/k/ - Weapons

>>631784

yeah but have you considered that revolver kills grant a 50% style point bonus which translates to an overall 20% more XP per kill? Fucking casuals I swear.

counterpoint:

BIG IRON

1) They look good

2) single actions are stupid simple repair yourself

3) THEY LOOK GOOD

4) repeat from 1)

That is some shit bait son. Who the fuck doesn't use a non-ferric rod when cleaning their guns or hell a fucking bore snake.

But anon, I have no money for anything better…

>>631812

>will obliterate any urban youth attempting to burglarize you

>huge round means less concern about shot placement

>simple operation,

>time-tested technology

>in case you somehow miss it creates a smoke could to confuse your attacker giving you time to reposition and reload

>>631784

>blowing off your fingers with tactical stances.

Well, if you're blowing off your fingers with muh tacticool mall-ninja stances, then you're doing something wrong.

>>631827

To be fair, if you're a bum banditry afficionado like OP or inrangeTV mud or feces can get into your guns due to degenerate scatplay jews and sodomites are famous for.

>>631825

how about it circumnavigate your ass and shoot a speedload in a tactical stance faggot

>>631831

>>in case you somehow miss it creates a smoke could to confuse your attacker giving you time to reposition and club them to death with it

Fixd

>>631831

The Ruski (>>631855) has it right there. If you somehow miss with the 33.7mm projectile then the smoke cloud should give you enough of a chance to close the distance and bludgeon them to death with the huge chunk of wood and steel you just fired at him. I imagine that the grenade tier muzzle blast would also disorient anyone within about 10-12 meters too.

>>631827

Kinda right though. Get mud / muck / goop on the cylinder and the action can be completely boned.

How often you're doing a low crawl through a muddy trench is something a /k/ommando has to judge for themselves.

95% of my firearms related decisions are based on aesthetics. Fuck if I'm dying in some drab ass camo with a piece of 9x19 tupperware. Feds are gonna have to take me down in full peacock dual wielding 7.5" .454 Super Redhawks.

>>631784

Wheel guns have +100% crit damage and have guaranteed elemental proc.

>>632020

Tell that to your wrist after you try aiming it at something. The weight at the end of the grip isn't there as a counterweight, it's a bludgeon (and decorative).

>>631876

Isn't a blunderbuss pistol a "dragon"?

The revolver enjoys the advantage of match grade accuracy and high reliability thus the French GIGN using revolvers. Yes, a MK23 might do those things, but the truth is a S&W combat revolver can hold those qualities at a quarter of the price. Something many don't consider very important, but it could play a role. Also one's bullseye and carry gun can be the same. In the ever so rare, but possible, situations where someone must use their sidearm from a rest the single action mode can be used to great advantage for great shot placement at range or otherwise.

For low skill shooters the revolver is easy to operate. Yes, more moving parts than a Glock, but also simpler to operate. Close cylinder, pull trigger. Limp wristing can send a light weight frame auto loader like the Glock out of battery and cause a critical jam in a fight, heaveir auto loaders and revolvers do not suffer this. Under poorer maintenance conditions, like those found in occasional shooters and new shooters who have to be taught constant upkeep and respect for their weapon, a dirty and gunky revolver may have hard trigger pull but will function, a poorly maintained revolver will work where a poorly maintained auto loader is a recipe for disaster. As also mentioned, newbies too afraid of carrying a round in chamber will have their problem fixed by using a revolver. Even a single action cowboy gun with an empty chamber has a full chamber when the weapon is fired.

There has been talk of problems in police departments about rises in accidental shootings with modern auto loaders that are DAO and no safety, in the hands of the professional it has advantages, in the hands of many average cops who are not gun fans or combat trained or oriented, its a gun so hot it will lead to increase in accidents. Put a safety on it and you have the liability of a safety stopping the gun form working. Carry hammer down on a SA or SA/DA auto loader you have another potential problem. Revolvers are both safe and don't have a safety, one of the old reasons why they stuck around so long. Not everybody takes it seriously, even many cops, giving them the pro slick DAO handgun doens't make them more dangerious to the bad guys, it might make them more dangerous to themselves.

