2f3c65 No.15465023
Why do the majority of people dislike turn based games? I see a lot of people that are happy about pokemon not having turn based combat versus wild encounters.
I don't get it, what's bad about turn based combat? It doesn't require hard execution like fighting games or something, it's easy and basically a way to make bosses 'easier' by grinding.
be23b9 No.15465058
In my opinion it depends on how it's implemented. If the turn based system is basically like a lot of RPGs where it's a glorified animation library then what's the fucking point. But if it includes tactics or something neat with the turn based mechanics I'm all for it. The idea is to think "why is this turn based"?
In a game like X-COM I believe it works for it, even if real time X-COM is a blast to play. In a game like, Trails in the Sky for example, it's the kind of game you play and think "why wasn't this like Ys but with party members" or something because the gameplay is complete piss and the turn based nature of it simply serves to simplify it into complete shit and make the game longer.
Oh and fuck grinding. Unless you're gaining cool abilities from leveling up(Which I guess Trails does do this so I can't hate on it that much) then level systems can fuck off.
aa7f83 No.15465110
>turn based combat is easy
Beat Battle Isle and come back to me fag.
09d85d No.15465115
>Majority of people
Now that's just bullshit, Pokemon and FF7 are still huge heavy hitters
ecd473 No.15465119
>>15465023
>majority of people dislike turn based games
>RTS are dead
>turn based games are still popular
f28ab1 No.15465121
>muh have to think through my moves
aa7f83 No.15465126
>>15465121
I love me some automated micromanaging, unlike those dumb and shallow turn based games. :^)
09d85d No.15465129
>>15465110
I can't imagine trails with a real-time combat system
I just wish that its combat systems were improved as well as the character models
He clearly hasn't played any SMT games or dungeon crawlers>>15465058
c7fef7 No.15465149
>>15465023
>Why do the majority of people dislike turn based games
I love them, but sadly they're a dying genre.
>It doesn't require hard execution like fighting games or something, it's easy
That's what stats are for. If one enemy has high evade, it doesn't matter how strong you attacks are if you can't hit him for example. What kind of turn-based games have you played in your lifetime that you think they're easy?
>a way to make bosses 'easier' by grinding.
So do action based RPGs.
Sage until OP replies since I think this is pic related.
c7fef7 No.15465151
aa7f83 No.15465157
>>15465151
How about you beat me at one of those easy dumb shallow turn based games? Give me your email address so we can play a casual game of Advanced Strategic Commander, dude.
57dbd6 No.15465177
>>15465023
What I've seen people shitting on is not turn-based combat, but
>Go out in the fields
>Random encounter with a generic enemy
>Kill it by doing X movement, then Y and finally Z
>Keep moving
>Again random encounter with generic enemy
>Do the same set of movements
>Keep moving
>Encounter
>Repeat
It gets stale very quickly and is highly annoying unless you are some kind of masochist autist that loves doing repetitive, boring stuff over and over again with barely any thought, a.k.a. grinding.
ef5cb0 No.15465204
>>15465177
>Kill it by doing X movement, then Y and finally Z
Usually it's X then X then X again.
sage because this is a shit thread that needs to die.
Turn based games can work but as anything it needs to be well made to be good.
It's just that the ones with shitty turn based combat get away with it way too often.
4a8047 No.15465205
>>15465058
>the gameplay is complete piss and the turn based nature of it simply serves to simplify it into complete shit and make the game longer
be23b9 No.15465206
>>15465129
I can, replace Adol with Estelle, sword with staff, and maybe have the Nayuta system where you can choose between spells on the fly and leveling up gives you more sword staff moves.
Maybe have a hot tag system with two or three other party members, but I guess all of this is due to the benefit of hindsight.
Don't get me wrong, I think Trails(the sky trilogy at least) is a very charming series but the gameplay is easily the worst part of it.
c7fef7 No.15465207
>>15465157
Pic related.
