/v/ - Video Games

They're simplified to the point where anyone can solve them so that the game has a goodfeel to it. If you get stuck or frustrated? You might stop playing, that's as badfeel. No good.

Also, devs are cucks and want their very difficult hard work to be seen by everyone, so all content must be available at all times.

9 times out of 10 puzzles are just braindead busywork used to pad out the game. They'd be more welcome if they were more dynamic, ie instead of pushing a block into an obvious crevice maybe have multiple solutions with tools that are also used in combat or exploration. As is, they're so far removed from the rest of the game you can tell they were tacked on after the fact.

>>16645168

>And when they do have puzzles, they're so braindead easy you have to question why they were there in the first place.

If used properly, even simple puzzles can be effective at throttling the pacing of a game. Quiet time is important between high action scenes in many titles, and a simple puzzle gives you some quiet time while still keeping you engaged in a title.

>>16645168

La Mulana series is for you.

>>16651406

That's not as bad as a block pushing "puzzle" because at least if you know the answer it takes like 2 seconds to do it while pushing a block takes the same, long, drawn out amount of time even if the solution is obvious, which it almost always is.

In my opinion I'm never a fan of puzzles unless it's a puzzle game. Because otherwise it just feels like the game stopping dead in it's tracks for something I'm not enjoying and isn't the point of the game.

Post SpaceJin smut.

Puzzle in other genres is a waste of time.

WAIT A MINUTE THAT CARD

>>16651442

Really most so called puzzle games could be more accurately described as nonviolent action. Tetris for example is less about solving anything and more pure reflex and planning.

The Jindosh riddle in in Dishonored 2 was an interesting diversion from the typical gameplay. The puzzle is very complicated, but if you solve it you can skip the entire level. It also has a pretty good lore reason for being in the game.

>>16645168

Most puzzles you find in a video game is figuring out what the devs intend for you to do, instead of any actual logic. So you end up solving pretty much everything by psychoanalyzing the devs intentions from the level design and not any deductive reasoning for puzzle itself. This makes the puzzles so easy they don't even feel like puzzles.

Dedicated puzzle games and edutainment bucks this downside but whether or not they're fun is a different matter.

>>16645168

They shouldn't be in games without good reason because you can never be sure what logic system the devs were working from, and therefore can never be sure what an answer is without being told, it being obvious, or just trial and error until it works. Puzzles need to be done well, so I say probably a mix of retarded devs and audience are to blame for having none of them in modern gaymes.

I have real bad tunnel vision a lot of the time when puzzles show up. The obvious solution is right there but I overlook it and spend a long time trying to figure it out. Puzzles have to belong in the game/mission they are a part of.

>>16651587

Dishonored 2 had some cool stuff honestly. The clockwork mansion, the time travel level.

>>16651965

>you're in some kind of spooky haunted japanese schoolhouse

>the developers want you to discover 16 keys to unlock the door to the shadow realm

>you then have to collect the Yu-Gi-Oh cards of Shuktukelingchong and banish the spirits to the third level shadow realm, but curse yourself into dying twelve years earlier than expected

>only then does the door unlock and you leave safely

What would actually happen:

>where the fuck am I?

>fuck this nigger shit

>bust out a window

>bail

I despise contrived ways to put a puzzle or series of puzzles in your way. Mysterious mechanisms that you have to solve and puzzle through to open some ancient vault and get rad loot? Fine and dandy. Having to complete a puzzle to get into a fucking toilet, when there's a hole in the wall that leads to the same place, but your character arbitrarily won't go through it? Get fucked.

>>16645168

They're gone because playtesters are dumb putos.

I want Talos Principle tier puzzles in 3rd person action games.

>>16645168

>but that can apply to most things in games that can be achieved without pure skill

All of those are fading away too - no more hidden secrets, easter eggs or cheat codes

>Like the bells puzzle in Bioshock (I believe it was Infinite)

Memes aside, do people honestly think that bit was supposed to be a puzzle?

>>16652284

It was a stupid segment regardless. It being a cutscene would’ve been less embarrassing, it was just asking the player to put the square peg in the square hole. There was no reason for it to exist.

puzzles are, much like water levels, a desperate attempt at give your gameplay variety when you don't know what else to add. I think demon souls is one of the only games that did puzzles in a non.puzzle game properly.

>>16652138

That kind of "puzzle" is the kind of thing to expect from games like Sierra adventure games. Those puzzle types are even worse than what I describe. Since by design the only way to know is to have played the game beforehand and savescumming. What I describe is essentially figuring out the level designers habits and that way you automatically know the solution to the puzzle, finding 90% of hidden stuff because instead of the hint given it is because the guy making the levels always has such habits as petting a nook on the third jump or always making the left path a dead end unless he feels its important.

>>16652284

>do people honestly think that bit was supposed to be a puzzle?

What else was it supposed to be? There's no reason for it to exist, other than the devs wanting to make stupid players feel smart for using very basic logical deduction.

>>16653392

Or that time Dishonored playtesters didn't know what to do because the guard npcs told them they could not go upstairs. You have to cater to a special breed of braindead players.

>>16653412

>>16653392

Companies intentionally grab the dumbest testers they can as an excuse to both make the game as entry level as possible and to do less work. Getting sick of the guy on the team overarchieving and clogging up your asset workload? Get your retarded cousin to come in and playtest the game and let your boss know that all that actually innovative shit that Jim came up with needs to be cut or we can't meet the deadline.

Puzzles were padding for the game so your combat section wasn't too repetitive, but most devs understand that someone who plays video games will have a collection of things they enjoy doing, so if they want to have a shootan they will go over and get out the shootan, and then if they want some stylish action they go over to whichever game that may be for them.

Post the one from Skyrim.

>>16656999

The goal of game development hasn't been to make a better game for the better part of 2 decades now.

Interesting unique puzzles are difficult to create, so I think both the devs and the players are retarded/lazy. Even puzzle games like Virtue's Last Reward has an iceblock puzzle.

A fun type of "puzzle" is one where you pick up cues in the environment or through found notes that don't explicitly state anything, but hint at possible actions. La Mulana would be a good example. Whenever I realize a game is doing this it makes me put that much more interest and attention into what I'm doing instead of playing with my brain turned off and the tv in the background. I wish I knew more games that did this.