/christian/ - Christian Discussion and Fellowship

>>578938

I think people should only be in prison for violent* offenses and the death penalty should be permanently abolished.

*"Violent" includes armed offenses, even if the weapon isn't actually used.

>>578938

human laws are ridiculous

Can you imagine that the punishment for the fact, that you grow a weed, is the same murder, as punishment?

>Addiction is treatable without throwing people behind bars

You are naive and stupid.

Also, separate by race.

>>578963

>imprisoning someone for addiction

Do you include yourself and your addiction to 8chan?

It's because American government has become so corrupt with bribery. There are for-profit prisons that pay politicans to institute criminal policies that lead to mass incarceration–which makes the prisons more profitable, to pay the politicans more, to make stronger laws, and around and around it goes.

>>578963

Well, my sister was addicted to opiates for 2 years, and by taking methadone for a few months, she was able to kick her addiction and has now been sober for 5 years.

Use of drugs should be legal (at least in their natural form - purifying them in to stronger chemical forms is arguably pharmakeia/sorcery). Rape, kidnapping and murder should be punished with the death penalty. Theft should be punished by the thief repaying his victim through labor (slavery). Prisons are unbiblical. Only pagan nations had dungeons in the Bible.

>>578968

Private for-profit prisons make up only 8% of the US's incarceration facilities. The two biggest problems the US has when it comes to prison are the war on drugs and the war on poverty. You can put someone in prison for the recreational use of certain drugs for up to 20 years. Likewise, you can throw someone in prison for being unable to pay a court ordered debt under the guise of "contempt of court".

>>578975

If you want to keep it Biblical, then you have to put witches to death too.

First of all, death sentence for rape, murder, and kidnapping in all cases.

Second of all, replace all other crimes with extremely large fines. The fine would have to be much larger than any economic gain the crime would have, for example if I steal a car I have to not only give it back to the owner but pay 2 or 3 times the value of the car as a fine. If they can't pay back the fines then just turn them into serfs or something.

>>578987

If the father of a child takes his kid away from the mother when she has legal custody, does he deserve to die?

>>578987

>killing someone when they haven't killed anyone

No.

>>578995

Fathers should have full custody over their wives, never mind their children.

>>578995

Mothers don't get custody. If a divorce happens, such as in the case of adultery (as our Lord says), then we follow the Napoleonic tradition and all of the wife's belongings are transferred to the husband as well.

>>579004

Rape in many cases can be worse than death, as many rape victims have said before.

>>579009

What if the man commits adultery or is abusive? Yeesh, man, even Islam has 100% equal divorce. What kind of caveman shit are you pushing here?

>worse than death

So, you want to kill someone over feels? No.

>>579018

>What if the man commits adultery or is abusive

He should be put to death, as per the Bible.

>What kind of caveman shit are you pushing here?

OK lefty, you clearly haven't studied Christian history because this has been the method for most of time.

>>579022

You want to kill people who hurt feels and I'm the lefty?

>>579022

>this has been the method for most of time

Only in Christian societies. Also, people for most of human history have shit in holes and wiped with leaves. You better not have a toilet, heretic.

>>579028

>You want to kill people who hurt feels

Huh? Is this how you undermine the severity of adultery and spousal abuse? Do you not know the punishments that God prescribed for such things?

>>579030

>Only in Christian societies.

Exactly my point. It is grounded in traditional Christian jurisprudence.

>Also, people for most of human history have shit in holes and wiped with leaves. You better not have a toilet, heretic.

This is nowhere near the argument that I'm making. Nice strawman.

>>578974

Congratulations to her!

>>578938

>What does /Christian/ think about the rate of incarceration in the United States? I'm personally appalled by it.

It's the simple result of following through with fair enforcement of the criminal laws of this country. Haven't gone completely lawless yet in this country. Do blatantly stupid stuff, you will get caught. The fact there's so many stupid people shouldn't influence quality of life for the rest who do follow our laws. Maybe those people who keep breaking the laws don't belong here?

>>578938

We should be using more corporeal punishment on minor crimes (whipping, caning, the stockades, branding, removal of fingers or hands) and executing more of the violent offenders and repeat offenders.

There's no need for much prison space as opposed to jails for those awaiting trials whatsoever, aside from political prisoners and the like.

I hate that you fell for the meme. Nobody statistically speaking is in prison for mere possession, they're in prison for the crimes that they didn't get charged for but possession is the nominal reason. Fact, 99% of all criminal cases get pleaded out and D'arquarious and Treonte are in prison for simple possession because of a deal that dropped the gun charges or the theft charges or the distribution charges etc. in return for not wasting the court's time.

FWIW I have no problem being very light with first offenders, for all crimes, provided that we can have them permanently removed from society, via execution, before they become fourth offenders. I'll let the bleeding hearts have a chance at rehabilitation, maybe even two chances, but not more than that.

