[ / / / / / / / / / / / / / ] [ dir / agatha2 / animu / arepa / fascist / leftpol / tacos / vg / vichan ]

/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Email
Comment *
File
Password (Randomized for file and post deletion; you may also set your own.)
* = required field[▶ Show post options & limits]
Confused? See the FAQ.
Embed
(replaces files and can be used instead)
Options

Allowed file types:jpg, jpeg, gif, png, webm, mp4, pdf
Max filesize is 16 MB.
Max image dimensions are 15000 x 15000.
You may upload 5 per post.


The Lord is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the Lord is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

File: 7c9563d93061102⋯.jpg (36.05 KB, 363x453, 121:151, seraphim_transfiguration.jpg)

9ba2ce  No.691052

1/2 Some background is necessary, but skip to the TL;DR if you don't want to read this part.

I am in my late 20s and I was raised in a non-religious household. About four years ago, I went through a difficult period of my life that made me feel very unsettled with being a "tragic atheist" and I wasn't satisfied with my defaulted moral nihilism. I don't think any of my understanding of reality was in critical error, but the lack of purpose or resolution to things seemed fake and gay (I don't really think any nihilist says "well I make my life's own meaning" with much conviction, personally). So I tried to connect with a few things about my human experience that did seem real or transcendent and that I knew I connected with in way that was exclusively non-material - things I couldn't subject to the scrutiny of utility. I became obsessed with the idea of Beauty as a virtue that shines a light on the things that are not fake and gay and point us towards a truer connection with reality, like a true communion of the human spirit.

I discovered the Orthodox Church through liturgical music. I was deeply moved by Rachmaninoff's Vespers (the USSR Ministry of Culture Chamber Choir production) and I felt more strongly than anything else that this was the most beautiful of the beautiful things I had encountered. I wanted to know what inspired this kind of work. I read up on what Vespers was, what Christianity was, I read a book called "Orthodox Alaska" about modern Saints, I started reading the Bible and watching Bible explanation videos on the internet and even started browsing this board when I learned of it (never before posted). I visited St. Vladimir's Seminary bookstore and picked up a dozen books and read each cover-to-cover. I felt like I was out in the cold night looking through a glass window into a warm and beautiful and kind world that I had never experienced.

I attended my first Orthodox service, a Vespers service, about three years ago. I encountered a guy we'll call Tom who was my age, he sang in the choir, and he was a reader. He welcomed me to the parish and we went out for coffee to talk for a bit. From then on, I developed a great friendship with Tom and his wife and most of the rest of the parish was very welcoming and I was even in the men's group that met during the week. I attended regularly, I went to the entrants class the parish has for study, I practiced a prayer rule, and I really liked the priests as well, but I never really developed a relationship with either of them and neither of them ever went out of their way to check up on me or see how I was doing. Nonetheless, I was still made a Catechumen. This was a little more than a year ago. So at the present time I have been going to this church for three years and have been a Catechumen for a little more than a year.

TL;DR: Nonreligious upbringing, have been going to an Orthodox church for three years and have been a Catechumen for a little more than a year.

For those that are Orthodox, you may be already asking why it is that I have been at the church for so long, withheld from entering the Catechumenate for so long, and have also been a Catechumen for a long time.

The truth is, and this this has been a struggle I have been trying to work out for this whole time, is that I have never personally experienced anything spiritual, important, transcendent, or otherwise confirming an existence of God or the supernatural claims the Church has. After a while, I have concluded that prayer does not work, at least for me. I don't detect anything special is happening during liturgy, like I don't feel the presence of God. And when the contemporary supernatural claims of the Church don't seem verifiable by my own experience, it is difficult to believe the historical supernatural claims of the Church as well. I don't believe that many events in the Bible actually happened, most of all, I don't believe the key point that Jesus died and was resurrected for the remission of our sins. I feel like I can't make myself believe it, either. There are so many holes and doubts and missed connections and false promises that the inconsistencies add up to be too overwhelming. I have cried out in desperation for Jesus to make this clear for me, to rob me of my cursed and unserving intellect if it meant I could just have faith and serve.

9ba2ce  No.691054

2/3

In spite of all this, I had been attending regularly and my priest was convinced that this was just all part of my suffering on the path to redemption and accepting Jesus and encouraged me to become a Catechumen to get to the next step. Until after this last Pascha, that is.

After Pascha, my priest asked me when I would like to setup a time to become baptized and enter into the church. I deflected saying that I was doing a lot of traveling and I would get back with him. I just never went back to church. Ever. Since April. And I don't feel any different. I don't feel like I am lacking anything. I don't feel guilty or disobedient towards God or anything. I am a little sad for the fact that they specifically say my name during the prayer for the catechumens and I am not there. I wonder if they still say my name.

