/v/ - Video Games

As long as ichimonji double still isn't the only usable combat art it's a good patch.

>I wonder if this means that they didn't intend for nothin' but parrying to be the only way to play the game?

People who complain about this never played Onimusha. At least in Sekiro it's more efficient to attack inbetween parry rape, and you get jumping stabbing and throwing mixups. Also dodging with leaping kicks if you want to add some Smokin' Sick Style. I do wish more arts didn't cost any Emblems, however. I probably won't bother to patch because I'm near the end of NG++ no charm, DLC wru?

Not long after I finished with the game as well. I see no reason to back because of small adjustments. I'll wait for DLC or the GOTY edition before going back.

I don't know it seems like until they make shit cost no emblems, "simon says" is the only real way to play the game. You just can't sustain the way you'd have to in order to make tools beyond "situational". These small fixes aren't going to fix the awful core combat

People have trouble with the Blazing Bull? I learned after 2 attempts to not use lock on and to relentlessly attack its ass until it was dead. It’s easy once your brain turns on. I like that they are buffing the Sabimaru. I’ve tried it on a lot of different enemies and so many seemed to have high poison resistance. I mostly use the upgraded flame vent against just about every tough enemy. Once they get burn status you get a bunch free hits in until they try to attack again.

Is it just me or is monkey see, monkey 2 a lot easier than the original monkey fight?

>>16393438

Yeah I had a much easier time with it and beat it on my second try. It makes sense that is easier since the headless ape has the same moveset as before, so you already know what to do.

Why do they have to make it harder? it's a fucking single player game.

Add more content. Fuck "balancing"

>>16393452

You also have the purple umbrella and you aren't wore down from his first phase which is basically bloodletting beast on a pcp/cocaine/meth cocktail.

>>16393499

I don't think they're making it harder. I think they're trying to convince players to use the other 80% of content instead of just one or two tools or special moves.

>>16393560

>trying to convince

It's more like force if certain tactics won't work any more.

>>16393322

>I don't know it seems like until they make shit cost no emblems

if they just made tools cost stamina instead of emblems, they wouldn't be bumfuck retarded

>>16392568

i hope the dlc is free

just like the base game haha

>>16392568

I completely agree, i can't wait to pirate the DLC

>>16394026

You should regain emblems with successful attacks or deflects or something along those lines.

>>16393322

>the awful core combat

You sure you played Sekiro?

>>16393322

<I should just be able to spam shit without cost

I don't understand why the fuck people are so stingy about their emblems

You have baseline 15 emblems per rest and with the ceremonial tanto thats another 15 on top of that by paying health

If you can't make 30 fucking emblems per rest (or more if you get the relevant skills) work for you then I don't know what your problem is.

>>16394026

>if they just made tools cost stamina instead of emblems

>stamina

stamina isn't a thing in sekiro

posture wouldn't make sense since it is literally meaningless, because even if you're posture broken you can just dodge out of being staggered before the enemy can capitalize.

making things cost posture would just be making it free with extra steps

>rebalancing a singleplayer game

I will never understand why devs do this.

Do they just not know the fun of finding game breaking bullshit?

>>16394096

Because it's fun only the first time.

I'd sure like if some of the cheese with some bosses was addressed, like how easy is to stun lock the corrupted monk

>>16394102

>because it's only fun the first time

You know, that's bullshit.

In a single player game if someone wishes to find new bullshit they replay with different loadouts, finding new game breaking bullshit is in it's own right replayability.

You can put in upwards of hundreds of hours into a game that has just the right amount of cheese into it.

The only thing you do by patching it is prevent that king of thinking.

>>16394108

Well i'm the kind of person that if i find something that works I'll always do that, so it's hard for me to not cheese something if i know it's the "best" way to deal with it, but by cheesing i'm just messing with my own enjoyment.

I like being forced to do things properly, then i can try different things until i get to the best fair way to do it.

>>16394108

Sekiro isn't a game that allows for much variation in playstyles to begin with, and the core gameplay doesn't make much of a distinction whether you cheese shit. Rebalancing things to make the OP stuff less broken would go some ways to make other tools worth using more in comparison.

The High Monk nerf was definitely necessary because if a boss uses sweeps then High Monk is often a no-brainer option because of the ridiculous posture damage it deals off sweep counters, in fact it makes the regular goomba stomp completely redundant because of the difference in posture damage dealt

You could use another combat art, but you have to do so with the knowledge that you're gimping yourself on purpose and most combat arts don't add such a significant difference in playstyles since you're allowed to have only one equipped at a time to begin with, and I don't feel like I have to design the game myself by playing with self-restrictions in order for the game to be any fun because the designers couldn't balance jack shit

Not to say I won't, but mastery of a game feels better if you know that you don't have to pretend this OP option that breaks the game doesn't exist

I'd rather they balance out Combat Arts by having using the stronger ones increase your Posture gauge, so there's some more risk attached to it

>>16394168

Sekiro is unironically better than DMCV

>>16394094

>I don't understand why the fuck people are so stingy about their emblems

You never stockpiled a stack of potions you never used because 'they might be useful later on' and ended the game with a full stack of them?

Emblems don't exactly refill on rest like your healing gourd does, you have a limited stack of them of which you can only carry around 15+, so if you use some during a boss fight and die that's a handful of emblems less to use in subsequent attempts. And if you die a lot while using emblems up a lot, it's not far-fetched to be in a situation where you have no emblems left anymore and no gold to buy them with because you died so often, meaning you gotta grind moar

Basically, why would you use limited resources like sugars and such in a game where progression is saved after death? Imagine what it'd look like if the healing gourd was a limited resource like the Pellets. If emblems actually refilled on rest like healing gourds then this wouldn't be as much of a problem

Sure, you have the tanto, but if you're stuck on a boss then expending one healing charge three times for only 5 emblems each time isn't that worth it

Then considers enemies drop emblems on death at random, so regaining emblems isn't that consistent

>>16394187

I don't think refilling emblems is a problem even at the later stages of the game where emblems get more expensive one farming run through mibu village should be enough to top you off for a couple deaths and the random emblem drops you get from all the little guys you kill are just the cherry on top, especially if you use the drop rate balloons

Taking 5 minutes to get a 100+ emblems isn't the worst grind in the world.

The tanto not being worth the charge kinda depends on the boss. If the boss is really weak to something that need emblems then using one of your gourds to get up to five extra uses of the boss' weakness is well worth it.

And even when the boss doesn't have a glaring weakness using one of your gourds or one pellet isn't a super big price to pay.

>>16394181

You shouldn't be proud of being the target of a shitpost's mockery.

>>16394094

>I don't understand why the fuck people are so stingy about their emblems

I liked the way Dark Souls handled spells, where you attune them to a slot and you get X number of casts before they're gone, and they automatically refill at bonfires. I'm not saying this game should be the same, but maybe they could've added some risk and reward to the process of using combat arts and prosthetic tools by making them cost posture. At least then you could use them more than a few times before having to grind for some more emblems.

<yeah but then people will be able to spam them

Well I just think that they should be prohibited once the player reaches the limit of their posture bar, and the abilities are on cool down until the posture bar reverts back to baseline. At least then they wouldn't be spammed infinitely, but you wouldn't have to worry about not being able to use them because they're tied to an arbitrary number of consumable trinkets.

Either that, or substantially increase the amount of emblems one can carry. I'd say double the current limit would be good, but the problem is that this is worse than the previous solution because they can be spammed for twice as long as they can now, and if they were tied to posture and given a cool down, this wouldn't be an issue.

>>16394220

I know that's shitposting, but it is actually somewhat true.

>>16394096

Because From have been bad at balancing since Demon's Souls. Granted they were all online games but even with Sekiro where PvP was not a concern they still fucked up. You could use a bunch of these tools and arts, but they're all fucking worthless next to only a handful of other tools and arts. This balancing ideally gives players more viable tools and arts. They should also raise the XP gained in NG+ as it seemed to me that I'd have to play through at least one or two more times to get all the skills purchased.

Well, some of you are having fun with this game, I see. Happy for you. I've never been a fan of Soul-style games, as I lack the hand-eye co-ordination and reaction time to learn the game proper.

>>16393322

This.

If you could use the tools as much as you want, it would make the game actually fun.

What do i care if the game is balanced and hard if I'm not even having fun with it in the first place. Besides, i had the feeling that most of them were useless anyway. The axe barely did stance damage.

The thing that pissed me off so much was when you also had to use emblems for that shitty weapon art you get later on. ffs

Friendly reminder to filter hipster and retards like >>16394373

>>16394529

The axe is great. The smash and the follow up combat skill does a lot of posture damage.

As long as they make more shit usable, as it standsthe game is the karaoke minigame from Yakuza only with health and posture bars tacked on.

>>16394102

>like how easy is to stun lock the corrupted monk

How?

>>16394688

literally just spam firecrackers

>>16394688

>>16394696

firecrackers + snap seeds + fistful of ash

>>16394705

>snap seeds

I had never thought to use snap seeds outside of Lady Butterfly

>>16394717

Really bad chart

>>16394717

Christ the soundtrack is so forgettable, it's a shame because 3 playthroughs and I can't remember a single song. I did one playthrough of DS2 and can remember at least a couple of songs. How do they fuck up so bad.

>>16394168

You shitpost, but I left DMCV on ice because I got hooked with Sekiro until I finished it twice, now I still haven't finished DMCV despite being a shorter game.

DMCV is a lot better to fuck around with combos and experiment with the combat, but Sekiro is a focused challenge with very little superfluous stuff. You don't have much to fuck around with in comparison, but it pushes you to learn the shit it does have not just to look cool but to actually win the fight. You could say that in DMCV mastering the mechanics is for looking cool, a separate additional goal to winning the fight, but in Sekiro those two goals are much closer to each other.

>>16394826

except for the looking cool part because Sekiro fights look and play very tamely.

>>16394819

One track in the Hirata Estate sticks out to me. When you reach the burning top.

>>16394717

Swap DSII and III then move them both down a tier and its accurate. Neither is very good but holy shit was III an abortion.

>>16394922

DMC's first and second playthrough are both trivially easy. By the time you hit anything remotely hard you've been eased into it so much you never really feel challenged, and I'm not 100% it ever really gets that hard at all.

DMC's gameplay, the entire series not just DMC5, is NOT designed around making challenging fights for you to fail at and eventually overcome. Hell, it even has virtually unlimited revivals (sekiro's resurrection is a strictly limited mechanic that functions like an HP increase) and/or healing items.

Simply beating a boss or other enemy is never the point. In DMC the entire point of the gameplay is the style system. You want to use fancier comboes, change up your attacks, avoid using items and avoid getting hit not because that's the best way to kill the boss, but because it's the best way to earn style points.

If you don't care about an arbitrary scoring system, and I for one absolutely HATE them, the entire DMC series is shallow as a kiddie pool. Just like you complain about with Sekiro, it boils down to using one attack over and over again because it does the most damage in the easiest opening. Unlike Sekiro though, the games don't actually try to make it difficult to do that one attack most of the time. Sekiro is balanced entirely around it's one ability and does as much as it possibly can to keep that one trick interesting and challenging.

>>16394922

But anon, you can set enemies on fire in Sekiro. That makes it better.

I honestly wish Sekiro was the Tenchu game it was originally meant to be. Its still a good game, but stealth game with good movement and combat (when it becomes mandatory) would be fun.

>>16395106

I disagree, I think it's a bad game that tries to do too many things, and has a combat system has the depth of a secondary playstyle.

>>16395080

>And Sekiro's combat becomes deeper how?

Sekiro's combat is deeper at the necessity level, DMC's combat is deeper at the score/style level.

All you can say in strictly objective terms is that Sekiro has a higher skill floor while DMC has a higher skill ceiling but a lower floor, and that DMC's incentive for reaching that ceiling is extrinsic (scoring) rather than intrinsic (being able to win at all).

>>16395080

>Right, having only R1 for combo possibilities was definitely a great idea, it's not like people complained about R1 spam and how brain dead it was in the other From games, I forget that now it's a feature!

How is DMC any different?

In Sekiro you dodge/jump/parry/etc. an attack or series of attacks, after which you can attack the boss only when allowed during a point when they don't have hyper armor (or when they do certain actions where you can deal extra damage like countering sweeps), and then retaliate with your most optimal offensive move (e.g. R1) until the boss does a breakout move with hyper armor enabled that forces you do defend again

In DMC you Royal Guard/parry/jump/sideroll/etc. an attack, after which you can attack the boss only when allowed during a point when they don't have hyper armor (or when they do certain actions where you can deal extra damage, like when Nelo Angelo in DMC1 taunts you), after which you retaliate with your most optimal offensive move. Which in the case of DMC either means a particular combination of moves with the highest DPS and/or inflicts maximum stunlocking on the boss, or a set of combos which generate the most style points while avoiding the move overuse penalty by cycling between pre-baked combos which contain different enough moves for the style meter to say you're doing a good enough of a job. Either way you'll be using that particular combo or set of combos over and over. Until the boss does a hyper armor-enabled attack which forces you to defend again.

The only difference is that Sekiro streamlined your offensive options to a single sword strike, whereas DMC may have a ton of options but in practice you're only going to be reusing the same set over and over anyways while leaving the rest to the wayside, as a good portion of your moveset is designed for group combat and not 1v1s (group combat in turn being where Sekiro falls flat).