For conceal carry and self defense, please name the massive shootouts conceal carriers have been in where their high capacity meant something. Police and military considerations aside, you won't find big boi shootings where conceal carriers burned through 45 rounds of ammunition. Fight a band of armed bank robbers, you might want a high capacity auto loader handgun (oh shit, you don',t you want a rifle or a shotgun) but when is Johnny Walkaround with his fucking conceal carry gun going to be blasting his way out of an armed warzone? Most police shootings are done in a handful of rounds, civilian self defense even less. Carry an 8 shot 357 Magnum N frame and in truth the average civilian is going to have the rounds he needs for non police or military or official security duty.

Which also brings us back to the point that conceal guns are small, people want them thin, they dont' want a big double stack high capacity auto loader handgun. By the time you switch to a single stack, by the time you enjoy the ergonomics of a small or even medium frame revolver, the differences begin to equal out. At the point you get micro auto loaders the revolver is a better choice, for these people its the way to go. 38 Special is better than 380 ACP, is a 357 Magnum 7 shot L frame that much worse than a comparable smaller auto loader when its all considered?

Also agree with the whole shot placement over capacity. At some point you are just blasting, your extra rounds are almost certainly cover not hits, not follow up shots but covering fire to retreat. If you want to end the fight your first few shots are the ones that win, especially in civilian self defense. Also consider that every time you shoot you risk collateral damage. Sparying 18 rounds of 9mm at Johnny Crackhead may seem like a good idea until 13 of those rounds miss and potentialy hit innocent people. Extra rounds and cover fire aren't everything.

>>632154

Because it's largely pointless.

Function > fashion.

>>632154

Is the trigger mechanism any more complicated than a conventional revolver? I've never seen one taken apart before.

Aside from that, probably 'market forces' (i.e. cheap and lazy) and cultural momentum. It's superior, but not by enough of a margin to change from the design that everyone's already familiar with.

>>632155

A lower bore axis is pointless?

>>632154

>>632181

They are more mechanically complex - they have an internal hammer that is cocked by that "external" one. They are also bulky, existing models even more so with that steel brick above the barrel and so are almost exclusively range toys.

>>632150

You ruined Counter-Strike, faggot.

>>632185

That's the Rhino, exclusively.

>>632244

Play better games,

FAGGOT.

>>632181

>Is the trigger mechanism any more complicated than a conventional revolver? I've never seen one taken apart before.

Skip to 2:30, they speak in pastalang, but you get to see the internal components.

Oh look, it's this thread again.

>>632278

So, do you think that the handgun in question should be in 9x19 or .45 ACP?

>>632154

Keep in mind that the recoil can be a problem in another way, keep in mind that handgun flip of the wrist helps to dissipate recoil, the more the gun flips and flops the more recoil is being wasted on movement. This is bad in that it throws the gun around (rare instances of people blowing their heads off when the bore sweeps under their chin when they jerk the trigger by accident and kill themselves with 500 S&W Magnum), means you have to work harder to push the gun back to zero for the next shot, but it means that sheer stress of the recoil isn't harming you much. Rhino drives the recoil right back into your palm, making the gun more controllable, also meaning the force of the blow is straight and direct back into the wrist and body. I think this is why the design hasn't been used with big boi magnums because at some point the design might hurt you because it punches more than it flips.

Its how combat auto loaders can run with recoil well, look how the Glock is designed. Between the slide and the natural flip of the gun, you dissipate recoil, the shooter only need to find a natural and gentle way to bring it back down to where it needs to be.

So one has to really ask oneself, "is the Rhino really that much better than a traditional revolver?"

Well since this is the revolver thread, I may as well ask here.

Been thinking about getting one. What's a decent revolver that's not too pricy? Any particular barrel length to consider?

Looking for something in .357 mag.

