/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>541875

Keep in mind that none of us are righteous.

It's hard, but try to keep that in mind.

>>541875

Take it as a model that is being given to you not to live your life by.

If there's anything about the sinful way they do things that you hate, introspect on your own life and go out of your way not to be like them you are dealing with. If they are rude, be especially polite. If they take the Lord's name in vain, always remind yourself not to. And so on.

If you put enough effort into improving yourself in these ways, you might even have a positive effect on them, but don't work expecting that to happen in every case. Of course, if they do something deserving a rebuke directly, don't be afraid to say things straight, or even consciously separate from them if you discern that they are creating a stumbling-block to you. It's all discretion.

Realize that God, in His mercy, will save them if you truly weep for them and pray to Him because you want to see them be saved, but who will save you?

>They don't deserve any sympathy, because holding sympathy enables them even more.

You do not bring people to salvation by treating them like demons, who cannot be saved, but by treating them like icons of God. Icons of God that may be covered in mud and feces, but icons of God nonetheless. They are victims of the devil, they are not free in Christ, but slaves to sin. As cliché and misunderstood as "love the sinner, hate the sin" can be, it remains nonetheless correct - you do not bring individuals to salvation by being blind to the distinction between their person and their sinfulness, even if they themselves are blind to it.

If they see any attack on their sinfulness as an attack on their person, then let the light of Christ shine through you, so that they may see that God truly works through His servants, and that He truly is love, humility, and salvation, and that a Christian lifestyle of perfection is the only way to avoid Gehenna, and most importantly, that committing sin is antithetical to this.

So, you have to not only cease to spite them, but you have to even love them. Our Lord, the only perfectly pure man because He is God, laid His life down for the sake of generations upon generations of sinners who deserve nothing less than eternal punishment. And we are expected to love the creation of God just as much as He has shown He does, and anything less than that will bring swift and eternal judgment upon us.

I suggest the first step toward loving others would be to speak of them with more compassion. "Roasties"? Language is a powerful thing, even in our private thoughts. As our Lord said, anybody who says to his brother "Raka" will be liable to eternal fire.

>>541991

Sure, but some people sin a lot more, and more severely than others.

>>541998

>maybe develop a more mature vernacular.

Sluts?

>>542003

That sounds like good advice, except for "If they are rude, be especially polite." I've tried this approach and it almost never works, it just tends to show weakness. I'd rather be blunt and harsh.

>>542006

>the distinction between their person and their sinfulness

What if their person is their sinfulness? I don't see how one is even able to realize this distinction is present in certain individuals. I don't believe all people can be saved, it seems absurd.

>So, you have to not only cease to spite them, but you have to even love them. Our Lord, the only perfectly pure man because He is God, laid His life down for the sake of generations upon generations of sinners who deserve nothing less than eternal punishment.

Again, this makes it seem like everyone who does something that falls under sin is the exact same type of person; sinners who are all equally bad. I don't think a person who has sinned once in the past few years is the same as someone who does it on a nightly basis, or am I wrong?

>>541875

Your family is not those related by blood but rather those who share union in Christ

LUKE 14:26

>If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

My family took a decade to make me choose between them and my faith but, when they did, I got the hell out even though it left me, my wife, and kids temporarily homeless. Gotta choose God- and God provided for us shortly thereafter.

Better to just ditch out now rather than put in a decade of effort to convert them and just have it blow up in your face because you didn't listen to God when he told you to "nope" the heck out of there a decade previous.

>>542019

>Sluts?

yea sluts is a better and more specific term.

people that use 'roasties' usually want to degrade all women, without exception.

>>542006

>Realize that God, in His mercy, will save them if you truly weep for them and pray to Him because you want to see them be saved, but who will save you?

Free will means those whom do not want to be saved will not be. No one brings anyone to salvation except God.

All you can do is lead a Christian life and show by example. Argument does not work (pearls before swine), kindness which enables evil does not work. Do what is good to further good things. Be polite but do not tolerate evil in your presence- remove it or yourself from the situation.

>>542019

>That sounds like good advice, except for "If they are rude, be especially polite." I've tried this approach and it almost never works, it just tends to show weakness. I'd rather be blunt and harsh.

Maybe I should have used the word considerate. It has less to do with speech patterns than basically, seek for discreet ways you can put yourself at an inconvenience for their sakes and see how they react. I'm not saying be over the top or passive-aggressive, but rather the opposite of that, just do it for yourself.

If something about them causes you resentment, try to make yourself asymmetric to them in the way you do things, rather than to escalate or return in kind. Some people get really uncomfortable in that kind of situation, knowing they're around you when they do those things.

>>541875

Just think of what awaits them. Think of the pain they will experience as they burn unceasingly for countless millennia, think of them never being able to know God or ever see any of their family ever again.

When you think of how horrid the life to come is for them its hard not to cry over loved ones,

>>542044

True, but hell is a place they make for themselves. You can pity if you want, but it's something they chose- in little steps during life. Lying to themselves and others, only using people not loving them. The loneliness and pain is entirely of their own making. So, you can pity, but it's more a pity for their failed existence than their suffering; the suffering was simply the natural result of their life- as it would be for all of us without the saving grace of Christ.

