/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

Fascism is incompatible with Christianity.

Most of my Romanian friends dislike him, but only two of them are Christian for real.

>>586341

But he wasn't exactly fascist, he was more of a nationalist. Sympathetic to fascism at best. Keep in mind also that he was murdered in 1938 so he couldn't have a wall rounded opinion on these movements. He was def anti-communist tho.

>>586342

I would like to know the official opinion of Romanian Christians and their church.

>>586341

>A theonomic, purely objective monarchy

>incompatible with fascism

Christianity IS fascism, stupid.

>Born to a devout Orthodox family (his father was martyred by Soviet Communists), as an ardent and very idealistic schoolboy, he joined ‘The Legion of the Archangel Michael’. This organisation spanned many interest groups. In some ways it resembled nothing more than similar movements in the inter-war years in the rest of Europe. That is to say that with its greenshirts, it was a rather fanatical, militaristic and moralistic boy scout movement with hero-worship of its founder, marching songs, spartan living conditions, keep-fit exercises and hiking in the mountains. However, at another extreme it also attracted some very nasty anti-Semitic elements who, known as the Iron Guard, were nothing but Fascists and were responsible for several political assassinations during the late 1930s.

>However, there was also a very strong Orthodox and spiritual element among the ‘Legionnaires’, which distinguished the bulk of the movement from nationalistic groups elsewhere in Europe at the time. The emphasis on national salvation, moral principles, hard work, sacrifice, seriousness, respect, self-discipline and teamwork were reflections of a monastic side to the movement and it was to this side that Valeriu belonged. Indeed, later in his life he regretted his youthful and idealistic association with the Legion, in which he had seen nationalism and politics, the inherently anti-Christian pride of a code of ‘honour’, spiritual impurity and from which, like many others, he had gone on to the fullness of Orthodoxy.

from here

http://orthodoxengland.org.uk/bookread.htm

But i would like to know more about the official outlook of the Church on Codreanu and his movement.

>>586384

More like certain political systems can be compatible with Christianity

Really amazing man, defended his country from the enemies of Christ.

>>586341

>t. someone who doesn't know what fascism is

>>586345

The Church will probably say they denounce him since he is seen as a bad guy in the eyes of the (((government)))

>>586399

But Valeriu was also very anti-communist and and they still think highly of him. I'm not doupding Codreanu's love for his country and God but my question is if he is looked upon more of like a political figure or a Christian one.

>>586384

This. There should be a bot that identifies political threads and spams this post.

If you are a politically motivated Christian, you are an idolater because you place your political system alongside Christianity. Thinking you can use politics to further Christianity is blasphemous because you deny God's involvement in the world. Want to make Christianity flourish? Be a good Christian, period. Not a good fascist, communist, liberal, conservative.

Read "An Essay on Man" by Alexander Pope. He correctly states "Whatever IS, is RIGHT" (l.292). See Leibniz and "the best of all possible worlds". This is the world God allows to happen. We must accept. God can create miracles very easily. If he does not, then he expects us to do our best in the world we live in and accept his will.

Politics is rebellious, denies God's will, and tries to change society without God by political means.

Evil people are eager for rebellion, but they will be severely punished.

Proverbs 17:11

>>586420

Oh, right - after God… we need Marx! or Hitler! or the Chicago School!

No, no, no … God is sufficient. Politics is idolatry.

>>586428

why would being religious preclude one from having opinions on good governance? if i take no interest in how my country is governed, then someone else certainly will

>>586454

According to Romans 13

"for no one is a ruler except by God's permission, and our present rulers have had their rank and power assigned to them by Him"

God selects our leaders, despite all the political histrionics.

While nationalism and even fascism are not evil in-themselves, he took nationalism to its extreme. He unfortunately held his country in greater importance in his heart than God. As well, his burning hatred for the Jews poisoned his soul. No matter how evil your enemy, you should not wish for their death.

>>586338

Romanian catholic anon here.

His movement was probably the best fascist / nationalist movement.

Zelea promoted not only the religious aspect but the cultural one too. So basically honour your ancestors (not worship) and also praise the Lord. Some of the songs the iron guard had were something like: brave legionaries fighting in Spain (yeah, they helped out in Spain the fascist regime) seeing the cross in the sky and gaining strengh.

The iron guard symbol meant a iron fence against the communist ideology.

The iron guard hated jews and masons. Had the legionaries killed an average politician then probably it wouldn't have been such a great deal. What nobody is talking about is that the political killing targets were masons mostly. Most well known: Nicolae Iorga (33 degree if i am not mistaken).

The same stuff abput the jews was said here as in Germany.

In the end Zelea was assassinated by the orders of the traitor king Carol II . A paid oposition guy was put in charge and the movement was destroyed.

They promoted orthodoxy as the main saviour of the country.

The iron guard had a famous painting of a pesant working the field and above him was archangel Michael protecting him.

They promoted volunteer work and would have sympathisers (mostly theology) students and farmers.

For the time being they did good for the country.

>inb4 he killed people

Yes, i do not agree with that either but those were the times. Throwing jews and masons out of the country would have been the best but it seems they knew a more violent way. Which by the way was what most european countries did.

I don't know in depth details but what i presented here is what less tgan 1% of romanians know. They know so little because communism hit hard and there is little to no Christian-nationalistic mentality left. Also not many believe the masonic conspiracies.

If there are any questions, ama.

>>586488

I was astonished by his book. It was very different from other nationalistic babblings about race or new age accultism i've come across in the past. I didn't notice anything fishy or heretical in his words and the Iron Guard's idealism is something i haven't see in any other political organisation, left or right.

Unfortunatelly i cannot find more info about the Christian point of view on him as all are either in Romanian or from nationalist orgs (from whitch many are anti-Christian).

In my country (Greece btw) we learn more about Valeriu Gafencu as a Christian Saint but

only ultra-nationalists seem to care about Codreanu.

I would like to know more of the Christian point of view on him. Maybe not so much the official stance of the church but more of the opinion of Christians in Romania.

>>586476

I don't know, i'm a little confused on the matter and i wonder if he strayed away from God with his extremism or was he just a man living in hard times who took extreme measures to protect innocent people.

>>586716

(It's me, romanian christanon)

He lived shortly and hasn't finnised his writings. 4chan /pol/ is where you can get most romanian opinions on this subject.

All that you need to know about him is that anyone who rejects jews and masons will be labeled as ultranationalist.

Was he a saint? I don't know how sanctifying works.

