/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>692308

The important thing to remember is that we don't go confess to "some guy" but to Christ whom the priest is in the person of. That's why, at the end, the priest says "I forgive you" instead of "Christ forgives you" or something like that. It's really Christ to whom we confess. As for what we actually "do", we simply make a sign of the cross, then say how long it was since our last confession, and then say how we sinned. We're only obligated to confess grave sins because by committing them we lose the grace of God, hence the need for "reconciliation" through the sacrament of penance. Confessing lesser offenses is recommended, though. So, confession would probably go something like "Bless me father for I have sinned. It has been 3 weeks since my last confession. Since my last confession, I have missed mass 1 time, entertained impure thoughts 4 times, sinned agaisn't charity 2 times, etc…" Basically, you examine your conscience beforehand so you can give the priest a good idea of the state of your soul. When your done, your priest will give you advice and assign you a penance. The penance is usually something like "say 3 Our Fathers", depending on the severity of your sins. The penance is mostly symbolic for the further penance you'll do on your own. Finally, the priest will ask your to say an act of contrition, and it ends with him giving you absolution. You should do your penance after coming out of the confessional so you don't forget it. And you can say a prayer to thank God for his forgiveness, as Christ's Blood washes your soul as clean as it was right after your baptism.

>>692308

>And why haven't protestants picked up on this or at least have their own version of it?

High church prots have it.

Also, heres a part describing its history.

http://www.orthodoxchristian.info/pages/confession.htm

>>692308

>but confession (at least what I see of it in movies and other media) seems like a good thing to do.

That kind of confession you desire is public in nature, neither Romanism nor contemporary low-church Protestantism has this.

>the idea of saying them just to come clean about things seems healthy to me

It is. See Proverbs 28:13, Psalm 32:5, and James 5:16. In fact, it is law: See Lev. 26:40-42, Num 5:6-7, but notice here the confessor is confessing to the whole congregation of Israel, not a single priest.

>And why haven't protestants picked up on this or at least have their own version of it?

Rome is partially to blame. Like I said, confession is a private affair to Rome, which is not conducive to the nature of Biblical society or ecclesiology. Alas, besides the Puritans, much of Protestantism continued to keep confession, if they kept it, a private affair contrasted.

The other side is Protestantism from the 19th century onward took a heavy antinomian view of moral living, thanks to dispensationalism among other doctrines. This neutered the church's teaching on sin, public and private, which de-emphasized the seriousness of sin's infraction against God and fellow man. Naturally, this also neutered the Gospel since if we don't have to follow God's law and if sin does not have to be exposed, why is Gospel so badly needed? Why follow God's desire for the faith to be a public faith?

>>692326

>Sounds blasphemous.

Yeah, Jesus got that a lot, too.

He said therefore to them again: Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you. When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.

>>692313

Priest says "your sins are forgiven", without mentioning who forgives them. It is still God forgiving sins even though of course priest is acting in persona Christi. The same way priest is acting in person of Christ during the mass but it's God sacrificing himself for us, not priest.

I think OP could understand this like if priest thinks of himself like he's God, he's not. Subtle difference but important one, like many in the teaching of Catholic Church.

>>692413

The priest definitely "I absolve you". If he didn't, the confession would be invalid.

>>692428

definitely says*

>>692308

Protties used to have it you are probably just in a church that threw it out. As said the priest is a stand in for Jesus. The reason it works is because we are telling our sins to another member of the Church and Jesus as Paul told us to do. Trust me telling a priest you fap and look at porn is not exactly easy to do. Oh you then say an act of contrition where the priest bears witness to you openly praying to Jesus to forgive your sins and keep you on the right path. Anyway once you confess the Priest tells you "I absolve you of your sins." speaking as a stand in for Jesus. Also you will be given penance based on the severity of your sins there is a thread up now where some anon who did a ton of stuff has to go on like a 3000 mile trip that's usually a severe case usually it is just praying, reading specific bible verses or some act of charity.

There are EXTREME examples however where you might end up excommunicated until you make things right.