In a 1v1 fight combos are often largely pointless (at least in a singleplayer game), as the most optimal moments for dealing damage to a boss is when they're vulnerable or recovering after doing an attack. If you consider that your primary goal is to win by depleting the boss' HP, why would you use anything other than the most DPS-efficient move? To that end, why would Sekiro even need more than a single swipe? Why would I want to use a move that doesn't deal the most DPS?

Fuck, you ever played Ys Origin or Oath in Felghana? It's got combat that's about as deep as Sekiro (one basic ground attack string, one basic aerial attack string, three magic abilities vs. seven prosthetics, and you get a very short rechargeable rage mode), but I doubt anybody here would disagree it's fucking fun in spite of offense largely coming down to mashing one attack button because the bosses themselves are all unique in how they force you to run around and dodge shit because it also incorporates elements of platforming and bullet hells instead of defense coming down solely to 'dude just press the i-frame dodge or parry button at the right time lmao', which is a cancer that ruined all Ys games past Seven. Hell, the later games gave you much more special melee attacks, but the end result was that you'd be indiscriminately spamming all SP skills because it looks like it deals more damage than normal.

If there's anything to take away from here is that Sekiro could have used more bosses which provide additional unique reasons to jump/parry/dodge/run around other than another variation on a sword swing and make the defense game more interesting to compensate for its basic bitch offense game, instead of turning Sekiro into another "look at this faggot boss being only able to attack once after which I proceed to stunlock his ass for ten seconds straight repeatedly" wannabe DMC clone.

Meanwhile games like Bayo and DMC have strong varied offense games but basic bitch defense games where avoiding attacks often come down to 'just press dodge/Royal Guard at the right time'. You can't really have DMC's style meter in every hack 'n slash, and a scoring system arbitrarily discouraging you from doing the most reasonable and optimal thing is gay as hell anyways since you know you have to hold back on the game to not break it instead of being able to go all out without having to worry about anything. You'll often get a lower rank if you kill things too fast before you're able to style good on them, which seems downright contradictory. The message would come across more clearly if discouraging spamming attacks was something that's enforced on a survival level, where it's not a matter of "if you spam the best moves over and over you'll get a gay style rank", but "if you spam the best moves over and over you'll FUCKING DIE", because the enemies could adapt to your attacks like how guards in MGSV change their get-up depending on your playstyle.

>>16395429

Oath in falghana has more depth to it's combat than sekiro does. Sekiro is like if oath in falgana only had the basic sword combo, no magic, and enemies just tried to run up and poke you.

Anyone playing Dragon's Dogma right now?

>>16394419

LMAO no.

Lacks mechanics that makes the gameplay varied.

>>16395525

Yes everyone is reddit because they don't post to your standards.

Been here since the exodus unlike 75% of the posters here.

LMAO

>>16395525

ROFL ok

>>16395792

I didn't get the issue with the final boss. I legitimately died to the Genichiro phase more, weirdly enough. As you said, the Mortal Blade would have been a nice replacement to add to that feeling, especially as Genichiro has the black blade to your red blade. But even then, the fight is Genichiro with two new moves and then suddenly you fight a different boss altogether. It wasn't really that hype fighting a memory of a great warrior who had no reason to fight you.

Should have just been Genichiro doing one last power up, becoming some kind of oni-human monster.

>>16395792

I don't understand why anyone would compare DMC and Sekiro in complexity, either. Both are good in their own regards but completely different.

>>16395873

But can you set enemies on fire in DMC?

Checkmate, capcucks

DmC2 is trash.

>>16395873

Because they both came out within two weeks of each other. DMC5 had a lot of hype and discussion and many had doubts it would be the game they wanted. Sekiro on the other hand wasn't really discussed or getting the marketing and push that DMC5 was getting.

When two action games release practically side by side, there are going to be comparisons.

>>16395908

Yeah that's more or less how I beat him the first game too. I didn't have the confidence to do a double parry yet, it wasn't until spending an hour or two on Genichiro that I really got the hang of parrying multiple attacks at all. None of the extra jumps or skills though, just dodge left, attack, space, repeat.

>>16395226

Well said. DMC's skill floor is abysmal and the game lacks sufficient reason to ever move beyond the bare minimum required, making it boring as hell. Sekiro's skill floor is one of the highest I've seen in a long time, but the ceiling is barely any higher than that. Since I play games to win them, not to jerk myself off seeing what retarded tricks I can do, Sekiro is an objectively better game.

>>16394717

<Sekiro's soundtrack blows all other similar soundtracks out the water, too.*

I don't understand the complaints about the soundtracks, it isn't all hits, but it's the best i've heard in quite a while since automata's

>>16395997

Because it's incredibly generic? Half the time I think I remember a track it turns out to be from Nioh instead. The track you posted is a prime example of it. I didn't even remember it until you posted it, and I'll probably forget about it once I close the tab.

>>16395997

Yeah Sekiro OST is the least memorable of known From games, the only thing that has stuck to my mind is the detection/fight music, unfortunately it is the weakest point of the game, especially when its "predecessors" have such fantastic and memorable tracks.

I have to add that I was so focused on the fights throughout the game that I didn't really have time to listen to the music attentively, will have to give it a listen outside playing.

>>16396025

The game sucks because I'm falling asleep beating it for the first 20 hours that I'm too bored to continue playing it and unlock anything that MIGHT be challenging.

>>16396029

No the game sucks because you suck. You're bad at videogames and you wouldn't know a good game from a bad one if I beat you over the head with it.

>>16396029

hey you got 20 hours out of the game, that's more than I can say for sekiro

>>16395997

this is the only good track in Sekiro's OST

>people having trouble with this boss

I think the only reason this miniboss got ANY attention was because a lot of players didn't say 'fuck genchiro and the main quest i'm gonna explore'. The tutorial-boss for rapid parrying that you ABSOLUTELY FUCKING NEED TO KNOW TO PROPERLY FIGHT ENEMIES IN THE CASTLE AND GENCHIRO HIMSELF is that centipede asshole on the other side of the Fort. Once he teaches you 'oh, spamming parry is actually a technique you need to use for some things and not just precise presses', many attacks of these guys that seem ridiculous become easy as piss.

If memory serves, all you have to do on that boss is wait for his sword to flash while sheathed, and then just spam parry. You'll instantly parry both attacks, and deal like fucking 50-60% posture damage. Do that twice, stab, do it twice more, done. Fight takes all of 10 seconds. Why did they put the tutorial boss for rapid parrying in the ass end of nowhere I will never stop being mad.

>>16396049

meant to reply to >>16395908 but I am indeed a moron.

>>16396042

>Complain the game is TOO EASY

>No you suck at the game

Fuck you

>>16396007

>>16396012

Well i guess we can agree to disagree, because i absolutely love it. Not all tracks sure, some are indeed quite forgettable, but most are epic as fuck and give me a good rush or are calm and beautiful Fountainhead Palace even haunting Hirata State, no idea if it's better or worse than the others since i haven't played any other FS game.

>>16396025

Score systems are shit encouragement, i'd rather be encouraged in trying to beat the enemy, not just trying to do it in a kewl way.

The problem with DMCV in the regard he means is that the first play through in devil hunter allows you to brute force the game and learn bad habits, so the combat can end up feeling rather shallow. I finished the game without having a real mastery of the combat, without feeling like a bad ass so i have not much motivation to go back i will though.

Also the combat system based on tons of combos has never been my thing, i'd rather get good with the basics instead of having to think about different combos and entering a ton of inputs, hence Sekiro is just more my thing than DMC but i can sure see why someone that's used to DMC will see Sekiro's combat as dull.

>>16396056

>since i haven't played any other FS game

I highly recommend giving a listen to Dark Souls & 3 and Bloodborne OSTs (including DLCs). I'm sure some composers are same so you might find some similarities as well.

>>16395965

>scarce enemy types

It's more that Sekiro has much better enemy placement than Nioh does. Nioh tends to have a grab bag of placement after a certain point and this has a tendency to cause everything to feel samey and not special despite the actual variety of youkai monsters in the game.

>>16396049

>The tutorial-boss for rapid parrying

>that centipede asshole on the other side of the Fort

Knowing that you can rapid parry by fanning the shoulder button lowers the skill requirement by fucking miles. I understand why they tucked the secret away with an optional boss, because knowing you can rapid parry really breaks many of the (boss) fights. Which really indicates just how poorly parrying is implemented/designed.

>>16396042

>>16396029

This is the first Fromsoft game that is unironically a rhythm game. I am quite sure not many people realized that is what they were signing up for, and as such can understandably complain that it doesn't play like a normal fromsoft game.

The core issue with Sekiro is that every enemy and attack has a response it wants you to give. It isn't a case of 'alright, I could parry this, or leap over it, or block it with my absurd shield and stamina or use my bow or lightning magic', etc, as it was in previous entries. Everything is tailored to one specific approach, and because of that, ever enemy and boss and encounter feels very, very railroaded. It becomes less a game of 'figure out how to fight this guy', and more just 'memorize what inputs each combo wants you to use and have the reaction time to input them quick enough'.

This isn't even so much a situation where you can say 'every game is like that if you break it down', because the attacks and bosses are all but scripted to engage in only set patterns that they expect a response pattern to and any deviation from that is 'you get hit'. First attack is a slash; you have to either LT at the right time, or get hit. Jumping, dodging around, NOTHING ELSE will reliably work. Ok now he is doing his spin, that's A. If you do anything else, you get hit. Now he could charge, which is A+left, or he could kick, which is LT again. Once you input the combo correctly, you have 1-2 seconds to deal damage, then reset for the next combo sequence you have to respond to.

You can see how this breaks down the AI in the worst way because there are many bosses that have just no response to certain tactics, because the game is expecting you and indeed DEMANDING you behave in a certain way. Lady Butterfly can be permanently stunlocked by just dodge+attack, dodge+attack, over and over because her attack window is just large enough to sneak those hits in that she was never designed with a response to it. The Final Boss can be beaten by just baiting a jump attack, stabbing, and running away without ever taking damage because you were never supposed to fight him like this and as such he was never built to counter it. Ash+Firecrackers have become THE MOST IMPORTANT tools because the can stunlock almost any boss, and since Fromsoft never expected you to just use them over and over, no boss has a way to break a stunlock with them or react in any way besides 'they hit the stun button, do the stun animation' forever. It is not a game of adapting to the current obstacle or building a certain playstyle, but memorizing what patterns the game wants you to respond with and parrot it back. And while not necessarily BAD, it definitely isn't normal for Fromsoft.

>>16396054

No fuck you for being a fucking moron who loves dumbed down shit for retards. Go jerk off, maybe that's more your level of gameplay.

>>16396056

Yeah I kind of agree with you on that one, what you said about learning bad habits on your first playthrough describes my first DMC3 run to a T. although I didn't fully grasp the mechanics of the game (I didn't even know jump canceling or many of the other techniques that are now very widespread were a thing) I had fun and it was a great experience, but after getting good it becomes far far better, and retards that played through the entire game dismissing the depth of the combat system because they just want to get to the end piss me off to no end.

Sekiro's combat is far more straightforward, which I think is a good thing, but also far more shallow. You can say that Sekiro's combat is better I like it to be honest, for the straight-forwardness I mentioned but then comparing it to DMC's combat without having any mastery over it is an action that could be properly described as "fucking retarded"

>>16396025

>>Score system to softly encourage you to try and master all those crazy mechanics

What I want is that the game eventually expects me to understand these crazy mechanics if I don't want to goddamn die, not because some magic bar in the top right corner tells me 'u suk lol'. Take Devil Trigger, in lower difficulties it's a neat rage mode power, it can even kill some bosses before you know what happened, but at higher difficulties the HP scaling is so wack that using Devil Trigger to maximize damage where possible is downright essential, and by extent so is taunting for refilling your DT gauge if you don't want to wail at enemies for five minutes straight. Then consider how DMD forces you to get aggressive and kill faster as enemies will DT if left alive for too long.

I should want to use these crazy mechanics for survival first and foremost. Scoring systems need adequate rewards to increase your probabilities of survival for the risks involved of scoring high to be worthwhile, like how in arcade games you get an extra life for every 1 million points or so scored. DmC would actually make you move and attack faster the higher your style rank was as encouragement.

>>16396083

He's not even optional though, which is what blows my mind. The gun fort is mandatory once you beat Genichiro, as it is how you get to the Guardian Ape and flower. They demand you learn HOW to rapid parry, but withhold that information until you pass by the enemies and several bosses that you absolutely need that skill for. It is like they implemented rapid-parry, realized how fucking broken it was and how much easier it made many enemies, so decided 'well we just won't tell them how to do it until it becomes more supplemental than mandatory'. Because as I said, if you know how to do that, that aforementioned miniboss, Genichiro, red-hat assholes and assassins, ALL of them become at least 50% easier. Hell even the loading screens warn you that spamming parry will just get you killed, but spamming parry is an ACTUAL SKILL. Utterly incomprehensible.

>>16396102

Really this all stems from the issue that the game doesn't know what it wants to do. It tries to do so much and as a result fails at everything.

>>16395966

>Having DMC-levels of combo options would have been unnecessary

I never asked for it to, I'm just arguing towards the depth of the system, as for some reason people really want to pull some mental gymnastics to try to say that DMC's combat depth isn't larger. All I really did ask for was directional inputs and allow them to be chainable, something you even agreed with in your post, instead they keep limiting you with laughable restrictions because nothing stops you from just pausing the game and changing arts mid fight.