>asking for personal info on an anonymous image board
>>>/cuckchan/ and stay there. Don't care if you're banned, Mehmet.
b608b3 No.15465209
Depends on the game I'd say. A lot of turn-based games can be an absolute slog to get through, especially if they have a slow start before you get to the good stuff (assuming there's anything good in the first place) or are just braindead easy with nothing to make up for it. High encounter rates with no real variation in how you deal with it can make things get old fast. I still love them though, but it's easy to see why others wouldn't get too into them.
b602e2 No.15465210
>>15465023
Turn base RPGs are easy, but it can get boring and repetitive if you figure out a formula.
Strategy RPG or Turn Based Tactical RPGs like Xcom and FE are better because you're always at risk.
29a19d No.15465243
>>15465023
Personally enjoy a lot of turn based RPGs, plus that most of the JRPGs and WRPGs I played, had different gimmicks(Grandia I and II with the action gauge, Xenogears and Legend of Legaia with the combo system, Wild Arms 1 and 2 with it's different mechanics per character, Lunar 1 with a grid based area and Trails in the Sky which expanded on the concept, and so on).
>>15465058
>Trails in the Sky
I disagree with that example, since the game is a bit tactical, with area affect spells, different weaknesses to exploit, positioning, especially if are playing on harder difficulties. There were plenty of times, where I had to think what move to use in order to survive(before learning about Hell's Gate, but even then it wasn't a sure way to victory, on every encounter, plus, like a retard choose Nightmare difficulty for my first palythrough, and I refuse to restart the game, I just finished the school play)
>>15465177
The same can be said about generic action rpgs or poorly made diablo clones.
aa7f83 No.15465271
>>15465157
>burner emails are personal info
iq89 tier post.
It's actually necessary for you to give me an email to play, the game uses an outdated mail service multiplayer.
aa7f83 No.15465272
000000 No.15465280
it's attention-deficit-whatever and it's very very common because our cellphones and unlimited internet access are causing it
>>15465115
those are from a different age, also there are normalniggers constantly whining about how much they want an action-based battle system in Pokémon
3ff5f0 No.15465285
>It doesn't require hard execution like fighting games or something, it's easy and basically a way to make bosses 'easier' by grinding.
You say that like it's a good thing.
I like turn based games. I dislike games that do turn based badly, which is a lot of them, and most of the JRPG genre, in my experience.
29a19d No.15465317
>>15465285
I agree with your statement, but would you mind sharing some of your favorite turn based games?
I already mentioned some good ones, in my other post
3ff5f0 No.15465346
>>15465243
>The same can be said about generic action rpgs or poorly made diablo clones.
Yeah, but I'd still rather slog through a bad action game, because the system of fighting just feels less annoying.
>press button
>bash enemy on head
>enemy die
<hit random encounter
<watch battle start transition
<watch enemy's entrance animation and some text scroll
<select move from list
<watch animation
<text scroll
<watch as enemy hits back
<read more text scroll
<repeat this a few times
<finally, enemy die
<you have defeated enemy text scroll
e48136 No.15465349
>>15465023
If by "turn-based" most games mean't something that made sense like simultaneous turn then I'd probably really like TBS.
Alternating turns is an archaic hand down from PnP and tabletop when you have to do things in person and has no purpose being in a digital medium with as much computational power as we have now.
It's not fun watching another player take a turn.
It divorces the feeling of control from the player since you can't do anything when it's someone else's turn and it grinds playing to a halt. This is why people tend to skip watching the enemies turn in something like RTW.
Also most turn based games are amazingly shallow and highly RNG dependent. Some even use d6 dice rolls, what a joke. There are RTS games like supcom that simulate projectiles so they can hit terrain or be blocked by other units and yet in a classic TBS this would just be a simple diceroll. You'd think since you don't have to calculate on the fly you could make the game hugely deep. Wargames like CMANO simulate real radar physics for detection and ARMA has fairly advanced and realistic ballistics modelling. X-COM uses a diceroll. That lies.
3ff5f0 No.15465355
>>15465317
I like turn based strategy. X-COM, Advance Wars, Fire Emblem.