>>692308

Numbers 5:6,7

St. Matthew 3:6

Acts 19:18

James 5:16

>Priests can forgive sin

St. Matthew 18:18

St. John 20:22,23

>>692428

In my parish (which should use the same catholic liturgy as the rest of the world?), the priest says "I absolve you" somewhere in the middle and then ends with "The Lord has forgiven you for your sins, may you walk in peace" (or something like that)

The confession is between you and God. The priest is the intermediator.

He said therefore to them again: Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you. When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost. Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.

Jesus sent his disciples to do this.

>Why don't protestants do this

Well most things protestants do/say/think is made up as an opposition to catholicism. I don't want to go on a rant here but as far as confession is concerned they deemed it unnecessary(just confess to Jesus). As a catholic that tried this approach himself, it does not work. Prots do not have confessions. Realizing how important this sacrament is, I cannot take protestant theology seriously. Without a genuine confession. the devil has a grip on you through your sins.

>inb4 muh personal confession to God.

Does not work, This was not what church did. And for a good reason. Prots claiming "muh some guy here forgives you the sins, they think God is not involved". Priests are given the authority to perform the sacraments. But it is GOD who does those sacraments. GOD forgives you the sins.

Also look at it this way: A priest has met lot of people with similar problem, perhaps he has experience and he can give a good advice. If you are not able to speak about your vices with other person - a person that is bound by keeping it secret - how will you be open about your change before God? or before yourself?

Confessing together by sharing your problems in church as Prots do it is not a confession. That' just talking about your roblems, not a confession

>>692308

>And why haven't protestants picked up on this or at least have their own version of it?

Lutherans retained it, but since lutherans declare general absolution at all of their services, it's normally by appointment only.

Priest prays for you. Confessing your sins makes them more objective.

Good motivation to stop repeating them.

First we need to remember that at the end of time, we're going to be judged. All our actions and intentions will be revealed. When you're absolved of your sin, it's blotted out and demon's can't use it against you, it allows you to move forward in holiness and virtue

>>700380

Protestants would be right, in so far that the priest can't absolve you by his own power, only by the power given to him by God. This is why we Catholics insist that our priests, when giving the sacraments, act in the "person of Christ", that is, he acts as Christ, not as himself. This is because, Christ alone is the High Priest, whose priesthood the priests share.

As other christanons have said the priest is acting as mediator. At the beginning he'll usually say something like "let's take a moment to be in the presence of God". The penance he gives you is based on the sins you've confessed and is supposed to help you avoid doing those sins in the future. It really does help when you're facing temptation.

The best way I've found to explain it is this. Think of salvation like a car, a free car gifted to you by someone who loves you. Now, you have a car, you can go places and do things you couldn't before. Now, over time, that car is exposed to dirt and grime from the outside world. The car receives wear and tear from continued use. In order to keep the car functioning properly, you need to wash it to remove the dirt and grime, and you have to replace fluids, gasoline, oil, tires, and the battery. If salvation is this car, then going to confession is giving the car a much-needed wash, and (though it's not exactly what you asked about) receiving Holy Communion is replacing the battery, and good works are replacing the tires, oil, gasoline, and fluids. In this context, the car given to a practicing, faithful apostolic Christian (Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, etc.) would remain as pristine and functional as the day it was bought for the duration of its life, while the car given to a Protestant (especially of the low church variety) ends up caked in dirt, with flat tires, a dead battery, low or no fluids, poor or no oil, and an empty gas tank.

Maybe this will help you visualize the apostolic system and the need for all the various church practices and traditions.

>>692308

>>692308

>I'm a dumdum protestant

:^D

>>692313

>"I forgive you" instead of "Christ forgives you"

>speaking on behalf of Christ

< #reasonsiAmNotaCathbro

>"Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained." (John 20:23

Priests forgive sins in Christ Name. Its Christ who forgives our sin through the Priest

>>701051

You do realize what an apostle is, right? To be an apostle is to be His ambassador. To be his representative and to speak on his behalf. That's why he sent the 12 to do his work, and they chose other apostles, on Christ's behalf.

>>701286

Then prots came:"Muh priests cannot forgive sins therefore confession is useless"

>We did not claim priests solely from their own power forgive sins. It is the Christ.

Whatever…I don't listen anyway because I dislike Catholicism

/thread