>>542055

>The loneliness and pain is entirely of their own making.

Of course but its a pain greater than any person can comprehend for a time period greater than anyone can comprehend. Its not like a fat person getting diabetes or a harlot getting HIV.

Yes the Japanese civilians chose war and supported war but it doesnt make the firebombings and atomic bombings not upsetting

Video extremely related (its only 3 mins)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTEskgiZDvI

>>542054

Its the most horrific part of being a christian imo

My parents aren't the best people but knowing that if I cant help them get saved in the next 30 years they will experience that stops me from sleeping whats worse it makes me seem crazy and pushy whenever I deal with them.

the way you stop hating sinful degenerates is that you stop being a hypocrite.

>>542019

>What if their person is their sinfulness?

This is what our person is:

>So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them.

Sin only came later. It is not natural.

>I don't believe all people can be saved, it seems absurd.

Yet that is the will of God according to 1 Timothy 2:1-4.

>I don't think a person who has sinned once in the past few years is the same as someone who does it on a nightly basis, or am I wrong?

If neither has repented, their sin condemns them both.

Of course, the one who sins more often and in more grave ways will have a much harder time to repent and cease to sin. But in the eyes of God, all sin is abominable.

>>542029

>Free will means those whom do not want to be saved will not be. No one brings anyone to salvation except God.

God can save those who do not want to be saved, by changing their heart so that they cease to be slaves to sin. One cannot change the direction of their heart after death, and yet we know there are sins which can be forgiven after death. But due to free will, God will not force a man to seek salvation on account of His own will, but rather, it will be on account of our desire and prayer to see that person be saved, as when the paralytic was saved due to the faith of his friends.

>>542026

>>>/lumbridge/

>>541875

Because of John 8:7. The post shows Pride, so you're just as bad - prolly worse off - because you know about it while they're just ignorant and unknowing.

Hate the sin, fight it, but don't hate the sinners – they have been deceived and had no chance to retaliate appropriately. That is not an option: Mark 12:30-31

That being said, of course it's not easy, especially when you're surrounded by degeneracy. But your hate - or developing hateful feelings (because I don't want to suppose you are hateful) - has the capability of damaging you beyond "sinning", namely if it starts to dictate your whole existence. Think of /pol/ types.

This is not what you want and not what God wants for you.

So please, brother, pray for them, for their conversion, be loving - or at least keep yourself from falling for sin through overwhelming feelings - and then everything will be going its way just right.

God bless

Some members of my family are monsters disguised as humans. They hate God. They hate Christians. Their every look toward a Christian drips with malice and contempt. Every word that proceeds forth from their mouths is blausphemy. They are liars and false accusers and backbiters. They used the naive trust I placed in them as a child to ruin my life several times over. My body still has the deformities of their abuse. They commit adultery and sodomy and prostitution and revel in sin and call evil good and good evil. They murder unborn babies. They hit children. My mother who is a sadistic sociopath (diagnosed during one of her stays in a mental hospital) beat me when I was a child, but the emotional and psychological abuse she subjected me to was worse. She utterly destroyed my siblings' souls. She raised us to hate God and despise goodness. These people have no shame nor remorse nor conscience. They are Communists. They call for and celebrate the murder of Christians. They react with rage at the mere mention of Christ. I've tried to help them but they only threw their sins in my face in defiance and worked to undermine and harm me as revenge. And they know exactly what they are doing. They are demons in human skin. I never want to see them nor speak to them again. I pray to God for their conversions. I do not hate them but I recognize that it is only through the supernatural intervention of God in my heart that I don't. My prayers for them are the extent of my love toward them. Besides that I only feel apathy toward them. If you think loving sinners means treating them like kindergarteners, then you can go ahead and "love" my "family" for me. They would devour you.

>>542178

spoopy

>>541875

>How do I stop hating sinful degenerates?

I hate myself too, it's not healthy.

>>542044

It's so hard for me to even comprehend this, and I have family that roll their eyes at the mere use of the word "church" in a conversation. After a long time, I've finally killed that atheshit meme within myself that God is somehow evil for "sending people to hell", now I know that people absolutely choose it. The difficulty is not hating people for their sin. I have to remind myself that I am wallowing in other sins, and that's just as bad. Even though my heart sinks thinking about this, I am also given greater joy in going to be with our Lord

cats aren't in the bible

>>542019

>Sure, but some people sin a lot more, and more severely than others.

Sure, but they are ignorant. You may not sin "as much" or "as bad", but you have Christ… so your sin is committed in full knowledge of the price of your sin, yet you do it anyway :) makes you think which is worse

>>543211

>no cats in KJV

cats don't exist; they are demons

Remember that they are made in image and likeness of God like you and are your brothers and sisters therefore. I think that by realising this, you'll fell more sorry for them then hating them.

Also you can remember a prostitute that repented in the gospels. Or At. Paul, who butchered Christians, but later converted and became head of the apostles with Peter, wrote half of new testament and got beheaded for his faith.