I like the original Fallout games.
I like Mario RPGs, and their timed hits mechanics.
75efeb No.15465357
Try HOMM3 and tell me that turn based games suck or are "outdated".
29a19d No.15465390
>>15465355
Thanks for the advice, the only thing I haven't tried is Mario RPG, I also recommend you trying Grandia I or II(there is no story connecting the two of them, just the gameplay is similar), it uses a bar where you see when you and the enemy are about to attack/use ability and if you time it right, you can cancel their turn, but they can also do the same to you, there is a video of a guy beating the second last boss in G2, without letting him attack one turn. The game also has almost no random encounters, you see the enemies on screen, Plus the story and .music are also great
aa7f83 No.15465455
>>15465349
>I'm a literal retard that thinks turn based games can't be heavily computerized.
349ef7 No.15465502
>>15465349
>Join a thread to argue a genre shouldnt exist because it causes your ass to clench
Kill yourself any day now you mongoloid.
2f3c65 No.15465510
>>15465149
not bait, it was a genuine question
000000 No.15465524
>>15465023
We don't. Journos/child rapists do. They pushed this meme in order to ban good games and create space for the shit cinematic nugames.
Turn based is one of the best systems for any RPG.
aa7f83 No.15465528
>>15465524
>RPG
I thought we where talking about strategy games, not this faggot shit.
2f3c65 No.15465529
>>15465524
Well by majority I meant normalfags and casual gamers, not 8ch
c7fef7 No.15465530
>>15465510
You're still a fucking nigger, because you didn't answer any of my other points.
c7fef7 No.15465536
>>15465524
Nothing wrong about fucking sexy kids. What are you, gay or something?
2f3c65 No.15465559
>>15465530
Sorry
>What kind of turn-based games have you played in your lifetime that you think they're easy?
By easy I was referring to execution desu. Just use the analog stick or d pad to navigate through the menu and press a button to confirm and another to go back. Of course they have depth to them that can make the overall game harder, but rather than requiring autismo execution it demands strategy/planning, which I hope even a normalfag can achieve if they keep at it enough, hell you even got the internet now for muh tips n' guides
32150b No.15465577
>>15465559
Why didn't you include that in the OP?
We could've had a way better discussion than this shit heap
c7fef7 No.15465580
>>15465559
You're still dodging my question. Of course you have to enter input to make a character perform an action. How else should you play a game, vie telepathy?
>muh
Stop talking like a nigger even if it's ironically it's annoying and ridiculing people who like to have honest discussion.
7665ae No.15465649
i used to love turn based games (SMT III, Wizardry 8) but now i hate them.
all of them are so easy grinding is a laughable concept in current year.
like all genres, JRPG's got beat with the casual stick around 2009-2012 and there hasn't been a single difficult one since.
even games that are directly marketed as very difficult, such as Darkest Dungeon and Stranger of Sword City are both overwhelmingly easy and i have to go out of my way, like ignore entire mechanics, just to see a character die.
in some of these games, they give you so much unnecessary EXP that it's actually very possible to skip an entire dungeon, an entire 10 hours of EXP gain, and still beat the bosses. so grinding? ha. what games have you been playing where grinding is even in the vocabulary?
most of the random encounters are killed in one turn. i remember i played 7th Dragon 2020 on the PSP and one of my characters was The Hacker class and i literally never got to see his status ailments a single time over the course of 10 hours because they require at least two turns to connect and everything died in one.
FUCK TURN BASED GAMES
c7fef7 No.15465683
>>15465649
Have you played P5 on hardest difficulty?
f49fb3 No.15465714
>>15465023
Well-designed turn-based games are actually a bit tougher than real time, not the other way around. The plain fact that you have to think farther ahead in turn-based games is a turn off for most, then there is the fact that devs can throw in more depth when a player is given more time to think. So, these games usually take longer to learn and more trial and error is involved before a player can be confident. So, people who are used to finishing up a game within a month of buying it will be turned off by most turn-based games.