>>579058

Do you really believe someone who smokes marijuana degrades the quality of life? I know plenty of people who smoke marijuana, work their jobs and are not negatively impacting society beyond being sinners like everybody.

>>579067

I have Bipolar with psychosis, and one time I kicked down the front door to a house that I believed was mine and started to take a bath. I am now on the proper medication and doing well. You think that I should get a finger cut off because of something I did while psychotic?

Also

>The courts drop gun charges and only convict on possession of drugs

Are you kidding me? The courts will take their time to prosecute you on the more serious charges, I promise you.

>>579079

>Do you really believe someone who smokes marijuana degrades the quality of life?

In a manner in which they get found out and caught, such as out driving, at work, selling to others, holding parties and so forth, yes. Yes they do degrade.

>>579085

>driving

Sure, that should be punishable with a DUI if they are driving high. If they're not high and are bringing it somewhere, I don't see the issue.

>at work

Sure, but the punishment should be getting fired, depending on what they do

>selling to others

So what? Everybody's gotta buy it somewhere, be it a dealer or a dispensary

>holding parties

You don't get invited to parties, do you?

>>579096

>>579079

Smoking marijuana is condemned in the Bible. It's called pharmakeia.

>>579097

Wait how they get a weed from the Mexican cloud forests over to Jerusalem

>>579099

The greek word pharmakeia means drug-taking. This is where we get the word pharmacy and other pharmaceutical words in the English language from. It is condemned in Galatians 5:20 as sinful. Now, you might say, but what for legitimate medical purposes? Obviously we cannot condemn the use of any substance for legitimate medical reasons. But people who smoke marijuana recreationally have no other reason but to get "high". Actually, though, marijuana is a depressant. So is alcohol, for example (in case you didn't know). The people who smoke marijuana recreationally have no other reason but a blatant indulgence in the passions. It's "fun" or it "makes you feel happy" as people have told me. But that is the only purpose. It makes you feel good, makes your problems go away, etc. If one cannot justify the indulgence in the passions through ways like masturbating and getting drunk, there is no way one can possibly justify indulgence in the passions through smoking marijuana.

>>579101

Well, yes, scripture condemns drunkenness but God also gives wine to make the heart glad. I think, like many things, it's the intent and fruits that matter.

>>579103

I might drink wine because I like the taste. I may have drank vodka if I lived in medieval Russia because it was the easiest drink to preserve at the time. But for what purpose, outside of medical or recreational, would one smoke marijuana?

>>579096

>If they're not high and are bringing it somewhere, I don't see the issue.

No issue with spreading the behavior to others? I see.

>Sure, but the punishment should be getting fired, depending on what they do

Not only that, but it negatively affects everyone else. It compromises both character and best practices in any conceivable job. Whether it's a judge or a janitor, why should everyone else be forced to tolerate other people's impairment on the job and the resulting negligence? So yes, that's why I not only have no issue with the laws as they stand, I appreciate them in a way. And it's not civilized either, so why should they be treated any better than what they are?

>Everybody's gotta buy it somewhere

That's the question, and the answer here is that the sellers are all morally bankrupt and turning a profit from the misfortune of others. Send them all to prison please, I don't care how many times it has to be done. This is just common sense.

>>578938

its disgusting because the vast majority of criminals and gangsters and drug dealers are non white, usually of african/latino origin, think about that

>>579105

wine taste is an experience you enjoy having

some enjoy the relaxation experience that marijuana provides

>>579140

>some enjoy the relaxation experience that marijuana provides

Yes, just as some people enjoy the experience that drinking in excess provides. But the Bible warns against addiction and drugs, just as it does against drunkenness.

>>579097

My understanding is that purifying plants into powerful pharmaceutical drugs is pharmakeia. Drinking a coca leaf tea is pretty harmless, snorting pure cocaine or smoking crack, not so much. Of course anything can be a problem if abused. The drug effects of alcohol 'making the heart glad' are praised but abusing it is warned against as it will lead you astray and make a mockery of you. Same applies to other drugs. Use a little cmon sense.

>>579022

You're forgetting that Jesus saved a woman who was guilty of adultery.

>>579105

Vodka didn't exist in medieval russia, as vodka is made from potatoes which come from the new world

>>578979

>Likewise, you can throw someone in prison for being unable to pay a court ordered debt under the guise of "contempt of court".

Not true, debtors prison has been abolished. If you physically cannot pay, the judge must order something else. However, when sentences are discretionary between fine/ jail time, they can choose jail over fine but usually it says one or both, so they could've imposed both anyway.

>>579351

>debtors prison has been abolished

De facto, yes, but you can still be held in contempt of court for disobeying a court order. Just look at any man who becomes incapable of paying court ordered child support or alimony.

>>579228

Not all vodka is made from potatoes.

http://www.ginvodka.org/history/vodkaHistory.asp