/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

We had a perfectly working tradition on family, until we decided to open our hearts to modernity and get with the times.

Now it seems everything is falling apart and we're are looking for answers everywhere except in our past tradition.

Why doesn't the Roman Catholic clergy just come out as atheists at this point? Do they even believe in God anymore? Why not look to Christian teachings for family tradition? At this point I'm just waiting for them to renounce the Trinity and canonize the Talmud and Koran.

I don't see what Catholicism has to gain by advising mothers to become shrewish nags

>>639274

>>639276

Maybe because the tradition of the past has failed? The meek will inherit the earth

>>639315

The only failure here is the Roman Catholic's in their duty to uphold even their own doctrine, let alone what is outlined in the Scripture.

And "meek" refers to those possessed of spiritual discipline to adhere to God's Law in the face of adversity, not the blasphemous passivity you seem to endorse.

>>639168

>(((Vatican)))

BASED

>>639484

Are the sacrament of FSSPX valid ?

>>639491

sacraments*

>The Cardinal added, “Pope Francis says always it’s impossible to be a Christian and to be antisemitic.

Pretty sure calling them the children of Satan is a little antisemitic.

>>639484

The thing that gets me about all this is that it just all seems so obvious. Even the most basic examination of new ageism and its endless spinoffs like satanism, masonism, progressivism, etc., reveals their common root in evil. They are each a product of the Deceiver himself, a million paths all of which lead to hell itself.

>>639494

The very affirmation that Christ is the Messiah is antisemitic by the logic laid out in that article.

>>639168

How a cultural element dies:

Step 1: A part of culture goes out of style, IE: Christian family structure.

Step 2: The part of culture is eventually forgotten by the masses.

Step 3: Someone says/writes "We should study and mimic nation X's views/practices of Y"

>>639549

🅱egome 🅱a🅱tist

>>639549

We seize it by force and cancel everything post-Vatican II that contradict the thousand-year Faith.

>>639491

Assuming you mean the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter, no, the FSSP "Bishops" that ordain their men were made "Bishops" in Paul VI's invalid new rite of Episcopal Consecration, so none of their sacraments, with the exception of baptism (if done correctly), would be valid.

http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/catholicchurch/where-to-receive-sacraments/

http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/catholic/priestly-fraternity-of-st-peter/

>>639498

Came across this recently:

https://aleteia.org/2018/04/16/crying-little-boy-asks-pope-if-his-atheist-dad-could-be-in-heaven/

Francis: "But how does God’s heart react to a Dad like that? How? What do you think? … A dad’s heart! God has the heart of a father. And faced with a dad, a non-believer, who was able to have his children baptized and to give them that courage, do you think that God would be capable of leaving him far from Him? Do you think so? … Say it loudly, with courage…

All: No!

Francis: Does God abandon his children?

All: No!

Pope Francis: Does God abandon His children when they are good?

All: No!

Pope Francis: There you go, Emanuele, this is your answer. God surely was proud of your dad, because it’s easier to have your children baptized when you are a believer, than to have them baptized when you are not a believer. Surely, this pleased God greatly. Talk with your father, pray to your father. Thank you, Emanuele, for your courage."

God didn't abandon his dad, his dad abandoned God.

For if you believe not that I am he, you shall die in your sin.

[John 8:24]

>>639630

A man spends his entire life as a disbeliever. At the very moment of his death, in his heart, he declares "I believe". Nobody heard him say it, nobody on this Earth knows him as anything other than a disbeliever; but God knows his heart.

This is why we don't judge others. No matter what you think you know about someone, God knows better.

>>639630

I was referring to https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Society_of_Saint_Pius_X

Thanks a lot for the links anyway!

>>639633

Unless he gave some indication of repentance before his death, we're obliged to say he died as he lived.

What's really insidious is Francis using a childs' broken heart, and peoples' empathy towards those situations, as a tactic to get people to believe soul destroying heresy.

It'd be appropriate to be sympathetic to the boys suffering, but you don't have to answer his question right then and there in public.

>>639636

Ok, yes their sacraments are valid. But, we have to be careful about not supporting heretical priests (SSPX positions are heretical) and attending Mass in those situations. MHFM covers the all issues thoroughly.

http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/catholicchurch/truth-about-the-sspx-mc-similar-groups/

Pope Leo XIII, Apostolicae Curae, Sept. 13, 1896: “When anyone has rightly and seriously made use of the due form and the matter requisite for effecting or conferring the sacrament he is considered by that very fact to do what the Church does. On this principle rests the doctrine that a sacrament is truly conferred by the ministry of one who is a heretic or unbaptized, provided the Catholic rite be employed. On the other hand, if the rite be changed, with the manifest intention of introducing another rite not approved by the Church, and of rejecting what the Church does, and what by the institution of Christ belongs to the nature of the sacrament, then it is clear that not only is the necessary intention wanting to the sacrament, but that the intention is adverse to and destructive of the sacrament.”