Did he fight against communism and globalist anti-christian ideologies? Yes.

Best way to label him is as a hero of our country. The reason?

Vlad the Impaler and Mihai the Brave are very well known kebab removers. They used violence and no one thinks will say that it is bad what they did. Did they promote Chriatian values? Not so much. They cared more about the people but they would be influenced by religion too as they asked for military support from the pope.

Stefan the Great was a famous kebab remover, however, for every battle he would win against the ottoman roaches, he would order the building of one momastery. That is why he built around 40-41 monasteries.

Constantin Brancoveanul was a romanian king that the ottomans forced him to convert to islam but refused. The roaches took his 3 sons (30 yo or something like taht) and topd him that if he doesn't convert they will decapitate his sons. He refused 3 times, each time one of his sons was decapitated in front of him. He died Christian.

Romanians were under ottoman rule for many years and never have the romanians ever give up Chriatianity. This is one of the cultural aspects the legionaries pushed.

My advice: go to 4chan /pol/, or to Ro/pol/ threads and ask the guys there. In modern day Romania as in any other state, the groups that promoted the killing of jews and masons are labeled nazis. You know the rest.

>>586718

I will attach a link tonight.

>>586742

I am probably the only romanian guy here.

>>586751

There are other (better) places on the internet where he could actually get "most romanian opinions" on this subject.

>>586753

Are you Romanian?

>>586753

People who are not into history will say nazi.

People who are into history will say nazi because the books present the facts but the teachers and professors were raised during communism and that is what communism promoted.

In romania it is pretty damn hard to find a group of people that are:

-religious

-right wing

-know history well

-know the jew and masonic are bad

The very few that agree to all of the above are mostly romanians from /pol/. It was a suggestion. If you have better options, be my guest.

>>586820

>/pol/

>100.00% non-christian

>>586755

im romania, whats up? che mai face

>>586855

Salutare vecine

>>586855

kurva

>>586338

a billion good parcente based

>>586753

Which ones?

>>586824

I've had some very nice religious conversations on /pol/ but i wanted to avoid the trolling and the bagans :D

>>586930

https://m.youtube.com/watch?t=763s&v=ZRt8BiJYo98

Better songs. Titles in description

I guess some call him saint. Oficially the church doesn't. You can't expect the head of the romanian orthodox church to canonise him. The head of the romanian church is a mason ffs. No official documents say that but masonic insiders say so.

http://boards.4chan.org/pol/thread/156085131

old thread where you can see how romanians think in regards to the iron guard

>>586930

I have heard for the first time this song and i can say it is "Treceti batalioane romane carpatii" 100%. It is a song about romanians btfo the huns from transylvania in 1918. The song in the link is legionaries wanabees. It's not original.

>>587187

First off it started as a anticommunist and globalist movement, that can be proven by its symbol of an iron fence. The religious and cultural ideologies were promoted because it is what united the romanian people for centuries. The people they killed were mostly jews and masons. After the assassination of Zelea the movement was divided and was out of control. In the end it rebeled against its own country which was the end of it.

>>587206

Antiglobalist*

>>587206

>The religious and cultural ideologies were promoted because it is what united the romanian people for centuries.

Which is one of the issues - Christianty being a secondary focus and motivator rather than the primary.

>people they killed were mostly jews and masons

Being a jew or a mason doesnt automatically justify their murder.

>After the assassination of Zelea the movement was divided and was out of control. In the end it rebeled against its own country which was the end of it.

It interesting that they were one of the only fascist movements that survived the death of their primary figure.

>>587239

>Which is one of the issues - Christianty being a secondary focus and motivator rather than the primary.

>Zelea promoted not only the religious aspect but the cultural one too. So basically honour your ancestors (not worship) and also praise the Lord. Some of the songs the iron guard had were something like: brave legionaries fighting in Spain (yeah, they helped out in Spain the fascist regime) seeing the cross in the sky and gaining strengh.

The iron guard symbol meant a iron fence against the communist ideology.

The iron guard hated jews and masons. Had the legionaries killed an average politician then probably it wouldn't have been such a great deal. What nobody is talking about is that the political killing targets were masons mostly. Most well known: Nicolae Iorga (33 degree if i am not mistaken).

The same stuff abput the jews was said here as in Germany.

In the end Zelea was assassinated by the orders of the traitor king Carol II . A paid oposition guy was put in charge and the movement was destroyed.

They promoted orthodoxy as the main saviour of the country.

The iron guard had a famous painting of a pesant working the field and above him was archangel Michael protecting him.

They promoted volunteer work and would have sympathisers (mostly theology) students and farmers.

For the time being they did good for the country.

>inb4 he killed people

Yes, i do not agree with that either but those were the times. Throwing jews and masons out of the country would have been the best but it seems they knew a more violent way. Which by the way was what most european countries did.

>Being a jew or a mason doesnt automatically justify their murder.

That is how things went during those times. Throwing high officials out of the country was hard.

I am not defending murder i am just explaining why they chose to do the things they did.

>>586460

>theres no way God makes certain people politically inclined in order to choose his leaders!

>t. Idiot

God works through usv

>>587572

Christian politicians have been a disaster in democracies. No gains, only losses.

>>587582

So we should just stop trying to keep people out of office who push for the legal murder of children?

>>587585

We stop evil with prayer and converting people. The Roman Empire was not converted militarily but by prayer and the grace given to Christians to be awesome examples in the midst of martyrdom.

>>587582

>Christian politicians have been a disaster in democracies.

Democracies in general have been disasters.

>>587591

>The Roman Empire was not converted militarily

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Milvian_Bridge#Vision_of_Constantine

>>587977

Constantine had a vision. The Battle was unrelated.

>>587981

He not only had a vision of the Christian God, but was told to fight under His symbol in the upcoming battle to win. Yeah, so unrelated.

He's comparable to a saint who was martyred, tbh. He genuinely cared about his people and the future of his nation especially since it was bordering the USSR, he met up with fellow students and tried to figure out ways to handle the scenario if the communist atheist Bolsheviks invaded. He rejuvenated the Romanian Christian spirit in a time when Marxism was growing in Romania and paid dearly for it.

>>587987

That battle had nothing to do with the Evangelism of the people in the Roman empire. Constantine wasn't even Christian by that time. If anything, the vision probably led his ban the perseqution of Christians and to legalise Christianity as one of the empire's religions (along with paganism, judaism etc). The Apostoles converted the people.

>>588118

How many saints were active womanisers who preached murder?

