77021f No.14063168
How do you make a game with good replayability without making it seem grindy?
Are there any games like that?
df3283 No.14063173
3127ff No.14063174
make a 30 minute long arcade game. shooters are a good example. encourage mastery through better and better play. Deus Ex is a game with cheap replayability. You will go through the same 20 hour adventure with a massive investment where the only difference is unmemorable decisions on whether or not you crawl through the vent this time or walk through the main entrance.
replayability is a meme for most modern games
a35646 No.14063181
Add a random generator, like the random generator for tracks in F-Zero X or Rapid Racer, or a random dungeon generator that just makes things progressively harder just to see how far you can get.
eec10a No.14063188
Character variety, obviously. See: Jagged Alliance 2.
2b73df No.14063189
06d8e5 No.14063190
>>14063181
Was about to say this, roguelikes as well as roguelites to an extent are the best examples of using random generation to increase replayability in my opinion
cbf7f5 No.14063194
>>14063168
Branching story paths and varying playstyles. Think Age of Decadence meets Deus Ex.
385783 No.14063198
>>14063189
No, you fucking retard. I will Never accept this answer. Not even as a joke.
bee583 No.14063209
Grindy games are post gamability not replayabikity
3127ff No.14063213
>>14063194
deus ex is a bad example because its always the same game and there's really skewed options for optimal play style.
cbf7f5 No.14063217
>>14063213
The idea behind Deus Ex is not, though.
6c7d82 No.14063222
2b73df No.14063225
>>14063198
Woah look at this faggot taking video games seriously. That wasn't a joke, nigger. DLCs add replayability on top of cash revenue. If your game is not a MOBA that attracts big spenders like kiddies or doesn't add a new plot DLC every now and then (like the nigger 3) then your game's replayability is null past 2nd or so gameplay. Unless you want to be autistic about it, which is fine, but most gamers (as in at least >95%) won't share the same passion.
3127ff No.14063226
>>14063217
the reality is even the original deus ex was over budget, took too long to develop, and the idea failed to be realized. It's worthless to follow an idea when the reality gives the opposite result - purely wishful thinking.
cbf7f5 No.14063229
>>14063226
>it's pointless because it's too expensive
Then go enjoy your Call of Duty games you fucking nigger.
6c7d82 No.14063233
>>14063225
We don't like people who pretend to be retarded, around here, cuck boy.
3127ff No.14063234
>>14063225
dlc isn't really replayability, it's new content.
3127ff No.14063237
>>14063229
call of duty games are more expensive yet they still release them on time. deus ex had a ridiculous budget for the final result and it still took more years than originally asked for in order to not get the game made.
yeah lets have more games that take 10 years to make. those always turn out well you retard.
cbf7f5 No.14063240
>>14063237
>Deus Ex is a bad game because it took too long to make
Even a nigger can tell Deus Ex is a masterpiece. You're somehow dumber than a nigger.
3127ff No.14063242
>>14063240
I never called deus ex a bad game you illiterate nigger. I said it's a bad example of a game with good replayability.
2b73df No.14063244
>>14063234
yeah and you make it so that you need to reach a certain point in game to activate the DLC, that will make the gamer replay at least a part of the original game - increase replayability. Additionally, they'll praise the DLC for adding lots of content, even if it's like 10% of the original gameplay.
>>14063233
>muh games are serious business
>don't make money off from games you're a cuck if you do
Go home, child. Learn how the real world works. Nothing runs on imagination, money needs to be made at the end of the day.
3127ff No.14063246
>>14063244
OP asked for good replayability, I do not consider recycling existing content in long games to get to new content to be particularly good. If you do think its good, I'm curious what you think is good about it.
cbf7f5 No.14063248
>>14063242
>calls someone illiterate
>can't even punctuate proprely
>yeah lets have more games that take 10 years to make. those always turn out well you retard.
Read the line above. Read it a second time so your brain has enough time to get some oxygen, and then see how your complete inability to use the English language implies that Deus Ex is a bad game.