>>639642

>Unless he gave some indication of repentance before his death, we're obliged to say he died as he lived.

No, we're not.

>>639644

Here, this will help you:

https://8ch.net/settings.php?board=christian

>>639645

Canon 2200.2, 1917 Code: “Positing an external violation of the law, malice in the external forum is presumed until the contrary is proven.”

Malice is presumed, the exact opposite of what you posit.

>>639630

Ambiguity is a favorite tactic of anti-popes like Francis, it seems.

Here's what a real pope had to say about ambiguity:

Pope Pius VI, condemning the Synod of Pistoia, Bull “Auctorem fidei," August 28, 1794: “[The Ancient Doctors] knew the capacity of innovators in the art of deception. In order not to shock the ears of Catholics, they sought to hide the subtleties of their tortuous maneuvers by the use of seemingly innocuous words such as would allow them to insinuate error into souls in the most gentle manner. Once the truth had been compromised, they could, by means of slight changes or additions in phraseology, distort the confession of the faith which is necessary for our salvation, and lead the faithful by subtle errors to their eternal damnation. This manner of dissimulating and lying is vicious, regardless of the circumstances under which it is used. For very good reasons it can never be tolerated in a synod of which the principal glory consists above all in teaching the truth with clarity and excluding all danger of error.

"Moreover, if all this is sinful, it cannot be excused in the way that one sees it being done, under the erroneous pretext that the seemingly shocking affirmations in one place are further developed along orthodox lines in other places, and even in yet other places corrected; as if allowing for the possibility of either affirming or denying the statement, or of leaving it up the personal inclinations of the individual – such has always been the fraudulent and daring method used by innovators to establish error. It allows for both the possibility of promoting error and of excusing it.

"It is as if the innovators pretended that they always intended to present the alternative passages, especially to those of simple faith who eventually come to know only some part of the conclusions of such discussions which are published in the common language for everyone's use. Or again, as if the same faithful had the ability on examining such documents to judge such matters for themselves without getting confused and avoiding all risk of error. It is a most reprehensible technique for the insinuation of doctrinal errors and one condemned long ago by our predecessor Saint Celestine who found it used in the writings of Nestorius, Bishop of Constantinople, and which he exposed in order to condemn it with the greatest possible severity. Once these texts were examined carefully, the impostor was exposed and confounded, for he expressed himself in a plethora of words, mixing true things with others that were obscure; mixing at times one with the other in such a way that he was also able to confess those things which were denied while at the same time possessing a basis for denying those very sentences which he confessed.

"In order to expose such snares, something which becomes necessary with a certain frequency in every century, no other method is required than the following: whenever it becomes necessary to expose statements which disguise some suspected error or danger under the veil of ambiguity, one must denounce the perverse meaning under which the error opposed to Catholic truth is camouflaged.”

>>639646

Don't spread it too much, then people will know and we won't have any hilarious moments.

>>639645

>No, we're not.

To suggest that is to deny the Gospel. For better or worse, we have been given knowledge of both good and evil and are expected to act accordingly. "I am the Lord thy God" is not a negotiation. Atheists, even if they've deluded themselves into thinking they're well meaning, are incapable of doing good.

On that note, can you RCs please handle your rampant atheist problem? Them LARPing as Christians has really gotten out of hand in the last decade or so. They're getting almost as bad as the Talmudists.

>>639690

For what man knoweth the things of a man, but the spirit of a man that is in him? So the things also that are of God no man knoweth, but the Spirit of God. 1 Cor 2:11

>>639633

>This is why we don't judge others.

>>639694

>1 Cor 2:11

The bible is referring to hypocritical judgments.

Matt 7:4-5:Or how sayest thou to thy brother: Let me cast the mote out of thy eye; and behold a beam is in thy own eye? [5] Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam in thy own eye, and then shalt thou see to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

"then shalt thou see to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye "

1 Corinthians 6:1-5: Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to be judged before the unjust, and not before the saints? [2] Know you not that the saints shall judge this world? And if the world shall be judged by you, are you unworthy to judge the smallest matters? [3] Know you not that we shall judge angels? how much more things of this world? [4] If therefore you have judgments of things pertaining to this world, set them to judge, who are the most despised in the church. [5] I speak to your shame. Is it so that there is not among you any one wise man, that is able to judge between his brethren?