To me, even if Condreanu is more of a political figure, members of the Iron Guard are defenitely neomartyrs equal to the first Christian martyrs. All the hardships those poor kids had to go through…

Seriously, read about the pitesti experiment. If Condreanu fought to stop these monsters from taking power, then he's good by my book.

http://www.thegenocideofthesouls.org/public/english/the-pitesti-experiment/

Other than that, saint or sinner, i can't judge him any further.

>>588164

>>588118

Meant for you

>>588161

Can i have some source on that?

>>588167

From Maria Bucurs "Romania" in Women, Gender and Fascism in Europe. From wikipedia

>Codreanu's hero from his childhood until the end of his life was Stephen the Great.[11] A vast legend was created around the womanizing Stephen's sexual powers, who had demonstrated his greatness as a man and ruler by fathering hundreds, if not thousands of children by women from all social ranks, an aspect of Stephen's life which the Romanian historian Maria Bucur observed "was never held against him, but rather used anecdotally as evidence of his greatness".[11] Despite his vehement insistence in public of the importance of upholding traditional Eastern Orthodox values, the charismatic Codreanu, who was considered to be very attractive by many women, often followed his role model Stephen the Great with regard to them.

As for the murder look at the acts carried out by his followers during the anti Jewish Pogroms

>On 23 January, a few hours before the rebellion was quelled, a group of Legionnaires selected 15 Jews at random. They took them in trucks to the local slaughterhouse, where they were shot. Five of the Jews, including a five-year-old girl, were hung on the slaughterhouse's hooks, still alive. They were tortured, their bellies cut and their entrails hung around their necks in a parody of shehita, kosher slaughter of cattle. The bodies were labeled "kosher". The slaughterhouse was closed for a week to purge and clean the house of the results.[5]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legionnaires%27_rebellion_and_Bucharest_pogrom#The_Bucharest_pogrom

Are these the acts equal of the first Christian Martyrs?

>>588174

So a gender studies professer and a jew are your sources? No ty

>>588174

the pogrom happened after Codrenau's death iirc

>>588174

>Maria Bucurs

>teaches history and gender studies at Indiana University

This has to be bait. Although she doesn't even accuse Condreanu for being womanizer, she accuses him for admiring a king instead of literally shaking to the fact that he was a womanizer.

>As for the murder look at the acts carried out by his followers during the anti Jewish Pogroms

If he ordered or aproved the killings then yes, that's a valid accusation on him. But as Christanon says >>588181

, he was dead by that time.

>>586341

Clerical fascism is a thing, you know?

Beyond that, monarchy is the only officially sanctioned system in the current year by God. Everything else is bargaining between what you can have and what's ideal. Fascism has at least one thing going for it - it's not democracy nor communism.

>>588180

>So a gender studies professer

She is a historian who has written works on gender issues. She has a doctorate and a masters in history from one of the better universities.

She isnt just some nobody gender studies degree holder from some no name university who you can reject outright.

>a jew

Dont really see the wisdom in assuming that we should automatically assume jews are liars here , anyway see the International Commission they recently had commissioned by the Government. For the genocide in general and the slaughterhouse incident on page 6. They have footnotes and sources to the material used.

https://www.ushmm.org/m/pdfs/20080226-romania-commission-holocaust-history.pdf

Likewise is Christopher Simpson of the American University: Washington a jew or not?

>>588185

>the pogrom happened after Codrenau's death iirc

Which is when his followers gained power. Or do you think the movement died with him?

The last part of >>588207 was for >>588181

>>588186

>Clerical fascism is a thing, you know?

And so is National Bolshevism, Anarcho-Primitivism and even Libertarian Monarchism.

>Fascism has at least one thing going for it - it's not democracy nor communism.

Just as democracy wins out from not being fascism or communism.

>>588207

>Or do you think the movement died with him?

The movement died with him. After his death the iron guard divided in 2 (the ones that believed in Codreanu and the ones who believed in Sima (i think this was his name) as the new leader.

In no way did Codreanu ever plot a revolution against his own country. The reason why the movement failed is because the iron guard started a revolution and started killing civilians. The army had to interfere and stop them.

As for the murder issue. How would you nonviolently remove masons, jews and commies out of a country?

>>588208

As i said earlier, it seems there was a split in his movement between the more ultra-nationalists and the ones who became more involved with the faith and took the path of martyrdom, like Valeriu Gafencu and the members who were tortured in prisons to deny God. For that only i believe we cannot reject the Iron Guard as a whole.

As for Condreanu himself, i don't know (and i can't find) what was his thinking on murder, pogroms etc. I've read his book like 3 years ago and i don't remember him glorifying murder or anything like that.

But even if he was actually a sinner (which he was since he murdered that cop iirc), what was the outcome of his actions and his life? Did he regret commiting those sins? Did he asked for forgiveness by God? History is full of great sinners who became saint eventually.

Those are some of the questions that troubles me about him.

>>588212

It looks like his movement was poisoned by extremism after his death so that couldn't be his fault.

>>588212

>he reason why the movement failed is because the iron guard started a revolution and started killing civilians.

So you disagree with that other anon about all that being jewish fabrications?

Given the context wasnt it more a power struggle than a revolution?

>How would you nonviolently remove masons, jews and commies out of a country?

There are vast amount of ways to do so - with communists you do so the way almost the entire western world did - prosperity, education and jailing violent agitators.

Masons and Jews are a more complicated question as they are not inherently malicious but by didnt of their ingroup preference allow memebers of their group to rapidly gain influence.

Solutions tend to be things like boycotting and shunning the bad whilst intergertating the low level to diminish their ingroup identity as has been done with other troublesome ethnic groups .

One can get rid of mafias without having to slaughter Italian immigrants.

>>588221

>So you disagree with that other anon about all that being jewish fabrications?

The leader of the movement became Sima who was a paid shill. Some historical details are unknown but the ruling power wanted the movement gone. The most efficient way to get rid of it is to show the people a good reason why the movement is bad => attack civilians

It kinda was a secret plot to take down the movement.

As a matter of fact, Zelea and some of his followers were to be taken to prison but on the way there, the prison truck stopped and they killed him and the followers. It was therefore a secret plot to destroy the movement.

>>588221

>with communists you do so the way almost the entire western world did

*eastern

the west seems to buy in the communist ideology more than the east because the west was never under oppression of a communist regime.