>>15465119
Case in point, here. Those looking for strategy games tend to gravitate towards turn-based strategy, which still thrives in a niche market because they tend to be deeper and more time-consuming. Meanwhile, those who are into the more fast-paced 40-minute-or-less format of matches were turned off by the strategy aspect of RTS and mindless mobas wound up being so much more profitable that they basically killed the RTS genre.
c9e6f6 No.15465842
>>15465559
>desu
I'm speechless
26787e No.15465843
I've seen normalfags complain that turn-based RPGs are too boring because "all you need to do is press Fight or whatever the generic attack option is to win". I can't think of a single turn-based RPG where this actually works, though. Even the easiest ones are typically easy because your non-"Fight" options are game breakingly powerful for like 99% of the game.
f10134 No.15465944
>>15465023
I don't dislike all of them. I'm playing one right now actually, but I do have to say I do prefer action-oriented games much more.
My problem with them is most of them bore the fuck out of me eventually, usually a couple hours in when the "newness" of the world wears off. If they're the kind of turn-based game a la Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest where you see your character(s) attack one after the other then I'd rather be playing an action game instead. Same with classic dungeon crawlers, I want to like them, but I just get bored with them.
I do enjoy some turn-based games where positional tactics play a role, like X-com. Disgaea also tickled my fancy.
I have Etrian Odysey on my backlog and normally I wouldn't even bother anymore, but I'm willing to give it a go.
I'm also fine with Pokemon games with battle animations turned off to speed it up. On top of liking the monsters the gameplay feels fast and, funnily, deep enough, with switching pokemon in and out of battle, to not dislike it. Wild encounters while trying to get trough a cave are still a pain in the ass, but that's what repels are for.
Now that I think about it, all the turn-based games I enjoyed have had elements of team customization in them on top of being games where either positioning matters or have decent animations to look at once you execute your turn.
I'm playing Frozen Synapse 2 right now and I'm enjoying it too.
>>15465058
Agreed.
32150b No.15465954
>>15465649
then go play older ones, those are still very much for the "hardcore" audience
d6d492 No.15466080
>>15465843
you're talking about people who play the first random battles of any given game and then generalize about the whole genre.
67a628 No.15466100
>>15465649
>Stranger of Sword City
Do a solo run. It gets laughably easy at NG+, but getting there will be a pain in the ass.
67a628 No.15466144
Actually, can anyone recommend some more difficult turn-based games to challenge? I've been doing some maniac mode FE9, is there something else like that? What about SRW, are there any entries that are both translated and difficult?
7771b9 No.15466189
>>15466144
The entire point of SRW is watching the animations and feeling cool.
da117b No.15466319
>>15465207
ANSWER HIM YOU FUCKING COWARD
Accept anon's challenge.
>>15465271
>>15465157
93b136 No.15466339
>>15465023
Pokemon is the best-selling game franchise and most people play generic RPGs on their phones these days so I would argue most people actually like turn-based shit
b9cfd1 No.15466397
>>15466144
>What about SRW, are there any entries that are both translated and difficult?
Alpha Gaiden. Also OG1 is fairly tough. I heard A Portable gets pretty hard too but I never finished it. Portable is such a stupid fucking thing to add the title, the original was a GBA game
81f7a1 No.15466427
>>15465058
Pretty much. It's the same reason why I'll never play another turn-based JRPG that isn't a strategy/tactics or card game: because there's no real reason for it to be turn-based in the first place. At least with strategy/tactics games, the turn-based aspect allows you to think about the moves/actions you're about to perform. Same thing with card games. Without any context to the turn-based aspect of a game, it just becomes a button-masher in my opinion, which is anything but fun.
871b2b No.15466449
>it's easy and basically a way to make bosses 'easier' by grinding.
You answered your own question. If a game is too easy, why even bother
f49fb3 No.15466904
>>15466449
Explain the popularity of games like Uncharted and Skyrim.