And the damndest thing? Not a single person at church, not even one of the priests, have reached out to me to ask me what was up or where I had been. Except for my friend Tom, but I was at this point friends outside of church, so I talk with him all the time. Tom, however, left the church as well, but he went to start seminary at St. Tikhon's. Tom knows my situation well and we have often talked about my "demons", but I have yet to find anything he says particularly compelling, which makes me feel bad because I know he cares about me and he tries very hard. (As an aside, I have considered that maybe the Calvinists were right and that I am not part of "the elect" and maybe I don't have a soul or something and Christianity is just for certain people who are capable of receiving grace).

Now, finally, onto the reason for this whole post.

Tom has reported to me that there is a blind priest at St. Tikhon's named Fr. Daniel. Tom says he had heard of Fr. Daniel from several different people who had been to St. Tikhon's before. Fr. Daniel is known for being clairvoyant. Tom said he did not know what that meant - like what it actually means, how it manifests, what people behave like - aside from a vague idea that he can see things other people cannot see. Now, Tom has never bullshitted me before. I may think that he may believe things that aren't real, but I don't doubt his own sincerity and honesty. He is the most courageous and honorable person I know. So it is with some great surprise that Tom called me the other day from St. Tikhon's about his encounter and confession with Fr. Daniel. His voice was trembling, even days later.


9ba2ce  No.691055

3/3

Obviously I won't talk about Tom's personal details, and he obviously wouldn't tell me all the things he shared with Fr. Daniel, but he described it as the "most powerful experience of his life". He said right from the beginning, he had the most warm and genuine kind of grace about him and joy to see him like Tom had been his friend forever. said Fr. Daniel knew everything in Tom's heart and soul very deeply, even better and more truly than Tom did. Tom said he was skeptical himself about this kind of experience, knowing that TV show psychics and stuff use creative questioning and manipulations to get people to think they are having a personal connection. But Tom said that he didn't really reveal anything, that he was mostly quiet, and Fr. Daniel had a kind of procedure and litany about his sins and anxieties and challenges. Things he shared with nobody else. Details that one couldn't just "guess", things just not generally particular to young seminarians, but personal details. Fr. Daniel confronted him about the grave consequences of these festering demons and sins - Tom said the gravity and visceral nature of his sins was never more apparent. Tom said he started to cry from an indescribable and overwhelming combination of emotions like he had never before had in his life. After confession, he went into an empty room and cried some more. He said he had the sensation that he was decompressing from a dream. Tom said he still can't quite believe that it happened and talked with his wife for a very long time about it. He said this was the first person he ever encountered that felt like was a living example of the mystical aspect of our faith, someone who is purified and illumined and receptive of God's gifts.

I'm sure you could guess my response. It sounds incredible, like quite literally impossible to believe. But nonetheless, I don't think Tom would lie or tell a tall tale, and he was also told by others that Fr. Daniel was someone with this gift and that he would "blow your mind" as one woman we know put it. But obviously, I don't feel any different after hearing this compelling testimony. Tom invited me out to visit him and maybe I can meet Fr. Daniel. Or who knows, maybe this seminary is filled with people like Fr. Daniel and there will be many great things there that will finally, unambiguously open my heart to the love of God, but for the life of me now, I don't feel it.

Have any of you heard of something like this? What would you do in my position?


b7467e  No.691059

It's not uncommon. Legendary confessors have existed throughout the life of the Church. You certainly shutoff go meet him, but I think that is not all.

I think it is hard for us middle class drones to have faith because everything is so comfortable. Part of loving your neighbor as yourself is meeting yourself in the person of your neighbor. Engage in corporal works of mercy, get to know your local poor, try to help them. Their faith will form yours. If I only could have the faith of a certain former prostitute and drug addict I know! The ability to lean on God and find hope even at the bottom of the world. Go and serve. You will find God.


b7467e  No.691060

>>691059

Should. Stupid autocorrect.


b6285f  No.691061

What do you have to lose? Why not go and meet him assuming you can go to St Tikhon (in Pennsylvania I assume?).


afafb1  No.691655

you should definitely go and see. I can sympathize with what you are going through. Most of us never get a road to Damascus moment in our lives tbh. I'm still searching for Christ in this life because without him nothing else makes sense. I haven't found him yet because of my own corrupt heart. But i trust in God that he will give me everything i need for my salvation and will lead me there before i die. I guess what i'm saying is you don't have to see angels during liturgy.


fdea40  No.691700

>>691054

>>691052

>>691055

OP I have a suggestion. Go to a Church or quite place and just pray don't say anything just pray. The first language of God is silence he will talk to you.

When you do this just ask God what does he want you to do and then wait and pray. Part of the issue is many people do not allow the Lord to take his time. We make a petition to him or pray for something and just expect him to deliver it immediately.




[Return][Go to top][Catalog][Nerve Center][Cancer][Post a Reply]
Delete Post [ ]
[]
[ / / / / / / / / / / / / / ] [ dir / agatha2 / animu / arepa / fascist / leftpol / tacos / vg / vichan ]