See chapters: european antifa and socialist ideologies and political parties

>>588221

>Masons and Jews

>not inherently malicious

Although #notalljews, all the jews who go to the synagogue and believe in the teachings of the talmud and all masons (gnosticism &co) are the problem.

The best solution is always nonviolent but the problem is that you need a big percentage of people in one country that are educated, redpilled and devout Christians. You will agree that the only country close to that is Poland (and they aren`t redpilled).

Going by this logic, is it wise that Romania fought the ottomans not only to keep their land but also their religion?

>inb4 they came marching with swords

we are in a psychological warfare.

what is your solution?

i ask this because it is unwise to say there is a problem and not come with a solution

Yes we were talking about how the legionaries thought violence was a solution but back then things weren`t the way they are today. one could feel the time for war was near. The same way Christianity is today. Maybe not as threatened physically (although chrisitanity is the most persecuted religion) but psychologically.

>>588217

His followers did kill masons while he was alive, probably the reason to get rid of codreanu

>>588215

See >>588228 I would argue that problem would be inevitable.

>i don't remember him glorifying murder or anything like that.

The chapter on "OUR APPREHENSIONS FACING THIS WORLD" seems to do that

>what was the outcome of his actions and his life? Did he regret commiting those sins? Did he asked for forgiveness by God?

If he did it must have been in secret or his final moments. In his book he blames the Justice Minister and the Jewish Press for "forcing" him to murder the Police Prefect who ordered the police to break up his political meeting.

Given his views expressed unless he had a sudden "conversion" as he was being killed it seems unlikely.

>History is full of great sinners who became saint eventually.

And history is full of even more great sinners who did not.

>>588234

> It was therefore a secret plot to destroy the movement.

I was talking more about the murders and thefts post Zelea.

>The leader of the movement became Sima who was a paid shill.

Wasnt it more him being more charismatic and being lucky enough to ride of the success of the Nazi domination of the region?

>*eastern

What do you mean here?

>the west seems to buy in the communist ideology more than the east because the west was never under oppression of a communist regime.

Not at all, the west has annihilated Marxism so hard that when their parties stopped getting money from the USSR and China they collasped.

They have been so successful that even historic socialist parties abandoned any pretense of nationalising industry or instituting workers control. Its all about fighting over who gets what is made now and who gets to be a part of it.

The only Marxism that remains the anemic academic kind that cannot even prevent their departments from getting their budgets slashed.

>See chapters: european antifa and socialist ideologies and political parties

Antifa are tiny and those Eurosocialists suffer from the above.

>Although #notalljews, all the jews who go to the synagogue and believe in the teachings of the talmud and all masons (gnosticism &co) are the problem.

They arent anymore than every Catholic who goes to Church is responsible for the acts of the Franco Regime during the Civil War or the French in Vietnam. As a Catholic you of all people should now about the issues of cultural believers.

>you need a big percentage of people in one country that are educated, redpilled and devout Christians

More so just a degree of trust and organisation.

>You will agree that the only country close to that is Poland

Not during that time period.

>Going by this logic, is it wise that Romania fought the ottomans not only to keep their land but also their religion?

Bit of a non issue as the Ottomans werent hyper keen on conversion as it would mean missing out on Jizya tax which is why places like Greece for instance were Turk controlled for roughly 600 years but still stayed largely christian. A better example would have been the Byzantines around the era of the first Caliphate .

>i ask this because it is unwise to say there is a problem and not come with a solution

Can you be more specific are we talking about now or Romania in the 40s? Likewise it is even more unwise to assume any answer must be correct in the absence of no immediate other one.

>The same way Christianity is today. Maybe not as threatened physically (although chrisitanity is the most persecuted religion) but psychologically.

You have to be so very careful with ideas like this because it is one step away from hysteria and blaming a complex a multifaceted problem on a group of individuals. Its the reason why the Rwandan Genocide happened and the reason Catholics were martyred and suppressed in Japan (and could be argued is responsible for many other genocides).

You need to be concrete with cause and effect as well as who is literally responsible.

>>588158

Are you kidding me. He gets a sign from God to do something that led to the flourishing of Christianity throughout the Empire and that's unrelated because it was through an action you personally don't like.

>>588161

>How many saints were active womanisers who preached murder?

You can shut your lying mouth.

>>588221

>There are vast amount of ways to do so - with communists you do so the way almost the entire western world did - prosperity, education and jailing violent agitators.

Salomon Morel, a high ranking communist and jew(what a shock) is accused of many atrocities, including revenge killings of 1,500 prisoners, is granted citizenship in Israel once the Soviet Union crumbles to avoid justice. Poland is reduced to asking politely for this guy to be returned to face trial. But if you say the holocaust didn't happen in the wrong country you get the entire brunt of the Justice system crashing down on your head. Its funny how commies, masons, jews, and anyone aligned gets the kid glove treatment, but anyone else gets to be ground into dust.

>>588228

>the stoking of the delusion of Jews/Masons/Communists plotting to exterminate,murder or exile all Romanians

Which was proved that it wasn't a delusion after all. Maybe not all Romanians but the Christians at least, they were plotting to exterminate them. Seriously read about the Pitesti experiment. Which brings up the question: Was the killings an act of self defence?

But i agree that the concept of the "national collective soul" souds wrong theologically speaking.

>>588236

See above. Can't the killings be justified as self defence? His country was in a civil war like phase anyway. I mean, murder is always a sin but the Christian can go to war if it is to protect defenceless civilians like women and children.

>>588236

I don't remember his book very well, maybe i will read it again sometime and pay more attencion to the details. But if he died without remorse you are right, he wasn't a very good Christian. But we can never be 100% sure about that.

>>588259

You said the empire was converted with military means and you brought the battle of Milvian bridge as an exaple. The battle was between the two emperors and it had nothing to do with religious matters. Now if Constantine's vision before the battle led him to become a Christian sympathizer (obviously) is a competely different matter.

>>588228

>excessive focus on martyrdom

No, what most Christians have today is insufficient will to be martyrs for Christ.

> stoking of the delusion of Jews/Masons/Communists plotting to exterminate,murder or exile all Romanians

No, not all Romanians, just the ones that won't submit.

>His own words

Don't see anything wrong with it.

>>588273

Its direct, divine intervention by God himself to bring about an outcome that lead directly to Christianity being able to freely flourish. Your splitting hairs here because military means was a huge and obvious way the empire was converted. Just because you two want ti ignore a step in the chain of events doesn't make it true.

>>588279

>Its direct, divine intervention by God himself

The vision was, the battle wasn't. I can't see why that's so hard to comprehend.

