/tech/ - Technology★

install gentoo

>;^)

Are they /ourguys/?

I'm glad they've finally caught up to Debian Stable. It only took them about 11 months. After the eternal wait for Devuan Jessie, that doesn't seem so bad. Is it really so hard to strip systemd out of Debian that they needed all this time, though?

>>912518 (OP)

>Dear Init Freedom Lovers,

Devuan is GPL though and as such does not respect my freedom.

>>912526

>BSDgger can't keep his cuckoldry contained to one thread

Sad!

>>912518 (OP)

Another alternative to systemDick inferno :

https://www.hyperbola.info/

It will include LibreSSL as default very soon as well.

The update from jessie to ascii still requires that you pull eudev from the experimental repo.

If you don't, you don't get a bootable system, and dependency loops prevent the package manager from taking any action.

Flasher image for BBB when? they only have SD images

>>912527

>Yes GPL master-san please bind me! Thats real freedom.

>>912527

Do GNU/Niggers really think BSD's are the only ones who dislike them? Literally everyone else dislikes you, sometimes even other GPL advocates.

>>912518 (OP)

I am guessing they'll add runit support on 3.0?

>>912555

Who said anything about proprietary.

>>912569

It's GPL so it's implied proprietary.

>>912569

A permissive licensed (like BSD) codebase produces a proprietary binary when compiled.

Devuan's great, may Ian rest in peace.

>>912555

> What does ASCII stand for / mean in this context?

Aside from ascii in computers it is also the name of a star.(more info about it on their site)

>>912575

I don't use code where I don't have the source anon. I use OpenBSD where all the code is available to me and freedom respecting unlike the very restrictive GPL.

>>912605

>but you don't see me begin a faggot about it

<Its not faggotry when its muh GPL guys

>Filtered and reported

You think this is Reddit? You think those have any meaning here?

what's the point when antix and mx linux exist?

I just bought E6400 with ME disabled and am going to use Devuan on it. I even have a Devuan hoodie, black one, for almost a year now.

>>912732

Yes.

Instructions:

You can skip the following if the udev upgrade path was fixed. It probably hasn't been fixed yet.

If it hasn't been fixed, a straight upgrade by changing repos to ascii and doing a dist-upgrade will break your install.

add "deb http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/devuan/ experimental main" to your /etc/apt/sources.list

apt update

apt-get -t experimental install eudev

REBOOT

comment out:

deb http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/devuan/ experimental main

any jessie lines

add:

deb http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged ascii main non-free contrib

deb http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged ascii-updates main non-free contrib

deb http://auto.mirror.devuan.org/merged ascii-security main non-free contrib

apt update

apt upgrade

apt dist-upgrade

REBOOT

4.9 kernels don't work well with AMD RX gpus, so you'll have to compile or look elsewhere for 4.16+ if you want AMDGPU.

For some perspective: Debian Stretch with SYSTEMD image console for beaglebone black was using ~5% CPU when idle, and spawned >30 processes for SYSTEMD services.

Devuan ASCII idles at ~2% CPU with <30 processes with SSH running.

>>912605

>I use BSD too but you don't see me begin a faggot about it.

The way you're acting in that very post, is faggy. Look at all that fluff you wrote just to tell someone that you don't like them. You have no point or purpose, you're not spreading information or correcting anything, you're not making an argument, you're not doing anything at all other than being a faggot. You don't even know how to ignore things on your own, you're relying on the filter and volunteers to do it for you. If I didn't think all of that was done on purpose, I'd have to assume you're underage.

People like you are just the worst, if you're after attention try twitter or something, anywhere but here. You went out of your way to make your post as visible as attention grabbing as possible too. Disgusting.

>>912525

I seriously don't understand why it took so long. If next time they can do it in under 3 months then I'll actually consider donating.

>>912884

The way you're acting in that very post, is faggy. Look at all that fluff you wrote just to tell someone that you don't like them. You have no point or purpose, you're not spreading information or correcting anything, you're not making an argument, you're not doing anything at all other than being a faggot. You don't even know how to ignore things on your own, you're relying on the filter and volunteers to do it for you. If I didn't think all of that was done on purpose, I'd have to assume you're underage.

>>913001

This guy really hates freedom

>>912526

The freedom of users is more important than the freedom of developers to exploit users. If you can't bring yourself to realize this, then we are at an impasse.

>>913031

>preventing someone from taking your freedoms is preventing freedom

No one is taking anyones freedoms you idiot. If I give you a piece of bread, I have not deprived you of a sandwich.

>>913030

>The freedom of users is more important than the freedom of developers

The users have the same rights under the BSD as the developers. What don't you understand.

>>913050

If a developer takes BSD licensed code and uses it in a proprietary project, then the users of that project are effectively not given those rights. Since the BSD provides a situation where a developer may legally do this and the GPL does not, the GPL is a superior license for protecting users' rights.

>>912997

What I don't get is why didn't they just build a backend that compiles packages using gentoo's portage.