Fuck off, we're done you animal.
2b0b9a No.14063251
>>14063242
>bad replayability
>all the dialog trees that you constantly find new surprises lurking in
>character builds
Sorry but it's a game with pretty strong replayability.
6c7d82 No.14063257
>>14063244
>Go home, child. Learn how the real world works. Nothing runs on imagination, money needs to be made at the end of the day.
And what does this have to do with replayability?
3127ff No.14063258
>>14063248
I said you misinterpreted me, corrected your interpretation, and you continue to misinterpret me by defending your retardation. Pretty sad display but feel free to kill yourself any time
>>14063251
>dialog changes
really not very interesting in deus ex and the game does this exponentially less as you make progress. It's mostly in the first few hours before the airport. after the airport it's very infrequent.
>character builds
you can be the swimmer guy and slowly swim through tunnels with nothing in them or walk through the robot defense or crawl through the vents right next to them to get to the same area. this is bad replayability.
3127ff No.14063263
>>14063257
>what does getting real, reproducible results have to do with achieving OPs goal?
are you retarded?
2b73df No.14063265
>>14063246
In that case you probably want competitive online games, they always last a long time if their rock paper scissors strategy requires some skill to learn but also more advanced. AoE, CnC etc. are still played for that reason. I don't think this works for singleplayer games, they always get boring unless they are highly randomized like DF and even then it eventually gets boring by fourth or so game.
6c7d82 No.14063277
>>14063263
Stop trying to derail with your retardation.
20d201 No.14063295
>>14063277
>i want my pretend game to be real! Look at me I'm an idea guy
Kys
7007ae No.14063336
Good scoring systems can really change how you play a game. You can normally play a shoot em up by staying at the back of the screen and holding down the shoot button to kill everything. A score system, however, will make you kill many enemies in a small period of time or sparingly. Certain enemies, who are usually a big threat, must stay alive longer until you graze most of their main projectile or kill them when they have a massive number of projectiles on the screen. Scoring systems are also important for strategy games and tactical RPGs. The scoring system in Fire Emblem 7 added tons of replay value to it. Why they don't bring the score system back for later games is beyond me.
RNG can also help depending on how it's done. In Fire Emblem, you can get a RNG blessed character, a character with stats that matches their stat growths, or a RNG screwed character with garbage stats. Either way it keeps you on your toes and makes you consider other characters sometimes. It also helps that the games throw a shit ton of characters your way so you can constantly swap out units if you don't like them to some extent. On the other hand, RNG for things like weapons crate in chests like in Borderlands can be lame if the RNG for good equipment is so low it promotes grinding. Many AAA games are doing this now just so they don't have to really bother with balancing while hitting people's addictive personality in the hopes of getting a whale.
Randomly generated rooms is another good thing. These are best done in roguelikes where they can be much more complex due to the simple graphics.
Character builds in general really help extend the time anyone is willing to play a game. Especially if it's team based like in many RPGs and most of the classes are viable. You can come up with some interesting teams if you are good enough to make the team work. Like a team with no healers that relies on quick defensive buffs and mass DPS to work, essentially killing the enemies before they get the chance to harm you.
Having depth and difficulty to your game. The longer it takes to master (while still being fun), the longer many may play. It actually helps if you need to actually become good and master the game's mechanics to beat some of the harder challenges. Difficulty settings that actually change the behavior of enemies or level design really help. Ninja Gaiden and Perfect Dark are good examples of these. Adding new objectives or replacing enemies with deadlier versions. Giving you more tools early on but less healing items in general.
Costumes and cosmetics really help too. People want to dress up all the time if they can. The more ways to do so, the longer people may stay around. Custom 3D Maid and Artificial Academy had many people playing for ages just to create certain characters from different shows or their own special snowflake.
3b4dfa No.14063343
Lots of fun content.
Perfect Dark has tons of modes.
Wesnoth has tons of scenarios, campaigns and addons.
