930564 No.14612189
Hey /v/, im looking for some action games that excellently teach the player how to play by having levels designed in such a way that the player learns by himself how to play the game, preferably more obscure ones. there are already some well known games that do this well, like contra, megaman, mario, resident evil 4, but what other games do this well?
ce4b89 No.14612286
Pic related. An NPC very cleverly and fluently pops out of your sword every 3 seconds to interrupt gameplay so it can tell you what to do and how to solve puzzles, it's so natural that you won't even notice it happening!
37050b No.14612358
Shadow of the Colossus is excellent in this regard. The only tutorial is a short mountain climbing segment and then BOOM, you find the first boss and have to fend for yourself. Hardly any handholding in that game after that.
[Note: If you're stuck and take too long while fighting a boss, an annoying cryptic hint will pop up on screen every 30 minutes or so.]
606c8d No.14612372
Mario 64 starts with a harmless playground for you to try out the controls. If you don't need it, you just run past it into the castle. It's so natural most people probably didn't realize what it's really supposed to be.
90e324 No.14612375
Shovel Knight does it fairly decently, even if it's easier than some of the examples here.
>first stage gives you nothing but your shovel to work with
>level is balanced towards newer players so they can figure out the controls and mechanics, but require them to learn his basic moves to progress
>provide incentives to experiment with the moveset (ex: gem behind a dirt block while you're bouncing on dirt blocks so player is tempted to dig for it, learn he can cancel his shovel drop in doing so)
>culminate in a relatively easy boss battle
>other two campaigns use a similar layout, but more balanced towards Plague Knight's and Specter Knight's movesets
I don't know if this counts, but it also does a neat self-imposed tutorial on the checkpoints in the next stage
>pass by checkpoint, it lights up
>bounce on checkpoint, it cracks
>bounce on it more, it breaks and you get easy money
>player eventually dies, learns by doing so it makes the checkpoint unusable for the rest of the stage (along with learning that he loses money after every death)
>he can then either leave the checkpoints alone or break them for more money, but risk losing progress
af1bcd No.14612377
>>14612358
Only ones that are difficult to figure out are the lion (if you fail the jump, most people will have to follow it back to the starting chamber) and the one you need to drive by its teeth.
5cbf68 No.14612393
>>14612189
It's almost obligatory to mention Super Metroid. The space colony at the beginning got the player going very well, and when actually on Zebes, the only thing stopping the player from doing many things is themselves like wall jumping and bomb jumping. Items are acquired in a pretty logical and incremental manner. I need to replay it pretty soon.
9ec86d No.14612529
1-1 being a great tutorial level is a faggot meme, you could replace the first level of Super Mario Brothers with any other level in the game and no one would be any worse off.
dc2ea9 No.14612574
>>14612189
>classic megaman
>tutorial
I don't think you can consider 6-8 stages or roughly half the game "tutorials."
540c18 No.14612831
>>14612574
Megaman uses a lot of techniques that Mario games use of debuting a new element in a safe environment then building on it with added twists. Stuff like having the magnet enemies pick Megaman up at first in an area without pits to figure out what they do before the real challenge. Same with the Disappearing Blocks. Start with just the blocks, then block + magnet, then block + magnet + pit, then new variation of b+m+p
68fa75 No.14612854
12f479 No.14612871
<how the fugg does 1+1 werk: the thread
lmao
30b6a6 No.14612883
I'm sure you've all heard Ego gush about MMX before he became a complete faggot who is too lazy to do anything but shitty let's plays, so I won't go into that.
I'm a big fan of how Portal is tutorialized. The first time you see a portal open, you see yourself through that portal, then move through it, as a demonstration of what the portals actually are. Lights and decals are used to draw your attention to things without making them painfully obvious, and the momentum thing is introduced well.
Yoshi's Island was a little textbox-y with it's early game tutorialization like with the controls, but it was all optional textboxes and later elements such as the rolling platforms and countdown platforms get introduced in a safe manner before throwing you into more dangerous situations. Hell, even one of the bosses gets tutorialized. Earlier in the Potted Ghost's castle you have to push a pot off a ledge for a key, which is also how you beat the ghost.
dab1f6 No.14612900
>>14612831
You mean the magnet things that show up on the first screen on Magnet Man's stage, make the jumps marginally more difficult, and never appear again?
a8e512 No.14612930
>>14612900
>shows up in one place
>is used a few times, starting in a way that can't kill you and getting more gimmicky over time.
>is never seen again
Yes. Exactly how Mario uses obstacles and new mechanics.
ff83ac No.14612936
>>14612375
> learn he can cancel his shovel drop in doing so)
I never picked that up and it took me several hours to get past a part that supposedly required it
dc2ea9 No.14613002
>>14612831
Not wtf surprising players isn't the same as a fucking tutorial.
ff83ac No.14613082
>>14613002
You're making a joke?
00b701 No.14613112
>Armored Core 2 tutorial
>Rank 5 guy is your instructor
>"Kill everything"
>"If you fail you die"
A succinct summary of Armored Core except for Gen 4
90e324 No.14613168
>>14612936
Which part was that?
9a3a87 No.14613181
>>14612189
Explain RE4 tutorial pls.
dc2ea9 No.14613182
>>14613082
No, I am not making a joke you nigger. Having a part of a level show off a new enemy without it being some cheap way to fuck over the player is not a tutorial. There are more than two options. It isn't just "cheap shot the player" or "its a tutorial."
