/v/ - Video Games

I'm playing the fan translated version of Pokemon Black so I could correctly pronounce Japanese words to english

>A huge portion of Core2/6/10k is just English loanwords written in katakana that 95% of the time are obvious before you even see the answer for the first time.

Can I just suspend all of these? I don't see how they offer any benefit, and I'd prefer to spend my new cards per day on words that I don't actually know.

>>15054373

They're easy to understand when you see them but you probably still want to internalize that they're loanwords and be able to recall them for use if you're interested in language production. Also, not all loanwords retain the meaning they originally held. Like how マンション refers to a large apartment building.

>>15054887

Those are good points. I don't expect to write or speak to anyone soon, but it's probably setting myself up for problems in the future to not know which ones they are.

>>15054373

It's not a huge portion. Unless the percentage suddenly jumps up later in the set, you get maybe one or two loan words per 20-word day. Since they don't really take much effort to memorize, just consider them a nice little break from the more difficult stuff

>>15055452

do it anyway nigger

>>15055502

game was dubs, no dubs no jap, maybe another time

>>15055452

>Leaving self-improvement up to an unlikely bet.

>Not improving yourself for self-improvement's sake.

You didn't have the strength of character to learn anyway.

>>15055574

Hence why he's a nigger.

>>15055452

Don't be a nigger, learn nip today!

Kenka Banchou 3 has an optional quest to collect bokken sold as souvenirs. Is that a real thing?

>>15055681

>with words

That's not what it says it does. It says Hiragana. You should be able to memorize Hiragana in a couple of days and then move on from there

>>15055727

it's actually a sequel to katakana.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/554600/Learn_Japanese_To_Survive_Katakana_War/

and they are releasing a romaji later.

its helping me learn characters, which you can combine to form words, its good for beginners and its in a form of an rpg.

>>15055752

Close to, maybe not over. I mathed wrong.

>>15055681

>>15055735

>Hiragana

>Katakana

>Romaji

<Not Kanji

<Not vocabulary

それは絶対に駄目です

>>15054373

At the least they're a quick test of your katakana reading, and they don't take much time so I just leave them in my deck personally. Plus as >>15054887 said some are not obvious and just have to be memorized for the way Japanese use them.

>>15055735

I would advise against the romaji one if it releases, since that isn't really Japanese or very useful.

>>15055752

>over 5 hours in anki

Why are you spending so much time on cards? That will likely become completely unmanageable with reviews.

>>15056058

Multiple decks. Vocab deck, Kanji deck, Kana deck (basically finished), Video grammar deck, text grammar deck. The kanji and vocab decks are pretty normal. The two grammar decks would make more sense outside of Anki (just watching the video series or reading the textbook), but putting them in there gives things a schedule and structure.

Also, except for the last deck (text grammar, which takes the longest of course), everything else is pretty stable in the number of reviews at this point. Anyway, in another ~10 days I should start reading manga and shit.

>>15055452

Come on dude, don't be a CIAnigger, learn today!

Two questions I have here.

1. How do I stop being a fuck-up on Anki?

2. Is it worth writing down the numbers and alphabet in Japanese?

>>15058209

>At the very least, write the hiragana/katakana 50 times each.

Done since years ago. Problem is keeping at it.

>>15058209

> It technically isn't mandatory if you only want to read…

Hmm, now I wonder if writing those kanji is a waste of time. Some of them are aggravatingly hard to get just right. Doesn't matter. Omega Labyrinth Z is forever gated from the West so I better step up my vocab and grammar game.

>>15058340

Writing the Kanji helps me memorize the meaning.

How are you having trouble with the kana after years? I'm a few months in and have them down, though katakana sometimes makes me stop to think for a second.

>>15054199

Should I take cards that are marked as leeches in Anki and just repeat them over and over outside of it? I turned off the suspension thing because I thought it was stupid to just pretend they didn't exist.

>>15058493

No trouble with the kana. What I meant to say is that I years ago I was pretty persistent until IRL shit happened and I was only able to do repetitive Anki reps with no time to add any new cards or decks. It was only until a few months ago that I tried to get back into things. Emphasis on tried because I get wracked by bouts of anxiety over being unemployed, which interferes with things. But enough blogposting. I focus on the Core 2K deck and my own vocab deck but the "2136 Joyo kanji by grade" deck leaves me in stitches every time I run into 20 more new ones so while I know it's a bad idea in the long run, I stop as soon as I review the ones that I do "know" for about a week. Writing did little to help and I hate that.

>>15058532

I turned new cards way down, 5 for kanji and 10 for vocab per day. 20 for both is way too many.

>>15058583

Fortunately, I found the option to change that pretty easily (though I had to make a new group so it won't affect the others). Still, I had to force suspend half the kanji deck because for the life of me, I can't recall the on/kun of most meanings. Or I can only recall one out of the two or just one of each instead of every single last one of them, but I deem it wrong anyway. Damn it, times like this I wonder if I'm crippling myself.

>>15054373

Cause セーター means sweater and I never would have guessed that

Also loanwords that aren't in English. Do you know German? アルバイト

>>15058493

>leeches

I usually just keep at it until they stick eventually. Maybe try an extra review step like handwriting. If I'm confusing two things then each time I come across them, I try to recall both and their differences. Some people find success in temporarily suspending a card for similar reasons. Get one word down, then they don't confuse it when later adding it back into their reviews.

>>15058532

>>15058617

Too much Anki will burn you out, I sure wouldn't be able to handle 20+ new cards each day without working myself up to that point. You could try a different resource for kanji if you don't like that one in particular. Try to generally make sure the ones you're learning are also the ones used in vocabulary you're learning. More ways to associate them with what you know and are learning makes for easier memorization. You shouldn't worry too much about perfect recall of the readings, they're easier to learn and recall in the context of vocabulary, in part due to the previously stated reason. The main goal of kanji study, I think, should be ability to visually recognize and differentiate and learn common meaning of the character.

>>15058617

Kind of like the other anon said, I use the Kanji deck to memorize meaning (and writing) of Kanji and learn the on/kun from vocab.

Yo fags, we could use some help putting together an email to Sony of Japan about the PQube censorship bullshit. Most of it is jewgle translated so if there's anything that can be fixed or added to or clarified please let me know

お世話になっております。

私は欧米のプレイヤでございます。

私は翻訳されたゲーム、PQubeによるOmega Labyrinth Zの検閲について聞いたことがあります。

私のような西洋の顧客はこのゲームを購入できません。

私はソニーとゲーム開発者をサポートしたいが、それは不可能である。 私はソニーにその姿勢を再考して、西にこれらのゲームをリリースさせてください。このゲームを購入してプレイしたいと思う他のゲーマーがいて、ソニーの検閲が好きではありません。

ありがとうございました

>>15058736

我慢？That seems to basically mean "grin and bear it" or "to endure" in English.

>>15056254

Makes sense. I probably used to study that long every day, but I would (and still do) just keep a vocab deck and do everything else outside of anki. If you don't mind doing all that with cards alone then I guess that works.

>>15058825

this worked really well with sega

>それだけは、食べないでください。

What does the で do here?

>>15058995

It's a negative request form, the ~ないで form. Make the negative and add で

食べないで Don't eat

使わないで Don't use

And so on. You can add ください to it to be more polite.

Regarding the "Indefinite pronoun の (= one)", that's not actually what's going on, right? It's actually a nominalized verbal, isn't it? Wiktionary and Jisho don't mention a separate pronoun called 「の」, this construction ([adjective]の) appears to behave like a adjective+suffix with respect to pitch accent (according to OJAD, at least), and there doesn't seem to be anything motivating this analysis besides making it more easily understood by English speakers. Normally, since the place I saw this was Genki, I would just assume that it's another example of Genki teaching things the wrong but fast way and move on, but the only places I've seen refer to an "Indefinite pronoun の (=one)" are Genki, Maggie-Sensei, and a peer reviewed paper that has been cited many times.

Also, can nominalized verbs behave the same way these nominalized adjectives do? I.e. you can say 「黒いシャツがある。赤いのもある。」, but can you say 「太っている人がいる。やせているのもいる。」?

>>15058995

No body is really sure where it comes from. It could be from the participle of だ, で, but there is no reason for any form of だ besides です to come after an ～い inflection morpheme outside a few recent complex compound tenses limited to speech.

Looking only at current usage, however, the ないで form is considered a second て-form of the negative. Japanese in Mangaland (not my book of choice but the only one I can find that gives them individual names), refers to these as "The negative te-form (naide)" and "The te-form of the negative (nakute)". The naide and nakute have their own specialized usages that split the usage of the positive te-form. Among said usages, one that naide takes is acting as the object of the verb ください in commands. This is may be abreviated from ないでください to ないで, the same way that the positive te-form may appear to make an informal request. But keep in mind that this is actually an abbreviation, so (prescriptively) marking a negative request is not the main or inherent role of naide, that job is done by ください which is not added for politeness but removed for casualness.

>get through RTK fairly easily

>start 2k vocab

>immediately realize I'm fucking retarded

That girl was right, I can't learn Japanese.

>>15059312

Don't give up you fucking faggot. Which version of the 2k deck are you using? How many new cards per day are you doing?

>>15059319

I'm using the Core 2k/6k optimized japanese vocabulary deck, 20 new cards a day.

>>15058736

There's an idiom, おくびにも出さない

"lit: not even letting out a burp", which means to contain your feelings and thoughts to yourself and give no indication to anyone.

>>15059158

It seems it can be used like that. Look at this sentence written by a native:

>どのねこも大きく太っていて過食じゃないのと話していたら施設の人が、元々大型の猫が多いと説明してくれました（中には本当に太っているのもいるらしい）。

の here is being used as a pronoun substituting for 猫。

>>15059794

What exactly are you having trouble with?