>If a punish can always follow into the same most optimal combo, why do you even need that many combo options for a 1v1 fight?

Because it allows replay-ability, I'll touch this again lower.

Keeping a combo going in a 1v1 is the most ideal case in DMC, while in the air Dante is safer, and keeping a combo up the air with jump cancels not only gives a boost to your style, it allows you to be save and look stylish while doing it.

You're doing good damage, you're looking good, and the game is giving you a GOOD score for it. This is what I mean with the style system working in tandem with the gameplay.

>Getting SSS-ranks in DMC3 was more of a puzzle of how many different moves you could use in quick succession while repeating moves as little as possible

I can understand that view point, as it's the same I used to have the first couple of times I beat DMC3, however that came from someone who did not understand the complexity of it, and I don't want to pass off the feeling like I'm some kind of DMC master, I mean I could barely pull off guard flying in 4 but I do understand it a lot better.

DMC games, specially after 3 are games that you really can't get the grasp off on your first time through it.

The style meter in 3 is also very flawed, as you can get an instant SSS by doing a DT explosion, it's not the best in the series but it is the harder to keep up, next to 5 which I think did it best.

>In fact the Style Switching mod breaks the balance of the style meter

Yes it does, the game was obviously not built around it, which is why I don't recommend using it the first time through. It's great to fuck around with though.

You're going to either like or absolutely hate 4, good luck with some enemy types, they are the worst ones in the series.

>The official manual literally says the parry window becomes smaller if you spam the parry button.

Then they sure fucked up didn't they? Because the webm I posted in >>16394922 is just me spamming block without getting much of a punish.

>I think the whole sentiment that replay value needs to be achieved through build variety is some gay arbitrary shit

I'll disagree with you if different builds actually change your approach to combat, like in Nioh.

If you're so against this though how are you against the way DMC does replay-ability? Since all it does is offer you a wide sandbox of combat for you to explore almost endlessly, this feels like something you would like as the game only keeps getting better and better, the better you become at it, not with some arbitrary build shit like you said.

>It deals mad vitality damage because it pierces through block

The vitality damage isn't that good, it does go through block but you are fully stuck there waiting for the animation to die off, this is a problem with many arts, they are unchainable with other moves and leave you wide open, they are very unsafe, there's some good ones in there but it's like 3/10 of them.

>All the niches of the grapple hook have already been covered.

Using it for 3-4 fights is considered "covered"? There's even areas in the game where you barely use it at all like the midget village.

The more I played the game the more I wanted more use out of it.

Anyway to clarify my initial point, I'm arguing that DMC has a much larger execution depth that Sekiro has by huge miles, and that once you understand Sekiro's combat, you're very close to being done with it, as there isn't much room to grow.

Who cares about balance in a single player game?

>>16396102

>>16396118

It's strange because the Souls games are pretty much the opposite of what Sekiro is combat-wise, and it worked so well. There are lots of ways to beat bosses, taking into consideration stats, weapon type, using sorcery/pyromancy/miracles; and you're naturally going to find certain bosses harder or easier depending on what type of build you went for. In Sekiro everything feels far more streamlined, like they allowed From to do their Soulslike difficulty(TM) but intentionally kept the number of available, effective options as low as possible so dumb players wouldn't blame the game when they did retarded shit.

>>16396095

*You can say that Sekiro's combat is good

>>16396156

I honestly feel that is the biggest issue that snowballed into making EVERYTHING feel very strange for a Fromsoft game, and as such polarized a large chunk of the fanbase. Fromsoft games have always been about finding a build that works for your playstyle, getting armor and gear to support that, then trying to overcome obstacles using your specific method. That is almost completely opposite as you said to what the formula is here; in Sekiro, the way to beat a boss has already been established. It is now YOUR job to use the static character you've been given to figure out what the strategy is to victory. It works from boss-design to strategy, rather than accounting for multiple strategies to build a boss around them.

>>16396166

That's even stranger, is it feels like a lot of bosses weren't built around your character. In fact the main bosses are far worse to fight than some of the generic minibosses. It's just a strange game that's just a series of bad baffling choices.

>>16396174

The Demon of Hatred one is a prime example of that yeah, same with the horse guy in my opinion.

Nobody bitched about metal blade in Mega Man 2 or begged for a patch. If the tool is broken OP, just don't use it.

>>16396157

And it sucks, because Sekiro is a good game and I had a ton of fun with it, although it's a bit rough around the edges. I can see this game becoming something great if they did a sequel and somewhat fixed the problems the first game presented.

>>16396145

>Keeping a combo going in a 1v1 is the most ideal case in DMC, while in the air Dante is safer, and keeping a combo up the air with jump cancels not only gives a boost to your style, it allows you to be save and look stylish while doing it.

You're missing the point. Even within Dante's humongous moveset there will always a particular combo which deals the most optimal DPS, or generates the most optimal amount of style points. But in a 1v1 the enemy is in either an attacking, a neutral, or a hurt state, and while its in a hurt state it can't do anything, so you're free to do the most optimal sequence of actions. This isn't so much the case if you're outnumbered, because now enemies will interrupt you if you're trying to do the most optimal combo on one enemy, so you have to adapt and factor in crowd control in your attacks, creating a dynamic challenge. Which is lost for boss battles since most of them are 1v1s.

The simplest analogy I can give is like fighting a lone Cyberdemon in Doom. You have all these weapons, but many of them are designed around fighting groups of enemies, so why would you use anything other than the Rocket Launcher/BFG/Plasma Rifle (assuming you're stocked on ammo)? Those deal the most DPS after all.

>is just me spamming block without getting much of a punish.

That is rather gay, though without Kuro's Charm spamming block works rather inconsistently to the point where I rather wouldn't want to do it.

>If you're so against this though how are you against the way DMC does replay-ability? Since all it does is offer you a wide sandbox of combat for you to explore almost endlessly, this feels like something you would like as the game only keeps getting better and better, the better you become at it, not with some arbitrary build shit like you said.

Aside from harder difficulties and all your abilities being locked on the start I'm not, grading the player performance also helps immensely in this regard, but not having pursuing high grades be implicitly part of just surviving isn't something I'm a fan of. It's why everyone played like a bitch in Vanquish, the game offered you the possibility to play like a badass, but it didn't really incentivize you to. A good scoring system goes some way, but ideally you want something along the lines of nuDoom's Glory Kills where 'being aggressive = more health' should hammer the point home to even the most casual casual, even if it was poorly implemented.

I don't like builds in action games because the balancing is 90% of the time downright questionable, and you have no idea whether you are playing something underpowered or downright cheesy. And as the game makes no distinction you might beat the game the first time around either mowing through the game or having to fight sponges everywhere, which must've been legit as you still beat the game. I'm more of a fan of different playable characters in old beat 'em ups where you have four or so characters with small but distinctly unique playstyles. DMC also is doing that more often, but because Dante keeps all the cool moves and weapons to himself all other playable characters tend to suffer from Vergil Syndrome.

>Using it for 3-4 fights is considered "covered"? There's even areas in the game where you barely use it at all like the midget village.

As far as uses in combat goes anyways. If you want to get crazier with it you could use it for triggering /grabbing things from a distance, yanking weapons from enemies' hands (no idea how to balance it though), and some more Spiderman-esque shit.

>once you understand Sekiro's combat, you're very close to being done with it, as there isn't much room to grow

Not that I think this is false, but I don't think it's that bad of a thing either. It just irks me that this gets brought up so often because it's just what people expect out of a Souls game or a modern action game in general, while otherwise replay value only really gets brought up for short indie games.

>>16396222

>so *for a single lone Cyberdemon why would you use anything other than the Rocket Launcher/BFG/Plasma Rifle

>>16396217

Yeah, you can see how they intended the system to work, but they didn't go far enough in any place. Like "break the enemy's posture to kill them" sure that's fine "now do it with an extremely limited moveset that never changes enough to feel like you progressed in any way". Same with them obscuring all of the damage numbers when it's incredibly obvious they're just hidden, it's all done in what feels like an extreme effort to prevent the player from feeling any sense of progression.

It needs a lot of work, and it's obvious they're doing sekiro 2 from the ending. 5$ from learns nothing and somehow makes the second game even shallower combat wise "only 1 tool at once" or some garbage.

>>16396102

The immortal guy at the shrine literally teaches you about attack flurries which you need to parry spam for.

>>16394187

>>16394209

Hell I'll do you better on Emblems; At the fountainhead there's a soccer mob that drops 15 spirit emblems on death. Once you get to The Fountain Head you literally never have to worry about emblems again

>>16394717

Demon souls should be at least top tier, bloodborne should be mid, 2 should stay at fucking shit and 3 can stay where it is. Didn't enjoy sekiro but I'd say it's at least a mid surely.

>>16396021

>start the game

>really big GO FUCKING HERE YOU RETARD sign

>takes control of the camera and forces you to look at the massive burning ball of light which you definitely would've never seen if you hadn't been shown it.

Why do games do this?

why was the whore even a thing in the game too? Jesus Christ how they made a character so disgustingly terrible without me even looking at her is beyond me

>>16396048

This is fucking awful anon. Firelink shrine with the lowest quality possible would be better.

>>16396316

Kill animations in Sekiro could be considered just another attack animation. Outside of some really big bosses, they take less time than the average strong attack, so the only difference between them and any normal attack button press is the fact you are invulnerable during them. In non-boss fights you can treat the kill animations as a strategic part of combat, since it helps to create space (other enemies back away from you as if shocked).

The only times it gets annoying are during the midget village, the giant mass of monkeys, and the first part of the divine dragon fight if you don't know to do the jump kill that wipes out 10 at a time. Basically only when you are swarmed with weak enemies and would rather AOE them all down rather than deathblow them one at a time.

I'd like to point out one of my other issues with DMC, and that's that the design doesn't really allow for anything other than fighting. Fight arenas are connected in an almost completely linear path with any secret extras being few and very far between, and there is absolutely no other approach besides entering the arena and fighting everything. Considering the enemies t themselves are mostly irrelevant at least in the first two difficulties you are forced to play through, it contributes to making the game extremely boring. Enter room, mash out combos, walk 10 steps, repeat. It has absolutely no room to change up the gameplay at all, especially since, as explained before, you have absolutely no reason to use any but the same few combos even if you are going for SSS ranks

While Sekiro's stealth is pretty bad, and the exploration is shallower than it appears, that's still three completely different modes of gameplay to DMC's one. Fighting, exploring, and stealthing all feel completely different, so there's much less fatigue and getting bored with one style.

>>16396316

>I don't remember when did DMC5 stop a fight to give a tutorial box

But right before or after, i mean i couldn't get a good pace when i was constantly interrupted in a myriad of ways, if they were in the middle of combat too i'd have just abandoned the game then and there.

>If this really bothered you then let me ask how much do the kill animations bother you in Sekiro?

Not at all, i actually find them really enjoyable, it's a treat the game gives you for defeating an enemy and i control when and if they happen too, it's completely different from the asinine bullshit the first hours of DMCV forces you through.

>Why would DMC5 need it?

I'm not saying it needs it, but i certainly find Sekiro leagues and miles more interesting in that regard, DMCV is going from small arena to arena with a generic city as backdrop for half the game then the other half is going from small arena to arena with a confusing and ugly "hellscape" as backdrop, with some retarded platforming and key/lock mechanics the parasites and the gaping infected vaginas thrown in that are as shallow as they come. Again, i don't mind it that much because the core of DMC is the combat and i think they nailed that part, but i do also enjoy the "being" in a setting, exploring it, finding secrets, best ways to sneak and attack and just the aesthetic aspect of it and in that case Sekiro is so so much better there's not even a comparison.

Again, i don't give a fuck about scores, it was cool getting some Ss but it's not like getting a B made me want to replay the level to get good, that's just not how i find motivation, my motivations comes from if you don't get good you simply can't continue.

>I just like that the game has enough depth to last me a life time and that I'll be able ti improve on it's mechanics long before I get bored with the game.

That's great then, and i like what Sekiro does instead, i mean honestly i think it's pretty retarded to compare the too, you fight with swords in the two that's mostly it.

>Yeah don't get me wrong, I really do want to see them do better with this IP because as it stands I see a ton of potential that just isn't realized here.

True that, unlike you i can say i loved the game for the most part, but it has it's flaws and missed opportunities, with some luck the DLC and maybe even a sequel can address that, for sure i'm looking forward to that.

>>16394922

Brazilian

>>16396085

There is more than one option. Parrying is the optimal choice, but you can do other things, just like >>16395908. That miniboss is defeated with 4 consecutive parries (2 attack comboes), but you don't HAVE to do it that way. Most enemies in the game CAN be fought by running around and punishing the attacks that leave them open, and never pressing L1 at all. Parrying is just much easier and faster in most cases. Well, "easier" is subjective because you can dodge and run without properly learning the enemy's combos, but you have to learn them exactly in order to parry.

>>16395937

I just use the poison tanto on him.

>>16396249

>The Mortal Blade wielded by Genichiro can open a gateway to the Underworld so he uses his own obdy to resurrect gramps.