It's like saying the Pharisees converted people to Christianity because Paul also had a vision from God when he was one.

>>588280

So God tells you to do something to get a certain outcome, you do and that outcome happens, but God totally didn't have a hand in that outcome. Sure thing bud.

>>588281

Alright you win. I can't continue arguing.

>>588467

I am not into spanish singers.

>>588272

>Which was proved that it wasn't a delusion after all.

Not at all, having a terrible brainwashing camp/prison - which also targeted zionists = does not equal extermination and mass murder or Romanians (which is what actually happened to the Jews at the hands of Romanians). Not only that but it was carried out by a government that was put in power by the Soviet military after Romania had declared war on the Soviet Union and took part in the failed German invasion. See the previous picture I linked you yes its true that life in the US will be tougher for illegals and possibly non whites but that doesnt mean the words of those people are therefore accurate. Similar principle

>Which brings up the question: Was the killings an act of self defence?.. See above. Can't the killings be justified as self defence? His country was in a civil war like phase anyway. I mean, murder is always a sin but the Christian can go to war if it is to protect defenceless civilians like women and children.

I'll put this another way so you can see the logic here: Between 280,000 to 380,000 Jews died as a result of the Romanian Government over a 4 year period therefore should the persecution and killings of the Iron guard and subversions of Romania be seen morally righteous acts of self defence indeed would have genociding the Romanians be self defence given that?

Self defence is about proximity and being proportionate. Acceptable case- shooting and a mugger armed with a knife who threatens you or someone else, not acceptable case shooting a black child because he is more likley to grow up and become a mugger that might harm you.

Your claim is essentially that it was morally justifiable to massacre Jews and because roughly a decade later a regime imposed by a foreign power (which Romania invaded) led by Romanians (and which had less jews than you might expect) would persecute Romanians. This is not self defence.

>But we can never be 100% sure about that.

I agree entirely.

>>588276

>No, what most Christians have today is insufficient will to be martyrs for Christ.

My point was it was martyrdom for a country not for Christ.

>No, not all Romanians, just the ones that won't submit.

The Captain disagrees with you, it was all of them.

>If these had been victorious, would we have had at least a România led by a Romanian workers' regime? Would the Romanian workers have become masters of the country? No! The next day we would have become the slaves of the dirtiest tyranny: the Talmudic, Jewish tyranny. Greater România, after less than a second of existence, would have collapsed.

>We, the Romanian people, would have been mercilessly exterminated, killed or deported

throughout Siberia: peasants, workers,intellectuals, all pell-mell. The land from Maramureş to the Black Sea, snatched from Romanian hands, would have been colonized by Jewish masses.

>Don't see anything wrong with it.

It introduces teachings that are unbiblical nor found in the teachings of the Church Fathers which gives nationalism a divine mandate and national identity a place in salvation

>>588439

Found the LARPer

>>588439

>>Being a jew or a mason doesnt automatically justify their murder.

Implying it does

>>586380

>>586399

First of all, let me give my explanation for saying that Fascism is against Christianity:

1. Fascism is based on might-makes-right morality. Christianity is based on God's morality. This is the first and foremost difference between them. Take, for example, Nietzsche, whose satanic writings are one of the primary influences on the Fascist ideology. /pol/ and other ACTUAL fascists often criticize Christianity (this should already be a warning sign) using Nietzsche's criticism that Christianity is "slave morality" which means helping the sick, the weak, the poor, etc. Under Fascist morality the sick should die of their illness, the poor should get rich or starve on the streets, etc, because the race needs to be glorified and reach its destiny and that can only happen through natural selection and social Darwinism, you have to let the lesser peoples starve and die first. This is what they actually believe. See also, "Might is Right" by Ragnar Redbeard

2. Fascism is opposed to Monarchy. Monarchy is supported by the Bible and by the Church Fathers. 1 Peter 2:13, 1 Peter 2:17, Romans 13:1-2, Matthew 22:21, Matthew 17:24–27, etc. See also, Politics Drawn from Sacred Scripture by Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet (for a Catholic perspective), also the writings of the Church Fathers (for an Orthodox or Catholic perspective)

3. Fascism is historically anti-Christian. Before the Second Grand War there were barely any pagan at all in Germany. However as soon as the Fascists came rolling around they became a prominent force. The Bible was banned from printing, Mein Kampf replaced it. Christianity was highly repressed, "positive christianity", atheism, and paganism replaced it. Etc. Now modern Fascist movements in the Balkans, Greece, and other countries are saying that Christianity is incompatible with their respective ethnicities and they need to revert to the "religion of our/their ancestors" HMMM FANCY THAT

>>588186

>Clerical fascism is a thing, you know?

Yeah and guess what? "Christian" socialism exists, doesn't mean it's not heresy.

>Beyond that, monarchy is the only officially sanctioned system in the current year by God

What do you mean by "only other"? Where is Fascism sanctioned in the Bible?

>Fascism has at least one thing going for it - it's not democracy nor communism.

Fascism is literally just a right wing version of Communism, they're both run by a one-party state. Note I'm not saying horseshoe theory but still. You have to be blind purposefully to not notice the similarities.

>>588777

>1. Fascism is based on might-makes-right morality

Where is the evidence?

>2. Fascism is opposed to Monarchy.

Completely illogical.

>3. Fascism is historically anti-Christian.

No.

Fascism can function pretty well under Christian rule. In it's barest essence it is tribalism maximized.

>>588781

>Where is the evidence?

Did you not read my post? Have you even read the prominent Fascist thinkers or are you meming? If you honestly don't think that might-makes-right is an essential part of Fascism then you are just stupid. But let's just write it here and now so that everyone else in this thread can see how wrong you are. Now, going back to Friedrich Nietzsche, whose main writing was supporting the might-makes-right morality, is not only frequently cited by fascists, but is without a doubt a prelude to the fascists and laid the ideological basis of fascism. In 1932, Nietzsche's sister, Elisabeth Forster-Nietzsche, received a bouquet of roses from Adolf Hitler during a German premiere of Benito Mussolini's 100 Days, and in 1934 Hitler personally presented her with a wreath for Nietzsche's grave carrying the words "To A Great Fighter". Also in 1934, Elisabeth gave to Hitler Nietzsche's favorite walking stick, and Hitler was photographed gazing into the eyes of a white marble bust of Nietzsche. Heinrich Hoffmann's popular biography Hitler as Nobody Knows Him featured this photo with the caption reading: "The Führer before the bust of the German philosopher whose ideas have fertilized two great popular movements: the national socialist of Germany and the fascist of Italy."