St. Robert Bellarmine, De Romano Pontifice, Book II, Chap. 30, “… for men are not bound, or able to read hearts; but when they see that someone is a heretic by his external works, they judge him to be a heretic pure and simple, and condemn him as a heretic. ”

The absolute state of Jewish families.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/04/26/well/family/some-lgbt-parents-reject-the-names-mommy-and-daddy.html

>>639168

Real honest question this isn't a shitpost I swear.

"King James Bible

And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it"

If the Catholic church is the correct church then why the winnie the pooh has it been Jewed on all levels? Jews are of satan as we all know and consdering they are seemingly prevailing it doesn't look so good. I really want to become Christian but this shit is really holding me back . Also I'm lazy tbh but this is really a huge part of it. I mean honestly I'm stumped here.

>>639872

>I want to join the church, but she has to conform to my special needs

Good luck with that.

>>639876

That doesn't answer the question my guy.

>>639872

>>639887

You should pray for an increase in faith to be able to see the truth. The Catholic Church is not a series of buildings, but is composed of the true faithful. Heretics, like those that can be found in the Vatican, are not part of the Catholic Church.

>>639889

I think I have a little bit of a better understanding now. I will research more. Thank you for your reply.

>>639872

Christ is talking about Peter's faith. The rock is the faith of Peter on which he will build His church upon. Pope's magic powers and infallibility was a later addition.

>>639892

Is that an infallible assertion of yours? It's clearly wrong, as it is inconsistent with the gospel.

Pope Pius XI, Divini Illius Magistri (#18), Dec. 31, 1929: “… God Himself made the Church a sharer in the divine magisterium and by His divine benefit unable to be mistaken.”

Pope Pius XI, Divini Illius Magistri (#16), Dec. 31, 1929: “To this magisterium Christ the Lord imparted immunity from error…”

Pope Gregory XVI, Commissum Divinitus (# 4), May 17, 1835: “… the Church has, by its divine institution, the power of the magisterium to teach and define matters of faith and morals and to interpret the Holy Scriptures without danger of error.”

Pope Leo XIII, Caritatis Studium (#6) July 25, 1898: The Magisterium “could by no means commit itself to erroneous teaching.”

Pope Pius X, Editae Saepe (#8), May 26, 1910: “… only a miracle of that divine power could preserve the Church… from blemish in the holiness of Her doctrine…”

Pope Pius XI, Quas Primas (#22), Dec. 11, 1925: “… the perfect and perpetual immunity of the Church from error and heresy.”

Pope St. Siricius, epistle (1) Directa ad decessorem, Feb. 10, 385: “And so He has wished the beauty of the Church, whose spouse He is, to radiate with the splendor of chastity, so that on the day of judgment, when He will have come again, He may be able to find her without spot or wrinkle [Eph. 5:27] as He instituted her through His apostle.”

Pope Pius IX, Vatican Council I, 1870: “… the See of St. Peter always remains unimpaired by any error, according to the divine promise of our Lord the Savior made to the chief of His disciples: ‘I have prayed for thee [Peter], that thy faith fail not…’”

Matthew 16:17-18-“And I say to thee: That thou are Peter: and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.”

John 21:15-17-“Jesus saith to Simon Peter: Simon, son of John, lovest thou me? He saith to him: Yea, Lord, thou knowest that I love thee. He saith to him: Feed my lambs. He saith to him again: Simon, son of John, lovest thou me? He saith to him: Yea, Lord, thou knowest that I love thee. He saith to him: Feed my lambs. He saith to him a third time: Simon, son of John, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved, because he had said to him the third time: Lovest thou me? And he said to him: Lord, thou knowest all things: thou knowest that I love thee. He said to him: Feed my sheep.”

Luke 22:31-32- “And the Lord said: Simon, Simon, behold Satan hath desired to have all of you, that he may sift you as wheat: But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and thou, being once converted, confirm thy brethren.”

I always find it odd how people like you will reject Papal infallibility, and then seemingly claim infallibility for yourselves.

>>639898

All this text and not a single argument about how Francis is God's chosen.

I never said that i'm infallible but you (Pope) did so it's up to you/him to prove me that he really is and till now he doesn't do a very good job isn't he?

The truth is very simple. Christ never said anything about Papacy, the particular verse talks about the faith and the meaning was changed intentionally for political reasons.

>>639911

Francis is an anti-pope. A heretic that isn't even Catholic, and therefore can't be a valid pope.

Watch this video, and it should become abundantly clear that the papacy is biblical.

>>639916

Sorry bro but it's pretty big, i'm gonna watch it another time.