You can spend years playing these games and still have things to do or check out.
97ee91 No.14063354
>>14063242
>deus ex
>bad example of a game with good replayability
This HAS to be bait.
cca4cf No.14063366
The top 3 approaches I can think of are:
>Procedural generation, like in roguelikes
>For a "designed" approach, you could add New Game Plus and re-use levels but flip them around and change the enemy and item placement
>Just make your game extremely dense, like Dominions 5 or any strategy/4x game worth its salt
7a6dfd No.14063760
>>14063168
You add buzzmechanics like "procedural" and "sandbox" and "open-world".
Pretty easy, since people are idiots.
77b546 No.14063891
It's called making a good game. I suspect OP is confused by the standard modern hack reviewer's retarded definition of "replayability". Replayability is not extra content. It's not the difference between a regular clear and a 100% clear. Replayability is literally whether or not the game remains fun on replay. It's whether or not the mechanics are deep or compelling enough that there is more gratification to be had after completing the game once.
0f97c6 No.14066393
>>14063891
Also, New Game+ doesn't fucking hurt.
94df6d No.14066789
As many anons stated before, randomly generated rooms is a good way to have replayability. Roguelikes are extremely popular with how many normies are buying into Binding of Isaac and Enter The Gungeon, and classics like Pokemon Mystery Dungeon does this very well.
Another way is to allow people to mess with the game as much as they want. Why do you think Doom after all these years is still played? The sheer amount of wads always gives you something new.
77b546 No.14066805
>>14066789
I think it's somewhat debatable whether what you're describing is actually replaying anything. Is Scythe the same game as Doom II? When you play Plutonia are you replaying Doom II?
And does that same logic apply to a game that is "remade" into something different every time you start over?
85041b No.14066809
Kero Blaster tweaks the platforming, boss patterns, and adds a whole new set of end game content, while also adding in a variation on the main story. 10/10 game
877098 No.14066814
Mod support.
>>14063891
Unless they have branching paths (which means you aren't "replaying" anything, you're playing a completely different part of the game), a puzzle based adventure game is never fun to play a second time unless you've forgotten all the puzzles. That doesn't mean the genre can't be fun.
43e3bf No.14066840
4bd4a4 No.14066922
>>14063168
Construction Kit.
Take Skyrim. It's a game and it's shit. Plug in Endreal and suddenly you have an entirely new game shoved into your shit game that's marginally less shit but a lot more German. Plug in a huge compilation of quest mods and revision shit and that goes even double.
Or even better, Morrowind, which already has replay value on account of the fact that you can't just do every faction. When you throw mods onto that, then things escalate even further from where they were before.
Bethesda figured this out. They're getting greedy now - they want to not just use it to make their games have greater longevity, they also want to monetize it. And that's terrible, just like their games. But giving those tools right off the bat? That was a stroke of genius. Truth be told, any game that doesn't include a construction kit or other modding toolkit of some kind is absolutely a joke.
A good character creator is also kind of a must. People will be more akin to playing a game a second time if it lets them do both a cute waifu playthrough and a lardass joke character with the same character creator.
ef1d0a No.14066946
Give the player all the combat skills to keep
Make random enemies be a stronger version of themselves
Map changes are good too
1b83c1 No.14067148
>>14063168
>How do you make a game with good replayability without making it seem grindy?
Make it highly moddable, and make the modding tools accessible.
>Are there any games like that?