If you look at their proposed long-term plan, shit will get more complicated as Debian absorbs more of the Pottering POZ.

The amount of work that's gone into de-pozzing Debian was surely more than bending gentoo compiles into apt packages.

>>913012

On the contrary. I'm for total freedom. I want everyone to own a gun. I want everyone to pirate everything that isn't already given away for free. I'm for people having total say over their property and being able to shoot anyone that tresspasses on it. I just don't like faggots.

I'm fine with both the BSD and GPL. I just don't see the need to bring it up every time someone is attempting to discuss software that falls under either license. I'm sick of hearing about BSDcucks and GPLcucks. In my ideal world neither license would be needed in the first place because people wouldn't need to have copyright over their work. Get rid of jew money and you solve the root problem.

>>912884

>People like you are just the worst, if you're after attention try twitter or something, anywhere but here. You went out of your way to make your post as visible as attention grabbing as possible too. Disgusting.

I forgot to finish my reply to you. Stop taking shit so serious I was drawing attention to the fact he was a faggot. I didn't have much to add to the discussion because I don't run Devuan on any machines at the moment but I was interested in seeing what people had to say about it because any distro without systemD is a good thing. If my post triggered you that badly you're going to have a hard time lurking here. Something needed to be said because he's shit up multiple threads with the same bait and nothing has been done about it. I'm perfectly able to ignore him without the filters but why wouldn't I take advantage of the option when it makes the threads he derails more readable? Why wouldn't I report his bullshit after being forced to suffer through it multiple times already? I know the hotpockets aren't going to do anything but at least they know people are growing tired of it if someone takes the time to send a report. Eventually you won't be able to discuss any Linux or BSD distro here because everything thread will just be shitposting from both sides calling each other cucks. Just look at the replies to this thread after your sperg out if you need more confirmation that it's a problem.

>>912812

Good for you anon. Are you using it for a daily driver? How does it compare to regular old debian?

>>913103

> In my ideal world

Right so you are a Larper living in a fantasy land. Stay cucked.

>then the users of that project are effectively not given those rights

Developers don't have some magical right to have source code delivered to them when users don't.

>are effectively not given those rights.

They have the same rights.

>and the GPL does not

This is called restriction of freedom, not freedom.

>the GPL is a superior license for protecting users' rights.

If by protecting rights you mean forcing distribution with someone elses resources.

>>913103

Faster, way less resources, the old leveled debian installation, so even a normalfag can install it instead of SystemcuckeD distriutions, only experienced problems few months earlier when upgrading to testing (eudev) and when I was trying apt-tor, and if I remember correctly, some packages were missing from repo etc. https://sysdfree.wordpress.com/ -- there was an article about that some time ago, somewhere on this site, didn't find it now, but he/they, I don't know, said that he won't promote Devuan etc., was complaining about heads too.

>>912527

>>912526

>>912535

Pls stop whining about licenses. Both GPL and BSD license are good. However, they have different emphasis.

>>912518 (OP)

>>912518 (OP)

>>912525

>using the smiley with the carat nose

>>912812

Nigneeto burrito my cheeto

>>913165

The picture is horrifiying. The birds killed the seagull and are eating its brains out by sticking their heads into its eyesocket?

>>914472

What if it's alive?

>>914481

Nah, it can't be.

That things likely been dead a week given that its bloated to near explosive levels.

>>914456

kys cuck/g/ autist

>>912605

aspergers, bipolar, dyslexic poster

Devuan is good checkbox

>>914546

That's one dank ass setup my friend.

>>912518 (OP)

The KDE option sounds interesting but I thought that Plasma required systemd...

>>914619

It doesn't even require OpenGL.

About fucking time

>>913164

You mean good Debian. It loads faster and is more stable and fast in general. Not to mention, although this isn't really a plus for it anymore, the minimal nature of the Jessie installer required you to think about your packages which is something I like to see in general.

>>914922

>You mean good Debian.

Yes I do. Old Debian is Good Debian. New Debian is systemDebian, just like nu-ubuntu is systemUbuntu.

If it had Gentoo's emerge/portage or BSD ports baked in, it would be great. That's a pretty big thing to implement though.

>>915037

I honestly don't see what is stopping the average distro from being a source based hybrid. If they allowed the user the amount of options portage has everyone would be breaking stuff as often as they do on Gentoo, but it would be nice to instead be able to download source code that is automatically compiled locally. Call it "apt-get sourceinstall". Don't allow the user to pick c-flags like shipped binaries and keep the c-flags picked by the maintainers but add march=native let the user have an USEflags-like system.

Essentially that'll let people chop off dependencies they don't need with configure options and everyone's software will be tailored for their setup. Those are the 2 main things a source based distro user wants, march=native and being able to use make options to disable features they don't want. And you don't have to compromise, keep the oldschool apt-get install in place and the default.