>>15059235

>marking a negative request is not the main or inherent role of naide

So is the main role to be part of a te-form (which has a variety of uses) but negative?

If I go to that Jisho site and watch anime, enough that I can sort of translate doujins to get the gist of it, is that enough learning?

>>15059958

I've only been doing it a couple days, but it takes me around 5 times of seeing a card before I can actually get it, my retention is awful anyways, and it already takes me over an hour doing this tiny amount.

>>15059958

ないで is used as a more polite form for negative commands, or meaning something like "instead of verb" or "without verb".

しないで a more polite version of するな　（１）or a more casual version of せずに（２）

例（１）：意地悪しないで Don't be mean.

例（２a)：彼は勉強しないで、テレビを見る

He watches TV instead of studying.

(2b):彼は休まないで働き続ける He keeps working without resting.

These sentences could be rewritten as follows:

意地悪するな・意地悪すんじゃねえ

彼は勉強しないで、テレビを見る

彼は休まずに働き続ける

>>15060083

Fuck. At the bottom, that should be

彼は勉強せずにテレビを見る

>>15059794

>20

Reduce the number of new cards that you do per day and work up from there. I recommend starting at 5. It may feel insulting at the start, but it's better than burning yourself out through hubris. If you still encounter words that just won't stick, write them down and make mnemonics for them. That's what's working for me.

>>15059958

>It's main role is to be part of a te-form but negative

Yes, but with the asterisk that なくて is also an negative te-form and their uses are mutually exclusive.

The て-form links two clauses, but the exact relationship between them can be pretty varied and ambiguous. Also, the te-form is used in several phrasal verb constructions. ないで is the negative te-form used in all of said constructions such as ないでください and ないでいる. The other major ones are that ないで is used to mean "doing Y without doing X" and なくて lists a negative action or state that doesn't affect the other clauses in the sentence. In general, though, ないで is more common.

>>15054373

>Can I just suspend all of these?

Definitely don´t do that. As others already said, many Katakana loanwords have drastically changed their meaning over the time, or aren´t even of english origin, anyway. Their pronounciation is also completely japanified. That´s why I would treat katakana loanwords not differently than normal regular japanese words. Or would you have guessed that グラウンド means sports field?

>>15065499

http://4chanint.wikia.com/wiki/Spanish

Maybe this can help.

inb4 "muh cuckchan!!", maybe our /int/ could do something similar instead of just eternally shitposting.

>>15065572

That's nice. Thank you Anon. One question that I have more than anything though, is if there are any good or recommended Anki decks for the language.

>>15065840

That's a way of using the "stem" of a verb with another to make a sort of compound action. With 行く・来る it means to come/go do the other verb.

>会いに行った

Go to meet.

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/polite

>However, a useful grammar that works in general for stems of all verbs is using the stem as a target with a motion verb (almost always 「行く」 and 「来る」 in this case). This grammar means, “to go or to come to do [some verb]”. Here’s an example.

>明日、映画を見に行く。- Tomorrow, go to see movie.

>>15065891

Oops, I meant "went to meet" in the past tense, but you get the idea hopefully.

>>15065499

get a college level textbook and also immerse yourself in Spanish media after a bit. You'll have to dedicate every waking moment you aren't working to studying or practicing if you're trying to be conversational in a year.

>>15065891

会い is not technically the verb stem. The stem is actually /aw/ and it can't be written in Japanese.

Similarly, the verb stem of 分かる is /wakar/ not 分かり.

>>15065891

>>15065895

>>15065910

I thought the stem of 会う was just 会. I think I'm more confused now.

>>15065910

if you're going to be a sperg about morphphonology at least have the decency to put them in double slashes or pipe brackets //aw-// so that people don't think you're taking about phonology.

>>15065954

the stem of 会う is //a.w//. but because /w/ has been lost before all vowels accept /a/, it looks like the stem is //a// in all forms except the ones like the negative perfect (会わない). Back when ゑ ゐ and を were pronounced with a /w/ you also would have had 会ゐます

the infinitive of 会う is 会い. u-class verbs form their infinitive by adding /i/ to the stem. people often confuse the stem and infinitive because they are the same for ru-class verbs, and because the stem is a purely theoretical concept that, for u-verbs, cannot actually be pronounced in the language (only used to describe the formation of useable forms)

>>15066025

>>15066032

Pre-masu stem. Whenever anyone talks about stem and is actually trying to teach you how to speak Japanese that's what they are referring to (or something equivalent). The stem you are referring to is only useful to those who want a technical, not practical understanding of the language

>>15058825

Don't use Jewgle dumbass, it will always sucks at grammar and you're giving them more reason to exist.

Just post the English letter here, be patient and anons will eventually deliver.

>私は翻訳されたゲーム、PQubeによるOmega Labyrinth Zの検閲について聞いたことがあります。

>私のような西洋の顧客はこのゲームを購入できません。

wat

>>15067865

On the contrary, it's practical and helpful for recognizing and understanding the distinction between the conjugation of 五段動詞 and 一段動詞。

>>15068369

It's one way to explain that I guess, but most sources will talk about changing the entire syllable from rather than specify that the consonant-ending stem doesn't change. IE they say く becomes か, they don't say that the K stem takes an A ending.

Guys what's the difference between 一暖驚 and 一驚?

Google translate says the first means surprised and the later surprising, but I can't confirm it anywhere else.

I'm having a bit of technical difficulties with my language bar keyboard. I probably pressed some weird hotkey and now I can't figure out how to change it back. When I have Japanese hiragana or katakana selected a single keypress is giving me a kana instead of (usually) 2. So if I type try to type か with ka I get のち instead, in order to get か I press t. I don't know how I got into this mode but I want it back to normal.

there's an audioprogram called 'pimsleur' that has audio courses for many different languages. it was designed awhile ago, before the current fad (aka bullshit) methods like rosetta stone and duolingo. the dude who made it. dr (or mr?) pimsleur, died a while back and thus new ones aren't being made anymore, however the ones that were made are of excellent quality. i've never used the japanese one myself, but i've used the german one and it's worked extremely well.

for major languages like japanese, there are three units total, each one comprised of 30 lessons of 30-minute length each.

it's designed for one lesson a day, but listening to one lesson for two days in a row before moving on to the next lesson can also work if one a day is too fast.

it's audio-only and thus should never be the only source of learning. using it on conjunction with other methods works best, especially considering that one or two 30-minute lessons each day is not too much extra time.

also, there was an 'updated' version of pimsleur made more recently called 'absolute pimsleur' that only has 10 lessons for each unit and is rather trash, don't confusingly get that one instead.

here's a youtube link (and an mp3 if you don't wanna check youtube) of unit 1 lesson 1:

youtube.com/watch?v=Tw72xejUUQE

https://www30.zippyshare.com/v/MWTqQPeS/file.html

and here's the magnet for the full course. (the magnet is actually for a torrent of many pimsleur courses as that one was the most seeded, but just disable the others and only download the jap one):

magnet:?xt=urn:btih:e357b3fa7f76d1b867e369cfab8086ef4416a015&dn=Pimsleur+Complete+Language+Collection&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.leechers-paradise.org%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fzer0day.ch%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.demonii.com%3A1337&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.coppersurfer.tk%3A6969&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fexodus.desync.com%3A6969

if someone needs i can upload just the japanese one to mega or something if someone has trouble with torrents on their connection, just lemme know.

>>15067865

>pre-masu stem

the infinitive isn't a stem because it's a full word and it has many other functions more important than being the form to which the //ma.s-// auxiliary attaches.

If you're using that katsuyōkei "stems" (katsuyōkei actually means "conjugation forms" and doesn't call them stems) then at least use it's actual name (ren'yōkei - continuative form)

and practical? how is it not practical. the stem is the thing to which verb inflections attach, it allows you to explain the conjugation of the kei forms instead of just memorizing them.

>>15068927

went ahead and uploaded it to mega.

https://mega.nz/#!Teg1iahT!k_HvNqfOzSD8pUKaTCsgfkwSlhefScmeLcX-TRYtj44

>>15070924

Because it's using ~てしまう grammar.

>>15068641

Where did you get it from? 一暖驚 doesn't show up in any Japanese text if you search for it. Only in Chinese.

>>15071701

Right?!

It's from a manga, though. Torako.

>>15073071

Can you post the page it was from? Maybe context will give a clue.

is there a difference between 行かないつもりだ and 行くつもりじゃない? I think the first should be "I intend not to go" and the other should be "I don't intend to go" but does Japanese actually make the distinction?

>>15058209

>hiragana/katakana

Does that include the alphabet in Japanese? As well as counting from 1-10? Forgive me if I'm mumbling certain things up.

>>15075202

Hiragana/Katakana is the alphabet. Numbers are in Kanji and will probably be among the first things you learn when you do vocab

>>15074908

I've read that negating つもり is "stronger" than negating whatever word comes before it (IE whatever it is you intend). I suppose it would be read more like "I have no intention of going".

>>15076125

If you enjoy anything from Japan like manga, anime, their culture, or anything else then it's certainly worth it since you won't have to rely on translations (that will likely be fucked) to enjoy that stuff. If you ever want to visit Japan it would benefit you greatly too obviously. There is also joy in the learning process itself and improving a new skill. The usefulness for a job would probably only matter if where you were applying had business with Japan and needed someone who could speak Japanese, or it was a translator job.

>>15065499

try to learn/memorize a few vital words to be able to get to where you're going, and practice them daily.