930564 No.14613468
dab1f6 No.14613704
>>14612930
>is used a few times
They literally only show up in one room and all the pits are two blocks wide. They might as well be scenery.
ade2a0 No.14616193
6bf257 No.14617217
>>14612883
All the bosses were tutorialized. The plant boss relied on a mechanic that was taught to you at tbe beginning of the boss stage. The two first bosses were egg throwing tutorials, one was about aiming and the other was about taking any opportunity to reload your egg count.
8406e4 No.14617330
What game has the worst tutorial?
84b888 No.14617649
>ties in with the main story
>teaches you all you need to know to beat the game
>you get to revisit parts when you grow accustomed to the game to get the S ranks
>sets up the best glitch in the game
>immersive from the moment you input your name
It's my favorite
88a275 No.14617694
>>14617649
Too bad the game is broken as fuck. 2 is superior.
ea7333 No.14618056
>>14617330
why don't you make your own thread about that? this is about excellent tutorials.
b2545b No.14618084
>>14617649
>Glitch
What glitch?
5c405b No.14624439
>>14612189
Most Nintendo games interestingly come with good tutorials. I actually don't mind even if they're usually a bit too entry level for my skill level.
04380d No.14624450
>>14624439
It's because they're kids games anon. Search your heart you know it to be true.
d5505a No.14624483
Postal 2: Paradise Lost was really surprising in this regard, since the first day of the game serves to really thoroughly showcase all the basic gameplay of it.
ff2fc7 No.14624674
>>14616176
Help. Im still stuck in the fucking parking garage
9fb365 No.14624744
>>14612883
>I'm a big fan of how Portal is tutorialized. The first time you see a portal open, you see yourself through that portal, then move through it, as a demonstration of what the portals actually are. Lights and decals are used to draw your attention to things without making them painfully obvious, and the momentum thing is introduced well.
Another big thing about Portal that many that may not notice is that Valve discovered that there were playtesters* who thought you could only "enter" through a blue portal and "exit" through the orange, so they made changes to have early levels (I think that point where you still have access to only fire only one portal from the Portal gun while the test room provides the second) to show it was okay for the player that there was no difference in which one you entered/exited.
* For those of us who have seen that infamous "iJustine takes 10 minutes to solve an early test room Portal 2 video", these people definitely exist.
7a1ab2 No.14624811
>>14612936
>>14613168
>I never picked that up and it took me several hours to get past a part that supposedly required it
Based on his description, maybe it's something like this?:
Hopefully not though.
02c595 No.14624817
>>14624439
>>14624767
Stop sucking nip cock.
84b888 No.14624832
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
>>14617694
Some would argue that while 1 has certain broken units, 2 has some of the most broken COs in the series. Both are superb games though.
>>14618084
37050b No.14624888
>>14612930
Shut up, anon. You know Nintendo would Never do that. Don't ever sully their good name again.
04380d No.14624974
>>14624767
Where did I even say that you insecure manchild?
d0c935 No.14624990
>>14618056
ya but this thread is garbage so might as well combine the garbage.
ff83ac No.14625113
>>14624811
Yeah, one of those, but with a collapsing floor and a knight that commits murder-suicide
3c8d30 No.14626171
ddf4a4 No.14627368
>>14612189
Bloodborne and Dark Souls are ones people often forget about
3985c3 No.14627501
>>14627368
I think you mean Demon Souls.
ddf4a4 No.14627516
Honestly never played it, didn't want to put forward an opinion of a game I never played
02c595 No.14630595
04380d No.14638221
>>14627501
Same difference.
579eaa No.14638700
How was I supposed to know there was something massively useful behind this door?
8623d5 No.14641760
I don't think that exists. It's a meme pretty much.
90e324 No.14642405
>>14625113
I assume you're talking about this section?
ff83ac No.14642456
0e1101 No.14642627
f68365 No.14646223
3bb842 No.14646310
>>14613468
That's pretty nice, got anymore vidya design videos like that?
add595 No.14646870
>>14646310
i suggest you to youtube search "game design" and see what interests you. the stuff GDC puts out is pretty good usually.
add595 No.14646874
4cd40c No.14646902
YouTube embed. Click thumbnail to play.
The tutorial for Blood Dragon did an excellent job at making fun of itself.
f1450d No.14651422
>>14646902
Blood Dragon is overrated tbh.
2bc3ad No.14651529
>>14616176
The only game where the tutorial is the final boss.
527ac1 No.14654067
Halfchan tier thread smh tbh fam.
0c4a22 No.14654325
Is Iudex Grundyr a tutorial on how to roll?
Next, you fight slow, weak soldiers with shields, then you fight the big knights. Is this a tutorial?
If so, I don't think Vordt is a relevant test. If you don't cheese him, it's back to rolling.
0c4a22 No.14654350
And what's the difference between a progression in difficulty and a tutorial? Are they the same thing?
3bb842 No.14657930
>>14646870
I have some GDC talks though I don't think I've ever seen one fully.
>>14646874
Those seem interesting, thanks.
>>14654350
The objective of a tutorial is to teach you something, it's either done in a safe environment or somewhere where losing won't matter.
Progression difficulty just lets you get used to the game before throwing in harder stuff, it doesn't seek to teach you anything in specific.