>>15474205
>that stated, alot of games, especially MMORPGs, are skinner boxes,
All vidya are. 100%. Even simulations are skinner boxes (here you go Mr. scientist, a nice, lovely, yummy new piece of data! Better work harder for the next morsel!)
>what makes people get in the skinner box in the first place?
Boredom and instinct. We're programmed to do, to react to our environment.
>what makes people get to the point where they care about the food dispenser in the skinner box?(higher lvls, etc.)
Without motivation people don't do things. They go and turn to the actions that DO have motivators (hunger, thirst, horny, etc).
>and just how bad is the burnout from finally getting that last bit of food from the food dispenser?
It can get pretty bad. I had vidya burnout so bad in my 20s I almost left the hobby behind entirely.
>is it okay to have grinds in a game as long as theres not many of them, they are infrequently desired, and they're all short grinds?
Depends on the game, the designer, and the audience. I, personally, don't mind grinding when it is done correctly (I LOVE the grind of the first Dragon Warrior game, I find it meditative and rewarding since the game was brutal difficult in my mind as a kid). Most of the time the timing is off due to a lack of research like what Blizzard has done into addictive behaviors and manipulation techniques (Facebook changed the notification from blue to red because RED gets people's attention and they saw an increase in people clicking after making the change. Yes, we're being manipulated, constantly).
>those questions cause me to think of the notion of a game where there is no such thing as levelling up, gear is all ordinary stuff, and the main thing to do in the game, is whatever it is that draws players to skinner boxes in the first place, except without getting drawn into a skinner box
Leveling up and getting gear is the motivator in the skinner box. You'll need some other motivator in that case, like the "score" in old Sierra Adventure games, Easter eggs for performance or secret knowledge, etc.
>again, what is it that draws players into skinner boxes?
Again, boredom and a lack of more pressing survival needs like the need for food, water, shelter. There may be a good hook to get people in, but even that hook is itself a part of the skinner box. I think what you might be getting at is the way the rewards get paced, particularly in MMOs. Just notice the IRL time difference between level 1 ->2 and, say, 59-> 60. It is EASY at first, low skill, high reward for low investment. That tapers off over time, creating a mental state not dissimilar to gambling addicts, always looking for the next dopamine hit.
>is it the premise of the game? is it the premise of a part of the game?
It is the unspoken and often unconscious desire for dopamine/serotonin hits in the brain. Literally neuro-chemical addiction.
>what other than the premise or atmosphere or cute girls or popularity can draw people to MMORPGs?
Socializing is big as that is one of the base human needs. The ability to stand out, to out rank others in some competition.
>what can draw people to video games, specifically MMORPGs, that doesn't just wear off after a week of playing, such as initially being fun?
Nothing, it all wears out as your brain adjusts to the dopamine feedback loop. meditation is the cure but good luck selling THAT to the instant gratification generation
>but that last quote sort of makes me think: is it possible to have a game that has in-game money, but neither has the game turn into a skinner box by having in-money, nor have said in-game money become useless after gaining about an hour's worth of it?
Nope.
>are there any MMORPGs that aren't skinner boxes?
Nope. Nor are there any games of any genre, either.
>do you just make those by making them be a sandbox game?
All games are skinner boxes, anon.