Holy shit that is actually fucking awesome. I love the way he old man claws his way out of Genichiro's neck too. The whole scene is brutal and great and having some meaning to it now completely fixes the wtf aspect of it.

>>16396446

Now there's a good game to bring up. MGRR was much better than DMCV, at the very least. For starters, it at least had both stealth and combat approaches, which keeps the game from being all combat all the time. It also had enemies that were actually able to fight back straight from the beginning difficulty. Also better music.

A good bit of the difficulty in MGRR is still based around trying to max out your score, but the largest part of the post-battle scoring is whether or not you did it without taking damage, which is at least a legitimately difficult gameplay task rather than just showing off some bullshit combo. Sadly the skill floor is still much MUCH lower than Sekiro, so in the end I still give Sekiro the better combat and exploration. About even on the stealth.

>>16394096

They literally do not, no. They see it as US vs THEM and fuck you if you are not having fun correctly.

The player's options should never be equally viable. There should be easy options and hard options, hidden cheese options, high skill shortcuts etc etc. Balance is basically removing all replay value.

(They should definitely fuck with the people who go out of bounds to noclip through the game though. Fuck those people so much. You didn't beat shit.)

>>16395965

>>16396249

I don't know if it's supposed to be a beheading or not, but I do know that at some point in history Japs weren't allowed to show beheadings. That bit of censorship might still be active.

But why would Genichiro resurrect the 40 year old version of gramps instead of the more agile 20 year old Isshin like when he was bro'ing it up with The Sculptor in their youth.

>>16396474

You are retarded. First off, MGRR did not have enemies that were actually able to fight back. I remember my first playthrough dying only to Armstrong, the game's skill floor is literally just being able to press forward + square at anything. Second: More is not better. Just because a game has stealth does not mean that it's better to a game that only has combat, specially in the case of DMCV comparisons where it's combat is of absurd depth. The fact that you're saying MGR stealth's is even a considerable aspect of the game already speaks volumes.

>the largest part of the post-battle scoring is whether or not you did it without taking damage, which is at least a legitimately difficult gameplay task rather than just showing off some bullshit combo.

Getting hit resets your style meter so to get higher ranks you need to avoid getting hit. It's the same shit.

>>16396501

I honestly can’t remember having as much fun with a game, as I did with DMC5. The combat really is spectacular, particularly with Nero who has so much variety with the Devil Breakers plus the most savage, visceral sword combos. Nothing beats going ham on a downed opponent with his slam combo. I noticed that despite the floaty, gravity-defying movement in dmc, they still allow the player a sense of weight and momentum in the actual attacks, which was noticeably lacking in Sekiro. I pressed R1, the Wolf swung the sword, but something was lost in the connection there.

>>16396501

>because that's all the game is

But it could be more than that, i know they focused on the combat and i agree that it shows but as i said i'd like more than that and since it lacks it, i find other games more enjoyable overall.

>You are not worthy as my opponent, casual schum.

I'd think the casuals were the ones into arcade-ish scoring systems, but whatever dude, scores aren't my thing game statistics though, oh yes give me that

>>16396504

Because of experience and mastery, Owl and Lady Butterfly are also old fucks, the point being they're veteran masters of their craft.

>>16396474

Sure but its stealth was underused and only there because it carried the Metal gear title. Not complaining but I wouldn't put it as a point of "things MGR does for better variety over DMCV". I'll gladly take Dante's straigh up combat, Nero's ""platforming"" and V-irgin's no hands combat segments over MGR's stealth.

As for the skill floor being lower than Sekiro…Nigga, is you serious? Do you know how much of a pleb filter Sam is? Let alone Bladewolf. MGR shits on Sekiro's combat on all acounts 24/7 all year.

And what kinda myopic way of thinking is that "if a game doesn't switch it up I get bored"? How can you stand to play platformers then or god forbid, fightans? Including shallow elements in a game makes it tedious and frustrating, not fun.

>>16396504

Isshin Trump was the one who beat the guys behind the war and brought an age of peace etc etc. Though old by that time he had found techniques, secret techniques, compound techniques, new skills etc to mitigate old age and show off his skill, mastery and technique. It's the most cliche samurai thing in fiction.

>>16396536

DMC5 was indeed an absolute blast. Cavaliere Angelo is my favourite weapon in the series, fucking up demons with my stand replacements with V and smashing demons with Nero was too fun.

>>16396541

>>16396547

I actually can't stand fighting games at all, and that's one of the reasons. I do sort of enjoy when a fighting game has a strategy/RPG mode built into it like at least one Soul Calibur did. When the game is the same thing all the time I usually get bored very quickly. In the case of DMC, this means I play for maybe an hour, then stop, and then I have to make myself pick it up again. After a few sessions like that I wonder why I'm even bothering to play it at all, and a few more and I just drop it for good.

Sekiro, along with many many other games, hits the right mix for me that I don't want to put it down. I play the game late into the next day without getting bored, often forgetting to even eat. That is what I define as a fun game.

Also with MGRR, I don't think I had any boss fight take me more than 2 hours on any difficulty, and most of them I was trying to beat with no-damage. Sekiro just trying to beat them at all took hours. Even on NG+ Where I already sort of knew the bosses from the first time (but now with no charm), there were still bosses that took hours.

>>16396586

>the casuals are the ones trying to perfect themselves

If you put it that way… alright

I'm happy enough just beating the game, i do want that to be challenging.

Yeah i've only played 5, though i'm kinda wish i had played the others before, at the very least to understand what the fuck was going on.

>>16396604

So it's entirely subjective. Got it. Who cares.

>>16396604

What? How the fuck did horse take hours? There are a ton of extremely easy bosses in sekiro.

>>16396616

It's a pretty well understood aspect of game design and the reason MOST action games have puzzles in them.

>>16396618

Oh hell no. Most doesn't mean all. Horse and Painting Monkeys were over in 10 minutes or less. Lady Butterfly, Genichiro, Owl, Apes, Corrupted Monk MK2 (didn't know about the jump kill), demon of hatred, and Isshin all took more than 2 hours each.

>>16396629

so 6 out of like 22 bosses

>>16396645

Sekiro only has 14 total boss memories. Owl and Isshin are both in there twice. Both versions of Owl are in that list (so 7/14) and I never actually did the Shura ending so I've never attempted the other Isshin, so that's 7/13 which is officially "most".

>>16396653

Some minibosses are harder than the main ones though

>>16396653

Other isshin is very similar. But how the fuck did you have issues the second go around. The bosses don't change at all

>>16396662

>The bosses don't change at all

What

>>16396661

Absofuckinglutely. I think Orin is probably harder than anything but Owl and Isshin. Minibosses aren't bosses though, most are skippable if nothing else.

>>16396662

Other isshin doesn't have the spear phase, so he's probably super easy. Second go I mostly struggled with Owl, lady butterfly and Isshin (and Orin). I didn't fight Owl mk2 on my first playthrough at all, and I was going charmless. Isshin I still haven't properly learned and my first playthrough on Lady Butterfly (who was the first boss I beat) I didn't do "properly", so I had to learn the proper way in NG+. I also struggled a lot more on the twin apes, first time was a breeze.

>>16396665

Stop advocating for boring games. If you have to "git gud" before the game even starts being fun (fat fucking chance of that happening btw), your game is a piece of shit. Hard is fun. Getting good to overcome hard is what games are all about. The only challenge I haven't overcome in DMC is the narcolepsy.

>>16396690

You fucking consider fighting games boring because you can't put an ounce of effort in any game you play.

Promptly shut the fuck up.

>>16396690

Go blow your tenbux elsewhere you fucking LARPer goon.

>>16396720

Just you wait anon, just you wait. You'll hate an enemy far worse than him and it's not gonna be a great ape.

>>16396720

Don't worry about confetti, after the corrupted monk all merchants will sell it, in facts it's my go to buff it only only adds extra damage against apparitions, after some grinding now i have more confetti than i'll ever use.

Nut yes, the headless are some bullshit and there's no reason to fight them after you've defeated them once.

>>16396734

Who?

>>16396754

>it only only adds extra damage against apparitions

I meant that it gives the buff not only against apparitions

>>16396752

Good luck against either of them in NG+ if you have to rely on that thing.

>>16396773

There's absolutely no good reason headless in NG+ though.

If they make another Sekiro game, one thing I would like for them to change is that the the posture meter is not the end all for boss phases. Change it so the the posture meter is an extra bar that people can work on for extra damage and it gets incrementally harder to do the next one but it does more damage. Example: first deathblow is 50%, then 75%, then 100% and so on and so on. That way, you can work up variety to do health bar damage with general attacks and other skills and mix up posture damage from parries and general attacks that damage the posture meter. Might be hard to implement since they'd have to have damage calculated if the deathblow exceeds the remaining health bar over to the next health bar phase. I think this would solve the dominance of posture meter deathblow tactics significantly so I hope they make it work for their next game in the series.

>>16396779

Let's be honest there's not really any good reason to NG+ in the first place except for the challenge of it. Skipping O'Rin because she's too hard defeats the purpose of playing NG+ at all.

>>16396629

>It's a pretty well understood aspect of game design and the reason MOST action games have puzzles in them.

god forbid a game focuses on one thing only

it's a mindset like that results in retarded shit like DMC1's underwater parts or Kamiya's indescribable urge to shove in Space Harrier parts where possible

instead of shoving in more half-assed exploration segments inbetween arena fights, DMCV did the right thing by cutting out the fat entirely and having levels be corridors leading to circular arenas, because I came here to kick ass and chew bubblegum, not to play fucking Super Metroid

>>16396583

more like that comic strip?

>>16396894

What's Hellboy doing in Chicago?

>>16396854

when they jump over you, you can do midair attacks to knock them on their ass, then get in some hits, then repeat

>>16396854

I only ever fought them once. I could never find a good strategy for them. Those guys are the hardest enemy in the game, as I rarely fought them.

>>16396863

Its cool that they get included, but I was disappointed that none of the characters have anything to say about the takeover/infiltration. Ninja guys are pretty easy, when they do their big bullshit air attack, back off and then wait for the sweep followup. Get good at parrying their base attacks and they are done in no time.

>>16396912

But there's two of those fuckers back to back in front of the temple and a third one walking around nearby, there is literally no way to avoid fighting multiples.

>>16396925

Except cheese. Unlike in Dark Souls, you are invincible in Sekiro while opening doors. You can literally just walk past those two door guarding assholes and ignore them. They usually don't even come inside. There are also multiple ways to cheese them with stealth, I'm sure you've seen the videos by now of someone throwing shit at them from around a corner until they walk by and get deathblowed.

>>16396925

crouch close to a grapple point so one of them sees you and moves to investigate, then grapple and backstab the other one. then you can deal with one at a time

>>16396946

At the very least, walk past them into the temple and use the idol there so you literally can just respawn right next to them after your failed attempt.

>>16396940

>Unlike in Dark Souls, you are invincible in Sekiro while opening doors.

There have always been door opening i-frames even back in Demon's Souls. It's the same animation carried over too, not like that's bad.

>>16397040

I remember there being at least a few doors where you could be attacked and knocked out of the animation, forcing you to deal with enemies in the room first somehow. Maybe only invulnerable on part of the animation?

>>16396925

>>16396946

Combine green sugar and crouching and grapple around the balcony area while the third one isn't looking at you. Then stealth kill the roaming one and then draw out the one facing your direction for a stealth kill and then finally stealth the one facing away.

>I wanna figure them out.

Oh. Well then try anti air deathblow when they jump.

>>16397070

DS2 is the only game that removed it, unless you were playing that I have no idea.

>>16397078

It was unreasonable to do that.

It's part of why I don't like DaS2.

>>16393560

Gearbox did this shit.

>OH NO PLAYERS HAVE FIGURED OUT OUR GAME WHAT DO WE DO

>Let's nerf everything useful, buff all of the enemies and call it a "challenge."

>>16397207

I don't think they actually really nerfed anything though. It seem like the closest thing to a nerf was how they back loaded the damage for monk skills where as before the damage was front loaded. Everything else seems to just be lowering the spirit emblem costs of several tools and skills.

>>16397264

I never used the monk shit. Saw it in a video once where the flip kick did like half a bosses posture in one hit. Kind of obvious why that would be nerfed. Everything else is a buff from the sounds of the patch notes.

>>16397264

They render viable tactics useless because normalshits complained that they were "exploits" and therefor the game is broken and "shit"

Everyone knows why the guards keep attacking you even after beating Genichiro? isn't Isshin the one now in command?

>>16398324

So you can grind.

Can you get back into that area after Ashina gate but before the castle proper once the ninja invasion begins?

>>16398324

Yeah that bothered me too.

>isn't Isshin the one now in command?

Technically but I get the impression that there really isn't a centralized command anymore after Genichiro is driven off.

>>16398374

>Can you get back into that area after Ashina gate but before the castle proper once the ninja invasion begins?

Guess you can try the Gyobu/Demon cheese to get there, i don't see the point though.

>>16398374

For some reason, that little area is completely closed off when they arrive. It never opens back up.

>>16396012

The flute noises in Beheaded's soundtrack always send chills down my spine, but yeah, there is nothing as memorable as DeS intro song or half of DS1's boss themes.

