/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>617779

Oh so when God layed His Spirit over Moses, the 70 elders, Josua and so on and so forth, that's not the Spirit of God, which necessarily must be God ? Really made me think

>>617780

Sorry, that sounded more sarcastic than I intended to. No, TertUllian did not invent the Trinity. It's all over Scripture, both, New and Old Testament

>>617784

No, that's about the level of sarcasm needed for such sad bait

>>617786

It’s not bait, we’re talking about God here.

The Spirit of God was to my understanding seen as a force rather than a form of God - until Constantinople.

Here, it's all explained:

>>617779

The Holy Ghost proceeds from the Father and the Son, what's confusing there?

Thousands of years of unanimous church acceptance over almost all denominations: God is a trinity

Some hick in rural tennessee: dat dun make sense to me

>>617827

and who would that be ? :)

>>617779

Why have you lied to Holy Spirt? You have lied not to man but to God.

t. Peter

Angels on the head of a pin.

>>617827

Can they be in Mississippi? if so this works:

>>617840

Could be a title for god, figuratively, metaphorically, anything

All I know is the early church fathers did not believe the Holy Spirit was a person like Christ the Logos was. It was never mentioned as a third form of god, nor as something particularly important. If you ask me the guys who came up with this got duped by Valentinian heresy of a Mother Nature of god and that shit is pagan 100%.

>>617977

>the Spirit of Truth

>Not important

Also these bait threads always appear twice or I'm dreaming?

>>617988

>the spirit of truth is an important thing

>DUDE THATS THE THIRD FORM OF GOD WOAH

see the problem here?

>>618011>>617988

Wisdom eg sophia is also the logos btw, is that a fourth person now too?

>>617779

>404 Not Found

Nothing of value was lost

Teachings of the trinity only divide Christians more with calling everyone who does not believe in it a heretic. There is only one God, that is correct, but to seperate him in three different entities is an oxymoron of everything God commanded in the Old, as well as the New Testament. Now, I know God can assume and create different forms of Himself. The Word was His first creation. God is the light itself, while the Word is the sound itself. The Word, or Jesus - as we all know Him - was in the beginning with God, but God has no beginning; God always was, is, and will be. But through the Word He created everything we can perceive. As John 1:1-3 says:

>1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

>2 The same was in the beginning with God.

>3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Also the spirit, is one form of God that is among us on the Earth, not a completely seperate entity. The concept of the Trinity always seemed fishy to me and think that it is one giant Jewish trick to make Christianity look like polytheism that claims to be monotheism.

>>618227

>God the Word is a creature

That is wrong. Do you even Nicean Creed ?

>[…] And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all worlds (æons), Light of Light, very God of very God, begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father; […]

>>618236

>Do you even Nicean Creed ?

Do you even Scripture? Do you put a man made creed above God's word?

>>618238

It's another "muh tradition doesn't count" episode, I see. Godspeed

>>618243

Your tradition doesn't count. You're pulling the same shit as the Pharisees. Your tradition perverted what God intended, as the Teachings of the Elders did. Your fallacy is nothing but another cycle of repeating history.

>>618227

>God is not created

>The Word is God

>The Word is created

This is your brain on jewish tricks

>>618244

So you're saying 2000 years of tradition that has sparked from Christ and the Apostles themselves, even the ~300 years to the ecumenical council of Nicea - are worthless, because you think your bible - which has firstly been given you by these very men you condemn and which is only a translation of translations of the original words of the inspired texts - is the only source of faith and truth. Also you say Christ is a liar, because when He established the Church and told Peter that the gates of hell shall never prevail against it - by divine intervention - that actually wasn't true. Also you deny God is working through the Church by revealing more truth bit by bit so that we may be able to digest and make sense of it ?

The gist of it is just that you're like "muh jooz" and hold yourself to be the utmost authority on all things faith-related - apparently you're even above God. I see. That's blasphemy and a blatant display of unlimited hubris and pride.

May God have mercy.

>>618227

>the Word was his first creation

NO NO NO GODDAMN IT YOU WERE DOING SO WELL GODDAMNIT MAN

>>618227

Spirit as a person?

It is a GREEK trick not a Jewish trick.

Hellenes came up with that. Not Jews.

>>618253

>So you're saying 2000 years of tradition

stopped reading

>>618253

You reason exactly like the Pharisees. All your secondary literature is the reason what you believe but not the Bible. You know, there is one thing the Catholic church did very well: gathering all the scrolls and manuscripts of the Old and New Testament they could, translating them, compiling them to one book, and not adding their own doctrine. In this part, they showed integrity. They even showed great integrity at not adding any gnostic books. Jesus was exactly against the "Traditions" of the (Talmudic) Jews that perverted faith to our one true God. And you come to tell me that your traditions are above the very Word of God. Don't get me wrong, there are sure Catholics that live infinitely more Christ-like than me, you, or any non-Catholic. It still doesn't mean that those who argue with "muh Church tradition and secondary literature" make Christianity look like Judaism and Islam, because both latter religions need secondary literature - but yet as equal - to their holy books.

