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File: b62957ce44086f1⋯.png (87.16 KB, 300x168, 25:14, ClipboardImage.png)

File: 183c0a6d0c51a81⋯.png (23.19 KB, 383x131, 383:131, ClipboardImage.png)

43beb6 No.14659565

This is kind of nitpicky but I am pretty sure I am not the only one, I decided to check Super Mario Maker for 3DS and of course, I had to unlock more stuff, in this case I had to play the stupid Mario Challenge thing, at least it was better than having to wait for 9 days, HOWEVER!

Developers and fans seem to have completely approach level design the wrong way or at least compared to the ones from the NES-SNES era, not because the earlier games had a set of varied levels but most of the time you could tackle said levels in more than 1 way, I can safely say that Super Mario Challenge in this game is full of one-way puzzle levels where your reward for advanced maneuvers is surviving, completing the level or basically staying alive instead of just a cool item or different route, I am not talking about Kaizo stuff, literally a bunch of levels made by the developers.

And well, at least half of that can be applied to Mega Maker's community levels too, I just wonder, have any of these people played the classic games or just a bunch of "hardcore" romhacks from the internet?

43beb6 No.14659586

Shit, I need to sleep, my grammar is all over the place.


efb77c No.14659607

Level design is a skill within itself, and it's part of the developer's job. Handing that job to complete amateurs is just asking for disasters like the games you posted. Customers aren't equipped to make their own games, that's why they buy them and don't make them.


43beb6 No.14659636

>>14659607

When I try to make a level I want to not overdo the gimmick if there is one and as I said, by experience I like when you can do stuff in more than one way, the worst offenders are those where you have to literally ride a platform and not touch the controller again.

Mega Maker stuff was more flexible overall and only lacks content (it has gotten a little better), but seriously, I don't get where these people get their ideas, was there ever a very strict path in any of the classic Mario games or Megaman games?


a550f4 No.14659638

I think I still have a few levels made in the Wii U version. However I'm not sure how to get the codes without bringing the Wii U out. With Miiverse support dead and the end of new additionsI never felt the need to go back and play. I think last time we had Mario Maker threads we shared levels that were mostly fun.

The lack of slopes killed my ambition. Mario Maker All Stars for Switch might add slopes. Until then I've retired from making Mario Maker levels.


8892b6 No.14659641

>>14659586

>>14659565

I can tell from the way you type that you belong at >>>/reddit/


43beb6 No.14659677

>>14659638

Slopes and some music themes indeed, kind of disappointed when you can't pick a few levels and make a "world" to carry over powerups and other stuff, also, the way you add layers but the screen has to scroll unless you are at the beginning, the end or if your other layer has only one screen.


dc206d No.14659705

>>14659565

And this should have been a niche game considering there's a level of autism required, but it was sad to see people thinking this was gonna be a Terraria-Mario game.

>>14659607

Hell, it worked for Todd when he needs to steal questlines, like Fallout 4 and that robot quest mod.


2cfc17 No.14660117

>>14659705

That's because Todd Howard is Todd Howard.


a60e2a No.14660126

>>14659705

That just shows how amateur Bethesda are, that some modder could blow their writing completely out of the water in terms of quality. Imagine if Hollywood writers could be beaten in quality by fanfiction. Oh wait


aa8c6b No.14660282

>>14659565 This is the way level editing always tends to be. You'll only get one or two guys not trying to have the special-est level around. Still, it's interesting for about 10 minutes to see some of the things people can do.


43beb6 No.14661054

>>14660282

Guess I should go back to Mega Maker and try to share some stuff, sadly I can't share anything made on the 3DS for Mario Maker.


534801 No.14661061

>>14659607

I wonder which ends up being worse: A level made by an amateur by hand or a level made with random generation by a computer.


71f85c No.14661065

File: 53e5de28b40d776⋯.png (438.64 KB, 480x621, 160:207, Mega Man community.png)

>>14659565

sounds like your just a scrub and need to get good at video games.


2b87a0 No.14661073

>ITT anons don't remember how absolutely patrician-tier some Starcraft and WC3 maps were

Better than the shit Blizzard craps out now, and were free.


43beb6 No.14661093

>>14661065

sounds like you just miss the point completely.


ac0a12 No.14661097

Platformer level design is pretty much a lost art. People have forgotten that the flow is the single most important thing. Instead all that people focus on is making the hardcorest IWBTG or Meat Boy copy. Platforming has turned into a shitshow where you're required to do a hundred frame-perfect inputs in a row, turning it from being primarily about the flow to just being a human robot and with zero regard for the flow. It's essentially a rhythm game now, where you're forced to get perfects on everything to even progress or get a passing grade. Boss battles don't exist either, just these human robot sections one after each other. I want real platformers back, not these shitty games where it's either brain dead easy essentially walking sims or three minutes of frame perfect inputs with every level being a time trial and no bosses or other such old platformer staples.