>>632327

I own a Rhino, firing .38 and regular .357 feels fine. The hotter .357 SD rounds do hurt, although that's probably in large part due to me being a handlet. The reduction in flip is actually pretty damn impressive, I've noticed both watching others fire the Rhino and other handguns the difference, while my rapid fire shots with it were rather well grouped.

>>632331

>What's a decent revolver that's not too pricy?

Define "pricey" because otherwise we'll assume you're a poorfag with absolutely no interest past the surface level and throw random shit at you.

General consensus is that Ruger and S&W are a good baseline, Taurus should be avoided if possible, Armscor/Rock Island Armory are poorfag specials if you're desperate.

>Any particular barrel length to consider?

Depends on what you want it for.

5" is considered the default choice, any shorter and you're throwing away effectiveness in exchange for a smaller package, any longer and you're looking for hotter rounds to keep up.

>>632357

I've got both an SP101 and a Security Six that's just like yours except black. If you have both of those you can do basically anything you'd ever want to with a .357 revolver. which didn't stop me from owning ten more revolvers but I have an addiction. The SS and the SP are fucking fantastic guns. Put hogue grips on the SP and a night sight to replace the shitty stock front sight and you get to join me in the incredibly rare club of people who have a CC gun that's actually fun to shoot at a range. For added being a faggot, chamfer the cylinder, add an 8 pound mainspring, and sand every single right angle on the gun and you've got sexiness in a small revolver like I do

The SS basically doesn't even need any modification, the thing's a goddamn nail driver just how it is. Mine came with a rubber aftermarket grip of some sort that I kept on it and other than that the thing's never given me a second of trouble in probably twenty plus thousand rounds now. You basically can't kill the thing and the SP and SS are about as tolerant of reloads as a gun can be, it'll handle anything short of you deliberately trying to blow up the gun. Also hands down the best ejector I've used on a revolver and I own fucking twelve of them, four of which are top breaks. The SS ALWAYS gets the shells free on the first try regardless of which direction I point the gun when I do it. That may be just that I got lucky with mine but holy christ it's an ejector from the heavens, the thing is so easy to use.

>>632331

A S&W 586 or 686, although the blue steel 586 is only six shot, L frame is tough enough to handle magnum diet yet is smaller than the big boi N frame, but a classic M27 is as strong as a Ruger Blackhawk and will never wear out, is heavy and mitigates recoil well through this weight, although many would prefer the L frame or medium frame because of the size and handle differences. If you wanna go biggest boi of all in 357 magnum get a modern 27 variant that has 8 shot cylinder and you are now at the top end of modern revolver combat capabilities. Although "not to pricey' means you will probalby stick with the 686.

5 inch barrels are probably the ideal combat barrel, maybe too long for conceal but the perfect size for duty/hip carry. 4 inch replaced it as normal as more and more police drove in cars and the longer barrels dragged and grabbed with their longer barrels and holsters. Snub noses are nice for conceal carry but they waste performance potential, also increase muzzle blast and making shooting more difficult. Longer barrels are superior in range and hunting guns that are used for those purposes only, 4 and 5 inch are easy to carry yet with the right holster rig and if you are up to it. If you don't mind carrying 4-5 inch, I say go with that. I carry a 6.5 inch barrel N frame myself.

>>632357

>>632359

I saw a security six with 6" barrel and Leupold M8-2x scope for $750 online.

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/revolvers/ruger-revolvers-security-six/ruger-security-six-357-magnum-caliber-revolver-w-scope-s-n-160-78064.cfm?gun_id=101127509

How does it look?

>>632482

>posting a gun that you want to buy

You're too stupid to own a gun.

>>632589

It's .38 Special rated for +P and the grip helps prevent most of the recoil causing nerve damage. You also shouldn't be bracing for recoil with a revolver if you value the feelings in your hand.

9x19 is arguably better than both .38 and .357 in a compact revolver, however, with much less recoil.