>>618238

The Bible is the fruit of Tradition, The new testament are compilation of saved letters from the apostles, to congregations who were reliant on oral tradition to keep the teachings intact. The Bible came out of the Church, not the other way around.

>>617977

>Could be a title for god, figuratively, metaphorically, anything

Except Holy Spirit is used as personal name.

"He (God) have sent me (God) and his Spirit"

t. Isaiah

"He (Father) will sent another, Holy Spirit, to be with you after I am gone"

"Holy Spirt procedes from the Father"

"Baptise them in the name of the Father and Son and Holy Spirt"

t. Jesus

>All I know is the early church fathers did not believe the Holy Spirit was a person like Christ the Logos was

They introduce God as a Being unknown; they suppose Christ to be unbegotten; and as to the Spirit, they do not admit that He exists. Some of them say that the Son is a mere man, and that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are but the same person, and that the creation is the work of God, not by Christ, but by some other strange power.

The Epistle of Ignatius to the Trallians Chapter VI

You cannot get earlier than that.

>>618227

The biggest and the most united denomination of Christians slapped not-trinitarian heretics on holy councils. And you little arians wish to talk to us about division?

>Anti-Apostle Paul thread

>Two Anti-Trinitarian D&C threads

I see the Muslims are raiding again.

>>618494

If I ever refuted scripture I would not be Trinitarian. But know my grace and anserw this one question - is time creation? For if it is and yet there was a time when Son was not like you would like to believe little Arius, then Son is at least second creation.

"I AM Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, saith the Lord God, who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty. I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore"

>>618558

I mean "refute with scripture", forgot that. Still, John 1:1-3 is quite clear.

>>618528

It’s all me bro

I now believe in the trinity, don’t worry :)

>>618566

And I am to. Is time creation? If it is and yet there was time when Christ was not then he is not first nor through him was everything created.

Is time creation?

>>618754

Some questions can not be answered :)

>>618758

Thing is ethier creation or creator. Is time creation? Or is time God?

>>618754

God exists beyond the realm of time. The concept of time only exists for us but not for Him, given he always was, is, and will be. Time has no relevance to Him. When the beginning was, He created everything through Christ. I am sure He created time, but rather as a guideline for us. What is time for Him and for us is a great difference though. In Daniel it says one day for God are 1000 years for us.

>>618789

“All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.” - John 1:3

>>618800

Ah, taking out John 1:1-2, so just to "debunk" what I've written. Good job at not doing a good job.

>>618332

You are a retard who takes something the Church gave you, and then have the nerve to trash the Church. You are just a modern day arian.

Learn what the Bible is, huge retard. You have failed to address a single point, and I wouldn't be surprised if your answer was stored in a file called "damage-control.txt" that you mindlessly copypaste when someone points out the infinite contraditions in everything you say. You keep repeating the same canned buzzwords about pharisees. You are exactly like the other idiot who says that Paul is unbiblical. And just like him, you are yet another product of protestantism, where braindead retards take the Bible, without knowing anything about what it is or its origin, and start making up fanfics. There is no difference between you and a mormon.

You are in no position to say who is Christ-like bcause you know nothing about Christ. So stop fueling your insane fanfic and go learn something about Christianity so that, eventually, you can convert to it.

>>618872

Saul of Tarsus manipulated Christianity to fit the Roman empires pagans that is the truth buddy.

>>618900

Scripture disagrees.

>…Barnabas took him and brought him to the apostles. And he declared to them how he had seen the Lord on the road, and that He had spoken to him, and how he had preached boldly at Damascus in the name of Jesus. So he was with them at Jerusalem, coming in and going out. And he spoke boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus and disputed against the Hellenists, but they attempted to kill him.

>Then the churches throughout all Judea, Galilee, and Samaria had peace and were edified. And walking in the fear of the Lord and in the comfort of the Holy Spirit, they were multiplied.

>>618948

He still added stuff that contradicts Jesus, so cannot be an apostle.

>>618948

Notice how Acts doesn’t call him an apostle not even once.

Oh my God I just read the rules this is a nicene-constantinopolean creed board mods pls don’t ban

>>619020

Acts 14:13 Which, when the apostles Barnabas and Paul had heard, rending their clothes, they leaped out among the people, crying,

>>619064

Still doesn’t count as a real apostle, the number is twelve and twelve it shall be forever. Disagreeing with Christ on the issue of salvation? Yeah buddy, you’re not part of the club.

>>619285

You were just disproved by Scripture and dodged the point because you realized you were wrong.

>>619285

You think to know what Christ says because of what a book says

You care about what that book says because it is scripture

You consider it to be scrupture because the Church told you it was Scripture

That very Church, that very group of people, also said Paul's writtings were Scripture.

Now please, stop coming iup with more excuses, you are embarrassing yourself, ex-muslim