>>15055681

I was happy to pay 99p for just the jazzy main menu music.

>>15086867

Cant say. I wouldn't even do 30, the time seems to increase exponentially rather than linearly. Since you are doing cards you are mostly already familiar with though whatever works I guess.

One thing I can recommend, if the reviews are piling up on you do a custom study with "review forgotten cards". Basically, do everything that you missed a second time that day, to make sure you actually learn them. I find that that helps me to get most of them right on the next day, and it doesn't really have any impact on whether I get them or not on the second review after that.

>>15087905

Everybody knows that they can't learn Japanese by now.

>>15087905

Maybe people are just too busy studying, or enjoying things in Japanese as a result of their studying. There also isn't often much to discuss unless a specific question comes up, so we often have long dead times and then spikes of activity.

>>15087937

>Maybe people are just too busy studying

Nice joke, I bet those good for nothings are shitposting elsewhere!

>>15087905

I just did the J-CAT test yesterday and apparently I'm at an N3 level after 1 year of studying. I'm quite surprised and proud of myself to be honest. Visiting Japan this October so I'll see how good I'll fare.

I've said it a million times and I'll say it again despite it making me sound like a shill - WaniKani is the best thing that has happened to me for kanji and vocabulary. It costs $50 per year (it's 100 but discount codes are always available) but it's very much worth the money.

>but it's just anki

On the surface maybe, yes. But there are a few very important differences. The first big one being the community, which admittedly you can have access to with the free 3 level trial. More importantly however is that there are a ton of websites such as bunpro.com and satorireader that can hook into your WK account and in their example sentences only show you furigana for kanji that you haven't yet learned on WK.

Jish also shows and links to WK levels showing you at what level you'll learn a given vocabulary. Lastly, there are 2-3 example sentences for every vocab you learn and a ton of userscripts to enhance the whole thing. I recommend everyone to check it out.

>>15088153

Heh. I didn't know "prosaic" in English, or "散文的" in Japanese.

I really like the "letter" for "Ya"

>>15087905

Summer Pockets just released. JLPT is coming soon. I'm guessing the concurrent posters we do have are cramming or just playing games.

There's also the fact that learning Japanese is a pretty lenghty time investment. I can't imagine how many Anons who have posted in these threads asking for suggestions have quit already.

>>15087905

>わたし

>not 俺

>>15089128

You're >>15068641 right? I was kind of curious about the raw for that part as well if you'd post it.

For that page, I have to go back to the previous one for context.

>馬鹿共

共 is a pluralizing suffix, typically derogatory. "Dismissed! Get lost, idiots!

>ゴリセン

ゴリさん short nickname for ごうり先生

>すっかり大葵に馴染んできた

(Torako has) Completely gotten used to Ooaoi (their school name) The て form + くる is like a time expression indicating the 馴染むing has taken place from prior up to this point.

Which brings us to the next page:

>その馴染む

With this she refers to what was previously said about Torako getting used to Ooaoi

>までに迷惑かけ倒されたがな

Up until (the above) she caused them a lot of trouble, in beating her/them in some way I guess? The が is "but" meaning. 迷惑を掛ける.

>ひん剥かれてた

Short/slurred ひん剥かれていた

>うっせえ

Short/slurred うるさい, which is more of a "shut up." うるせえ・うるせい are other slurred alternatives to うるさい.

Once again I didn't read everything you wrote and might have missed something.

>>15090173

Been using google Google Handwriting Imput app on my phone. Works better than any desktop app I found for identifying kanji based on my bad mouse drawings.

>>15090173

Use radicals and stroke count. That seems to work very fast for me. NHK news easy has a feature where you can switch the furigana on/off, so you could use that for some practice before trying to drop it completely.

>>15090209

>>15090198

I knew about radicals and stroke count but not about the NHK thing and the App. Will probably try those out. The thing is, it´s incredible tempting to just constantly read the furigana instead of the actual kanji signs, so i´m probably better off going "cold turkey".

>>15090166

That's 一瞬驚いた

"I was surprised for a moment"

Not what you claimed.

>>15090842

And can you point me to a source other than google translate, genius? It seems to be an expression formed by 一瞬驚 + いる (in this case it's past conjugation). My issue is that 一瞬驚 doesn't show in any dictionary I could find, and because I want to understand where the word/expression came from, I asked here.

>>15090876

Have you tried breaking it down into component parts? Look at it as 一瞬 modifying 驚いた. So it's exactly like he says, one (瞬=moment) [of] wonder/amazement (past progressive).

>>15090930

That's stupidly simple and works pretty well

>>15090166

I wouldn't worry too much about trying to phrase it in English so long as you understand it. Some things just don't translate 1:1 very well. It's not my forte, but here's something, I guess.

>Yeah but she sure caused a lot of trouble, taking me/us out before getting used to the place.

>>15090876

>>15091050

protip: if it doesn't show in any dictionary that's probably because it's not a Japanese word

>>15092319

Ika Musume, Konohana Kitan (maybe? I don't remember), Nagatoro, Takagi-san, certain doujinshi.

Just not Yotsuba unless you're using that vocab pack thing.

>>15092867

Not always, but if you don't get results on google then yeah.

>>15091185

But that's pretty good anon. Thanks. English isn't my first language either so it's twice as hard.

>>15092319

One manga I recall as likely being one of the easiest I've read was ななゆり if you like sickeningly sweet yuri.

>>15094608

If you really wanted to use it so bad, there's an Anki deck of it which would be better because it doesn't have the limits the website does. Honestly, I don't know a lot about it, but being spaced repetition based, I'd just call it a worse version of Anki with only one deck. Three if they separate radicals, kanji and vocabulary. Some of the radical names they give are, in my opinion, bad. So if you want to learn radicals I wouldn't suggest it. I believe you're correct in no offline. IIRC, (1) anon mentioned something about "the community," but you have us among plenty of other no-cost Japanese learning communities out there.

How important is it to memorize which version of a verb is transitive or intransitive? I imagine that as long as I know the base meaning of the word I should be able to recognize based on the particles and context where everything fits.

>>15095709

I personally take care of it, just in case, but it seems not that important since you can often see if it's intransitive by the particles.

Intransitive verbs never use を

I'm not sure right now if there are cases where they use the same particle and it's not clear, forgive me, I'm drunk right now.

Perhaps someone else knows?

>>15095709

Very important. You will often see sentences with the subject/object omitted or topicalized and you won't understand the proper meaning if you don't know which is which.

車は壊れた　The car was broken / The car broke down.

車は壊した　(unstated subject) broke the car.

>>15097744

Unless there's very special context involved where other forms of "breaking" are possible, the assumption in either case is "the car broke down". If the latter contained a subject then it would likely be blaming the subject for causing the care to break down. With no subject the sentences are effectively the same, one broken car and nobody to blame.

If there is other context, the the event would be clear from said context. If someone physically broke the car, like by punching it or something, we'd probably have noticed that in a previous scene, so the context would be clear regardless of knowing which one of those verbs was transitive.

>>15097869

That's completely wrong. Those two sentences are fundamentally different. In the first sentence, the car broke down on its own.

In the second sentence, someone or something else broke the car.

Intransitive verbs necessarily imply a subject, whether stated or not. Transitive verbs necessarily imply both a subject and object, whether explicitly sated or not.

*fill in the blanks depending on context

壊れた > "(it) broke".

壊した > "(it) broke (it)"

>>15055681

Your brain is lazy. This game essentially tricks your brain to memorize Hiragana so it doesn't need to constantly check the cheat sheet to progress through game. It does rather good job at it. Definitely worth a pirating at least.

Lets say i learned 500 kanji before completely lazing out, how exactly can i get back without going through them all again?

>>15087905

I actually gave up and went to learning python.

I finally got good enough at python so i think i might try doing this again.

>>15095709

It is important to know what arguments of a verb take which particles, I.e., that the object of 会う is marked with に, and that the thing you もらう is marked with を but the person who gives it to you is marked with に. If you learn this overtly as transitivity or not doesn't matter as much; learning one gives you the other should you need it and vice versa.

There are shit verbs which change their meaning depending on if they are used transitively or intransitively, most notably, transitive 聞く means hear/listen, but intransitive (personに) 聞く means "ask [person]" (but this distinction gets muddled in compound sentences), and placeに出る means "to appear (at)/attend" but placeを出る means to "to exit (from)"

Finally, sometimes you need to note the transitivity of a verb simply because the English verb it translates to is polytransitive (transitivity varies) and/or ergative (intransitive subject becomes transitive object), and in Japanese these two meanings are represented by entirely different verbs, so in order to use the right word you have to memorize the transitivity of each. E.g. English "Start/Begin" (an ergative verb) becomes 始める (exclusively transitive, "I start something") and 始まる (exclusively intransitive, "I start (to do something)").

>>15098020

Start doing grammar and vocab instead and review kanji slowly or as needed.

>>15098044

I'm not going to translate them all, but the pictures pretty much display exactly what the words are describing. The first one for example:

笑いながらkiss - kiss while smiling/laughing

泣きながらkiss - kiss while crying

怒りながらkiss - kiss while angry

kiss直後の二人と９課 - the couple after kiss and section 9 (this might be a reference to where they work?). Then the other other people are giving them shit.

>>15098042

聞く is transitive in all cases.

Even when it means "ask", you have sentences like these for example:

人に理由を聞く

人に情報を聞く

The object marked by を can be either the thing being asked about or the thing being listened to. Conversely, in these sentences 聞くmeans "hear" instead of ask.

人から情報を聞く

人から理由を聞く

>>15098544

well the guy has no eyes at all, too hard to point an expression on him hahaha I take what I get, ty very much

>>15087905

>>15087905

I gave up.