>>16398324

I believe, technically, Isshin is always the one in command as the head of that Household and clan. Genichiro is just the super popular and supported military leader, which makes him the 'boss' and has everyone listen to him. Which makes sense since Isshin never seemed to agree with jack shit Genichiro was doing, but couldn't do anything to stop it. From the dialogue, it really seems that only the jittery assholes throwing shurikens on the rooftops directly report to Isshin, which is why they were ordered to leave their smoke-signals to guide you around. But that remains infuriating because they will attack you even after being directly ordered and actually obeying the command to 'hey go mark a path for that ninja guy'. During the siege, several dying NPCs will even refer to you as 'their reinforcement', or laughing about the irony of having to work together now. Making it even more baffling, as even semi-average soldiers now seem to know the guy attacking them all game is supposed to be on their side, but having them all still attack you regardless.

>>16399346

Perhaps they don't like you since you killed Genichiro, perhaps the rest attack you bbecause for them you're just a random shinobi breaking into the castle, idk.

>>16399467

They attack you because if they weren't hostile they would have to be interactable NPCs and From didn't want to give them dialog beyond the occasional shout.

>>16399496

I mean yes, they're enemies just because you need to kill something. but still

>>16399565

Not true. Many of the Ashina troops later in the game give like 2 exp. They aren't meant for you to kill, they are meant die fighting the ministry troops. It's absolutely unnecessary for the game to make you fight them if they somehow survive, but if they weren't hostile they would need an "interact" prompt and something to say, otherwise the game would be inconsistent and appear to be bugged or incomplete.

Are they the Shogunate's goons come to fuck everything up? Who rules over Ashina?

>>16399467

>killed

But you don't. He runs away for all the roof tengus to see.

>>16394826

Being addicted to soulshit to the point where you can play a bastardized, clumsily designed version of it but can't be fucked to play a game that pushes your skill to the limit is your own damn problem. And no, learning rhythm isn't skill compared to the skill ceiling of any DMC. Shit, DmC is a better game than Sekiro.

>>16399692

yeah sorry, you just humiliate him repeatedly instead.

Think about it, even in his final form he's just the warm up phase for his grandpa, what a cuck.

>>16393322

Prosthetic tools are the crutch, they should remain options for situations you can't be bothered to fix with your sword. Being able to spam them defeats the point of the entire combat system.

>>16400060

Except the "point" of the combat system is more like a dulled edge with how boring and monotonous it gets. The unchanging nonexperimental nature of the combat is the biggest flaw with the game. At least let tools be used freely or something to try to break it out of the complete stagnation that combat becomes.

Did they fix the parry spam? If not I don't give a shit.

>>16399689

My knowledge of feudal japan's politics is not fucking great, but from what I could piece together in the game, the current situation is,

>Bunch of assholes 20+ years ago were being assholes

>Ashina guys rose up under Isshin to kill the assholes and become the new boss of that area

>Main nobility/ministers aren't super thrilled about literal peasant uprising turning into a major clan

>Isshin however is a fucking badass so they don't want to deal with it.

>Isshin is now dying and old and Genichiro is a punk bitch, so the ministers/inchargefolk are getting ready to storm this place

>Genichiro knows he's a punk bitch and Ashina is screwed so decides to kidnap his cousin/nephew/fuckingwhatever Divine Heir to use Dragonblood to make him immortal and defend Ashina

>>16400131

Parry spam is a literal mechanic needed to defeat some bosses and attacks so no, it will never be fixed.

>>16395966

>57 hours

Fucking terrible my man. Post again once you have 300.

>>16394759

>>16394717

Demon's souls is god tier. Fuck you.

>>16392544

Haven't noticed any difference with the combat arts, but the axes now are pretty damn good

Have any of the updates giving better strategies for Owl's second fight? The most effective method I've seen so far is hyper aggression with Yashariku's Sugar.

>>16396446

I'm enjoying it immensely even though I suck at the game. Just died 50 times on the ninja in the starting cave before finally killing him. It's like playing Dark Souls with frame skip on. Seriously, this game is fast as fuck compared to Dark Souls.

>>16400084

It doesn't make it dull. It makes it more difficult. There's a high amount of RNG so you have to pay close attention to what move the boss is using and use the appropriate countermeasure with perfect timing.

So the Loaded axe is pretty fucking good now. I think they sped it up a bit? I just used it to fucking annihilate last phase shura ending Isshin. When he does his long charge up attack that's fucking unblockable and shit, just loaded axe his face for massive damage AND inturrupt his attack in the process. Works well on the doctor too.

>>16401021

No there isn't? The fuck are you talking about every boss has a number of patterns that they all follow pretty strictly. It's not even "oh I wonder what attack he'll do" it's "oh he did X attack so I know he'll sweep".

It's incredibly strict patterns

>>16401120

the point is that they randomly mix up patterns with perilous attacks which you get a only very short time window to reply appropriately to based on reading the enemy's stance, like how Genichiro can follow up with either a thrust, sweep, or regular attack after doing a jumping strike

>>16401170

no they don't perilous attacks come at set places during the combo

>>16401176

you know a perilous attack comes, just not what type

again: Genichiro's leaping strike mix-up

>>16401237

Except it's a 1/3rd chance if it were truly random at set places. It's not like in the middle of his flurry he'll randomly throw a sweep or something. Even then a lot of enemies don't even do that. The combat stagnates because there's one "right" choice in how to react to any given situation, and how little the combat even tries to vary from start to end. From is incapable of making interesting combat, and at least in their other games you had the illusion of player choice from picking weapons, in sekiro you don't have that because the viability of other options is so absurdly bad, you can attempt to do tools only… except you won't actually be able to kill a boss entirely, and you'll have to fall back to the painful sword combat.

>>16401305

Except that's the issue, they're situational, and the core combat is absolute trash

>>16401265

>The combat stagnates because there's one "right" choice in how to react to any given situation

In a 1v1 situation in an action game, there always is one objectively best choice to defend yourself.

In Dark Souls parrying was the best option because it staggers enemies and lets you follow up with a riposte for massive damage. In DMC Royal Guarding is objectively the best option because it charges up your powerful Release ability and leaves you with less recovery frames. In Bayonetta parrying with that one accessory is objectively the best option because it inflicts stagger, follow up with an extended Witch Time, and heal you a little bit. In Metal Gear Rising perfect parrying is the overall best option because it deals huge damage which gets boosted to almost one-shot levels on Revengeance difficulty, though enemies which flash yellow need to be dodged and enemies which shoot at you need to be ninja run'd. In the party system Ys games Flashguarding is objectively the best option because it nullifies enemy damage and refills your EXTRA and SP gauges quicker than you could normally, on top of giving you a temporary damage boost.

In Sekiro you can choose whether to dodge a strike so you can chip away at their Vitality and in turn reduce their Posture regen, or to Deflect to fill up their Posture gauge. Then you have Perilous Attacks which aside from thrusts being deflectable (even though there's zero purpose in deflecting a thrust instead of Mikiri Countering it) can't all be deflected and require their own given approach. If anything Sekiro is to be commended for not having one single universal parry button which works against practically every single attack like all these other action games nowadays.

Sure, those other aforementioned games have other defensive options as well, it's just that parrying is 90% of the time the best option. In singleplayer games there's zero situational drawbacks for parrying in games other than its high execution barrier. But once you do learn it, it's usually the best option available. Only in group fights may things differ for parrying being the best, but guess what boss fights in these games aren't?

Sekiro cuts out the illusion of choice and presents to you the bare naked body of the state of modern action games. It's purely about switching between offense and defense, and you're given very little superfluous options (if any at all). In a 1v1 you're bound to stumble upon the best offensive option and the best defensive option anyways because there's usually very little that will force you to change up your most optimal picked moves, so Sekiro just reduces everything to its most basic essence to sidestep the illusion of choice (aside from its prosthetics which feel more like special weapons in Mega Man because of the highly specific weaknesses). Even if you crammed DMC levels of moves and weapons into Sekiro, it wouldn't matter, because people would just stick to the strongest sequence of moves or most suitable weapon against a boss anyways, like the dodge/attack/attack/dodge tactic against Butterfly or Firecracker spam against Corrupted Monk. If you want to avoid this illusion of choice, there should be something to break up those optimal strategies.

Sekiro is the first game in some time to (unintentionally) acknowledge the broken nature of parrying in singleplayer games by forcing you to respond in ways other than parrying through perilous attacks. Unfortunately these are very set, if they were used randomly more often in the middle of many points in a boss' attack patterns then they would go a long way to make fights more interesting.

But there are other ways of going about that. Like the boss having multiple randomly overlapping attack patterns. DMC1 did the same thing with its Mundus fight where sometimes all these attacks would layer in unexpected ways, and you had to constantly adapt and figure out an opening. Or you could do more with group combat, like in Streets of Rage. You can't exactly stunlock a boss forever if constantly spawning grunts keep tagging you from behind and also require attention. That's what made the 2ape fight in Sekiro so different, for example. There it was more of a case of 'how the fuck can I hit the black one without either one of them hitting me' rather than just parryin' everything. The mindset of being able to fix shit combat with "moar options" is a cancerous and unsustainable one because you eventually have to draw a line how much shit you're going to stuff in the game. Instead it ignores the actual problem where the existing options themselves are barely utilized to their full extent. I sure could stand to have more boss archetypes in Sekiro than 'Bloodborne boss who lost his way' and 'person with sword' (that aren't downright cinematic setpieces or puzzles like 4monkey or Dragon). Making the existing options (prosthetics) actually viable would help too.

>>16394373

bad game

normalfags like

grug mad

>>16401437

The latest patch was geared towards making more prosthetics and skills viable. They aren't ever intended to be your main bread and butter damage, but different weapons and tools being the best option in certain specific scenarios goes a long way towards changing it up. I don't know what they did to every tool exactly, but except for Leaping Kicks every change was a buff in some way.

I'd like to point out that parrying in Dark Souls isn't the best option most of the time, or even an option at all in a great many cases. I'm pretty sure more bosses can't be parried at all than can, and that's not counting the individual attacks that can't be parried even on parryable bosses.

>>16401437

See what you miss though is that in both of the other games, blocking had a purpose, enemy HP was actually their HP and not "modifier to their IK bar" and you couldn't spam parries because they had an animation lock on the backswing making it a risk/reward situation. In sekiro you're flat out told "yeah spam that shit to block flurries". There's no risk vs reward aspect to deflecting in sekiro, it's just "do it and a block is a failed deflect"

>>16401464

Wrong. If you spam parry the deflect window shrinks massively and leaves openings where you aren't parrying or blocking.

>>16401476

actually wrong it goes from 30 frames to 7 frames. Both are massive for a "parry"

>>16401481

>.117 seconds

>average "good" reaction time is around .250 seconds

>This is considered a "massive window"

>>16401492

It is compared to lets say a fighting game, where 3rd strike's window for a red parry was 3 frames. And you didn't get any compensation aside from walking into the fucking hit, unlike in sekiro where mistiming is a block.

>>16401492

Actually I can do you one better. The best recording reaction time (based on professional video game players) is .120 seconds. That parry window is smaller than the fastest reactions in the world.

>>16401495

Normal parrys are 6-10 frames (so longer than sekiro's spam penalty window), and that's a fighting game where you are NOT supposed to be able to parry most of the time. Sekiro is designed completely around parries so it has to be a bit more lenient or nobody but daigo would be able to play the game.

>>16401505

Yeah, so you made my point for me, it's the main goal is to parry, unlike in other games where it's a bonus. The depth that other games do for rewarding something like that isn't there because it's expected. It's an important element of why the combat is so completely stagnant and boring. It's an absurdly bare bones combat system for a game that's all about being half baked.

>>16401492

>>16401496

>>16401505

This is moronic. A parry window and reaction time are not the same thing at all.

The "parry window" he's talking about is the greatest length of time rendered in the game where it will still accept an input and count it as a deflection instead of blocking, which I guess is 7-30 frames (definitely feels closer to 30, based on other games which I know have a counter window of 6). That's not the same as the REACTION window, since your human reaction starts as soon as an attack is telegraphed, which is usually at least a full second (if not several) before the attack actually deals damage. Have you never played a game that requires frame-perfect inputs? How do you think those are possible, if no one has a reaction time of 0.017 seconds?

>>16401576

While they aren't the same thing, they should be the same thing. You see the attack start, hit parry and that should work. Games do it moronically and have you wait an arbitrary amount to 'time' the parry as you are supposed to get hit.

>>16401589

>You see the attack start, hit parry and that should work. Games do it moronically and have you wait an arbitrary amount to 'time' the parry as you are supposed to get hit.

the moment an attack is actually going to hit you is arbitrary to the timing of parrying it? are you retarded or is this your larping hour?

>>16401755

I won't deny that at all, personally I think the windows are already way too forgiving. the retard trying to talk about how you should be able to parry an attack by pressing a button the moment you see it beginning to wind up blew my mind.

>>16401755

That's wrong though. If you mash block you end up failing to block entirely and getting hit. Happens quite often against enemies with weird timings, like spear-isshin.

