvinism is ubiquitously considered a meme here.

Why? I'm diving into Christian theology, and the two schools of thought that fascinate me the most are reformed and orthodox.

Kinda depends, do you want to follow a denomination that is suited to your own beliefs or the most objective to what God intended for his people?

>>711832

> the most objective to what God intended for his people?

Obviously this

>>711836

why?

Probably the one in which you follow the Bible and not the rules of a denomination

Whatever you believe is most authentic, in your journey I suggest you start with whatever one you most agree with and progress from there. What Christian background are you from anon?

>>711854

My main issue with this is clearly the Bible is corrupted. Translation errors, biases in translation, etc. It's almost certain the original meaning of many words/passages has been lost.

>>711863

No Christian background, my mom is pretty atheist and my dad is agnostic. My grandmother is a pretty devout Lutheran (Missouri Synod) though.

>>711885

But it's what we have, no? If God willed it and said it's the Bible (KJV) it's ok then what's wrong?

>>711886

Which bible then?

>>711885

the bible is the most accurate historical document in the world. you sound just like a muslim. you probably are.

>>711892

wow what a response

whats the most accurate bible then? There are 10,000 versions. Which one is the true and accurate one?

>>711815

This %100

God's Church is not made with hands.

The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth; so is every one that is born of the spirit (John 3:8)

>>711885

The KJV is the most popular translation based on the manuscript tradition which dates to the very first copies of the New Testament.

Heaven and Earth shall pass away, but my words shall never pass away (Matthew 24:35)

>>711912

vulgate and if you can't read latin, Douay Rheims.

the vulgate removes any homo heresy by translating arsenokoitai perfectly and unambiguously as faggot. Jerome was fluent in hebrew and greek and was a master translator he knew what he was doing. also he had access to the hebrew version of matthew, which many people all attest there to being, as well as other manuscripts long gone. vulgate is the best bible there is, DR if you can't read latin

>>711810

Go, visit, speak, try. See where you improve and what makes you a better christian.

>>711810

>Does it even matter?

No, just be a good person and it's fine, God will understand XD

>>711810

>How do you figure out which denomination is the one you should follow?

>Does it even matter?

After 20 years there will be only two options:

– Orthodox Christians, autistic, enemies of the humanity, who claim that their Church is the only Church where living people become living temples of God, the Holy Spirit, and all other denominations are in error;

– all other denominations will be religions of love and respect, because all denominations have pieces of the truth and we all are children of God meeting him in different ways.

I’m gonna hyjack this thread for myself:

I’ve been concidering Orthodoxy for a while now but I’ve been having doubts and somehow the Baptists are also calling to me.

Mainly my doubts come from prayer with The saints, mainly if they’re just people we ask to pray for us, why are there different patrons? Aren’t they all talking to the same God? Like it would be silly to ask a plumber for help only when you need the pipes fixed under the faucet, especially since all the spirits of the saints are said to hear us from heaven. In addition, the Akathist absolutely seems like Mary worship at times (“Rejoice, Rock which refreshed those thirsting for life“ really gets to me considering Christ is called the Rock from whom water rushed fourth in Paul’s epistles: “And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.“(1 Corinthians 10:4))

Not gonna make any rash decisions too soon, but I would really appreciate your responses.

>>712339

>Orthodox and Baptist

It's interesting that in many ways Orthodox are opposite of Baptists. But despite that, it seems the Orthodox and some Baptists are some of the few remaining Christians who have not modified their thinking to be more in accordance with modernity.

> prayer to saints

There are two things to be known here. The first is common for Orthodox and Catholics and the second perhaps is specific for the Orthodox.

First. It is common among the Christians to ask other people to pray for us. We ask our friends to pray for us, we give alms to poor Christians and ask for their prayers, we ask our priest to pray for us, etc. And since God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is God of the living, and not of the dead, we ask also Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and all righteous to pray for us.

Second. God Holy Spirit lives within the saints and the saints are in God. The Saints are perfectly one just as Christ is one with the Father. The following words in the prayer of Christ have exact meaning, they are not allegory: "that they [the Saints] may all be one, just as you, Father, are in me, and I in you, that they also may be in us". (John 17:21) Therefore, a prayer to a Saint is like a prayer to God. This isn't because the Saints have made themselves worthy of this with their good deeds. This is because Christ wants the Saints to have the same glory as his glory: "The glory that you have given me I have given to them".