>>15100243

Sometimes I wonder I should do this too. But I invested way too much time into it. Sigh.

>>15100243

>>15100787

Why? Hit a wall? Lost interest?

>>15101348

It's more like I'll never learn nip

>>15094608

>>15095576

I'm the (1) anon, I post here often in these threads but sometimes there just isn't enough to shitpost to get my post count up. There are a couple of reasons why I prefer WK, will try to elaborate.

>Anki only resets once per day

This might be just me doing it wrong admittedly but my Anki (and I use it for the core 2k / 6k deck) resets every night at 4am. I do it once during my lunch break and then it's nothing until tomorrow. WK actually does the "spaced" part of "spaced repetition system" right in that things can come up for review several times per day

>They have a more structured leveling mechanism

This is again subjective but they have several "levels" for each item (apprentice, guru, master, enlightened, burned) and you have to get e.g. a kanji up to guru (get it right 4 times in a row) to unlock the vocab for that kanji. This means that things are unlocked as you learn them, not just linearly like with Anki. Once you unlock a word you unlocked it because you learned all the kanji associated with that word.

>It's written by native speakers

This is probably the biggest thing - the stuff is written and double-checked by native speakers. Most anki decks feature sentenced from tatoeba, if at all, and anyone regardless of skill level can contribute to those so it's questionable just how good the quality of the material is. Besides, all the sentences in the ore 2k / 6k deck are pretty useless because every single one of them is 「彼は　x　です」.

>Platform integration

This might be useless to most but I use sites like satorireader, jisho and duendecat which can all hook into your WK level to show you content appropriate to the kanji you've learned (or in case of satori, shows furigana only on the kanji you haven't covered in WK)

I mean yeah, it really isn't for everyone and to many it will just appear as anon said - anki with a single deck. But for me it's personally been more than the sum of its parts and in the end it worked, I'm just over a year in and I can comfortably read the majority of everyday Japanese (at ~1300 kanji right now). With discount codes it's like $50 per year which is honestly nothing. All that being said, I for one prefer externally imposed structure to my learning (meaning I don't have to look up and prepare the material myself) as I think it's hard enough to learn the stuff in the first place, I don't want to spend my time and effort learning how to learn the stuff I want to learn, so for me it works, YMMV.

>>15103402

Shitposting so I don't be the (1) anon again. That meme can't die soon enough

>>15103402

>(2)

But it sounds like it works fine for you so that is the important part. I spend money on physical books even though I could easily get free digital versions because I prefer reading that way and get more out of it. It's also nice to not stare a a screen for a few hours a day. Some would say this is stupid but I don't care.

>things can come up for review several times per day

This can be done in anki too, if you just choose to repeat a card. The idea is if you got a card easily then you don't need to see it again that day, freeing up time to review things you have more trouble with.

>Besides, all the sentences in the ore 2k / 6k deck are pretty useless because every single one of them is 「彼は　x　です」

Fairly accurate, the examples just give basic context and usage, they certainly aren't interesting or challenging to read most of the time. The cards also don't always have all the meanings for a word, so you pretty much want to look up every new word to get the full idea. Anki has many strengths but it is far from perfect.

>>15103460

Yeah see that's the thing - language learning is a long-term thing and the most important thing is routine, no matter what it is so what works for some people might not work for others. I encourage everyone to try every resource available as a trial - WK offers the first 3 levels (I think) for free so you can get a taste for it. Satori also offers some of its stories for free, go check that out as well, helped me immensely.

>>15103402

>things can come up for review several times per day

To my knowledge you can do this with Anki via the "steps" option in a deck.

> you have to get e.g. a kanji up to guru (get it right 4 times in a row) to unlock the vocab for that kanji.

I don't see this as a plus. It's a lot easier learn them together; when you can associate kanji with vocabulary and vice-versa.

>It's written by native speakers

This just comes down to picking a better deck, editing an existing deck or otherwise making your own.

>the sentences in the ore 2k / 6k deck are pretty useless because every single one of them is 「彼は　x　です」

The goal of core is to give basic sentences as context to teach basic vocabulary, not to teach grammar or challenge your reading ability. I don't think it's a bad resource or anything, but I'm not a huge fan of the deck either.

I agree that routine and keeping at it is the most important thing, that checking out different resources is always good, and I'm glad to hear your studies are going well.

>>15104119

>To my knowledge you can do this with Anki via the "steps" option in a deck.

As far as I know, any step less than 1 day will show the card immediately once all lower step cards have been shown. All minute-based steps are done as <X minutes. Instead, if you want to repeat your cards again in 4 hours you can set up a custom study to "review forgotten cards". The effect will be roughly the same.

>I don't see this as a plus. It's a lot easier learn them together; when you can associate kanji with vocabulary and vice-versa.

Learning them together is the point of that system. It guarantees that any vocab you learn will come from the kanji you have been working on. In Anki you learn random vocab and random kanji and just hope that they coincide.

>>15065499

I don't know your situation but that can't end well. Knowing Spanish implies you're going to have to deal with spics, and the moment anyone learns you're fluent you'll be chosen to deal with them every time.

>>15104294

>As far as I know, any step less than 1 day will show the card immediately once all lower step cards have been shown.

I believe it does this with the default steps of 1 and 10 because of the learn ahead limit, another option under tools>preferences which by default is 20 minutes. So any step within 20 minutes will come at the end of review no matter what, but say you were reviewing for 30 minutes, it would try to stick you with those each 10 minute step cards at the 10 minute mark. Lowering it or adding a step above said limit would force you to come back to review again at the x minute mark if you finished reviewing earlier than the review time. I could be wrong about how it works as I prefer one Anki session a day and never saw fit to try otherwise.

> It guarantees that any vocab you learn will come from the kanji you have been working on.

It guarantees learning them in relative proximity to one another, but not quite together. The way he said it, it's learn the kanji for a few days, then the vocabulary. I think it's much better than the, "learn all the jouyou kanji, then learn vocabulary" method, but still could be bettered learning them even closer together. It would just be a lot easier to initially learn that character when you're simultaneously learning a word that uses it too.

>In Anki you learn random vocab and random kanji and just hope that they coincide.

This depends on what deck/s you use and your study habits outside of Anki. It's not how I typically studied.

>>15103207

Yes, I got that already, that won't help me.

About the WK shit: I tried it, but I don't think I even get to the point where it started to teach actual words. That whole system is just too rigid. No offline mode is a deal-breaker, also the inability to edit cards (yeah, I know, it's my problem that english is not my native language and I should die, but I don't care). Yes, spending 5-10 minutes every day managing my Anki cards (and sometimes writing addons to workaround retarded things in Anki) is not ideal, but it's still better.

>being this much of a weeb

Is ちゃ pronounced "CHA" or "CHYA" I know きゃ and the like are pronounced "kya" but I wasn't sure about し, じ and the like.

>>15105621

I think it's technically CHYA, but it depends on how lazy the person speaking is, and most people are really damn lazy and ちゃ is already used as a lazy way to slur words together to begin with.

>>15105700

>ちゃ is already used as a lazy way to slur words together to begin with.

Then what is the correct way to represent the "CHA/CHYAA" sound in Japanese? Or is it just not used in the language?

>>15105621

>>15105700

>>15105749

Pretty sure it is not case of laziness, just such sounds don't exist (chya and shya). They probably decided to write them with small やs, because the rest already use them (and are pronounced as ya) and the し and ち rows would be the only ones not using them.

>>15105749

No native words use ちゃ. But loan words do, however they're written in katakana.

チャ

>>15106902

LOTS of contractions use ちゃ. For instance, てはいけない becomes ちゃいけない and なくてはいけない becomes なくちゃいけない or just なくちゃ

>>15106902

Maybe you are being dislexic and confusing ち for さ? Becauseちゃ appears all the fucking time in native nip, the most common example being ~ちゃん

>>15105621

it's pronounced [tɕa]. Native speakers may perceive it as /tja/, because that is it's phonemic shape, but recent influence from English means that many may be able to distinguish a separate /tja/ that would appear in loan words that is, (チャ vs テャ)

Also guys please learn SOME kind of standard phonetic notation before posting phonetics and phonemics questions. It Doesn't have to be IPA but trying to write out sounds like they were English words is super imprecise and can easily lead to confusion.

>>15105822

There is no such thing as "chya" in Japanese.

the sound romanized as "cha" is phonetically /tja/ (I.e., 'tya'), is pronounced [tɕa] (as opposed to English [tʃα], and is written ちゃ or チャ.

>>15105700

There is no difference between "cha" and "chya". /tja/ will be pronounced [tɕa] regardless of how fast the speaker is talking. There is no such thing as "chya" because "cha" is just the Hepburn Romanization way of writing /tja/, so "chya" would be like saying /tjja/, that is, it would be like saying '

チィャ'

>>15105749

You're right that it has nothing to do with laziness and that "chya/shya" don't exist, but like I said to the other posters, ちゃ and しゃwere "chosen" to represent the sounds because phonemicly they are, as far as Japanese is concerned, actually /tja/ and /sja/, and ち and し are /ti/ and /si/, and the y-sequence syllables are all written the same way: i-column-kana + small y-row-kana. That is, there is no difference between how you arrive at きゃ vs ちゃ: one is how you write /kja/ and the other is how you write /tja/.

>>15108201

is phonemically* /tja/. The slashes make it clear if you know the difference between [] and // but just to be clear, /tja/ is phonemic and [tɕa] is phonemic.