>>632670

>but they (Cannon) are unrestricted and about the only thing you don't need a license for in the UK

According to the National Cannon Association of Great Britain (http://www.ncagb.com/legal.html) that's not entirely accurate.

>There is no reason why you should not be permitted to have one or more cannon if you already have a Shotgun Certificate (SGC) or Firearms Certificate (FAC).

>A smooth bore of less than 2” calibre with a barrel at least 24” long is a shotgun and can be placed on a SGC. Anything else is a firearm and must be on a FAC.

>In supplying the required ‘good reason’ for a new FAC, or a variation, simply state that it is for competition purposes, that you are a member of a club and if questioned can state where the competitions are held. It may be helpful to state that the cannon is in effect a black powder muzzle loader.

>Cannon have an appetite for black powder and if you don't have an Explosives Licence already it's worthwhile starting that process early with your police force Firearms Licensing Department.

>You can use a black powder substitute like Pyrodex or Triple 7 and avoid the paperwork, but an Explosives Licence for shooters black powder is actually easy to obtain and costs nothing.

>You will also need a Recipient Competent Authority (RCA) to transport black powder between your premises and a range. This permit is free, and as of 1 June 2012 is provided as part of the Explosives Licence by your local Firearms Licensing Department.

>Once you have an Explosives Licence and before purchasing your black powder you will need a lockable, wooden box in which to store the powder. UK regulations demand that containers of black powder must be kept in a box constructed of 18mm plywood.

>Where a box holds more than one container, each individual container must be separated by a 6mm wooden partition that is securely fixed to the outer walls of the box. Each compartment must allow 30% additional height between the top of the container and the inside of the lid.

So not quite entirely license free, but I'm glad to hear that these are UK legal, and apparently rather easy to get hold of (by our standards at least), and that you can get them online from about £240!

>>632678

>Firearms certificate

Actually you don't. It's considered obsolete so no license required.

>>632700

Do you have a source for that? Even if it is true you'll need an explosives license for the powder.

What's the general consensus on top breaks?

>>632773

Its probably a webley in .455.

>>632769

Pretty blurry anon, not gonna lie. My first guess was a .38 Colt because of the shape of the grip, but it could also be a Smith & Wesson.

Barrel's too thin to be modern so I'd say it's fairly old, 1960s or older.

>>632771

Nah, hammer spur's different and you would probably spot the ejector easier.

>>632770

Neat but irrelevant unless someone puts them back into production using something stronger than .38 Special and .45LC.

The action beats itself open with each shot so it's not something a lot of engineers want to work with in a design.

>>632778

>.38

>>632773

Yeah, it's definitely a .45 from looking at that hole.

>>632781

How did you found that pic? i am to stupid…..

>>632785

on /pol/

>>632786

I guess I should have corrected myself, the British were the only ones that continued to make them after the invention of smokeless which was too hot for most people to bother with the fragility of the break action and into the 20th century.

>>632788

Is their fragility something that modern metallurgy could remedy, or is it a problem inherent in the design?

>>632790

In theory it's the design itself rather than metallurgy, though nobody wants to go through the process of proving it.

There is a modern Webley in production(kinda) that's a 7-shot .357 although with how much it costs I doubt there will ever be a torture test to show off its strength, or lack thereof.

>>632790

It probably could be done today. The Russians did make that break action .357, but then again it might not even exist at all due to there being absolutely no info about it anywhere outside of it being "DA GUN FROM BATTLEFIELD 4!" Again, the people who really stuck with break actions were the British.

>>632790

Until someone decided to put several hundred rounds through that Russian .357 or that webley nobody will know for sure.

>>632801

It never went into production because few govt-owned manufacturers were fast to agree with "gun control agreement" pulled off by Russia and US leaders. The faggot in rule was supposed to reject and remove communist measures, not implement more of them and now every fucking bitch whines about ebil gabidalism pointing at the mess he createdone time leftists managed to pull "no real socialism through", probably due to mass illiteracy forged by red scum

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP-412_REX

>>632807

Wasn't yeltsin elected due to heavy US interference like sending PR specialists?