>"Rejoice, Rock which refreshed those thirsting for life"

Yes, the rock in Exodus 17 and Numbers 20 is Christ. Mary is named rock poetically because she bore the One who slaked our thirst with living water.

>>711810

The one that has a Church.

>>711810

I have my own, but don't wanna brag about it. I am currently not accepting any new members anyways because I only have one chair and I sit in that one.

>>712385

Can I borrow that chair? Or at least, a feeling?

>>712370

Interesting. Although I already knew that the Saints are not to be worshiped and that we pray with them, I didn’t really connect the theosis to our intersesion with them. Also Mary and Jesus do seem to share many titles in common, the Western Church even saying Mary will crush the head of Satan (although that might come from Jerome’s mistranslation plz don’t kill me Catholics)

Also it’s facinating how the Anabaptists (Mennonites) share a lot in common with Old Believers in terms of lifestyle, although as you stated they spilt from their respective churches for opposite reasons (Mennonites for the church following church tradition too closely, OB for the Church not following church tradition enough). In any case, I’ll pray about it. Thank you for your help!

I unironically think The Living Bible is the best translation because I am low IQ to try to understand what they are even saying otherwise.

Sometimes I go to the Catholic mass down the block, a sister church to the one I was confirmed in. Catholics have great aesthetics and sincere solemn respect for the house of God. No eating an hour before mass. Perfect Sunday clothing. Making the vessel pure to receive the Holy Spirit. But Catholics can get so obsessed with what's heresy that they are like the hypocrites Jesus talks about in Matthew 23.

Other times I go to a Lutheran ELCA mass. So much more casual. They have a drum set and electric guitar, people come as they are, CHEW GUM DURING MASS (huge no-no). But this church is very focused on improving the local community, whereas the Catholic one is a much more macro scale.

So it's like, my local Catholics will be like LETS GO MARCH AGAINST ABORTION AND CONVINCE STRANGERS, my local Lutherans will be like SUPPORT SOMEONE YOU KNOW TO HELP THEM AVOID ABORTION.

Each denomination has different useful attributes in helping me serve our Father's will.

>>712539

It sounds like your Father's will is what you want it to be. The right denomination isn't always the one you feel most comfortable in.

>>712544

No way, your view of my comfort is backwards. I purposely go to uncomfortable masses or "sermons". I have faith the Father puts me where I need to be.

>>711810

>How do you figure out which denomination is the one you should follow?

>Does it even matter?

"The true Christian does not belong to any particular sect. He may participate in the ceremonial service of every sect, and still belong to none. He has only one science, which is Christ within him; he has only one desire, namely, to do good. Look at the flowers of the field. Each one has its own particular attributes, nevertheless they do not wrangle and fight with each other. They do not quarrel about the possession of sunshine and rain, or dispute about their colours, odour, and taste. Each one grows according to its nature. Thus it is with the children of God. Each one has his own gifts and attributes, but they all spring from one Spirit. They enjoy their gifts, and praise the wisdom of Him from whom they originated. Why should they dispute about the qualities of Him whose attributes are manifest in themselves?" Blessed Saint and Mystic Jacob Boehme.

>>711820

>>711824

>>711815

The theologians and Christian sectarians keep on continually disputing about the letter and form, while they care nothing for the spirit, without which the form is empty and the letter dead. Each one imagines that he has the truth in his keeping, and wants to be admired by the world as a keeper of the truth. Therefore they denounce and slander and backbite each other, and thus they act against the first principle taught by Christ, and which is brotherly love. Thus the Church of Christ has become a bazaar where vanities are exhibited, and as the Israelites dance around the golden calf, so the modern Christians dance around their self-constructed fetiches, whom they call God, and on account of this fetich-worship they will not be able to enter the promised land.

>>711810

1. Learn the different doctrines of the main Christian denominations, obviously you don’t have to learn every esoteric little detail like the essence-energies distinction, but you should understand the basics of the different denoms and what they justify their beliefs with

2. Read the Bible. Full book, special emphasis on the New Testament

3. Dive deeper into the different denoms now. Learn what the different churches all back to their theology with and rule out obviously unbiblical ones

4. Study church history and the Fathers

5. Discover that Orthodoxy is the true faith

>>711810

Ask Christ. Jesus will tell you if you're doin' it wrong. I know it sounds strange, but that's how it goes. The Church is Jesus'. I think He will know how it goes.