Essentially that would provide a safe source based system not nearly as broken as gentoo, albeit with reasonable limits to ensure stability. Package versions between sourceinstall and install would be the exact same, the only difference is that instead of getting ready binaries you get build scripts and source code.

>>915045

An expansion of your idea would be to have a set of USE flags defined by the user, and checked against at package install time.

If a binary package somehow conflicts with your USE flags, the manager would automatically build the software from it's Ports tree around your USE flags.

To put this in perspective, you could set a USE flag to disable SYSTEMD, and the package manager would only compile packages if a binary package somehow conflicts with SYSTEMD being disabled.

I'm not particularly fond of source based distros because of compilation times, but they make shit so easy when you don't agree with the distro's governance.

What is the difference between antiX and devuan?, besides devuan taking 11 light years to catch up to stable?, why not give up and contribute to antiX?.

>>915045

-Gtk -qt -x +minimal etc... Are pretty useful use flags but may """"break"""" functionality (as is the point so to speak).

BSD ports are pretty weak in comparison to portage imo, a bsd is useless on a rpi versus gentoo on a rpi for example because of this.

>>915074

>>915085

AntiX is susceptible to Poettering's "gentle push" because it's based on Debian.

SystemD will continue to spread its tentacles and swallow more and more projects until the developers of distros have no choice but to budge, and eventually AntiX will be unable to stay away from SystemD or deem it too much effort.

Devuan on the other hand will patch packages to drop SystemD dependencies making it and its derivatives immune to the "gentle push".

There's no devuan-based distro with AntiX features such as the liquorix kernel in its official repositories, but if you want a lightweight distro try MIYO. It runs openbox and it doesn't have much more than just the interface and a pretty good default theme that I'm using with a custom wallpaper in this pic >>915011

Read this to see what I call "gentle push":

https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2010-September/000391.html

>>915289

>Read this to see what I call "gentle push":

>https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2010-September/000391.html

>Sooner or later they'll hopefully notice that it's

not worth it and cross-distro unification is worth more.

I've spent more time fucking with SYSTEMD workarounds than installing Devuan or some BSD.

It's nice to know that boittering doesn't understand that there's a third choice.

Now I have undeniable proof that it's malware.

>>915386

I didn't think about this when writing, but a side effect of:

>Sooner or later they'll hopefully notice that it's not worth it

would be poor documentation, poor support for external programs, and not fixing bugs that aren't bugs if you look at them through SYSTEMD glasses.

In the same stroke, the inclusion of SYSTEMD components into the kernel would indicate the intent to replace all non-unified userland extensions.

been using it for some days, I find it very good and stable

>init freedom

So how do I write my own init system? Where does the Linux kernel document what it expects init to do? The Linux man page just redirects to systemd's.

>>917030

I don't mind that systemd has a manpage, I just wish the Linux init system man page talked about it from Linux's point of view not some random ass user space program's. When I look up some system calls, I don't want to see fucking glibc wrappers either.

>>917023

You don't need to write your own, we already have this https://git.suckless.org/sinit/tree/sinit.c

Thats right, you don't even need 100 lines to have a fully functioning init. In this config.h is your inittab, and rcinitcmd[] is what gets called after the kernel calls sinit (You need init=/bin/sinit or whatever on your kernel cmdline). rcinitcmd[] is an going to be your init script which mounts procfs/sysfs(in the case of linux) and then mounts any other filesystems you want (devfs, any local filesystems). At some point after sysfs/procfs it can bring up your loopback interface, run an fsck, seed /dev/urandom, and at the end can call another script which will spawn your services such as agetty, sshd, or any other daemons you want running.

>>912518 (OP)

cool

>>917051

An init that doesn't initialize like 99% of a modern Linux system and leaves it to what is going to be essentially another init is fucking garbage, anon. How do I use cgroups with that? All that shit needs to be in whatever is the parent of everything else so is a natural fit for pid 1.

>>917328

>doesn't initialize like 99% of a modern Linux system

Why didn't you mention that you wanted something that implements the freedesktop shitware of the week. systemd already does that for, all packaged up into one monstrosity of terrible ideas. But of course my method can also start all that shit. Want udev? Spawn udev instead of mounting devfs. Want dbus? Spawn dbusd. Want tmpfilesd(or whatever the fuck that cancer is)? Launch that in your init scripts

>How do I use cgroups with that?

By using cgexec, cgcreate, and friends in your init script. Or alternatively by using the cgroups vfs. Personally I think cgroups are retarded and if linus had just implemented the chroot protections that grsec created (or just fixed his own shitty implementation) then there would be no need for cgroups.

>natural fit for pid 1.

No, all pid 1 has to do is wait for children to reap and spawn an init script.

>>917364

https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/197437/what-exactly-does-init-do

>People will tell you that fork()ing things and acting as the parent of orphaned processes is the prime function of process #1.

>Ironically, this is untrue.

>Dealing with orphaned processes is (with recent Linux kernels, as explained at https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/177361/5132) a part the system that one can largely factor out of process #1 into other processes, such as a dedicated service manager.