>>632809

Probably, though a demand to fuck commies was also an important factor. That'd also explain the common perception of capitalism in this country as copying US actions and following its decisions.

>>632764

>So in theory it's perfectly legal to own a Schwerer Gustav in the UK

Do you know anyone wealthy and autistic enough to bring a test case there?

>>632905

We don't live in a timeline that wonderful, do we.

>>632905

I think I finally understand why Anglos look like utter shit nowadays, and it has mainly to do with the jaw.

As our food has become more refined the muscles in our jaws have become smaller, thus making the mouth itself smaller. I postulate that due to a diet consisting of solely battered fish, beer and greasy kebabs in particular have caused the Anglos jaw to deform far more than normal.

The only reasonable step from here on is to genocide the Anglo.

>>632930

You might be on to something.

Does anyone have experience with the security six as a9mm? I've got one that I can buy thats decently close to where I live.

Also, suggestions for someone who isn't retarded but isn't 21.

>>632930

Its because anglos """free""" healthcare doesn't considers bad bite as illness so anglos literally became nation of crooked teeth and misshaped sculls.

>>632951

My dentist just about fucking lost it in the office when he was explaining this to me.

It doesn't stop at crooked teeth and misshapen skulls either though. A lot of people end up with extreme jaw pain which still doesn't constitute a health problem according to many of our governments. Jaw pain which requires NSAID's or opiates to cope with. Can't sleep because your jaw is keeping you up at night? Developed depression because of it? Hurt yourself at work because of your lack of energy and absent mindedness caused by not getting a proper sleep for 10 years? Here! Take these sleeping meds, SSRIs, go to physiotherapy, get some back surgery…

Here in British Columbia, Canada, broken noses and orthodontistry/dentistry is all considered "cosmetic" meaning that even though I only have 35% airflow through my nose due to breaking it as a child, I have to pay out of pocket to get it fixed because the healthcare that I pay $75/mo for out of pocket by law, in addition to our federal healthcare which Canadians pay anywhere from 15%-33% of our incomes towards (to say nothing of other contributions we're forced to make by the government) won't cover the cost of having a doctor punch me in the fucking head and set my nostrils and septum properly. I'm about ready to just get drunk and get a friend to drill me in the nose, then go into the hospital and seek treatment.

Broken bones are covered, but not preventative corrective action.

>>632930

So the solution is to start eating tougher and less-refined foods? I can get behind that.

>>632980

Not every state is super retarded. Alabama for instance 18 is legal to buy a handgun private purchase, it's Federal law that says 21 and that's regarding FFL's only.

>>632980

Michigan laws you can buy from a private seller at 18.

>>632990

>>632980

Thankfully I do live in a non-retard state. However, most people only sell to 21 and older

even my close friends parrents cause they fraid ATF gonna ram their ass in.

and my family are all nogunz,

What'd be more fun to get and shoot?

A security six with scope for $750 or a nagant with holster and cleaning kit for $300-350?

>>633505

The security six is a shit deal as it costs as much as a factory new revolver. Mostly because of the scope the seller is trying to jew you with. The nagant wouldn't be fun to shoot because you can't shoot it often (unless you reload or havr good sources).

Try to get the scope removed and lower his price to atleast 500.

>>633505

>A security six with scope for $750

Ludicrously overpriced. You could find a good used Blackhawk in .357 or .44 with a scope mount for less than that. possibly even a Redhawk.

Out of those choices I'd go with the 1895 Nagant, as long as you're aware the double action pull is ridiculously heavy. Try to get a pre war, they're usually better made.

>>633515

>The nagant wouldn't be fun to shoot because you can't shoot it often (unless you reload or havr good sources).

It's called the internet you mong. SGAmmo, AIM, J&G keep 7.62 Nagant in stock. PPU and S&B both load it, and hell you can shoot .32 S&W long and shorts through it without an issue.