>>712548

/thread

>>711810

I agree with Gabor Vona that we should get as close to God as possible within our cultural circle. In the end there is a reason why Latins are mostly Catholic, Eastern Europe is Orthodox, etc. because every single denomination absorbed the culture from those regions. You will go crazy if you try to decide rationally because all the denominations have many pros and cons, scandals, etc. There is so much to read, Church Fathers, all kinds of exegesis, there are even full books about subjects like the Filioque.

This quote is too Perennialist but in general I agree with the sentiment:

Vona does not seem to really mind that the traditional school based on the global synthesis of different religious directions and spiritual-cultural tradition contradicts the official Jobbik image of being “Christian and Hungarian.” He himself follows the “metaphysical tradition.” A couple of months ago this is what he told weekly newspaper Heti Válasz: “Every larger global religion has a core truth which is the same as in the other ones and in most cases it’s called God. Everyone has the task to get as close to God as possible in his own cultural circle and within his own faith. As a Hungarian, European and Roman Catholic person I have the same task. However, at the same time I pay attention to, study and understand other cultures and religions too.

Also, I like this insight by Cologero Salvo about how reading other traditions made him appreciate his own tradition more:

[For Borella, going back to the ancient doctrines was] like a delighted child going from discovery to discovery, from treasure to treasure, from marvel to marvel. I recognized and loved this Christian past, its beauty no unworthy of the God whom it had honored with its liturgy, cathedrals and theologies. It was in me as flesh of my flesh, soul of my soul, heart of my heart, and I did not know it. Once discovered, fixing the gaze of my spirit upon the holy Fathers and Doctors, upon the Clements, the Dionysii, the Gregories, the Augustines, and the Thomases, I said: I too am of their race. Surely not by sanctity or genius, but by blood. Drinking in the freshness of the ages, I felt my Christian soul revive.

>>712548

This kills the denominational infighting.

>>711885

Become Lutheran. Ask your Grandmother to show you the way.

>>711810

If you're saved, follow Christ. That makes you a Christian, which is all you need to call yourself. Whatever other traditions you do or don't honor are irrelevant so long as they don't disobey His commandments.

>tl;dr follow Christ and what you'll find is Christianity.

I've been struggling with these questions a lot too. I fell away from religion for a tome, but as of late I've been brought back into the fold. This has been my hurdle. I know Christ is in my life, I know that God is providing for me and I trust his judgment. However, I can't figure out if there is one church apart from the rest or if all of the mainstream denominations are true ways to seek Christ.

Surely I'd get some sort of sign if I was on the wrong path, right? I'm a 20 year old protestant looking to get into ministry and I just feel like I've been blessed in so much of my life that I feel like God isn't upset with the path I'm on.

He's given me my wonderful life, the love of my life that I'm marrying, he gives me strength and comforts me when I pray for it. I've been really sick lately, but even then, I feel like I used to when I pray for help. I know I still sin and do wrong, but I feel like I wouldn't have had these experiences if I was on the wrong path.

I imagine there are people from every denomination that feel this way. Maybe we all feel blessed because we're all on the right path and coming to Christ through our faith? I don't know, I'm rambling. I guess I don't really have an answer for you besides: "but seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you."

I believe it's important to attend Sunday services so don't choose one without a church near you.

>>711828

It's mainly a Catholic board.

>>712877

>Begoming Miaphysite :DDDD

no thanks. Also the early church fathers were more aligned with the western tradition of thought than the eastern crypto-Platonist "it's just a mystery, man"

if god's inside you you don't have to go to church

i dont know if make holy the sabbath day is what the rules of the religion says or what god says but i think as long as you care about what god says and not anything else you can do no wrong, like Im sure you are supposed to just listen to your conscious or something, I'm sure doing the right thing is just a natural thing and you dont think about it since god is natural. church is man made and not natural. Like animals they just exist in the moment. they do no right or wrong cause they arent exposed to either, just completely at one with nature. I think that's what god intended and the actual mind and church and consciousness and everything man made is not god. but what do I know. I think that's the point though, all you have to know is that you know nothing and if you know nothing how can you possibly do anything? just completely do nothing and you'll be one with god then. Like monks do. sit in an empty room with nothing forever and you'll be holy as winnie the pooh