Furthermore, Nietzsche was extremely well-received in many intellectual Nazi circles. Nietzsche was mandatory reading in all the German universities and it was taught that his writings were a "hitler prophecy". I could point to similar examples in other Fascist movements but this is basically it. This is why Fascist were so welcomingly jingoistic, so willing to commit political assassinations, etc. If you cannot see this in the eugenics programs and race worship and every other part of the Fascist ideology then you are certainly blind.

>Completely illogical.

Name a Fascist movement that supported the monarchy. You can't! They're two different types of government, stupid! You can't have absolute monarchy and fascism at once! But Fascism is also ideologically opposed to Monarchism. Mussolini was a huge critic of the monarchy, as was Hitler, and basically every other charismatic leader. So was the namesake of this thread. He claimed to support the Monarchy but actions speak louder than words, he was actually arrested for High Treason against the King of Romania. This also goes for the Fascists in the Netherlands, who hated the monarchy because they didn't do enough to advance the race. Once again I could go into more detail and provide more examples and I will if you really want but the readers get the point.

>No.

Not even an argument? How about you respond to what I said? How about you respond to how /pol/ hates Christianity, how literally every major Christian church condemns modern fascist movements, how many modern fascist movements condemn Christianity, and everything else I previously said?

>In it's barest essence it is tribalism maximized.

That's not compatible with Christianity. Christianity condemns petty tribalism and if you can't see that, once again you're blind.

>>588757

I'll have you know the jews pushed for communism in Romania and during communism jews had been doing well. I know that because my grandfather lived to see that. I don't know where you get your souces.

Why would you even consider saying that during communism jews suffered?

Have you even heard of the book: 200 years together?

I see some chriatians here are actually ok with zionist jews and masons too. What's up with that?

>inb4 christanon, are you promoting murder?

No i am not but stop being apologetic for jews/masons/commies. Fascists had their part in killing another human too but the argument ends there. Killing is bad but zionist jews, masons and communists are bad and today.

>>588844

>I'll have you know the jews pushed for communism in Romania and during communism jews had been doing well

I didnt say they did not, hence why I made the distinction between jews and zionists.

>Why would you even consider saying that during communism jews suffered?

Because some of them did, the greater suffering of one group does not erase the suffering of another. Hence why even though Jews suffered so greatly during the war period I would say its deeply wrong to ignore the suffering of other peoples during and in the aftermath.

>Have you even heard of the book: 200 years together?

I have. are you familiar with the The Culture of Critique series by Macdonald?

>I see some chriatians here are actually ok with zionist jews and masons too. What's up with that?

With Jews or its a question of doctrine and church policy, although I cant recall the theology of it from the top of my head. I do know that the Catholic Church has changed its views on Jews over time even if does not go to the extreemes that Mormons and some evangelicals do.

As for Masons, part of it is because not all countries have the same history of Masonic anti clericalism and liberalism. For instance Masons played a very different role in places like Mexico and Italy and Brazil compared to Canada and Germany and Australia.

Likewise masons lost a lot of their secrecy and power and were superseded by other groups leaving most masonic groups as LARPers for working class men.

>No i am not but stop being apologetic for jews/masons/commies.

I would say the same about you and mass murder/genocide. One can understand the Jewish Question and the dangers of globalists (both socialist and """progressive""") without having to justify or tacitly accept unchristian methods used against them.

One of the hardest parts of dealing with these matters is not giving into hatred or the "ends justify the means" mentality

>>588853

>I would say the same about you and mass murder/genocide.

I just said i am not for murder or genocide. I am pointing out the fact that jews have suffered shit during communism. The only regime that tortured and killed the jewish community is the fascist one. Where do you get the idea that jews suffered during communism in Romania, or any other country?

>As for Masons, part of it is because not all countries have the same history of Masonic anti clericalism and liberalism. For instance Masons played a very different role in places like Mexico and Italy and Brazil compared to Canada and Germany and Australia.

>Likewise masons lost a lot of their secrecy and power and were superseded by other groups leaving most masonic groups as LARPers for working class men.

You're now defending the teachings of the kabbalah and jewish mysticism. Masonry was from the begining a antichristian. It promoted Hiram Abif from the Bible along with egyptian mystery schools.

Be honest. U like zionists, commies and masons, don't you?

>>588872

>I just said i am not for murder or genocide.

Just as I am not for Zionists, masons and communists.

>Where do you get the idea that jews suffered during communism in Romania, or any other country?

>The Pitești Prison (Romanian: Închisoarea Pitești) was a penal facility in Pitești, Romania, best remembered for the reeducation experiments (also known as Experimentul Pitești – the "Pitești Experiment" or Fenomenul Pitești – the "Pitești Phenomenon") carried out between December 1949 and September 1951, during Communist party rule. The experiment, implemented by a group of prisoners under the guidance of the prison administration, was designed as an attempt at violently "reeducating" the mostly young political prisoners, primarily supporters of the ultra-nationalist Iron Guard, as well as former members of the National Peasants' and National Liberal parties or Zionist members of the Romanian Jewish community.[1]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pite%C8%99ti_Prison

In the Soviet Union you had simmilar cases combined with the destruction of Synagogues and the Purging of the Jewish Section of the Communist Party

>You're now defending the teachings of the kabbalah and jewish mysticism. Masonry was from the begining a antichristian. It promoted Hiram Abif from the Bible along with egyptian mystery schools.

Where do you see me defending Masonry? You asked me why some Christians are ok with that group and I gave you an explanation why. If I explain why the Germany invaded the Soviet Union does that mean Im defending Nazism?

>Be honest. U like zionists, commies and masons, don't you?

See >>588221 you can deal with the Jewish Problem and Masons + Commies without breaching Christian principles. I dont see why this flusters you so much.

You say you are not for murder or genocide yet when I condemn that behavior you accuse me of being a shill for Zionists and Masons and like communism.

>>588759

>My point was it was martyrdom for a country not for Christ.

No, for their people and their salvation.

>The Captain disagrees with you, it was all of them.

You misunderstood what I meant. That will be done to those who won't submit. Those others will do it by their own hand.

>It introduces teachings that are unbiblical nor found in the teachings of the Church Fathers which gives nationalism a divine mandate and national identity a place in salvation

Matthew 25:31-33

Matthew 28:19-20

A nation isn't just some boarder on a map, it is its people. Saying a people have an obligation to the current, and future salvation isn't anything new, for Christ will ask each Leader of men to account for each soul under their command.