>>15104460

>It guarantees learning them in relative proximity to one another, but not quite together. The way he said it, it's learn the kanji for a few days, then the vocabulary. I think it's much better than the, "learn all the jouyou kanji, then learn vocabulary" method, but still could be bettered learning them even closer together. It would just be a lot easier to initially learn that character when you're simultaneously learning a word that uses it too.

Just want to clarify one thing - in WK yes, you learn kanji for ~3 days before unlocking the associated vocab but that's on SRS level 4, the kanji will appear again later (in a week, in a month etc.) As you miss items inevitably it just starts mish-mashing together at later levels.

>>15106989

>>15107046

Sorry I was being a fucking idiot. I was thinking of ぢゃ for some reason

>>15109287

but ぢゃ is used in compunds where ちゃ undergoes rendaku

>https://jisho.org/search/%EF%BC%8A%E3%81%A2%E3%82%83%EF%BC%8A

Also in Kagoshima and Kôchi dialects where the d-z meger didn't happen.

>>15108616

2k/6k

>>15111511

> encounters kanji in vocabulary so feels the need to drop everything and learn 1000 kanji in context instead of just doing the vocab

why do you niggers do this?

Also why can't you just use a Kanji course on Memrise? And don't use Duolingo unless you're 12.

>>15111686

1000 kanji out of* context

>>15087905

I've been lurking and sadly I've been busy at work.

>>15111377

Why not the 10k deck? It still goes in the same order, so you would complete the 2k/6k section first before moving on to the last 4000 cards.

>>15111753

I assume it's because they don't use clozes.

Why the fuck ARE Anki deck makers so opposed to clozes, anyway?

>>15111792

what?

>>15111753

I like cloze delete, but I don't know how I'd go about making a good vocabulary deck with it. Too difficult to deal with synonyms and the like.

>>15111886

Mind explaining what you are talking about? I have no idea how to make Anki

>>15111828

Sorry I was thinking of 'type:' not 'cloze:'

>>15054199

To all those people out there who know enough japanese to play H-games, is it worth the effort? If so, I'll start learning japanese.

>>15112171

My main reason was to play some non-h games, and read mango

If you're invested in the hobby, then yeah it's worth it

>>15111951

https://apps.ankiweb.net/docs/manual.html#cloze-deletion

>>15112200

Ok. The 2k/6k doesn't do that either and what would you even use that for?

>>15112539

I don't really know how you would go about implementing it effectively for learning vocabulary. I think it could be good for other stuff like kanji/writing or learning conjugations, particles and maybe some other stuff though. There's likely better formats but here's a couple quick examples for how you could use cloze deletion.

言葉

Write the missing kanji.

Use a definition as an indicator. You could also use a sentence over a definition and can set either kanji to the hidden one for variety, might still have some issues with synonyms though. If you're just learning to write, not worrying about pronunciation, you could instead just provide the reading of the clozed kanji as the best safeguard against synonym issues.

例文であります

Fill in the blank + "である," masu-form or other indicator about what conjugation you're to provide. List a type of particle that's clozed, it's function.

Didn't mean to respond to your post earlier, but one reason to go with 6k over 10 is 6 is pretty sufficient to set you up to start reading, so you could seek out new vocabulary more pertinent to your interests doing that instead.

>>15111686

Thanks for the non help. Welp, time to shell out three hundred for WK, then.

>>15113335

Did you even read the OP? There are tons of other resources for learning Kanji. Kanjidamage uses radicals and wacky mnemonics. There is Remembering the Kanji, the Kodansha Kanji Learner's Course, all kinds of courses on Memrise, Anki decks, youtube videos, and all kinds of other sources. And saying not to use duolingo is helping since that site isn't very good for Japanese.

Until I was about 12 I thought other languages were just English with other letters. How long will it take to learn chess?

>>15113922

>Until I was about 12 I thought other languages were just English with other letters.

Did you not begin to learn a single second language until then? How is this even possible? What education system is this?

>>15115106

Probably American. We don't start mandatory second language education until 13 at the earliest.

>>15115174

Even then it's like 50% Spanish with a smattering of French and German. All those languages use the same alphabet.

>>15112171

I personally lost interest after I was able to play them.

The thing is, dialogues in the H-games I played were really shallow, somtimes cringy and most of the time cliche, the same phrases repeating over and over again, kinda makes you wonder why you learned to begin with.

I played some games where the gameplay was nice though, I was in that weird situation then, where I wanted to skip the porn entirely since it was so forced and bad.

Hentai is even worse, "oh she is so kawaii~", "I-I'm putting it in now" and "uh oh senpais dick is inside me kyaa~" gets really old after a while.

Can I play fun games? yes

Does it lose some of it's magic? yes

>>15076125

Learning Japanese over the last one and a half years has monumentally improved my discipline and opened my eyes to what my capabilities are. Trying new things in unrelated areas are much less daunting.

Is there anything wrong with the て form video from nama sensei? It was fucking useful if it really is that simple. Everything ive read from various places make it seem incredibly daunting. It still does seem that way but seems much more bearable after watching that.

>>15123647

The conjugations he shows are correct, but those are only for Group 1/Godan/う verbs/whatever you want to call them. For group 2/る verbs you just replace る with て. So some of his conjugation examples are not correct, like 食べる is 食べて not 食べって. It also has many more uses than what he mentioned.

>>15115877

I play a lot of doujin eroge, but they've kept my interest ever since starting to learn Japanese. A lot of the time I just quickly skim over the actual H-scene dialogue as I agree with you there. Onomatopoeia and cliches. The lead-up and such is more important to me anyway. There are outliers though, of course. Very relaxing to play, I find. Can always load one up, even though I might not feel like picking up something else in Japanese at that moment.

>>15124740

The idea of all Japanese all the time; constantly exposing yourself to the language in one way or another as much as possible is good stuff. From what I know of it, I wouldn't bother with the website or methods suggested too much beyond that, personally.

>>15123688

>>15123701

Much appreciated anons. Im still quite fresh when it comes to this language but i have a question regarding verb conjugations. How exactly do you know when to use the conjugated form of a verb? For example, i understand that ます is a polite version and of course there are the negative polite forms but when would i ever use other forms like て for example? Can i just crank out the ます form for any type of sentence? If i want to give a command of say, run! (走る), does the ます form allow me to do that? Or do specific verb endings correlate to the type of verb tense you want to use? I think i may be a bit retarded when it comes to verbs but im hoping an anon can save me

>>15126103

I'm pretty new so take this with a grain of salt.

-ます is usually only used at the end of a sentance to make the whole thing politer.

-て forms are used for things like gentle commands, chaining verbs together (I ate and I ran and I slept), and auxiliary verbs (-ている being one of the biggest examples).

For your example, I don't think 走ます would work as a command. It means "[somebody] runs". If you wanted a command, you would use "走て(ください)" or "走ろ" if you're being forceful.

>>15126103

learning hoe to conjugate a word form is the first 5%, learning when and how to use it and understanding it is the other 95%.

In this case, the uses of the te-form are (this is a bit simplified):

>predicate (be the verb of) a subordinate clauses in a compound sentences

<this single use is used very broadly, so it is equivalent to many things in English, including complex sentences joined by "and".

> act as the object of several compound verb constructions, notably ください and いる

where as the masu forms

>predicate (act as the verb in) the main clause of a sentence spoken in a non-familiar register (equivalent to Spanish Usted, French Vous, German Sie, etc.)

>>15126325

equivalent to when you would use* those pronouns.

They aren't actually equivalent because masu is a verb form and those were pronouns.

Should I make a mining deck if the word/kanji I want to know is already in one of my existing decks and I haven't gotten to it yet? I'm pretty sure you can set an unshown card to show up the next day.

>>15126194

>>15126325

God bless anons. this makes things a lot more clear for me. At first i just wanted to be able to play jrpgs without having to wait for translations but now i am truly enjoying the challenge of learning a language that is so different from english. Glad this thread exists, dont know what id do without everyone here.

>>15126194

Those would be 走って and 走れ. You are correct about usage though, 走れ is a strong command, 走って could be a few things depending on context, and 走ります is polite.

>>15130840

That's one of the stranger conjugations. 1-step verbs get ろ endings while 5-step verbs get え-step endings. Usually both types end in the same vowel sound.

>>15130890

the 段 in 一/五段 means "column" not "step". As in the columns of a Kanji table, which is where the name comes from.

>>15130916

Shut up no one cares what it's called. Every single grammar book uses something different.

>>15130957

Of course you haven't. EVERY source uses something different, so no doubt whatever source you used has something completely different from whatever I used.

"Group 2 and group 1" "RU and U", "1 step and 5 step" "ichidan and godan" (yes, in romaji). In fact I haven't seen 一段 五段 yet, but that just goes to proove that every source uses something different. It DOES NOT MATTER what you call it, what matters is how you use it.

>>15130927

No not really, almost every textbook uses one of several names that actually describe the way they work, either

>vowel/consonant base

>mono/pentagrade

>ru/u

>ichi/go dan

or

>1/5 column

and Japanese sources only use ichi/godan.

Translating 段 as step in this context is not descriptive of how they work (what is a "step"?) and is also an obvious mistake. I can't find any textbooks actually using the terminology of "steps" so I'm going to assume this is a mistake you made yourself and that's why you're so angry. However, if you did get that from a textbook then it's pretty worrying that people who apparently don't even know about the Kanji table or that 段 means column wrote a textbook.

>>15130999

>>15131016

It's a Japanese woman mistranslating the English English so it's u understandable, but I have no idea why she felt the need to rotate the kana table besides to fit the screen better. It's still a mistake and is a functionally worse name than almost any alternative besides "group 1/2"

>>15131044

The kana table is usually written like that in english material. 段 also translates directly to "step", and step OR column is a valid interpretation of how it works on the table (with column only applying to a certain orientation, step works in either direction). Given that step is easier to say, it seems like the natural choice.