But the fact that you're defending Papacy while in the same time literally speaking against the current Pope says a lot about Papacy itself.

>>639929

I'll say it again, Francis is not a valid pope, There have been more than 40 anti-popes in Church history, and Francis is one of them. Nothing he says or does has the authority of the Church behind it, and he has no bearing at all on the papacy.

>>639932

Ok so lets wait to see if the next one is any better, but i highly doubt it.

>>640022 (wub a lub)

Blocks your throne of St. Peter

>look at me

>I'm the Pope now

>>639945

It does not matter who the next one is, where they're from, the message they deliver, or the way in which they run the office; someone's gonna bitch about 'em loudly, often, and with fervent surety that he is the "worst pope eva!"

Francis is just the flavor of the week. Believe me, I know. I was absolutely 100% guaranteed by my grandfather, with God-given surety beyond any form of doubt whatsoever, that JP2 was going to be the "last pope" and that the Tribulation was upon us and Christ would return … in 1986.

Well, here we are boyos.

>>640022

Cardinal Sarah seems like a good bloke…we'll see what the Holy Spirit has to say in merit after the end of this current papacy.

>>640127

Yeah, yeah. The best thing about doomsday prophets is that they are 100% wrong, 100% of the time.

>>640129

>Jesus and Paul and John were 100% wrong 100% of the time

Might want to switch religions then.

>>640136

You need to have a seriously poor understanding of the apocalyptic passages in Holy Scripture if you think their purpose is "how to predict the future and know when the Second Coming will occur."

It's quite easy to tell if something is sensationalist doomsday heresy rather than serious apocalyptic theology: if it claims to know when the end is coming, then it contradicts Christ's own words. Furthermore, apocalyptic theology aims at revealing the eschaton, or end purpose of all things, and is not simply some literalist sequence of events for their own sake.

>>640127

>one interpretation is correct because it's in my personal lifetime

What makes you think Christ is coming back in your personal lifetime? Do you honestly think he wants to meet you?

>>639872

Begome Ordodogs

>>640104

>How does the college of cardinals create an anti-pope?

By "electing" a heretic.

>Are they anti-cardinals?

Not necessarily, but many are probably not legitimate.

>How low down in the hierarchy do you have to get to find people who have a legitimate claim to their positions?

Until you find valid, licit, Catholics (who aren't heretics, apostates or schismatics).

Here's the law:

Pope Paul IV, Bull Cum ex Apostolatus Officio, Feb. 15, 1559:

6. In addition, [by this Our Constitution, which is to remain valid in perpetuity We enact, determine, decree and define:-] that if ever at any time it shall appear that any Bishop, even if he be acting as an Archbishop, Patriarch or Primate; or any Cardinal of the aforesaid Roman Church, or, as has already been mentioned, any legate, or even the Roman Pontiff, prior to his promotion or his elevation as Cardinal or Roman Pontiff, has deviated from the Catholic Faith or fallen into some heresy:

(i) the promotion or elevation, even if it shall have been uncontested and by the unanimous assent of all the Cardinals, shall be null, void and worthless;

(ii) it shall not be possible for it to acquire validity…

(iii) it shall not be held as partially legitimate in any way…

(vi) those thus promoted or elevated shall be deprived automatically, and without need for any further declaration, of all dignity, position, honour, title, authority, office and power…

10. No one at all, therefore, may infringe this document of our approbation, re-introduction, sanction, statute and derogation of wills and decrees, or by rash presumption contradict it. If anyone, however, should presume to attempt this, let him know that he is destined to incur the wrath of Almighty God and of the blessed Apostles, Peter and Paul.

>>640155

>Do you honestly think he wants to meet you?

I hope so, or else I'm in pretty big trouble.

>>639492

>>639491

>>639646

Look, I posted it again!

Not commenting on the body of the article, but the sentiment in the headline is true. Most Catholics and Protestants (especially in America and Eastern Europe) have fallen under the spell of individualism and personal liberty would do well to draw inspiration from other family-oriented cultures in their midst such as Jews, Mormons etc.

>>639630

>unironically linking the vatican catholic autist Dimond

>>640979

Dimond and MHFM are a bunch of weirdos who claim everyone they hate is demon possessed and led astray. They teach, effectively, that the Catholic Church has been essentially infiltrated, seemingly contradicting God's promise that the Gates of Hell shall never triumph, as they receive communion from an eastern church. This leads to despair and loss of faith amongst trads

They should not be taken serious by anyone, even most mainstream sedes avoid them although their video on Anderson was basically correct

Just watch their latest video where Jimmy Akin is called a heretic because he likes….square dancing