Doom, Neverwinter Nights, Elder Scrolls, Freespace 2.
eb8186 No.14067159
Add content after you beat it and add insane difficulty levels. Also make it skill-based so that the longer you play, the better you get. So if the game is good you can get people to try to keep getting better overall.
a55958 No.14067810
>>14063168
Fucking modding support?
df3283 No.14067819
I think one of the more important things is to make all the gay story shit and gameplay downtime skippable, nothing kills replays harder than having to sit through the same (unskippable) cutscene over and over, or large swathes of nothing-but-walking inbetween actual gameplay
Ninja Gaiden for the NES truly was a pioneer in the field of cutscenes in videogames because you could just press START to skip that shit and get right into the gameplay, something many modern video game developers struggle with
992741 No.14067830
you make it into a difficult chalenge fun to overcome
like God Hand or Cuphead
God Hand i played so much that i left my fingernail engraved in the O button after pressing it so much and it was so fun i showed it to all my friends who also got into it and we played it again together cus it was fun, not just to overcome the game's chalenge but to compete between ourselves on who could play better
That game needed a punch out style multiplayer game mode
5b5b61 No.14067834
>>14063168
>How do you make a game with good replayability without making it seem grindy?
Kind of a trick question, because no matter what you do some asshole is going to accuse you of grindiness or padding out the game if you go for any sort of replay value. To me I think the trick is if you can find a way to make each replay experience feel unique, and even that will piss off casuals who want to feel like they did everything in one sitting.
6ba3dd No.14068363
Just make the game good. Autistic lore dumps are not good. Leveling systems are not good. Copy and pasted hallways are not good. Quests logs are not good (game so shitty and bloated you need a too list).
Anything that isn't game is bad.
ac6a76 No.14068568
>>14063891
>just make a good game
>if just has to be fun
have any more subjective statements to try and pass off as if there's some fucking gold standard on how to make a game and what makes a game fun?
47f2a1 No.14068635
Give a few good options but limit how many you can use at once. Devil May Cry 3 does this best where you have multiple styles and different weapons. Switching any one of them completely changes how you have to approach the game.
cd0ebd No.14068657
>>14063168
random map generator
c499b5 No.14068671
>>14063168
Infinite quests.
5daf73 No.14068737
Does Portal1 have good replayability?
a5bb49 No.14068755
>>14068737
No, as with any puzzle game, once you know how to solve them, it loses all charm.
a5bb49 No.14068803
>>14063168
Choices, both story and gameplay choices.
If your game has multiple endings or routes, people are bound to play at least once for each one.
Additionally, you can add gameplay choices such as classes or builds that will make players want to try them out. Or maybe give the player the choice of which stages to do first and make that have an effect on the course of the game.
Better yet, combine both and make the gameplay choices affect story.
2260f7 No.14068869
>>14063173
this helps for shorter games that are ultimately highly skill based. it gives the player an incentive to get better by seeing an obvious difference in their own score. however theres a lot more that can be done than that, even nes games offered things like cheat codes, new difficulty levels on completion.
But I think games start to get a tad more replayable when you start looking at the following generation. Things like doom (with its endless wads/ mods).Even 16 bit platformers offer a little more than that earlier generation, per example super mario world has a greater skill ceiling than the mario games before it, tons of secrets and large levels. Then you have games that follow the model of unlockable content, this is seen more in the follow on from this generation, lots of ps1 and n64 games have content you unlock by completing something in the game. Even extra difficulty levels is an unlockable.
So a few games with great replay value
>doom (mods endless mods multiplayer)
>roguelikes like ADOM, nethack, brogue etc.
>smash bros 4 (trophy hunting, multiplayer)
>civilization can be won under tons of win conditions, plenty of mods good series for replay value (4 is the best one also play master of magic if you like dos games its a civ like thats really good)
>if your computer can handle it torrent one of the sims games dont buy it, but these can be real fun I'd say 3.
>harvest moon series.. its a tad grindy but these give you a fuckload to do. my favorites the game boy advance one.
>black and white 1 and 2 and the pokemon mystery dungeon games all have solid replay value.
>if you just like visual novels these tend to be replayable with their branching paths… might wanna check it out.
2260f7 No.14068906
and I mean this black and white not the god games, those are only really good for like 2 plays. double post sage.also if you really like one game op look for rom hacks of it, that's always a fun diversion. Im fond of super metroid hacks, but that's not quite replay value. You still have to have mastery of the base game typically to play the rom hacks that get made.