Again, it doesn't matter. If you know how to use it everything else is just a distraction from learning what is important.

>>15131074

>>15131044

Here's another example of the Kana table where the vowels are in separate rows. This one however is flipped with あえいうお being on the right side. Tae Kim refers to verbs as "U" or "RU" btw.

http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/complete/hiragana

How long have you guys been studying? I just recently got to the first year mark, and the amount I've learned is staggering, but at the same time it's frustrating how little I know.

>>15131268

Started May 4th so just over 2 months. About a week left to go before I start trying to read sort of on my own, I've been through 3 different grammar sources (working on the fourth) and over 1000 words but I'm still more than a little overwhelmed by the prospect.

>>15131268

Around 14 months now.

>the amount I've learned is staggering, but at the same time it's frustrating how little I know.

I can relate. Although I don't think it's frustrating exactly, more just keeps things in perspective that this takes a long time to get proficient at. It's easier to accept errors with that in mind for me.

What would you guys say is a timeframe to learn this through 1-2 hours per day of study? I've seen anons saying a year and I call bullshit. I'm assuming it would be several years at that rate.

>But why only 1-2 hours per day?

I have a shitty job and I don't want to blow all my free time trying to learn how to play ecchi games. I'm not sure if I really even want to invest the time, I'm just curious to see how much of a project this would be.

>>15133012

1-2 hours isn't bad. it's actually somewhat on the high end. Anyway it depends on what you mean by "learn this". In a year you should probably be able to read simple-ish manga with some help. If you want to be able to play video games like a native I'd say probably 5 years at the minimum, but I'm not that far along myself so I can only guess.

>>15133012

2 hours every day, 7 hours of grammar and 7 hours of kanji every week, maybe. You can can for sure do N4 or maybe even N3. It depends on how fast or slow of a learner you are, I guess. Reaching N3 is a pretty descent level for reading a lot of stuff. But I am probably exaggeration the abilities of an American.

>>15133037

I should have clarified, I would ideally be learning to play games, mostly RPGs and weird lewd/silly shit that would never come to the west. I'd also be interested in understanding spoken Japanese so I could watch obscure anime that doesn't get subs. I appreciate your answer, at the very least that sounds like a realistic timeframe even if that's just an estimate.

>>15131291

>>15133012

I started doing it about 5 years ago, something like 1-1.5 hour/day, on average. I still don't know anything. Well, I should be able to do an N4, but I never really looked into what it actually entails, so I don't really know.

I'm a few days away from starting reading. The Anon's Japanese Learner Package has some suggestions to start with, as well as a spreadsheet referred to as "the cornucopia". However, two out of three download links are dead and I don't even know where to start out of the spreadsheet.

So, can I get any suggestions to help me get started? Either working links or easier to find beginner alternatives would be good. Also any general pointers for someone just starting reading. General methodology, how and when to make a "mining" deck, where to get a proper text hooker as keeps being mentioned. Up until now I've been following the Learner Package's guide religiously but what's coming up seems like the biggest set of hurdles for me in the entire course and there's not a whole lot of guidance here. About 4-5 days 'till I start.

>>15135953

The link for スケッチブック changed, I found it here: https://mega.nz/#F!DtgAETJZ!PwSUjDbkbVrpphUPh0ENew

Not sure what the other one is.

Do you know what he meant by

>it will take you 22 days to cover all of them

for the VJG videos? It only took me a week to see all of them at least once.

>>15136175

The settings are fucked up. You aren't supposed to see 20 videos a day (that's absurd). There's 66 videos, so obviously the intention was to see 3 per day. How you handle reviews is up to you.

>>15136183

Well shit, I watched 10 a day. I'll keep watching the reviews until about 22 days have passed, so I don't miss anything from trying to do too much at once.

Ten a day took fucking forever, what an retard I am.

>>15136194

I'd keep watching reviews somewhat indefinitely, at least until you are comfortable applying all that grammar. Of course, with 3 per day at the start they are now spread out so that I only get 0-3 per day to review, and I can skim through most of them so it's not really a hardship to keep up with.

>>15135953

I suggest not to always be a stickler about understanding 100% of everything right off the bat. If it's just beyond you or is too much at once don't be afraid to just move on from some passages and keep the flow going for a less frustrating, more enjoyable experience. Not to mention sometimes things make more sense after moving on with further context or in-story explanations.

Any time can be good for a mining deck, I'd guess. Don't add every single unknown word you see to the deck. A word like 攻撃 (Attack) for example, you'll see it all the time in games, no need for Anki when you see it that often. You can always suspend them later if you decide you don't need to Anki a word too though.

バンプね

Alright, help me understand the following. For context, they're lyrics to a song. I will embed the song, too, so you can listen. Here's something I don't get:

たとえ君いがいのすべての人を敵に回す時が来ても君のこと守り抜くから

How is いがい being used in this sentence? I consulted jisho, and I've come up with three possible uses for the word. They are as follows:

1. 以外 = (adverbial noun) with the exception of; excepting(U+200B was here)

2. 意外 = (na-adj) unexpected; surprising

3. 遺骸 = (noun) corpses

Since the song is kinda edgy, I could see the sentence saying something like, "Even if there comes a time when you're surrounded by the danger of everyone's corpses, I'll come and pull you out of your troubles" but I don't think that's right. If that's not it, then what the hell is it actually saying?

I think I understand the rest of the song fairly well, so I don't really need to post the rest of the lyrics, but I will anyway for the sake of sating your interest, in case you actually care and you want the lyrics.

Song: 一輪の花

君は君だけしかいないよ

代わりなんて他にいないんだ

枯れないで一輪の花

光がまともに差し込まない

君はまるで日陰に咲いた花のよう

望んだはずじゃなかった場所に

根を晴らせて動けずにいるんだね

閉じかけた気持ち吐き出せば

痛みも苦しみもすべてを受け止めるよ

だから泣かないで

笑っていて一輪の花

いまにも枯れて仕舞いそうな

君の無邪気な姿がもう一度見たくて

君の力になりたいんだ

たとえ君いがいのすべての人を

敵に回す時が来ても

君のこと守り抜くから

君は君だけしかいないよ

今までもこれから先にも

たとえ君いがいのすべての人を

敵に回す時が来ても

君のこと守り抜くから

負けないで一輪の花

>>15140656

>たとえ君いがいのすべての人を敵に回す時が来ても君のこと守り抜くから

Even if I make enemies of everyone else, I will protect you to the end.

>>15140656

>>15140686

>How is いがい being used in this sentence?

Sorry, forgot to answer your actual question. If my translation is correct, then いがい is 以外, as in "everyone except you".

>>15140703

>>15140686

>Even if I make enemies of everyone else

>敵に回す means "to make enemies"

Oh, I see. I didn't realize that bit, now it makes more sense which いがい should be used. Thanks.

>>15135953

This >>15136555 is good advice. You're not going to know a lot of shit still, so stopping every 5 words to looks something up can get exhausting. I'd recommend trying to find something that is actually entertaining to you too, not just whatever is at a low enough reading level. And last, don't be discouraged by not understanding a lot.

Are there any good books for studying for JLPT N1?

>>15148659

Nice ID.

>>15148705

>>15149932

MODS!!!

I am reminded how much this place sucks tbh

>>15150789

>I was merely pretending to be retarded

Good job, I'm still convinced.

>>15150812

Then leave.

>>15054199

What happened with the /vg/ move?

>>15152677

That was a different faggot. I'm sure he's still over there but it's probably deader than here.

Where can I download nip grammar books? I'm looking for 中学英単語でいきなり英会話

>>15153279

Are you so certain?

So I've just finished reading the Tae Kim grammar guide for the third time and I don't feel like grinding Anki cards neither for vocab or pure Kanji. Would be dumb and/or inefficient to start reading right away, learning vocab in the process?

>>15155028

No, if you feel like you're at a point where you think it'd be more worthwhile to just read things, then do it.

>>15155028

If you can withstand stopping every 10~20 seconds to look up stuff without getting burned out, then go for it. Think of it as power-leveling; it's harder but it pays off faster.

>>15155050

It's more like stopping every 1-2 seconds to look up words. The first time I tried it, it took me hours to read a single paragraph. (I had to look up every second word or so, since I only knew a few hundred words then. I also had to lookup unknown grammar, which is a bit more complicated.) But unfortunately I burned out…

>>15155093

Are you actually remembering words after you've looked them up or no?

If you're looking up the same word multiple times it might be better to try to do a bit of memorization in addition to your reading to speed up the process.

Maybe get a short list of what you're having difficulty remembering in what you're reading and try to memorize those words specifically.

>>15155144

This is good advice, specially with complicated kanji

>>15155093

>>15155050

Add words to a custom anki deck every time you have to look something up or you won't make any progress. Include the example sentence from whatever you were reading, and make sure you can understand everything. Otherwise, you're doing it wrong.

>>15154818

Well the thread over there is definitely deader than here, that's what you get for moving to a slow board. Not only do you lose most of your current regulars but you aren't going to get many new ones either.

Now, if the faggot who tried to jump boards is back in this thread that just makes him an even bigger faggot than I thought.

>>15155144

>Are you actually remembering words after you've looked them up

No, I have to add them to an Anki deck and review them dozens of times for that. Which brings to >>15156079, yes, I tried it, added every word to an anki deck, this way it only took me two weeks to actually read a fucking sentence. And a bunch of words in my deck that I won't encounter again in the next 5 years.

How do you determine the stroke order of a character you've never seen?

