/v/ - Video Games

Polygons > everything else and if you don't understand why you are a lost cause

>>14914015

No, it's because devs aren't willing to put in the time and effort.

>>14914033

>just take my word for it guys

Everything these retards have claimed has been debunked. They are retarded scammers.

I'll wait until they actually have a proof of concept playable demo that we can test out. For all we know they could be leasing a supercomputer or something.

Pretty sure the problem with this is that it can't directly animate. The trees could be as detailed as they want, but the leaves will never sway in the wind because that would involve dynamically calculating the movements of billions of particles. Also any sort of collision still has to be boxed in standard polygons as well but that's easier to manage.

SAGE HIDE REPORT=

http://www.codersnotes.com/notes/euclideon-explained/

>>14914056

Go shill somewhere else. A lot of people don't know about this, and the more people we can get the word out to, the more pressure will be on devs to implement it, even if it won't be for a few years.

>>14914062

>retard who can't even write a single line of code on python and loves to shill for retarded debunked scammers who claim they have found the key to unlimited detail tells me that I am the shill

Immediately shove a tube in your aorta and put the other end of it in your mouth and start drinking, retard

Last time I read about virtual geometry John Carmack said we wouldn't have the hardware to do sparse voxel octrees for several more years. Then the virtual texture data can be stored with that.

>>14914087

When was that?

This shit is the solar roadways of vidya

>>14914162

>she actually said "netorare"

Kanna is cute! CUUUTE!

>>14914039

>nobody from academia or rendering, VFX or gaming industries have used this method because they're lazy lol

>still defending this shit EIGHT YEARS later

Nigga you dumb.

Voxels are superior in every way.

>>14914056

>Please, just go buy a PS4 today

haha

>>14913981

Its just voxels but everyone else is ignoring voxels so at least give these guys credit for trying to explore the tech, even if they overhype and exaggerate what it really is. They aren't snake oil salesmen trying to sell a scam, like anon's like to believe with no grounding and these guys get "debunked" by industry insiders the same way stuff like Denuvo being harmful to your system gets "debunked."

>>14914401

>Please, just go buy a PS4 today

He says that if you want unlimited detail aka any other game that isn't the bullshit euclideon makes, then just buy a console. He doesn't say please neither is the artiicle about shilling for consoles you absolute zero-argument retarded nigger.

>They aren't snake oil salesmen trying to sell a scam,They aren't snake oil salesmen trying to sell a scam

Yeah that's why they've been shilling for "their" obsolete tech for 10 years that has been around for 3 decades and they keep showing indieshit-tier visuals despite hyping their engine as unlimited detail.

Kill yourself.

>>14914444

Who's paying you to shill against this thread or are you just that mad. For one, that article you linked says that lighting is impossible with voxels but the OP webm clearly shows working reflections. If anything, the tech isn't purely voxels and is cheating somewhere. The tech isn't obsolete so much as its divergent from the path gfx tech has taken. Its another unexplored branch that these people are trying to explore and for some reason retards like you gotta be so mad about it you post 4 times in 30 minutes. But go ahead and call me and everyone else who disagrees with you a drooling retard. This thread is about having a discussion, not about you (((shutting it down.)))

>>14914056

>Visible voxel artifacts in a so-called Unlimited Detail engine.

his proof of in engine artifacts is a compressed video on yt

>tl;dr – GPUs get better every year. If you want unlimited detail, just go buy a PS4 today.

really?

>But please, don't give these hacks any money.

it's almost as if company uses gaming to get more hype around it but see it's application elsewhere

>>14914499

> defiantly

*definitely

>>14914444

I'll check your digits, but you're wrong. The tech isn't obsolete, the problem is nobody is working on it because it's easier to keep working with outdated polygons. At least Australia >>14914499 (checked) knows what's up.

It's a scam. A con. A false promise. You have been bamboozled by a ruse.

>>14914807

>what is a fractal

:^)

>>14915452

Prove it, faggot. Just because it hasn't been done doesn't mean that it can't be done. Did you even watch the video?

>>14913981

I watched some of their recent videos, they simply got some business offers from the industrial sector and made software for 3D design using data from 3D scanners. They have some really impressive tech going on. Most importantly, it's all based on a fast point cloud data search algorithm which can pull the points quickly straight from the hard drive instead of trying to copy shit to ram first.

Imo the biggest problem with point cloud data would be the data size. Already the polygonal games are nearing the 100GB mark. Here, environments alone would take up huge chunks of space, not to mention the game logic and animations. I can see a combination of pointcloud and polygoins being used in some experimental games pretty soon though, but we're gonna need much larger disks and faster internet for that.

>>14915780

> Prove it

Okay. >>14914056

>>14915945

That's bullshit.

>>14913981

How can a human being sound so annoying?

An interesting proposition is to use voxels for LOD rendering, and using traditional polygon rendering for geometry near the camera (vid related).

Voxelization has its place in the future of rendering, namely for doing accurate bounce lighting.

For a more realistic voxel engine, Atomontage is much more promising than Unlimited Memetail:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nr5JqYYye3w

It still has the problems with animation though, where the animation is limited to the framerate it's captured in.

Sure. As long as i don't pay anything to anyone for the games that utilize this.

Never give money to studios, companies or corporations. Entertainment must be free.

Why is this meme constantly posted as proof of something? Inswear we are the only ones who remember this crap.

this thread should be deleted and the faggot op banned

>>14916355

"point cloud data" in this context refers to a collection of data organized in a 3D grid.

"The cloud" is a term referring to software that stores data on a server that is accessed by the client application. Google Docs is a "cloud" application because the data representing the documents, as well as the software that edits those files, is stored on Google's servers, and provided to the user when they open Google Docs. Specifically, Google Docs is Software as a Service (SaaS). Cloud services aren't really a scam, but they do limit what the user can do with software, which is bad.