9a13a2 No.15467011
>>15465346
Realistically speaking, most of the shit listed under the bad turn-based gameplay doesn't really take more time than the animations of the action game
3206d4 No.15467036
>>15466904
>/v/ is responsible for the success of mainstream titles
>/v/ buying games
>/v/ playing games
63e887 No.15467044
Because waiting for computer to do its shit without anything to do yourself is
BORING
37866e No.15467349
Turn-based strategy like disgaea or advance wars is the way to go for turn-base combat
0e5449 No.15467648
>>15465243
>with area affect spells, different weaknesses to exploit, positioning, especially if are playing on harder difficulties.
I've played PS1 games with that exact same shit. I forgot the name of the game in question but you paused to perform an action on a target enemy. It was pretty neat but I lost the game and got my ass handed to me by that teleporting ghost asshole.
ecd473 No.15467733
>>15466144
I have heard people calling Devil Survivor difficult but I didn't find it all that challenging so maybe give it a try?
871b2b No.15467754
>>15467036
I’ve no doubt that /v/ plays every game that was claimed to be shit
eeb400 No.15467777
>>15466904
Both are easy games. Easiness transcends implementation.
e0a74e No.15467789
>>15465023
Because most JRPG turn based combat is a fucking snoozefest. There's nothing wrong with turn based combat if you actually have to think when you fight (Heroes of Might and Magic 3 for example)
000000 No.15467796
I don't know. /v/ used to love turn based and cried day and night for turn based mmos but then /v/'s favourite games switched to plebshit.
1d1cce No.15467800
Is Bravely Default any good?
eeb400 No.15467807
>>15465843
There is one game that is exactly like that anon. Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest. Kinda doubt they played that one though, despite it being created specifically for them.
1d1cce No.15467811
>>15465843
If you get overleveled, that works sometimes. But a lot of modern TBRPGs have an "automash attack" button.
7665ae No.15468095
>>15466100
>i have to go out of my way, like ignore entire mechanics, just to see a character die.
thanks for proving my point with your retarded ass response
67a628 No.15468110
>>15468095
>suggesting to do a challenge run is retarded
What are you a casual?
7665ae No.15468113
>>15468110
i'd rather play a game that's not balanced by mobile phone pandering kikes in the first place. there are many games that don't need a "challenge run" to be fun. do you play shitty game for baby pokemon too? epic nuzlocke challenge where i ignored 99% of game's mechanics to have fun instead of play a game that's already hard even when utilizing all tools.
f49fb3 No.15468766
1bef86 No.15469005
Because most games don't have a fast forward button. A lot of turn based games become amazing when emulated with fast forward.
baa933 No.15469174
>>15467800
If older Final Fantasy with jobs is your style, sure. Be aware of some stupid bullshit like having to wait real hours to have your village be rebuilt, the opportunity to pay real money for bravely second, something I never saw a need to use, and a story that starts decent enough, but drags on for the worst reasons. I liked it, but there were a few things that irritated me more than they should have.
baa933 No.15469181
>>15469174
If you have a hacked 3ds, totally give it a shot.
c21c61 No.15469210
>>15465243
>The same can be said about generic action rpgs or poorly made diablo clones.
This is wrong. With an action RPG you at least have options. It's not like some turn-based games where the grind becomes so tedious they include a fast-forward auto-battle button or like Earthbound where you can skip the battle entirely if you're strong enough. Turn based RPGs have a mindless tedium problem. If you can just mash one button to blaze through a battle, your game is fucking trash. People like to attribute NuPersona's big growth to waifu faggotry and that's only partially true. People like the One More turn system because it makes the turn based combat engaging because there's an actual reward to playing smart that's more than "You used Fire on Ice enemy. You dealt 1,800 damage instead of 1,300 damage."
This is why Paper Mario is held up with such reverence, because even a battle against a low level enemy can cost you a lot of health if you don't do the action prompts for your attacks.
So take a game like Pokemon. The rumors say there's big changes coming to the next "core" game and I hope it's something that makes the combat more engaging. Especially when you look at the absolute state of competitive Pokemon. Competitive Pokemon is all just toxic spikes and reflect and protect and every Pokemon on your team having leftovers as a held item. Competitive Pokemon is more about making sure your Pokemon live long enough to neuter the enemy team with debuffs than Pokemon actually battling.