I don't have a specific example, just wondering what the general approach is

>>15157332

If you know the basic rules it's not all that difficult, especially when you've practiced with a lot of different radicals. They all function pretty much the same so you should get the patterns even if you haven't seen them before.

There are some exceptions. A lot of + shapes made from consecutive strokes seem like can go either way. Of course that really doesn't affect anything, which is why it's variable in the first place.

The detailed answer is one radical at a time, starting from the leftmost, top most discrete radical. Within the radicals you follow the same pattern, Top to bottom left to right, but there are some big exceptions and I don't exactly know WHY. For instance 土 is always written with the middle horizontal line first, even though the vertical line would be "top most", while 亠 is always written with the top vertical line first. Meanwhile the inner + in 田 can go both ways depending on the kanji it appears in.

>>15157332

Once you practice it a lot, it just becomes pretty obvious. I can guess the correct order and stroke count like 95% of the time since I've written out so many characters by now. Like >>15157358 said, there are rules you can study up on too if you want, or just learn it from practice. Some seem to have exceptions in their order, I guess you'd have to just memorize those if you wanted to be totally correct.

>>15157332

>>15157358

>>15157376

If I'm not mistaken, all of the rules for Chinese stroke orders apply. Basically it is horizontal before being “broken” by vertical (see 美). It's another strange rule, just how the 2nd stroke of 口 is a right angle stroke instead of 一 and 丨.

>>15157847

Aren't the nips famous for that though? I remember reading something about "what is not being said" is more important than "what is being said"

>>15157332

Google 「漢字」　書き順

>>15157407

From what I've heard some characters differ between languages.

I'm stumped. I can't figure out what this means.

そんな彼も、ある日を境に

ピタリとつまみ食いを止めたとか

>>15160641

Now, I could be wrong, but I think it says something like, "Much like him, will I also meet the day when I suddenly stop eating with my fingers?"

>>15160641

>>15160824

The そんな is referencing some previous description and applying it to 彼. Kind of like a, "Carl who passed out drunk at the meeting the other day? "That" Carl?" sort of thing. Note, it's not really necessary here, but you should usually try to include some context when inquiring about meaning of something in Japanese. The を境に is just indicating that like that day was the day. From then on out. The とかis the raising of an example sort, the example being that the guy in question up and knocked off the (sneaking food?) one day.

>>15161055

Yea I should have included more context. It's kind of long though so I'll link to a pastebin.

https://pastebin.com/kVtec2n2

I'm trying to translate an RPG Maker game. Each "paragraph" is a separate text box.

I'm unable to make sense of つまみ食い in this context.

>>15161123

It's in reference to "旦那様のコレクションに手を出していたとか" he was sampling from the master's collection (of women it seems).

What's the best way to get started on listening practice? obviously listening to shit I'm talking about the most basic anime there is with clearly spoken sentences. I'm probably going to end up using https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BFhjMYwhePw but i'd rather it have jap subs so i can atleast look up what it is im hearing.

>>15162725

I see. For some reason I kept reading it as "correction". I'll need to double check other places where コレクション is used to make sure I didn't get those mixed up too.

>>15163095

If you've read any manga in Japanese, I'd suggest the anime version of one. You should already know most of the vocabulary so you can focus more on training your ear than trying to comprehend the meaning. It's also a fair bit easier to make out words you already have knowledge of, I find. Otherwise many SoL CGDCT tend to be on the easier side.

>>15165144

Forgot to mention, I wouldn't recommend translation as being a good study method. Focusing on the Japanese alone will be more productive learning. As a novice with the language, the finished product also typically ends up substandard which is undesirable.

Is "おてんばはどのようなパンツを着るか？" correct?

>>15165625

Yeah, that's right

>>15165646

最近はドラゴンズドグマを買った、　でもそのゲームの声の出演 が英語です

>>15166012

There are Japanese voice overs for dragons dogma.

>>15166012

PCのゲームだとこれを使ってください。

https://www.nexusmods.com/dragonsdogma/mods/108

>>15165646

Because I couldn't stand playing a game where I have to stop every 5 seconds to look up words moonrunes.

みんなさん！　伝えたい事があるよ！　日本語を勉強するためにゲームをするのほうがいい！

>>15169797

Grammar correction:

「するのほうがいい」って言うのはカタコトだよ。正しくは「したほうがいい」。ちなみに「の」は動詞の後に付くと名詞化する役割を持ってるよ。

>>15169843

>カタコト

Yeah, my writing/speaking is basic as fuck. ありがとう。

>>15169909

I'd recommend 2k/6k for vocabulary at the very least. Kanji and more grammar would depend on how much time you can spend a day. You don't need to know much, if any grammar to study kanji alone.

>>15055452

if dubs i'll also learn jap

>>15170409

Why not learn Nip so you can free yourself from the cancer that is (((localization))) and play good games that won't ever get translated?

How am I supposed to convert those azw3 files of (light) novels into proper epub files with Calibre? Not to mention the font and that horizontal formatting (instead of the vertical one) is quite screwed up. First time doing this shit so I'm quite confused

>>15167931

Just use kanjitomo, lookups take half a second.

>>15174157

Is there a tutorial about it? Last time I tried it, the recognition quality was horrible, it didn't recognize even the most basic kanji.

>>15175527

I know it doesn't work well with text on top of backgrounds/outlined text, but if you were trying it with regular black on white / white on black and still having problems then I don't know what to tell you. I'd tell you to try capture2text instead but that doesn't have a built in dictionary.

Is there a complete translation guide for よつばと！ that explains everything? i sat here like a tard thinking 「手がはなせない」 meant my hand can't speak 手が離せない****

I just want to cut down on the time I'm gonna need to be looking up shit.

>>15178650

The thing is, I kinda wrapped my head around that "My hand can't speak" "maybe that's a way of saying i can't use my hand or something", it's only after i started to type it into google did the IME come up with something that jisho wasn't seeing.

I've been doing rough translation of stuff for a few days and I came across "租ちん" a few times, does anyone know what it means or how I'm supposed to read it?

>>15181397

Wrong kanji.

https://www.weblio.jp/content/粗チン

>finally get to frame 3000 in RtK

>this is it

>anki deck still has more cards

>they're listed in the index, but don't follow 3000 in the contents

>the pages are just missing

>check this thread for better downloads

>open the mega link

>FIREFOX IS NOT SUPPORTED, DOWNLOAD MEGA BOTNET OR GOOGLE BOTNET GOY

Does anyone remember how to get around this? There's an addon or something floating around that allows you to download files of any size from Mega, if I remember correctly.

>>15186048

Seconding this

>>15186048

jDownloader or any Chrome fork.

>語である

>心者には辞めるほうがいい

こら、他人を騙す前にちゃんと自分で勉強しろ！

特に文法だな。

それに、意志があれば、易しいか難しいことはあまり関係ない。

例えば、RAWギャルゲームをしたい人達。

>>15186194

反省しました。もう少し力を入れて。ちゃんと文法勉強しなくちゃ好きな小説家作品が読めない訳なんですね。文法校正ありがとうございました。

>>15055452

If singles I'll finally learn jap.

>>15187002

Do it faggot.

>>15186048

>firefox not supported

>works perfectly in palemoon

wew

More seriously, what are you trying to download? There's also megatools.

>>15170424

This is why i keep going. I cant believe some of the shit that keeps coming out and isnt just boycotted. I refuse to buy any games done by nisa out of principle but i assume most anons do and have done so for a long time. Real sick of seeing gay memes in my games

>>15189512

>I cant believe some of the shit that keeps coming out and isnt just boycotted. I refuse to buy any games done by nisa out of principle but i assume most anons do and have done so for a long time

I can't believe the sort of shit people will accept as "passable" localization.

>Does a character make a joke or any sort of reference more than once?

>Congratulations, you now have free reign to replace that character's entire dialogue with the latest dank memes from KikeYourMeme

There is literally nothing worse than using rapidly aging "referential humor" to (((localize))) a game.

That and localizers literally going to Japan to push agendas and try to get devs to precensor themselves. I'm not interested in giving money to support that.

>>15171330

You could just turn down the new card amount if reviews are getting unmanageable. How many decks are you using to where it takes that long?

>>15190520

I think something like this could me more natural:

日本語はテクストをよく作成する練習の仕方がありますか

Or maybe this slightly different way:

いい日本語を書く練習の仕方がありますか

I might be full of shit though.

There are websites you can pay to have a personal native tutor. You could just go to Japanese streams and try talking too, I've done that a little. Youtube comments too. I'm pretty bad at writing too though since I don't practice it much yet. A tutor would likely be the most optimal since they will correct you. Not sure if there are free sites for that.

>>15054199

This is the first time I've visited these threads. I decided to challenge myself by learning Japanese as fast as possible. For fags who know the language, how long did it take you?

>>15190836

It's going to take you a long time, unless you

1) have access to native level speakers who you can interact with on a regular basis and who can constantly correct you, give you advice, etc

2) dedicate large portions of your day to learning the language. For those who teach themselves but who have other obligations in life, one or two hours is perfectly fine, albeit quite slow. If you can dedicate 4+ hours A DAY to your studies, then you can double or triple the rate of acquisition.

3) surround yourself with the language so that you're constantly adapting to its nuances (e.g. constantly listen to music, watch shows or movies in the target language, etc)

4) use your dedicated study time to actually learn the language's syntax and mechanics instead of just doing flash cards and consuming media

If you just want to do Anki for an hour or so a day, skim Tae Kim or IMABI, and fill your time with raw anime, you can still learn the language, but this is a pretty laid back approach, and you won't get as much out of this as you would by "putting your nose to the grindstone" and really immersing yourself in the language on a technical level.