47f2a1 No.14068912
>>14068869
Pokemon Dungeon games are unplayable for the same reason the new main games are. There is huge endless story all over the place. Unless you care about a children's story about Pikachu's friend being lost then you have hours of button mashing just to get to the good bit of the game. Every dungeon is a 5-10 minute button mash sequence from the last one.
47f2a1 No.14068918
>>14068906
Pokemon Black/White is cancer that killed the series. Do NOT listen to this guy unless you enjoy being preached at by annoying npcs who interrupt your adventure every town in order to waste your time on meaningless non-sense.
aad61a No.14068937
>>14068568
Because asscreed with orcs is "fun" to you, you fucking nigger? Fuck off.
aad61a No.14068942
>>14068918
>>14068912
Pokemon is shit genwunner, the only good thing about it is romhacks.
47f2a1 No.14068955
>>14068942
No, Pokemon can be pretty good. My favourite is Gen 3, I thought the physical/ranged split was a good change. X/Y is a solid game.
Your strawman doesn't work. You're just a loser who thinks pokemon stories are worth reading rather than something better. Pokemon is about catching monsters not some whiny kid bitching about how unloved he is.
aad61a No.14068962
>>14068955
Pokemon is shit you fucking manchild loser.
6b23bf No.14068963
Hooktube embed. Click on thumbnail to play.
>>14063168
Well-hidden and worthwhile secrets can keep me coming back to a game. Dark Messiah of Might and Magic is the best example of this I can think of. The secret areas are so much fun to find and almost every time they are worth finding. On some occasions you'll just get some boring potions but most of the time it's a unique weapon that completely changes the way you play(ie. fire staff or lightning shield), a really useful accessory(endless quiver, ring of the phoenix) or potions that are actually really useful(full-health potions, antidotes for THOSE GODDAMN SPIDERS FUCK). Combine these secrets with the distinct builds you can make and the skill system that doesn't allow you to be a jack-of-all-trades adds some great replay value. I still come back to this game every year. Also multiple endings/campaign paths can contribute to replayability for some people but DMoM&M does this so poorly I won't go into detail about that.
ac6a76 No.14068967
>>14068937
better than asscreed because >>14068671 :^)
2cf736 No.14068983
Best form of replayability lies with games with RPG elements that allow you to do things differently each time. Games that also have more of a randomized environmental scripting also have good replayability. Games where you can mod things and make new things also.
39a18b No.14069024
Shitload of fun items and enemies who respond to every single possible course of action you may take.
Examples of this: MGS3 and Peace Walker.
Almost unlimited replay value, because there are fun items, many ways to play the game and the enemies will respond to different things you may do.
You don't need a shitty "random rooms" generator. Just make a game with fun items, fun maps, shitload of secrets and smart enemy design. There you go, you just made a good game with good replay value. No need for being a cuck who releases shitty DLC or abhorrent-quality "extra content" through the use of a no-effort random generator.
Co-op is also great. If your game's campaign could theoretically be played in-co-op mode, then make it. Else you can make a different short campaign co-op mode or even better - have both the main story be playable in coop, add additional short campaigns for co-op and random maps for people to fuck around with.
MANDATORY:
Your gameplay needs to be fun, or else the players are stuck with a million of boring things to do.
ac8c95 No.14069051
In my opinion a replayable game has two elements to it
>gameplay that doesn't get old fast
>a hook to allow replayability
The second one is a bit more general. It can be anything from a new difficulty setting that changes how the game plays, to a new NG+ playstyle, to a different character/story/campaign.
33a659 No.14069347
>>14068962
Baffle me to even see threads about it. Un fucking credible.
a90239 No.14069447
>>14063336
My nigger, I'm replaying it for the 5th time as we speak. There are few feelings as satisfying as winning the growth gamble and getting B L E S S E D units; no idea why either.
e7a8fc No.14069472
1b83c1 No.14070972
>>14068671
I really thought that was heading toward a "JUST FUCKING BUY IT!" at the end. Possibly with a face change to Angry Todd.