85a059 No.14661104

>>14661097

play less western indie shit you scrub


71f85c No.14661113

File: 193a4a5c41a074c⋯.png (1.33 MB, 1103x667, 1103:667, megaman 2.png)

>>14661093

>smooth brained scrub want piss easy levels

>double digit IQ thinks crying to neo/v/ for sympathy is a good idea


43beb6 No.14661119

>>14661113

Even the classic Mega Man levels had more than one approach and not a strict input requirement man, way to completely miss the point.


5b5ea1 No.14661131

I used to make Quake 2 and AvP2 maps, and the primary limiter of my abilities was my crap computer, with the secondary limiter being the tools. I used Qoole for Q2, but its editor windows couldn't display very many polygons, even in wireframe editing mode. I had to make levels in chunks, then tape them together and hope everything aligned properly with no opens. DEdit for AvP2 was its own sort of fucking mess, and would regularly fuck off in random ways when compiling.

Anyway, I think the primary skill for mapping would be a strong imagination. The ability to visualize the planned map in its entirety, as if it was a real place, then use the editor to make a "simplified" version of that reality. The reason why many people cannot do this is because they lack the mental facilities to form virtual worlds. A strong imagination requires a lot of mental processing power, which translates to high intelligence. I think of imagination as virtualization, like making a sandbox computer within a computer, your imagination is used to create virtual worlds within the space of your skull. Those who are incapable of this are typically idiots. Look at who bothers to make signage, products, and miscellaneous infrastructure items for their game maps. Amateur as my efforts were, I still put goddamn street lights, curbs, manhole covers, power lines, pop machines, and dumpsters in my city maps.

People seem to be unable to focus even on the broad basics. What is the "gimmick" of the map? How will this map be fun for players? What does it bring to the table that others do not? Are there secret paths? Traps? Once the broad strokes are laid out, more complex details and fluff can be done, like the shit I mentioned above. It's a shame that stuff like Quake, Doom, UT, AvP, and Battlefield are now limited to the most diehard of fans, and big communities like Polycount are shadows of their former selves. The early 2000s were a treasure trove of custom maps, player models, skins, mods, and total conversions. Shit, Battlefield 2 came from the Desert Combat mod for Battlefield 1942.


71f85c No.14661134

File: f57096ee26f41ce⋯.gif (2.36 MB, 300x262, 150:131, f57096ee26f41ced8094786d17….gif)

>>14661119

>constructs a strawman level

>crys about how that straman level is too Kaizo for them to complete

<why you no remake marywio 1-1?

<marywio 1-1 had multiple options you could pipe or you could no pipe


43beb6 No.14661144

>>14661134

Is about how level direction differs now and how even the developers in Mario Maker fell for the stupid trend where the level is deprived of secrets rewarding said advanced maneuvers because all of them are required just to complete the level instead.


43beb6 No.14661155

>>14661131

If we expand onto shooter level design a horrible offender is Overwatch (if anyone has played it), the game balance is horrible, rebalancing heroes is barely impacting things because level design is ass, focusing too much on chokepoints.


5b5ea1 No.14661156

>>14661144

Triple dubs checked for truth. There are a few ROMhacks for Mario and Mega Man games that make interesting levels that could very well be confused for official levels, considering they aren't dull, without also being kaizofuckery.


4e0784 No.14661229

>>14660126

>Imagine if Hollywood writers could be beaten in quality by fanfiction. Oh wait

Name one instance.


4e0784 No.14661234

>>14661155

Fuck off, TF2 cuck.


2b87a0 No.14661235

>>14661229

Hollyweird writing IS fanfic tier, anon.


43beb6 No.14661266

>>14661234

I haven't played TF2 for a long time, stopped playing shortly after Gun Mettle.


57efcc No.14661275

>>14661229

Everything original to the hobbit movies since lotr fan fiction writers actually read the fucking books.


f9d6fd No.14661320

>>14659705

I'd be willing to bet most big name Bethesda game mods are made by unpaid interns anyway.


4f4d0f No.14661344

>>14661229

They made a movie about 50 shades of grey.


1b01ff No.14661351

>>14661229

>>14661344

50 shades of grey was originally a fanfic of Twilight


2cfc17 No.14663333

>>14661351

Twilight was originally a fanfic of trash.


43beb6 No.14663381

Are you basically saying that kaizo stuff and current "linear puzzle platformer" is fanfic tier?




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