No matter what you do, though, it's going to take some time. At least 5 years, maybe longer or shorter depending on how you decide to approach the act of learning.

>>15190566

>You could just go to Japanese streams and try talking too, I've done that a little.

Do you know any good japanese streamers? And thanks for the corrections.

>>15191737

Not really. I've watched some on twitch, but not regularly. I also subscribe to a lot of vocaloid producers on youtube, and some of them stream occasionally. You could look around the niconico live section, that has Japs doing all kinds of shit.

I need synonyms for penis

>>15195625

https://jisho.org/search/penis

>>15197156

I got a laugh out of the use of the honorific お in おちんちん

Hey anons, so I'm almost done with Genki I Second edition; I have two more chapters. For my own use, I've been compiling notes on the grammar and kanji found in the books, sometimes just because writting things down is a good way to help remember them but a lot of the time so that I can write corrections to the grammar lessons.

I personally think that Genki is a good resource for telling you what to learn and when, and giving you a lot of practice material to work on it, but I know that it's pretty bad in terms of actually teaching grammar accurately, preferring to make the lessons easy to understand instead of accurately describing the language. For various reasons, very few Japanese resources are super linguistically rigorous but Genki can be one of the worst in this aspect at times.

That said, partially as a review for me and partially because I think it would be helpful to others, I was thinking about editing and recompiling my notes into a companion/correction guide and posting it for everyone. I'll probably do this regardless but I was wondering if anyone here would be specifically interested in it.

Of course I'm just getting done with Genki 1 so a lot of things like naturalness and cultural correctness I wouldn't be able to comment on; the corrections in the guide would mostly pertain to things like Japanese morphology, syntax, and phonology, which I've done a lot of academic research on because I think its important to building a good foundation with the language and also because I think it's interesting. I have also been teaching myself Japanese with Pitch Accent explicitly, so the guide would cover vocabulary and inflection with Accent as well.

>globalism: the thread

>>15199178

>learning a new language is bad

Why do you bother post in this threat?

>>15197681

おちんちん is baby talk for dick.

Like おてて for hand, おめめ for eye, etc.

>>15195625

>>15197156

肉棒 should've been listed. In doujinshis it sometimes replaces おちんちん.

>>15192373

Anyone have advice? I've turned up Kanji to 10/day and vocab to 20/day. At that rate I should get there in about 20 days, which gives me around enough time that I might as well redo the Visualizing Japanese Grammar deck because the reviews are starting to get sparse. I'll also try to read some grammar books if I have the time.

>>15200171

>redo the Visualizing Japanese Grammar deck because the reviews are starting to get sparse

Don't do this. If you know the material when the reviews come up then you're good, no need to waste time when Anki is trying to space your reviews in an optimal fashion. Trying out different grammar resources for different perspective would be better if you want to do grammar study.

I'm not familiar with the Anki pack you use but I wouldn't worry too much about keeping recommended daily card totals. Pacing yourself to not get burned out is most important. I'll take a guess that the next step is some basic reading, in which case I'd say go ahead and give it a go if you want to. Won't hurt to try. As a head's up though, your first reading experience is going to be a bit of a drag even if you double or triple your known word count.

>>15200171

I wouldn't recommend trying to follow someone else's study schedule perfectly like that. What worked for them may not work for you. If you can manage that many new cards a day and retain them all, and have the time, then sure go for it. Like >>15201865 said though, you don't want to try so hard you burn yourself out.

>>15187712

Anki pack in the OP.

>

Unfortunately, Firefox has an insufficient buffer to decrypt data in the browser, and we recommend you to install the MEGA desktop app to download large files (or use Chrome)

>>15203594

Neat.

>>15054199

Wow damn these threads are still going, I haven't been in one of these in years or even /v for that matter but thanks to one of these I started learning I've done pretty well the last 3 years. So thanks OP and thanks to all the weeb faggots that keep the threads alive and add new resources, they do help. But nothing can help more than your own desire, perseverance and dedication to learning

Also for those of you who are advanced enough, and if you watch LPs on YT, following Japanese Youtubers can do wonders, not only for learning phonetics but also for learning some current culture.

I recommend https://www.youtube.com/user/norunine

Maybe others can chime in with some recommendations.

>>15206005

I think a lot of this is fine, but wouldn't suggest trying to translate. A lot of people inevitably will try to do so, but it's a bad habit they should try getting away from. You don't want to think in terms of your language, but in Japanese. Focus should be on simple understanding. Also, you don't really need to put off grammar until your comfortable with vocabulary, especially considering your recommended resource details meaning for all the vocabulary he uses in his guide and that you mostly recommend learning vocabulary from native material which you would want grammar for. Can't say I much like the idea of adding kanji meaning and readings to vocabulary Anki cards either.

>>15206592

I usually stay away from Japanese Let's Players because, from what I've seen, most of them play Minecraft or Japanese exclusive titles, not to mention they usually target kids with their content which tends to make their delivery a bit obnoxious.

I didn't know about 2bro, seems alright, plays mostly PC games and western games even STALKER?! and I kinda like his laid back delivery, so thanks you weeb faggot.

Anyhow https://www.youtube.com/user/pockysweets

Is it normal to refer to deceased pioneer/innovators who created techniques you use as 先生?

>>15213483

Also, I was thinking of simultaneously studying Mandarin while I'm at it. Since Japanese is related to it, how helpful will these resources be with comprehension?

>>15213504

You should only learn Mandarin if you want to end up killing yourself later in life. There's a reason every other Asian country hates China.

>>15213508

The Chinese are the most detestable group to me, but I figure that if I'm bothering to learn Japanese, I might as well go the distance. I'm a Canadian citizen, so if I move up there it might be useful to know.

>>15213526

Here's the thing. If anybody learns you speak mandarin any job you try to get will only want you for that and you will forever deal with the Chinese. They're literally turboniggers with a better IQ. If they can lie, cheat, or steal they will.

Do you want to spend your life being Anon [TurboNigger Liason]? Learning mandarin will hardly, if at all, help you learn Japanese. What it will do is force you to deal with the Chinese for the rest of your working life.

>>15213580

I know, I remember the thread. I just think it would be fun. I'm not learning the language to talk with people or play Japanese games, but I'm doing it for intellectual and humorous satisfaction. I like the irony of it. Like, being a polyglot who doesn't like talking is just funny, especially a polyglot who knows the language of a group he has absolutely no interest in. I also swim and sail despite being deathly afraid of it because it's also funny. I don't know, anon, I'm just a huge fucking autist.

>>15213624

you are just going to end up confusing yourself. Learning Japanese is hard enough by itself, you don't need to double your workload.

>>15213669

Them being related probably makes it worse, because it adds extra confusion

>forget almost all of my anki deck because i'm a lazy fuck and stopped studying

Why do I do it

>>15214203

Stop doing that, you faggot.

>>15213333

As an honorific suffix yes; as a stand-in for their name or a description of them, I don't think so.

>>15213483

Loads of resources for learning Kanji. If you're talking about the less common ones then probably but it's going to be more scarce, you should probably just focus on learning those when you come across them in vocab. and remember that logographic writing systems are different from phonographic ones in that you do not need to know every or even most characters before you start learning it; it's a better idea to learn most of the kanji alongside something else, like vocab.

>>15213504

Nitpick: they aren't "related" because that word implies genealogical relationship, it's more that they have a lot of similarities. That said, research shows that it's better to not learn similar languages at the same time because it just makes your brain confused. Chinese and Japanese aren't as similar as a lay-person might think but I'd still recommend picking something that isn't east-asian if you plan to learn multiple languages at once. Also don't learn Mandarin because then you might have to interact with the Chinese. Learn Cantonese and return democracy to Hong Kong.

>>15213669

This is the wrong mindset. German is probably one of the better languages to pair with Japanese because there is a very small chance of confusing yourself. I am also doing Japanese and German at the same time.

>>15214238

ok…

>>15214317

regardless of whether they will make you travel to China, it increases the chance that you will have to deal with 中華人民共和国じん exponentially.

>>15215744

じ is historically, orthographically, and in some dialects actually, equivalent to /zi/, while ぢ is historically, orthographically, and dialectically /di/. Likewise, づ is in those ways /du/ while ず is /zu/. However, most dialects (including Tokyo and Kansai) merge /d/ and /z/ before /i/, /j/, and /u/, so they cannot distinguish the contrast that じ and ぢ and ず and づ represented. In the standard orthography, ぢ and づ are only used where they are obviously the result ち or つ being voiced (mainly in rendaku of kanji with ち or つ in their reading)

>>15214317

It isn't so much that it is impossible to hide or lie about it so much that you start needing to hide shit constantly.

It's similar to speaking Spanish in a SW US state. The second somebody knows you speak Mandarin at all you will literally just be

>the guy that knows Mandarin

>send the Mandarin guy to deal with them

<Not every job on the planet deals with the Chinese either

No, but a significant portion do and once you get outed as a Mandarin speaker it is nearly possible to drop due to how few people want to deal with it and even fewer people will hire

>The Mandarin guy that doesn't want to deal with the Chinese.

Even if your company doesn't currently deal with China currently some faggot accountant or executive trying to "streamline the process" for a promotion is eventually going to try to cut out a supply company that DOES deal with the Chinese and when their first deal goes horribly wrong because of Chinese people being Chinese it will be your fault.

The pay is not worth the potential responsibility and blacklisting you could receive for not wanting to deal with Asian niggers.

>>15215744

Kana should only take you about 2-4 days total. You are doing fine but don't get cocky just because the easy part is coming easily.

>>15216191

I too enjoy discouraging others