What you seem to have a problem with is that he doesn't have a 21st century radical individualistic perspective on salvation where no one is truly connected to anyone.

>>588931

Fascism is preoccupied by the clothing (namely the forms of state organization), National-Socialism by the body (namely the racial eugenics), whereas Legionarism is preoccupied by something much deeper: by the soul (namely by its strengthening through the cultivation of Christian virtues and its preparation with final salvation in mind, salvation dealt with by the Christian Church in the most perfect fashion).

-Codreanu

>>588796

Why are you talking about fascism and national socialism as if they're the same thing.

>Not even an argument? How about you respond to what I said? How about you respond to how /pol/ hates Christianity

You're the one who needs to provide evidence for any of your claims.

>Christianity condemns petty tribalism and if you can't see that, once again you're blind.

Are we reading the same Bible?

>>588903

>See >>588221 you can deal with the Jewish Problem and Masons + Commies without breaching Christian principles. I dont see why this flusters you so much.

I saw your arguments but in no way will they work nowdays.

Is the answer to these problems "the final solution"? Of course not.

My beef with the new world order is that it cannot be stopped. It's too big of a mess and many people are bluepilled. You give your opinion on ways it can be stopped. Wrong.

The only way to get rid of these parasites is through violence. Since violence is NOT the Christian way, here we are today only capable of pointing things out and talking about them. I do understand why many Christians fall for the deceptions of this world, that is why i see no purpose in defending (or explaining) why zionist jews/ masons/ commies do the things they do.

The " purge" of the jewish community was short lived and had little effect. At least for Romania. You see, it's kind of hard to torture jews in a country where there are little to no jews left due to the nazi rule.

>t.Pitesti experiment

I'll look into its details but i can tell you that jews in Romania during communism didn't have much to deal with. Some would even go as far as to say they flourished during Ceausescu's rule.

>inb4 Source?

Romanians who lived during communism.

>>588918

>No, for their people and their salvation.

How does murdering government officials and policemen lead to salvation?

>You misunderstood what I meant. That will be done to those who won't submit. Those others will do it by their own hand.

How do you get that from that quote? He is literally talking about the Romanian people being murdered and exiled so that the Jews could colonise Romania and make it into a Jewish country hence the next line

"Here it is that they would have built up their true Palestine. "

>Saying a people have an obligation to the current, and future salvation isn't anything new,

They do as people not as Romanians, Italians or Greeks.

>What you seem to have a problem with is that he doesn't have a 21st century radical individualistic perspective on salvation where no one is truly connected to anyone.

Its not a 21st Century view believe that national identity plays no positive role in salvation, indeed in the case of the Jews was a great barrier to it.

>>589140

>How does murdering government officials and policemen lead to salvation?

By protecting innocent people from corrupt officials in league with enemies with the direct goal to destroy Christianity? What next, you going to try to make me feel bad that Franco had to kill a bunch of commie shits during the Spanish civil war?

>How do you get that from that quote?

By reading more then just a few quotes by the man. Here's another if you want.

“Anyone wishing to conquer a people could do it by using this system: Breaking its ties with heaven and land, introducing fratricidal quarrels and fights, promoting immorality and licentiousness, by material ruin, physical poisoning, drunkenness. All these destroy a nation more than being blasted by thousands of cannon or bombed by thousands of airplanes."

He knew very well that they didn't have to outright exterminate,murder or exile all Romanians when they can set about promoting their poison making them do most of the work for them.

>They do as people not as Romanians, Italians or Greeks.

Nowhere in the bible does it say to turn all nations into rootless grey masses.

>Its not a 21st Century view believe that national identity plays no positive role in salvation

Then neither can a family or larger community play a role either. Like I said, 21st century radical individualism.

>>588439

>filename

Get through the entirety of this or wallow in your ignorance

https://imgur.com/gallery/725A7

>>589213

>Believe in the holocaust

>wallow in your ignorance

Fixed it, you had it in the wrong order.

>this entire thread

>not one ChristCom anon

alone again, naturally

Seriously though, this belongs in its designated sticky

>>589218

>ChristCom

?

>>589232

So you're a commie dipshit. Got it.

>>589232

/christian/ is a NAZBOL, not CHRISTCOM, board.

>>589243

>CHISTCOM

>has Jesus, our Lord and Savior

>you get to keep your toothbrush

<NAZBOL

<distorted memes

<mandatory redistribution of toothbrushes

<no salvation

Choose wisely, brother.

>>589208

>Then neither can a family or larger community play a role either. Like I said, 21st century radical individualism.

>If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple.

>>589208

>By protecting innocent people from corrupt officials in league with enemies with the direct goal to destroy Christianity?

Aside from not allowing his movement what evidence is there of the police prefects goal being the direct destruction of Christianity.

>By reading more then just a few quotes by the man. Here's another if you want.

Thats talking about the method of conquering, the quote I posted was about the goal of that conquest - namley the idea of the Jews establishing their "true Palestine"

>Nowhere in the bible does it say to turn all nations into rootless grey masses.

I did not say that it did only that it hasnt any bearing on your salvation.

>Then neither can a family or larger community play a role either. Like I said, 21st century radical individualism.

Just plain 1st century radicalism see Matthew 10:35-7 and Luke 12:53

>>589273

>>589276

>Just plain 1st century radicalism see Matthew 10:35-7 and Luke 12:53

Wow, that doesn't refute literally anything I, or codreanu said. No where does Codreanu state that family or nation goes before God. Its literly the opposite. If you use that verse in the manner then it goes against a literal Commandment. It doesn't mean you have no obligation to your family. Its kinda mind boggling that I have to point out the obligation to family is part of Christ teachings.

>Aside from not allowing his movement what evidence is there of the police prefects goal being the direct destruction of Christianity.

>in league with enemies

How about you come back with some reading comprehension.

>I did not say that it did only that it hasnt any bearing on your salvation.

So someone could, in good conscience in your opinion, turn all nations into rootless grey masses. If Christ didn't seem the need for it then I don't see why I need to follow your thinking on it.

>Thats talking about the method of conquering, the quote I posted was about the goal of that conques

And? You were asking about method and how it fit into what I said.

>namley the idea of the Jews establishing their "true Palestine"

Thats their goal for the entire world.

>>586460

That doesn't make any sense. What about free-will? They chose to become rulers, and to act as they did.