>>16401464

> you couldn't spam parries because they had an animation lock on the backswing making it a risk/reward situation

no

Parrying with automatic counter follow-ups automatically inflicts stagger which interrupts an enemy's attacks to begin with. Only like I said before in a group fight situation where another enemy can hit you during your counter follow-up and interrupt you is it any risky, therefore most bosses are exempt of this risk and reward situation

>There's no risk vs reward aspect to deflecting in sekiro, it's just "do it and a block is a failed deflect"

Okay, first off, if you deflect, your posture bar is going to fill up regardless. Even if your posture bar is completely full you can keep deflecting forever. What this means is that you can aggressively continue to keep attacking and continue deflecting everything without retreating to recover your Posture, preventing the enemy from being able to recover his posture as well. But if you miss even one deflect in such a situation, your guard will be broken and you're left massively vulnerable. Here the risk and reward is very implicit: stay aggressive, risk your posture bar being full all the time where missing one deflect will end you, or briefly retreat so you can recover Posture, but so can the boss. This should be incredibly obvious with Isshin when you back off to heal.

Also, I double dare you to find me footage of someone perfectly deflecting Genichiro's entire 2-hit -> multi-hit combo, because deflecting the second last hit is downright impossible as far as I've found.

>Ninja game

>don't get to be a ninja

I don't like this game at all, i was so disappointed when my guy was basically forced into stupid head to head combat. No Ninja would be stupid enough to do that before rigging the game beforehand. Like why can't i rig lines like Lady Butterfly for example? Why am i a ninja if i continue to fail to be one and feel like one?

>>16402503

See that's one real issue that I have with the game. You get to be a ninja and do ninja shit right up until you run into a boss. When that happens the game takes off your ninja mask and forces you to put on a ronin hat and have a 1v1 duel.

>>16394209

>one farming run through mibu village

why would you even need to farm?

farming is not fun at all

>>16392662

Shit, in Onimusha you had to attack between the start of their attack and before it hits you, it was even more difficult that parrying in Fromsoft games because you had to account for your own attack animation and theirs.

In order to get those critical one hit kills.

>Found the base game easy as fuck

>Try NG+

>Its even easier

This might be the new easiest game, usurping Demon's Souls. No stamina bar is a fucking limiter release and a half. Without the bell, using the charm and the ichimonji double cheese -which i refuse to use on principle of not being a bitch- i dont see how even none casuals are saying its hard.

Are people that trained to backstab fish, iframe roll and turtle up?

>>16403358

After watching several videos of people trying to play this game, that seems like the case. They just try to stay back and dodge instead of being aggressive and when dodge fails they stay back and try to play Simon Says with parries and they keep their guard down while waiting for attacks. It's like they are scared of hitting the attack button or are hypnotized by the enemy or something, it's weird, they just do basically nothing for 90% of the fight.

>>16402512

>have a 1v1 duel

<Game favorite strategy is to throw multiple enemies at you

>have a 1v1 duel(bosses)

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

Hit

<repeat until you can damage posture>

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

<buttonmash

<block/parry

Cut-scene execution

Throw in some dodges and jumping for variety,perhaps some fireworks for free hits or other tools for extra damage on openings.There you go, you got Sekiro.

I exaggerate , of course, but its really shit that the game doesn't let you do ninja stuff other than the sweet grappling,which I'm 100% sure got refined this much just for PR reasons.

The ninja enemies should feel like characters having limited versions of your skillset, instead its you that get shit moves or limited by emblems, that aren't allowed to have any real power(in general), lest they undermine the block/parry/sidestep shitty combat.

Also beating the game(not really , I'm on sword saint) felt like beating the game's bullshit , not the opponent characters.Thing is, I'm bored of it.I'll try the last boss on and off just to finish the game.

There is pretty much nothing else to do other than the Shura ending for me I think, I'll pass on NG+.

>>16403423

The absence of kaltrops, clones, bombs, summoning dogs and crows and such was off but so was the "HEY HERE'S CATFISH MEN IN A VILLAGE OF UNDEAD MAYBE ITS GOING TO GET CRAZY SUPERNATURAL NOW LIKE BLOODBORNE" and then dragon fight aside its back to dudes with sword and once in a blue moon dude with spear.

You know whats fucked up? Everyone i know has one achievement/trophy to finish it and all they gave up on it and its the same exact one for everybody: unlock all skills.

For example i finished NG+ still needing 32 of them and it was at 65,000xp per level and climbing at an increasing rate. Thats like 1-2 THOUSAND generic mobs to kill and by that point you should have done everything in the game including the shura content if you save scummed it up.

Maybe its because at worst the other games kept some skills behind a simple covenant grind but just killing mobs for hours and hours after you've beaten all the bosses is a fucking lame finale to your experience, and it takes so much xp its always going to be the last thing you check off.

>>16404309

Why are you people obsessed with getting all the skills? maybe just maybe if it is such an absurd grind you're not meant to get them all.

>>16404365

Or you just do it and shut up about it. I'll have as many skills as I want, shitspeaker.

>>16404365

Because its a achievement/trophy to complete the list of challenges set by the developer like i mentioned?

What the fuck is up with the barely literate posters lately? its like dealing with chinese bots.

>>16404386

don't know, but it's pretty bad recently. I know there's one dedicated shill for sekiro who's barely literate.

will there be no-parry challenge run?

>>16404738

no-glitch no-parry and then I'm interested.

>>16404745

I was just fishing for increased i-frame mod

>>16404309

I used cheatengine right before starting NG+ to unlock everything.

An Xp curve should be a trivial thing to fix if you can make enough noise.

>>16404882

Is there any interesting CET publicly available? How far are we yet from boss rush mod?

Holy shit, DMCV is fucking destroyed.

How did they do it, bros?

>>16401265

Just had a rough time getting past Shirahagi, the gun bitch in the poison buddha room. I found I got goomba stomp her deathblow or dash away and dash cut her into a combo. That's one more option than you claim.

>>16403358

Nigger I die 50+ times on many bosses. 100+ on Shirahagi. This is an extremely difficult game.

>>16405702

I have but he won't hop off my dick for the half hour it takes for Sekiro to whip it out, admire the craftsmanship, then swing it. I tried the Ashina Cross too but then I just look like a jackass sheathing my sword while he walks away and chucks some knives at me.

>>16402331

Does it have to be the 2-hit into multi hit or can it just be the multi hit by itself? I can parry the 6 hit pretty easily if not all that reliably and already have video for it. Getting him to do the 2hit first is a little rare to start with.

>>16405716

He has a few pauses that you can take advantage of. The big one is when he throws the anti heal ball at you but he has a few others.

>>16405684

>>16405716

>he throws shurken at you, then jumps into the air for a downward thrust

When he does this, dodge to the side and punish

>he does a two slash attack and pauses a bit after

When he does this, parry and punish immediately after

>he throws a Lloyd'd Talisman or whatever the fuck that prevents you from healing

When he does this, move to the side and punish

>he jumps on your sword and into the air, away from you while throwing shurikens

When he does this, it's safe to heal but only after you block the shurikens

>he throws smoke in the second phase

Keen an eye on him because he's vulnerable at this point in time

>he throws poison at you instead of shurikens and then jumps into the air for a downward thrust

When he does this, curse at him like the nigger he is, or maybe you can try using a prosthetic, but I would just run away otherwise you'll get affected by poison

>he mocks you when you die

Git Gud, faget

Honestly, he's pretty easy once you get it down. It's the second fight that's a pain in the ass.

>>16405684

If he is breaking your poise that means you are blocking and not parrying or parrying when you should be dodging. You need to parry (or dodge) almost everyone of his moves. If you deflect/block his standing still/charged overhead strike it will eat up your poise, you have to dodge that.

>>16405760

>>16405684

Here's a tip, Owl will always follow up his dashing side-slash with the anti-heal talisman IF you aren't already debuffed. As long as you avoid the talisman, he keeps doing that throughout the fight, which gives you a nice long opening while he stands there throwing it to do some damage. If you time it right you can actually hitstun cancel his throw entirely, all because you know the move he does BEFORE the throw.

>>16405760

>he jumps on your sword and into the air, away from you while throwing shurikens

>When he does this, it's safe to heal but only after you block the shurikens

This is absolutely wrong. He can follow his backjump+shurikens with a dashing strike forward, which can immediately chain back into backjump+shurikens. I've seen him do this 3 or 4 times in a row, which is just a giant fuck you to your posture gauge

Update 1.04 going live now. Anybody got the patch notes?

>>16405830

https://www.sekiro.jp/news_detail_190425_01.html

>We would like to thank everyone out there playing Sekiro™: Shadows Die Twice.

>We will be releasing a new patch that fixes an error present in our previously released 1.03 patch.

>Target Platforms

>PlayStation 4, Xbox One, PC

>Release Timing

>April 26th, 2019　10:00 JST

>April 26th, 2019　03:00 CEST

>April 25th, 2019　18:00 PDT

>Release Notes

> Fix for an error in update 1.03, in which the Blazing Bull’s Vitality and Posture were not set correctly.

>We would like to apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused users.

>It is our hope that everyone will continue to play and enjoy Sekiro™: Shadows Die Twice.

>>16406012

When are they gonna fix the glitch where bodies disappear or sink into the ground? Fix the cosmetic things too, guys.

>>16405564

This isn't even good b8. A normal human adult without any mental disabilities should not take more than 5 tries on the hardest bosses. The Demon of Hatred is the only one that isn't "attack twice, deflect until an opening then attack". Unless you were a complete fucking idiot and never noticed deflecting enemy attacks raises their posture gauge and attacking without being deflected lowers your own. Stop trying to back off and turtle like its durk sows.

>>16406763

>A normal human adult without any mental disabilities should not take more than 5 tries on the hardest bosses.

Who are you trying to fool?

>>16396068

Ds3 Dlc redeemed the main game. I never bought dlcs but i needed a closure to darksouls

>>16405684

I always just attacked him after he does his shurikens and slam.

>>16401314

first you were complainig about the lack of variety, now you are outright saying the core combat is thrash. Elaborate, souls are some of my favourite shit, i was worried about this game because people were shitting on it here. Combat is actually great since stealth is part of the combat and not just a pacifist type gameplay, some anon mentioned rythm and optimal strategy, stealth in this game fits that mold as you can always make better and more strategic choices as how you approach each map. The loop is different from souls in this game you usually have a good view of the enemy placement and it's how you approach the whole area that counts, how you optmize who you take down first.

The bosses also have an optimal way to be dealt with. In a sense you are polishing your skill to the utmost perfection. My greatest gripe is the way exploration suffers in this game since you have to actually break from the main loop to search for items, though they're well placed so it's not that tiresome. The fact that the maps are seo big also accentuate this fact since you will have to really go out of your way to get certain things. Souls and bb were more organic in this respect with smaller paths, also normally it would consist of you walking and havin to make choices based on how much risks you were willing to take. And so there was always tension.

>>16407060

In short this a more focused experience all around. Darksouls had a less "deep" combat once you were locked in a build, which fits the western mindset(the iconography used in souls) which is more about dealing with situations in a pragmatic manner(hence the variety of tools at your disposal) instead of the eastern devotion you see on their religions(see the crafting of the budha, and their view of martial arts as away to reddeming the body of seen, or imperfection).

>>16407060

In short this a more focused experience all around. Darksouls had a less "deep" combat once you were locked in a build, which fits the western mindset(the iconography used in souls) which is more about dealing with situations in a pragmatic manner(hence the variety of tools at your disposal) instead of the eastern devotion you see on their religions(see the crafting of the budha, and their view of martial arts as away to reddeming the body of sin, or imperfection).

>>16407081

>>16407075

fugg

>20 more skill levels to go for the platinum

THIS IS SO FUCKING BORING JESUS CHRIST

>>16407311

What if you don't go for the platinum?

Where are you farming anyway? i haven't found the grind that bad honestly

>>16407316

I'm making NG++++ my Shura end so i dont have places like the easy fountainhead one. Theres a 1156xp stealth kill right at the old grave statue and its effortless but fucking tedious.

and i want it just because i've platinumed every From game since Demon's and its kind of the only games i actually try to. I can't buck the OCD trend 6 games in.

>>16407311

Why do this ahead of DLC? Why do you care about meaningless cheevos in the first place? Sort out your life, anon.

>>16407339

He probably doesn't even have the game, look at all the shit he's talking. I'm tired of these people.

>>16407334

>NG+4

>Farming at 1,156xp per reset

Are you brain dead? There are spots you can farm at lower NG levels that are 5k+ every ten seconds.

So I'm missing a couple prayer beads. I have 9 full necklaces now, but where are the other two? I got the ones from the samurai 7 or whatever, and I think I got all the headless + shaman guys, so where are the others? I know you get one from armored warrior, and I think you get one from the undead bull in fountain head, so I'm at a loss here.

>>16406763

>any boss can one or 2 shot you

>you die in seconds if your inputs are perfectly timed

Nice b8 nigger.

>>16407394

>perfectly timed.

Go back and try to parry in DS1 then compare to the obscenely generous parry windows here. Either you are shit b8 or a fucking idiot and either way you look like a dumbass.

>>16407387

>the headless + shaman guys

Those don't drop beads. You might have missed some beads hidden in the map like the one near the Tengu or the one in Mibu village.

>>16405702

Yeah, I'm definitely not good at it. It's like the stars align when it happens on a boss.

>>16407403

Dark Souls doesn't require parrying at all. You never have to parry once and the game is easily beatable. This game forces parrying.

>>16407387

Now that I think about it - did you revisit Hirata after beating Owl? There's a couple of them there, I missed that in my first run.

>>16407414

That must be why people like lobos did full clear no parry runs weeks ago then?