>>14916355

>Is "Cloud" just an industry code for scam?

lel.

Point cloud is a form of data something similar to voxels but fundamentally different. Voxels are basically a 3D raster image– that is, grid aligned cubes. A point cloud on the other hand is a series of volume-irrelevant points, or particles, each with their own 3D coordinate values. The fundamental difference is similar to the difference between a 2D raster image and a 2D vector image.

>>14916355

Nah, clouds are made of servers, balancing routers and some other shit.

>>14915954

Great argument. Reported for clearly being a paid shill for these scam artists.

>>14916603

Technically speaking, "The Cloud" is made of corporate suit gobbledegook

>>14916355

(((Cloud)))

More like

Mandatory Always Online

I thought he came up with a tool awhile back to convert polygonal shit to his engine. Guess nothing came of it

>>14913981

Oh look its this guy again.

Just remember kids, Chris Robberts has been at his scam for less time than the Euclideon guys have been at their scam. You guys haven't got anything to show for the past 10 years of development besides that god awful retarded as fuck hologram ammusement park in Brisbane.

>>14918027

>nothing has come of it

Did you even read the thread?

>>14915874

>>14914499

Lowpoly is objectively the best aesthetic for videogames. Realism can go fuck itself.

I work with point clouds. They take tons of computing power.

>>14918653

>some retarded business jews with too much money on their hands fell for the scam

>this somehow validates the technology

you're either underage or braindeadly retarded or both

most likely you're also some kind of nigger

>>14913981

Shit scam trying to sell voxels as something else. There are companies out there actually trying to make voxels work for video games and easier to work with. Companies like Atomontage who are legitimately trying to make voxels a strong alternative to geometry deserve everyone's attention more than Euclideon's decrepit old scam.

>>14915962

I remember that post; it's from Notch's old tumblr.

>>14920610

Oh God, I still remember how much shit everyone gave him for that too, which all amounted to:

>notch

>>14913981

>Euclideon

I was just thinking about these aussie frauds a couple days ago. Mostly about the last thread where an obvious shill came here and had eerily specific and quick recall of obscure information about a company that's done pretty much jack shit besides useless tech demos. It was hilarious. Wish I archived it.

Lots of misunderstanding in this thread.

1) "Unlimited detail" isn't voxels, it's a point cloud. You can have an arbitrry number of dots in arbitrary densities, each with it's own 3d float position. On the other hand, voxels are a 3d bitmap: equal density.

2) Point cloud has useful applications in 3d scanning and archiving (say, archiving a 3d representation of an old cathedral). Unlike a bitmap (voxels), whose individual values can be inferred from where the data is in the file and knowing the resolution (in a 2d 3x3 image, the 5th value is the center pixel), point cloud instead requires each dot to explicitly save it's individual position to file (probably a 32 bit float for each dimension, too) on top of it's color value. This makes point clouds EXTREMELY heavy in file size. It's madness to have game content be point cloud-based.

3) It's not true that you can't animate point clouds. Bone riggings could conceivably be attached to groups of dots, not any different than vertices in polygons are, just much more numerous. Of course it's not practical, the computations would be stupidly huge. Similarly, surfaces could be inferred by a program for collision detection. Again, stupid and computationally expensive.

4) With polygonal tessellation, parallax mapping and normal mapping there's no perceptual limit to polygon geometry graphics. Textures can be procedurally generated with increasing uniqueness thanks to new innovations such as Substance. There's is absolutely no benefit to point cloud in games. None. It's computationally expensive and it's not like there's a graphical limit to polygons with proper shaders and textures anyway.

>>14929967

I'll reiterate the most important point: don't confuse voxels with point clouds.

>>14916355

I heard crackdown 3 was canceled.

The point of the cloud early on when they wanted to sell the xbone was that they could theoretically get less loadtime on some games that where going to be destruction heavy and get more data from the cloud down to the console.

In theory it was about the particles reacting more realistically, the early prototypes of crackdown 3 showed the destruction with the help of the cloud and it was an always online experience.

>>14915945

>tl;dr – GPUs get better every year. If you want unlimited detail, just go buy a PS4 today. But please, don't give these hacks any money.

How about you go suck a dick? And Euclideon isn't a scam, they aren't selling it to make video games, they are using it where it should be used.

>>14914119

>When was that?

I want to say it was right around the time he left id for Occulus. It was for sure before nuDoom came out. IIRC he said he was aiming to get the virtual geometry into id Tech 6. After he left id hired the main Crytek engineer to replace him, and took the id Tech 6 engine in a different direction with no virtual geometry (virtual textures still in obviously).

>>14913981

>WHEN will devs get off their asses and implement this technology

They can't implement it in a way that it replaces polygon graphics entirely because these voxel graphics are basically pre-renders, they are static data. The most you could do with it is a minecraft clone or something along those lines.

>>14930962

>They can't implement it in a way that it replaces polygon graphics entirely because these voxel graphics are basically pre-renders, they are static data.

That's not true if I understand correctly what John Carmack's goals were. Using sparse voxel octrees I think his idea was to raycast the voxels. Hence his term "virtual geometry".

>>14930991

Okay but that's not what Euclideon is, from what I understand.

>>14931096

LOOK AT ME MARTY I'M GAY PEDOPHILE VOXEL; I'M VOXEL RIIIIIIICK

>>14913981

I hope it's legit but have a hard time believing it. If they were claiming 10-100x the detail at the same framerate I might believe them but when they say "infinite" it sounds like marketing bullshit rather than something mathematically possible.

>>14914499

>Yea

"Yea" is pronounced like "yay," and is an archaic version of the word "yes," much like "nay" is for "no." The word you're searching for is spelled "yeah."

>defiantly

Kill yourself.