5f6acd No.15469235
>>15469210
>all those fries touching bare tray plastic that has probably had thousands of hands touch them since the last time they were washed
Makes my stomach turn.
1c57c4 No.15469309
>>15465023
Just thing to point out.
You can't judge turn based games properly if you didn't play absolute pinnacle of the genre.
c11f96 No.15469350
>>15469210
>This is wrong.
How? There is functionally no difference between mashing A to get though a trash mob fight versus spamming your biggest nuke to get through. Being able to use Nuke A over Nuke B changes literally nothing as far as mechanics are concerned.
e0a36e No.15469440
>>15469235
faggot, the trays you get at the counter are freshly washed and most of the time even wet from the dishwasher so that the paper they put on the trays gets all soggy and shit. I am more worried about soggy fries
1823a8 No.15469463
>>15469210
>Talks about competitive pokemon
>Uses 6v6 singles smogon memes
6v6 isn't competitive pokemon. Only retards and showderp play that. As stupid as TPCi is, even they managed to realise that showdown is degenerate and made the less-shitty VGC rules for competitions.
ebdeab No.15469483
>>15465349
>X-COM uses a diceroll. That lies.
Assuming you're talking about nuCOM, there is no "lying" occurring; you just fail to understand seeded probability generation.
d5bb37 No.15469495
Because every generation has shorter attention span than the previous.
07c5ca No.15469518
I can fully understand why some people wouldn't like them. I've heard one explanation that they'd rather just actually fight, instead of waiting their turn like they're at the DMV.
Personally I'm fine with turn-based combat, but I can see why it would turn some people off, no pun intended
cb14e1 No.15469520
>>15466144
Try to beat FF Tactics Advance without using anti-law cards. Prepare for hell
>Anon's face when he has to defeat an enemy without attacking him or using magic
6f27d6 No.15474702
>>15469210
>With an action RPG you at least have options. It's not like some turn-based games where the grind becomes so tedious they include a fast-forward auto-battle button or like Earthbound where you can skip the battle entirely if you're strong enough.
The whole point of that is that there's no joy in fighting something you can mash attack to defeat like the Persona example you gave. If you're so strong that no strategy is involved or the EXP you gain is so minuscule it's not worth your time. Then you don't have a reason to fight those enemies.
>>15466144
Hard mode in the english version of FE10 is even harder. Other hard games with turn based combat is Natural Doctrine, Dungeon Travelers 2, and Rondo of Swords. You could also try challenge runs in those types of games like a 2 or 3 man team in Etrian Odyssey or playing the Disgaea games without repeating a level or going into item world. I've also heard the Utawarerumono games for the PS4 and Vita are tough if you play on hard.
0e5449 No.15474737
>>15469483
There are hidden variables which influence chance to hit which is not taken into account to the accuracy percentage shown to you in the UI. This is why nuCom 2 can have you miss 100% shots in vanilla.
2b3127 No.15474744
>>15469520
If only enemies could actually get red carded the game would be so much better
f49fb3 No.15474924
>>15469210
>If you can just mash one button to blaze through a battle
But literally the same thing can be said for over 90% of action RPGs, even the good ones.
67a628 No.15475536
>>15474702
>Hard mode in the english version of FE10 is even harder.
That's bullshit and you know it. There are a couple of moments in FE10 where you depend on RNG to not die - like in 1-6-2 where you can't make it to the right hand side in time before enemy myrmidon attacks Fiona twice with around 10 crit at the end of a second turn and it's game over if she dies, but aside from that, there is a clear strategy on what to do to win and if you do things right, your hit rates are always consistent and somewhere near 90-100. FE9 Maniac drops you into the land of 60-70 hit rate right from the start, meaning you have to adapt more if you miss important swings.
>rest of the post
Thanks for suggestions, I'll try them out.