>>587591

Prayer can only be granted through action, if able, you should push for your prayers in all ways that you're able.

>>589301

>Wow, that doesn't refute literally anything I, or codreanu said

The point was showing the personal nature of salvation and how that takes precedence over the nation and yes even the family. You honor your parents but not to the extent of disobeying God.

>How about you come back with some reading comprehension.

Because the only evidence you have shown of the murdered Prefect being "in league" with a group whose goal is the "destruction of Christianity" is his opposition to the Iron Guard.

>So someone could, in good conscience in your opinion, turn all nations into rootless grey masses.

What has this got to do with the point of nations not having a bearing on salvation?

>If Christ didn't seem the need for it then I don't see why I need to follow your thinking on it.

Once again I dont see how this is connected to the question of what role nation plays in ones salvation.

>And? You were asking about method and how it fit into what I said.

Because its a different subject and its explanation incoherent

" Yes Codreanu said the Jews wanted to exterminated and exile all Romanians but what he actually meant was that they just want to control and enslave them because of this quote discussing how a group could subvert a country"

Your reasoning is the equivalent of JW's who use John 14:28 to deny the divinity of Christ

"Yes Jesus says that he and the Father are one and that he existed before Abraham but hes not claiming to be God just look at the distinction in John 14:28 "

Both are faulty.

>>588952

>I saw your arguments but in no way will they work nowdays.

How so? Heavier than air flight seemed impossible until it wasnt.

> i see no purpose in defending (or explaining) why zionist jews/ masons/ commies do the things they do.

If you dont understand the motivations of those who would destroy you you will *always* be a step behind. You will fail to understand them and fall for hysterical and fictional answers and the despair and wroth that follows.

Its like trying to grow vegetables without understanding the seasons and soil conditions. Its also why often the most brutal answer seldom the most effective - see the abject failure of the Romans to suppress christianity.

>I'll look into its details but i can tell you that jews in Romania during communism didn't have much to deal with. Some would even go as far as to say they flourished during Ceausescu's rule.

Well bear in mind that prior to the Great War (1930) there were about 730,000 Jews in Romania (with 280,000-380,000 of them were being murdered during the war) and at fall of the regime in 92 there were just under 9,000. Thats a population decrease of around 98%

Far from flourishing the vast majority of them wanted to get the hell out of there

- so much so that the regime actually used it to make money from Israel

>Ceaușescu wanted economic independence from the Soviet Union, which was content to keep Romania a backwater and as nothing more than a supplier of raw materials, but to fund economic projects, he needed hard cash. As a result, from then until the Ceaușescu regime fell in 1989, about 1,500 Jews a year were granted exit visas to Israel in exchange for a payment of cash for every Jew allowed to leave, in addition to other Israeli aid. The exact payments were determined by the age, education, profession, employment, and family status of the emigrant. Israel paid a minimum of $2,000 per head for every emigrant, and paid prices in the range of $25,000 for doctors or scientists. In addition to these payments, Israel also secured loans for Romania and paid off the interest itself, and supplied the Romanian Army with military equipment.[63][70]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_Romania#Post-War

>Romanian government would allow 4,000 Jews a month to emigrate to Israel; this decision was at least partially influenced by a large Jewish Agency bribe to the Romanian government. This agreement applied mainly to ruined businessmen and other economically "redundant" Jews. Around this time, Israel also secured another agreement with the Romanian government, under which Romania issued 100,000 exit visas for Jews and Israel supplied Romania with oil drills and pipes to aid the struggling Romanian oil industry.[6] By December 1951, about 115,000 Romanian Jews had emigrated to Israel.[7]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romanian_Jews_in_Israel

>>589243

>>589248

JOHN THE BAPTIST WAS ANARCHO-BAPTIST

POSTED BY ANARCHO-BAPTIST GANG

>>589329

>How so? Heavier than air flight seemed impossible until it wasnt.

As far as i am concerned, all actual practicing Christians don't listen to lady gaga. Does that change her popularity?

No.

Just because practicing Christians don't support modern day degeneracy, that won't mean that bad things will die out. Saying you can defeat the masons/ the zionist jews/ commies means you have't understood what the Revelation was talking about.

In short. It ends bad for Christians.

>You will fail to understand them and fall for hysterical and fictional answers and the despair and wroth that follows.

Dude. I know why they do the things they do. I know how things work. This thread was about Codreanu and his movement. It was good in the sense that it promoted Romanian culture and orthodoxy. It was a movement dedicated to resist the red threat. The things they did were the ways in which the dealt problems during those days. It wasn't a Christian thing to do and the movement was destroyed.

Nowdays, the jews, masons and commies have become so strong that it is silly to even consider fronting them.

If u say there is hope and there are things that can be done in order to make things better and to kick degeneracy out of a country, that will be most hilarious.

Say everybody in a country decides to kick out the zionist/talmudic jews (many of them), that country will be labeled antisemitic and therefore economic sanctions will be installed.

If a country kicks out its masons, then economy and politics will be affected.

News flash these are the end times. Deny this. I dare u.

>>588853

>One of the hardest parts of dealing with these matters is not giving into hatred or the "ends justify the means" mentality

true

>>589320

>he point was showing the personal nature of salvation and how that takes precedence over the nation and yes even the family.

Again, that doesn't refute literally anything I, or codreanu said.

>You honor your parents but not to the extent of disobeying God.

Its not just honoring, not just your parents, and the obligation isn't just material but spiritual as well.

Ephesians 5:23-29

1 Timothy 5:3-5

Matthew 15:1-9

Ephesians 6:4

Proverbs 22:6

I get you want to take a individual approach on life and salvation but it doesn't pan out the way you want it to go.

> his opposition to the Iron Guard.

You mean his violent crackdown. How about Codreanu was never convicted because people not even in the same city knew that they were corrupt.

>What has this got to do with the point of nations not having a bearing on salvation?

Because it does. Christ says to go and make disciples of all nations, and each nation will come before the Lord at the end. Just because you have a microscopic view of life and salvation doesn't mean the rest of us do. All you can do is to misrepresent and say we are elevating it higher then we do.

>Because its a different subject and its explanation incoherent

Not realy, maybe you just can't follow.

>>586338

>He was fighting for justice but he was also a murderer.

So was Moses.

>>589484

Anarchist christianity has to be the single most retarded oxymoron i have ever heard and i am honestly disturbed by the stupidity of your post

>>589435

Also King Solomon had 1000 wifes but Christ gave us a New Testament you now.