I swear zoomers get so mad when they can't beat a game and come up with the silliest excuses for the easiest from game in the series. You have all the tools to bully every boss and only demon should give you a chance of trouble just because its a mix up and breaks the formula to return to bloodbornes "stick behind the leading leg" boss strategy that its spent the game getting you out of.

>>16407387

There are a fair few in chests and one behind a hidden rotating wall in the castle to the right of the central area where the old lazy and two samurai patrol. But dont forget to check underwater in every body of water after the mibu village boss gives you the dive ability.

>>16407421

Let me think. I defeated all the main bosses:

>gyoubu oniwa

>fire bull

>butterfly lady

>genichiro 1

>folding screen monkeys

>guardian ape

>guardian ape + friend

>corrupted phantom monk

>corrupted monk for real

>owl 1 + 2

>blue dragon

>genichiro 2

>sword saint isshin

Then I defeated all of these mini bosses:

>chained ogre at beginning

>chained ogre in ashina castle

>chained ogre in ruined outskirts

>samurai in the tutorial

>samurai in ashina outskirts at beginning 1 + 2

>samurai with spear at moon viewing tower

>samurai at entrance to ashina castle

>samurai before final fight with genichiro and isshin

>blue garb swordsman before genichiro 1

>blue garb red eye swordsman during ashina siege

>armored warrior

>shinobi hunter in hirata estate

>purple shinobi in sekiro's cell

>purple shinobi at hirata estate

>purple shinobi near sunken valley shrine

>giant white snake

>drunkard at hirata estate 1 + 2

>drunkard in the woods before mibu village

>drunkard in ashina outskirts during siege

>headless guarding demon bell

>headless in pond at ashina castle

>headless in the well in sunken valley

>headless in forest before mibu village

>headless in the ashina abandoned dungeon

>headless at fountainhead

>shaman in the abandoned dungeon

>shaman inside the headless ape boss room

>shaman at fountainhead

>snake eyes shirahagi in poison pit

>snake eyes shirahagi in gun fort

>edward scissor hands in gun fort + mt. obongo

>orin of the water

>ookami leader in fountainhead

>undead bull in fountainhead

Then, I found the beads inside these chests:

>attic area in tower where you first meet oni mask isshin

>in a pool of water in mt. kongobongo

>in the caves after gun fort

>fountainhead depths near headless

>mibu village shrine before monk

>mibu village pond

and that's about all I can remember off the top of my head, but there may be more that I'm not remembering now.

>>16407511

Copy-paste from Fextralife:

Ashina Outskirts (5)

1x Dropped by General Naomori Kawarada upon defeat in the Outskirts Wall - Gate Path.

1x Dropped by Chained Ogre upon defeat in the Outskirts Wall - Stairway.

1x Dropped by Tenzen Yamauchi upon defeat in the Outskirts Wall - Stairway.

1x In a chest in the attic of the temple where you speak with the Tengu of Ashina for the 1st time. You must grapple up the rafters and then wall jump into the attic.

1x Dropped by the Blazing Bull upon defeat in the Ashina Castle Gate.

Ashina Outskirts - after set ablaze (1)

1x Dropped from Shigekichi of the Red Guard upon defeat, he is located in the courtyard past the stairway gate in Outskirts Wall - Stairway.

Hirata Estate (3)

1x Dropped by Shinobi Hunter Enshin of Misen upon defeat in the Bamboo Thicket Slope.

1x Dropped by Juzou the Drunkard upon defeat in the Main Hall Courtyard.

1x in a chest behind the hidden wall near the Hirata Audience Chamber Sculptor's Idol. The hidden wall is denoted by a wall scroll at the end of the pathway being patrolled by the Bandit Soldier & Bandit Archer.

Hirata Estate - second memory (2)

1x from Lone Shadow Masanaga the Spear-Bearer where you found dying Owl in the 1st Memory.

1x from Juzou the Drunkard rematch.

Ashina Castle (5)

1x Dropped by General Kuranosuke Matsumoto upon defeat at the top of the stairway leading to Ashina Castle.

1x Dropped by Lone Shadow Longswordsman upon defeat in the Ashina Reservoir Well.

1x Dropped by Seven Ashina Spears - Shikibu Toshikatsu Yamauchi upon defeat in the Ashina Reservoir.

1x In a chest behind a hidden wall in the Upper Tower - Antechamber. The hidden wall is located between the two sets of armor behind the two Blue-Robed Samurai sitting in a room on the right.

1x Dropped by Ashina Elite - Jinusuke Saze upon defeat in the Ashina Dojo.

Ashina Castle - after overrun with Shinobi (3)

1x Dropped by Lone Shadow Masanaga the Spear-Bearer upon defeat at the Great Serpent Shrine. Only before Ashina has been set ablaze.

1x Dropped by Lone Shadow Vilehand upon defeat in the Ashina Dojo.

1x Dropped by the Chained Ogre upon defeat in the bottom of the Upper Tower. Jump down from the Upper Tower - Antechamber Sculptor's Idol area where two Samurai and an Old Lady are walking.

Ashina Castle - after set ablaze (2)

1x Dropped from Seven Ashina Spears - Shume Masaji Oniwa upon defeat in the Ashina Resevoir.

1x Dropped by the Red-Eyed Ashina Elite - Ujinari Mizou in the hidden Dojo below Isshin Ashina's Room. This is the same room that contained 3 Nightjar Shinobi prior to defeating Genichiro Ashina and contained 1 Nightjar Shinobi and 1 Lone Swordsman Shinobi after Ashina Castle has been overrun by Shinobi.

Abandoned Dungeon (1)

1x Sold by Dungeon Memorial Mob for 1400 sen.

Senpou Temple, Mt. Kongo (3)

1x Dropped by the Armored Warrior upon defeat atop the mountain past the Shugendo Sculptor's idol.

1x Dropped by Long Arm Centipede Sen-Un upon defeat in the Temple Grounds.

1x From the Temple Grounds Sculptor's Idol jump into the pond containing two Treasure Carps and dive. This can only be obtained after acquiring the Mibu Breathing Technique Latent Skill.

Sunken Valley (4)

1x From the Under-Shrine Valley Sculptor's idol, turn around and walk up the hill slightly. Grappling across to tree stump. Kill the two Riflemen. Double-jump and climb up the wall next to them. Hug the wall and shimmy around the ledge. On the other side, drop down to find the prayer bead in the snow.

1x Dropped by Snake Eyes Shirafuji upon defeat near the Sunken Valley Idol.

1x Dropped by Long-arm Centipede Giraffe upon defeat in the Gun Fort.

1x After defeating Long-Arm Centipede Giraffe, there is a hole in the floor to the left of the statue. Crouch and follow the left path to the chasm. Follow the two grapple hooks to the right to the first platform. Look up and to the right for the next grapple point to the next platform. Walk across the platform then look down and to the left for the final grapple point. This item will be on the ground in the center the mini-centipedes and poison geckos.

[cont]

Ashina Depths (8)

1x Dropped by Snake Eyes Shirahagi upon defeat in the Poison Pools.

1x Past the fog gate guarded by Snake Eyes Shirahagi, just before the drop into the Ape's Den, look up and to the left. There will be a grapple point. Follow the path until the spot where you have to crouch. Go past the first overhang, stand up, turn left, and jump up on the ledge. Follow the path and climb the wall using consecutive wall jumps. Look up towards the statues head and grapple. The item will be on top of the statue's head. Video Location

1x Dropped by Tokujiro the Glutton upon defeat in the Misty Forest.

2x Dropped by the Headless Ape upon defeat in the Ashina Depths. You must first defeat the Guardian Ape in the Sunken Valley Passage before you can fight this boss.

1x Dropped by O'Rin of the Water upon defeat in Mibu Village.

1x From the Water Mill Sculptor's Idol go through O'rin of the Water's arena, over the bridge, and up to the house. There is an opening to the right-side of the house's stairs you can crouch under. Go to the left side of the house, look up and interact with the revolving floorboards. Go outside the house and grapple to the 2nd Floor. This item is on the Shrine surrounded by Spirit Emblems.

1x In a chest at the bottom of the Lake in Mibu Village. This can only be obtained after receiving the Mibu Breathing Technique Latent Skill.

Fountainhead Palace (3)

1x Dropped by Sakura Bull of the Palace upon defeat. Once you make it to the Sculptor's Idol past the courtyard full of flute-playing Nobles, turn left and run down the length of the palace. The Sakura Bull will appear from around the corner once you are about 1/2 way down the length of the palace. Note: If you land a stealth deathblow, you will still have to fight the bull as it does not kill it.

1x located at the bottom of the Great Colored Carp Lake. There is a pit in the lake with 2 headless and a giant skeleton with glowing worms on it. The prayer bead is located around the skeleton. You do not have to kill headless to retrieve.

1x Dropped by Okami Leader Shizu upon defeat at the Sakura Tree.

>>16407552

>1x in a chest behind the hidden wall near the Hirata Audience Chamber Sculptor's Idol. The hidden wall is denoted by a wall scroll at the end of the pathway being patrolled by the Bandit Soldier & Bandit Archer.

>x in a chest behind the hidden wall near the Hirata Audience Chamber Sculptor's Idol. The hidden wall is denoted by a wall scroll at the end of the pathway being patrolled by the Bandit Soldier & Bandit Archer.

It was these two that I was missing.

Other than the dried serpent viscera is there anything worth exploring the snake cave for? I'm guessing not.

>>16407582

ok I see that I pasted the same one twice. The other one I found needed was inside the hidden room in Hirata estate, behind the shinobi wall.

>>16407434

>game encourages playing a specific way to absurd degrees to the point it's considered a challenge meme run to not do it

>someone does it

<hurrr fucking zoomers see the game doesn't force it

<hyperbole doesn't exist

Christ, people who defend sekiro as the second coming must have some form of brain damage

>>16407060

Because it extremely encourages a very boring playstyle, and dangles tools that could be fun in front of you while limiting their use. While sure you could try to have fun, know that the game is going to resist you doing so every step of the way because it wants you extremely deeply to play it as this slog of poor design choices. You stealth, not because the stealth is fun or in depth, but because it means you have to do the awful slog combat for less time. The core combat loop coupled with the completely reactionary (both AI and player) combat is extremely shallow and boring as all hell. If there were some variety you could at least be like "well yeah I don't like the sword combat but I do like X,Y or Z" but in sekiro the game will fight you even attempting to do X,Y or Z. You want fun ninja tools? fuck you they're extremely limited because of how much hp our bosses have. You want to stealth and be a ninja? fuck you stabbing someone through their throat is only good enough to halfway kill them or 1/3rd kill them. Instead you're just a dark souls character with extremely limited choices and only one weapon, enemies that don't feel like they were designed around your moveset at all, and an extremely generic story with how much they pushed "your character is a character". I called in the first minute of playing the game "your character is going to have to kill kuro or sacrifice himself and half the game is going to be a fetch quest for random shit to unlock a door", and lo and behold I was right because from can't write a story.

>>16396504

Its stated in the game that resurrecting people brings the prime version of a person back from the dead.

>>16407620

There isn't anything else in there, save for the back exit.

>>16408351

There's an exit?

>>16408376

Takes you to Ashina Depths, the room with the snake eyes miniboss

>>16407772

there's absolutely nothing wrong with the sword combat

>>16407665

Congratulations, you managed to post the same one 3 times.

I'm guessing the other one you needed was in a hidden room in Hirata estate Ashina Castle near the Upper Tower Antichamber idol.

>>16408447

just press parry twice when he swoops in once you enter his range, do this often enough and he'll kill his own posture bar

>>16408461

You can actually deflect it? I have only ever been able to deflect the first hit, tried many different timings before concluding it was one of those unblockable attacks without a perilous symbol to warn you.

>>16408447

Are you talking about the red-eyes Iai-jutsu faggot? Because you beat him the same way you beat the normal iai dude. Either double-parry his ass or do this if you are a pussy ass faggot yourself >>16395908

>>16408472

the ashina cross is a quick 2-hit strike, so quickly parrying it twice will solve your problem

>>16408447

Okay my guy, get ready to feel dum-dum.

Red eyes are afraid of fire. You know what counts as fire? The red umbrella. Take it out, parry his attack AND he cowers for a few seconds, leaving you ample time to get some hits in. Rinse, repeat, he's dead in under 20 seconds.

and this is why you pirate games

>>16408669

Using this to "justify" pirating

Fuck off just admit you deserve free games, I have and I don't give a fuck getting them

>>16408669

I pirated Sekiro, then bought it a few days later because I was really enjoying it.

>>16409029

I'm not justifying anything you braindead faggot. It's almost impossible to downgrade modern games through steam to previous patch versions. I don't deserve jack shit. I pirate games because 99% of devs/pubs are kike cocksuckers who don't deserve a dime, much like the film industry, So go ahead, waste your money on meaningless shit, no one cares faggot. Don't get your panties in a wad and be defensive like some unpaid shill defending a company that could care less. The jokes on you faggot.

>>16409056

Good for you, no one cares. You're doing a good job of being a little consumer. Now that's something to be proud of.

>>16392544

Reminder that Sekiro is set in a period in japanese history where same sex relations weren't frowned upon and sex between young and old was common, so whatever fanfic you come up with Sekiro destroying Kuro, The Divine Child, Emma, Isshin or even Genjiro's ass is perfectly valid.