>>633673

Which is why I said good sources you double nigger. Paying ~$25 for 50 rounds (assuming it's even in stock at your favorite store or site) sucks ass for going to the range and plinking away without a care. .38 is cheaper and .357 reloading components are everywhere along with being able to pick up ammo or components at any decent spot without having to wait several days

>You can also shoot ammo that's slightly easier to find than nagant ammo but not as easy to find as .38/.357

Milsurp is fine but unless you reload or HAVE GOOD SOURCES (like I already said) you're only shooting when your wallet or UPS/FedEx permits.

>>633738

>i'm going to pretend some of the largest sellers in the US are next to impossible to find or require some secret handshake to buy

I'm not arguing .38/.357 isn't more plentiful, I'm calling you a retard for making retarded statements. This isn't 1985, 7.62x38r is out there. Hell a lot of stores out in bumfuck backwoods Alabama have it on the shelf.

>>633726

44 and 500 will both drop bears.

The difference is that a 44 is actually concealable, and will drop a human just as well as a 500.

>>633754

I'm not saying nagant ammo is next to impossible to find I'm saying you need to buy from certain stores that stock it or sites hence the good sources comment. If you have some gunshops that stock it then good for you but not every shop has the space for less common ammo even if it's current year and most times you can't just take a walk into wally world and buy a cheap bulk pack to blast away like nothing. If someone asks what would be more fun between a 5.56 and a .30 carbine I would say 5.56 since you can find it in giant bulk packs for cheap. Not saying the other ammo is impossible to find, just that you need to have a GOOD SOURCE to have fun because in my mind a more fun (what the guy asked for) gun is one you can shoot for an entire range session.

I have a rifle in 8x57js (arguably more popular than nagant ammo) and I have several good shops within minutes of my house that stock it but I sure as shit can't find it for a cheap price as most places want 15 or 16 for a 20 round box bi metal jacketed ammo. I can't find cheap bulk packs so I buy a box or two occasionally but still end up reloading a shit ton. It still gets left behind occasionally in favor of an AR. Again not impossible to find, just not a cheap plinker to have constant fun with.

Revolvers are cheaper to hand load your own ammunition, are cheaper guns on a reliability-price graph, and can be shot through clothing and other memery. They're just overall more reliable at the 6 month or 1 year mark of a SHTF scenario.

>>633771

>>633726

Drop bears are terrifying.

>>633938

Even a .357 snub nose is more powerful than most autoloaders, other than the guys who conceal a full size 1911.

>>633956

Enjoy that massive loss of velocity and crippling nerve damage, Elmer.

>>633729

I laughed/10

The way around this is easy.

get 6 glocks and attach them to a wheel. Now you have a fully revolving glock with 60 to 78 rounds of ammunition.

Own the streets with the new Glock Revolver Special

>>632185

>more mechanically complex

>the only difference between a "less complex" is a single bar that cocks the hammer

Nigger, the internals are complex no matter what, what's a drop in an ocean?

>>634035

That just looks like a jackhammer

I know Ian's a faggot, but it's the first thing that came up and I'm lazy

>>634041

It's the Six12, and it has absolutely nothing in common with the Jackhammer. They don't even look similar.

>>632124

this should be copypasta

>>633992

Unless the gas seal was perfect wouldn't that just burn a hole in your wrist?

>>634463

That's what Space Marine power armor is for.

>>634042

>bullpup rotary 12 guage cylinder

>nothing in common

>>631784

IT'S NOT JUST ABOUT SHOOTING, IT'S ABOUT RELOADING

>>634464

You could get the same result, at a much lower cost and weight, with composite vambraces. A few thin layers of ceramic armour layered with plastic and all topped off with a layer of waterproofed Sodium Silicate to deal with all the fire.

>>635946

this. revolvers are great for reloaders, not having to chase down brass is great. also, you can get away with some hilariously low charge weights with revolvers due to not having to cycle the action like on an auto loader.