/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>704053

Having alcohol is fine as long as you don't over indulge and get drunk or anything like that.

st. paul literally said to have a bit of wine and it's good for you. if you are predisposed to be an alchy or can't handle it fine, but it's definitely not bad for you in fact it's good for you. have a glass of wine or beer with a meal.

the most important thing is your intent when you're drinking. if you're there to socialize, be friendly, then it's good. if you're intent is imma get smashed tonight then no don't do it that is sinful. hope this helps.

Inb4 "Jesus never said anything about bars! So I can get drunk there ok?!?!??"

>>704054

>Having alcohol is fine as long as you don't over indulge and get drunk or anything like that.

I.e. le standard societal opinion

I'd be curious however as to examining the difference between different types of drink. All beverages appear to be treated equally for simply being alcoholic but perhaps there might be a moral difference between the consumption of stronger spirits and lesser concentrated beverages. It was not always that strong spirits existed in our culture and most of them appear to have been originally created in monasteries.

Perhaps of interest might be to look into what the opinion of Jewish theologians may be on the matter, but heaven forbid many to take after Jews in anything.

>>704138

Nope. Just dont get drunk. But wine is always a superb patrician choice, of course.

>>704139

Society has come to tolerate stronger spirits but they're really hard to gulp down for a reason. The consumption of more highly concentrated alcohol recreationally may be more hedonistic than traditional wine and beer. I'm aware that distinctions between the two probably haven't been made or received tractates on the level of the Philokalia or the Ladder of Divine Ascent but perhaps it should have.

>>704146

Like I said

>>704138

>A person can do nothing better than to eat and drink and find satisfaction in their own toil. This too, I see, is from the hand of God,

>Ecclesiastes 2:24

Drinking is good. The Bible encourages it. Paul encourages Timothy to have a little wine (1 Tim 5:23). Literally Jesus made alcohol consumption apart of the central act of worship in the Church, the Eucharist. However the Bible does forbid getting drunk off of drinking.

>strong spirits

>Give strong drink to him who is perishing, And wine to him whose life is bitter.

>Proverbs 31:6

There's no problem with having a sip of whiskey or vodka every now and again, Deuteronomy 14:26 even encourages strong drinks for the Israelites. Once again, as long as you don't get drunk off of it, there's literally nothing wrong with it.

>Perhaps of interest might be to look into what the opinion of Jewish theologians may be on the matter

Hmmm I wonder (((who))) could be behind this post?

>>704152

Yeah Yeah I get that there's popular animosity towards Judaism today but I still would think that it might be beneficial to see what their opinion on the matter is since this has probably had a tendency to be overlooked. It's not like they're sanctioning drunken orgies.

That word translated as "strong drink" is translated as wine elsewhere so it is an inconclusive example. Wines may have varied in their content but spirits as they are known today didn't really come about until the middle ages. For all we know an opium containing concoction could be a wine. Remember cocaine wine?

>Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.

>>704160

>That word translated as "strong drink" is translated as wine

Nevermind that word is there as well but then what to make of >>704163

>>704167

There also appears to be debate as to whether shekar refers to beer instead. Greek uses "méthu" which is related to mead.

>>704069

Beer is liquid estrogen

>>704053

A glass of alcohol a day is all that should be permitted and all a man needs to unwind at the end of a long day. The Bible is pro-alcohol anti-drunkenness.

I don't condone alcoholism or addiction but from my time spent in bars I've found decent people going through hard times and for whatever reason alcohol is their go-to.

For some a beer or two with familiar faces while sharing a laugh or rant before heading back to whatever awaits them back home can be a great comfort.

>>704053

Because they're degenerates.

Bars are degenerate.

Pubs are Good, just don't drink Or eat too much.

Pubs are meeting places, restaurants, and hangouts for men.

Bars exist to cater to all the degenerate aspects of nightlife and hookup culture; primarily allowing "women" to be worthless sloots.

Dumb question but at what point does "drunkenness" start? You'll feel very slightly tipsy after like 2 drinks, is that supposed to be the limit? Or is it like "stumbling retard" levels?

>>704431

A Thomist would say it's when you lose control of your reasonable faculties, and begin saying "eh" to stuff you know is wrong.

If I had a couple drinks and was tipsy but still "good" mentally, it'd be okay. If I drank to the point where I brought out the vulgar banter, or jacked off/attempted to get laid, it'd cross into sinful territory because I'm dismissing my own knowledge of what I should/shouldn't be doing.

You have to be honest with yourself though, as everyone handles intoxication differently. Some people can keep a clear head for a while, others are checked-out after just a couple. Best to err on the side of caution.

>>704437

We can also follow precedent. St. Benedictine monks are limited to only 3 glasses of wine, as far as I'm aware.

>>704443

Sounds reasonable to me although some might consider it too much.

>Ecclesiasticus 31:31,32,35-39

"Fire trieth hard iron: so wine drunk to excess shall rebuke the hearts of the proud. Wine taken with sobriety is equal life to men: if thou drink it moderately, thou shalt be sober. Wine was created from the beginning to make men joyful, and not to make them drunk. Wine drunken in moderation is the joy of the soul and heart. Sober drinking is health to soul and body. Wine drunken with excess raiseth quarrels, and wrath, and many ruins. Wine drunken with excess is bitterness of the soul."

Also:

>St. John 2:1-11