Sekiro is a rthyhm game because parrying requires timing.

DMCVfags have turned full mad.

>>16408669

>This is why you pirate games

>Because buffing previously-useless abilities in order to make them usable is bad, apparently.

I pirated anyway, but the update is good. The only nerf was to one ability that was clearly out of line. All the other skills and most of the prosthetics got buffs of some form in order to make them better. You'd have to be pretty retarded to want to play on the old patch unless you are trying to speedrun and need the old glitches.

>>16409151

>You're doing a good job of being a little consumer. Now that's something to be proud of.

>Paying for things you enjoy is bad.

Yeah, sure thing, champ. I want them to make more games like this so I give them money. Is that difficult to understand, nigger?

>>16408351

Where does it exit to? is the area worth it?

>>16409234

>Sekirofags are so butthurt they have to bring up DMC5 out of nowhere

You can like both and point the flaws of both you raging homo.

>>16396720

Just wait till you face the underwater headless or the somethingsomething warrior that bullet hells you with balls of terror.

>>16410753

Underwater is way easier and the Shimichen warriors are trivial with confetti and anti-terror items. You can demolish their orbs in seconds and set them into the pattern of shooting the beam.

>>16410763

I mostly just hide under the purple umbrella until they jump and then do the anti-air death blow on them.

>>16407772

There really is a severe imbalance in the game design. It wants to be about fast, breathless sword fights, but pumps up boss health and posture to such an absurd degree that encounters just become a slog. It wants to be a stealthy ninja game, but then locks you in an arena (fog wall and all!) like it’s Dark Souls. And yes the game gives you the tools to win, but who wants to use them? Because holy fuck, that katana is the least interesting, least satisfying main weapon I’ve yet to see in a From game (part of that is because of the player characters excessive floatiness).

>>16410807

>but pumps up boss health and posture to such an absurd degree that encounters just become a slog

the bosses would be too easy and go down in like a minute if that wasn't the case

I think the problem is rather that you're playing too cautiously as opposed to embed related

>>16410767

I never once figured out the anti-air deathblow. How the fuck does it work and are you able to actually fully one-shot a healthbar of a boss with it?

>>16409478

It goes to the Poison Pool area. From the Poison pool idol, you can see the opening just above and behind you. It's effectively a one-way shortcut that goes from the back of the shrine to there.

>>16410753

>>16410763

Almost without fail, the most challenging bosses in the game have some kind of cheese related to them or bizarre mechanic you'd never think about. When you go back and NG+ it or read some guides, you'll get really annoyed.

>The game was designed with the idea you would stand in front of enemies fighting them fairly. Almost all bosses can just be ran from, thus allowing you to bait out specific moves you can punish rather than fighting them fairly.

>Firecrackers work on basically every single enemy and boss in the game, and will stun and interrupt whatever they are doing. This allows you to break annoying chains or stunlock an enemy by firecracker+attack+firecracker+attack for guaranteed damage. This can be combo'd with Ash, as many human-sized enemies/bosses will be stunned by it as well, allowing you to ash+attack+ash+attack.

>Basically every attack can be parried. Giant ape fists that send shockwaves can be parried, earth-shattering spear throws can be parried. Successfully parrying these will often lead to the boss collapsing or going off-balance for high posture damage and letting you sneak hits in.

>The AI will always focus on the thing that damaged them last. When you are able to turn NPCs to your side or bring them into a fight, you can use this to do insane damage, let the NPC get one hit so the target will start turning towards them, then go apeshit again.

For specific enemies,

>Drunkard's arena in Hirata Estates can be cleared first. If you run out of the arena and hide, Drunkard will then turn around and walk back, letting you stealthkill one of his healthbars. Immediately run to the friendly NPC, get him to help you fight, and you can cheese the entirety of the second healthbar just by staying at his back, slashing repeatedly, and backing off to let the NPC get a hit occasionally to fuck the AI's targetting.

>Assuming you got even one health upgrade and are on your first playthrough, Gyoubu Horse-Boy isn't actually able to damage you. His moves are too slow to punish blockbreak and hit too weak to do much posture damage. This means you can literally hug the horse the whole fight, hold block, slash when it is safe, and be completely untouched through both phases. Firecrackers will also obviously give you much longer stuns to abuse if you bought them.

>Blazing Bull's AI is broken to always try to face you. As soon as the fight starts, just run towards the cow's ass. This will make it run off and skid-turn to face you. Follow it when it does this, stay on its asscheek, and it will repeat this pattern forever. Every time you get close, just charge-slash once and whittle the health down. If you ever accidentally face it head on, dodge like mad to get behind it, use firecrackers, and resume the pattern.

>Lady Butterfly's attack pattern is just slow enough that if you spam dodge+attack, she will be locked in place and take constant damage. Dodge counter-clockwise around her, attack from dodge, immediately dodge again, attack from dodge, and she will be unable to even attack you. She may block your strike, but just keep doing it. This works in both phases, but in the second phase you might tank some damage from butterflies. Additionally, if she ever does leap up onto a rope, spam some shiruken as hitting her when she is airborne will immediately drop her and do high posture damage.

>A lot of people have trouble with the asshole spear-miniboss where you originally rescued the divine heir in the tutorial area. The area is huge, so bait out a mikiri counter, then wait. He will usually follow this with a massive swing or sticking his spear into the earth and uppercutting with it. Both can be parried, and parrying either will send him stumbling off balance for even more posture damage and a free hit.

>>16411161

>The ninja in the well where the game started (and this applies to all enemies of this type/minibosses that show up later) do fairly fast attacks. Parrying is key. But the important thing is that after a few chains, they will do a red charge attack where they raise their foot and stand in place. You can parry this if you time it right, but this actually counts as a thrust, and can be mikiri countered much more easily.

>Do not bother fighting headless till mid-game or later since they are a pain in the ass and drop nothing of real value. Buy the purple gourd from outside Mibu village; it holds 5 charges, and both removes terror AND slows terror buildup. Pop it before any terror-related fights and whenever terror builds up. Headless' slow-aura can be dispelled just by doing damage, so the safest and quickest strategy is simply to pop confetti, gourd and red-candy and charge in swinging. Parry occasionally if you can, but do your best to just spam damage. Expect to die, but you can fairly easily out-damage the headless into 2nd phase, die again, and repeat.

>Purple-orb boys are similar but significantly easier. The orbs and bullshit is just a distraction; gourd, confetti, red candy, and rush into them swinging. They won't attack back at close range usually, and their orbs can't get at you if you are right on top of them. Do tons of damage, dispel their aura, and when they go invisible, wait. They will re-appear and fire a beam at you. Counter to all logic, this beam CAN BE PARRIED to negate all damage and terror. Wait for it, block right before it reaches you, rush towards them so they can't use actual attacks, resume damage. Do this 3-4 times and the fight ends.

>O'rin of Water is a pure parry fight. Don't even bother doing damage. Stand there like an asshole and accurately parry the first few moves, then just fan the parry button when she starts doing quicker combos. If your posture is ever broken, she will try to grab you. Spam B, and you can recover and dodge to the side before she grabs you. Repeat till dead.

>Centipede after the gun-fort is just a tutorial boss teaching you how to fan the block button. When he does his combos, just rapidly press the block button to parry everything. This works on any boss with fast attack combos.

>Fake Monk can be stunlocked by ash+attack+ash, or firecracker+attack+firecracker, or both. Confetti to make the fight easier, red candy if you want, stunlock and spam.

>Guardian ape, again, can have all of his attacks parried. Get in his face and do so, use firecrackers, try to stay nearby at all times but watch for grabs. Also a note; Ape is one of the only bosses that will counter firecrackers by sometimes collapsing forward for damage when you use them. Get behind him or to the side whenever you use them just in case. Headlessape is an absolute cakewalk and all the sword blows can be parried. Do some damage, parry, run if he starts charging his scream, repeat. If he stands up super tall and brings his sword down, parry, and he'll be stunned for a short period.

>Headless Ape 2 electric boogaloo is the exact same, but when phase 2 starts and he brings in the other ape, immediately switch focus. Other ape has absolute trash posture, so drop a firecracker, attack till he recovers, drop another firecracker, attack. Back off if headless starts to be a bitch but 2-3 firecrackers and the other ape will be posture broken very quickly, and you can resume the fight.

>Small thing, but during the Dragon fight with the horde of tree-dragons, you can leap onto one of the trees left from the attacks and deathblow from above into the crowd. This will do an animation where Sekiro swings the corpse in a huge circle, oneshotting any dragons nearby. Try to cluster them and you can eliminate this whole phase in a few seconds.

>For the final boss, Phase 1 and 2 are done normally. For phase 3 and 4, completely ignore the boss and start running. The boss has no response to this but to shoot at you ineffectively or chase you. If he is chasing, let him get close to do an attack, but run off again as soon as the animation starts. Eventually, he will try to leap at you. Run towards him as soon as he starts leaping, you will run under him and can charge stab him in the ass. Both phase 3 and 4 can be done this way taking no damage.

>>16411074

You don't have to double-tap to parry it accurately. On and 'quick' attack chain, the game just wants you to rapid parry. As soon as you see the sword glint, just spam block and you'll parry both attacks. Works for shitty red-eye guy below Isshin's room, and the other miniboss before you fight Genichiro.

>>16411162

That doesn't even mention that actual retardation that the spear gets a special property only against headless ape. If you hit him after he falls down in the neck, the spear yanks the centipede out for a lot of posture damage. It's absolutely retarded because the spear never has had that mechanic before.

Also it fails to mention that every single human boss uses Dark Souls 3 AI, so you can bait both forms of owl into an infinite dodge loop by just not targeting him and swinging at his side while hitting him. If you get him caught in a corner while doing this he actually can never recover.

>>16411172

I actually never knew that first one. Cut me some slack, Jack, wasn't mean to be a 'how to beat every single boss', just some lesser known cheeses or easy tips for bosses folks here are known to have difficulty with. That headless spear trick is neat, but the boss itself is so piss easy you'd probably not need it. In Guardian Ape, they just rely on you already having used much of your healing and recover with the Ape phase, and in the headless 2 fight bringing in the second ape. The headless ape itself has only like 3 different attacks, all of which are incredibly telegraphed.

>>16411199

Yeah, it is an easy fight, I was just pointing out that the spear thing is very dumb because it's not set up as a thing the spear can do.

>>16411203

it is said that the spear can take armor off enemies don't know which one though and it's not like the game has to tell you every possible interaction in it.

>>16411212

There's a difference between "vague attribute" and "here's a unique interaction that's never used, mentioned, or anything remotely similar"

>>16411212

Yea but it's not even logical, you expect shit like the mortal blade to work on the ape but it doesnt. That the game has these weird interactions while simultaniously fucking you over with interactions that are supposed (according to the description) to work is just infuriating.

>>16411215

But you have something similar, i just remembered, you can pull enemies towards you with the spear, is not really that surprising you can do that with the centipede

>>16411212

There are like 3 or 4 of those fatass retards with huge clubs that have a small plate of armor over their stomachs, preventing damage from the front. Right after the bridge where you are told about it is one with a bell; spear and pull removes the armor. Personally I too never made the connection and thought they were talking about Robert's Dad on the bridge, since he's so armored you literally can't hurt him. To be completely fair, almost every single prosthetic is utterly useless and never touched except for Firecracker. The rest are so insanely situational they only come out for one or two enemies or enemy types and then are never touched.

>>16411221

It's pretty different, especially because no other enemy reacts like that to any tool. It's just a dumb thing that makes the game feel less finished. The spear in general just feels unfinished, there's only like… 3? or so enemies in the game that can have their armor stripped, in spite of a ton of enemies having armor.

>>16411224

Tell me about it, the tools are a massive letdown, especially because some of them would be fun if they had more polish.

>>16411232

Which is doubly weird cause the tools have equally lots and little development at once. I remember on NG+, I used that terror-shield umbrella to negate the headless ape's scream, then did an attack from shielded and there is a great animation of two blades being imbued with terror as you strike forward. It even caused the ape to stagger. And while cool, I was thinking 'there are literally maybe 3 enemies in the whole game you could use this against, why does it exist'. Same goes for the fire umbrella; only two enemies seriously use fire in the whole game, why do they merit a whole separate upgrade? There are 4-5 different 'versions' of shuriken, but since it does fuckall posture or health damage even as lazurite, all you need is the basic one to knock the 4-5 enemies out of the air who leap upward and give you time to react. It's weird how they all are developed and seemingly try to offer alternate strategies, but the entire game is based around 'figure out how we want you to beat this boss' instead of the usual Fromsoft method of 'Use your unique build to overcome this challenge'.

>>16411224

>>16411252

You're exaggerating, there's no doubt something wrong with the tools mechanic, but they nowhere near useless well some are

>>16411289

The Shinobi tools are much better developed than the dogshit hunter’s tools in Bloodborne. My complaints are the opposite, more with the core combat mechanics.

So is it possible to get up into the cave in front of the idol in the poison swamp area at all?

>>16411695

yeah, from the sunken valley

>>16411695

I just said it here

>>16411143

>>16411143

That is so gay. They should have rewarded anyone with balls enough to go through that god forsaken cave.

>>16403358

>have a lot of respect for seraphim17

>even he struggles in this game

I'm calling bullshit on your opinion, even if it's easy for you you just may be abnormally talented.