/tech/ - Technology★

>>890381 (OP)

Good, anything to hurt Google.

thank god

i trust Oracle over any other tech giants

these guys are evil for right reasons

>>890381 (OP)

hopefully java dies forever now

>>890381 (OP)

>this kills the java

>Google has to pay a fuck ton of money too

Fantastic.

yay

>>890381 (OP)

Probably Google or some alliance will appeal.

But anyway, Google already has plans to stop using Java, with the whole Fucsia stuff, so this might as well be the beginning of the end for Java.

Also, Java might be foreseeing this and might want to die with a bang, loaded with cash, instead of withering to irrelevancy.

>Part of Google's defense was that the 11,500 lines of copied code were insignificant compared to the millions of lines of code in Android. The appeals court rejected that by asserting the quality and importance of the copied portion must be considered alongside the quantity.

9 billion dollars

that's, $782,000 per line of code.

fuck jewgle

>>890382

>let Oracle make API development sue-able

>fuk googl LOL!

<brainless wojack.png

>>890471

>copy someone else's copyrighted code line for line for use in your own for-profit advertising and data collection medium against the terms of service

>call it "fair use API development"

<get sued for 9 billion dollars and lose.

>>890481

An API is not "code", it's a bunch of methods to interface with something. What do you think RFCs are?

>>890483

MS call it patents and already make a fortune from android even if Huawei don't pay anything for them and still not sued for it, so it's practically a ransom. Still some fags thinks Oracle is the gangsters.

That is a bullshit ruling. The effect it will have on anyone who programs is some serious bullshit.

Google being hit is a cherry on top of a turd mountain.

>>890381 (OP)

Actually what happened is when Google bought up Android, it was using Java ME, which costs like a couple pennies per device. Google tried to Jew Sun (at that time) and decided to simply copy and rename the source code to Java and use the same source for the programs. Meanwhile they reimplemented some of the APIs but it was an obvious copy paste job which was proved in court. Magically Oracle lost but now they've won on appeal.

If Google had paid its pennies they wouldn't be in this fix. It's also why Youtube is so shitty, they didn't want to pay their mpeg royalties so they cooked up this new bullshit VP codec nonsense to "compete" with the industry standard.

Google's doomed anyway, sit back and watch the shitshow. I give them a year tops before their ad market collapses.

>>890466

>this might as well be the beginning of the end for Java

You interact with computers that run a JVM with Spring and Hibernate probably everyday, like when you withdraw cash or buy shit on the internet.

Java is the COBOL of the 21st century, and it's not going to "wither to irrelevancy" anytime soon.

>>890504

*meant to say "COBOL of the early-21st century", because we probably gonna have a new one around 2038 or 2048.

>>890486

Patents don't last until death+70

>>890498

VP8/9 is better than mpeg. Don't let hatred blind you.

>>890514

>VP8/9 is better than mpeg

Are you retarded? VPX has a smaller filesize, sure, but it's not better my any other measure.

>>890504

No one likes to pay royalties. Things like AV1 exist precisely for that, and nothing is forever.

>>890471

cuckchan.png

>>890421

This.

I hate Java. Installing a VM to use a program is fucking retarded and I have to keep this trash o my PC just for JDownloader2.

Any recommendations for alternatives?

Pyload doesn't have a working GUI, so it's not an option.

>>890531

>Gui

Disgusting, aria2 is all you need, but if you do need a gui:

http://ugetdm.com/

>>890381 (OP)

but isn't this case about google using sun's/oracle's code in their JVM implementation?

>>890531

Java is secure programming language because of the JVM (if the implementation is good). Also, if you don't want to have JVM installed, you could get a processor that understands java byte-code directly :^)

>>890522

>but it's not better my any other measure.

You don't have to pay Google to use it in a product.

>>890381 (OP)

Google will never go down with shit like this even with blatant internal hate against male, or racism against white etc... and that's because it's backed up by the CIA/NSA world spy network.

>>890543

thx

fucking tui meme should stop. If you're using a graphical environment it makes no sense to run a terminal to display stuff build out of characters inside it.

>>890552

>Java is good, secure

>Buy a Java processor

Hell no. Java is only used by pajeets and pajeet software (, giant hello world programs) and I don't think a Java processor contains the standard library making installation a requirement. Every software can crash if it contains flaws. Java is no exception.

https://github.com/EnterpriseQualityCoding/FizzBuzzEnterpriseEdition

How did Java ever get off the ground? Did it have a purpose when Sun created it? Can I blame Oracle on the current state of Java?

>>890597

the reason java got popular, is that it was one of first technologies that was used to make interactive cancer web applets. the original vision for java was to be language for embedded systems (see oak programming language).

>>890564

It makes a lot of sense. TUI can easily run on any low-end hardware, even small ARM SBC with little memory and no botnet GPU driver. It can run over a low-bandwidth ssh session or serial connection.

>>890564

TUI is good because it's an universal, uniform and space efficient (as long as you print lines of text; like a music player) alternative to GUIs.

>>890628

Printing lines of text isn't a TUI

This is the best news about Java since the MSJVM lawsuit.

>>890621

True but I specifically said inside a graphical environment. Those don't run on low-end hardware. The console buffer was also never meant to to do tui. I'm pretty sure it's damn inefficient inside a window.

>ssh session

Yep. That's it's sole use nowadays.

>>890617

This. Minecraft(best example for java shit code and only example java coders can give if you ask for games) ran as applet "inside" (actually outside and had full user permissions) the browser.

>>890684

It doesn't really matter if the display is graphical or not. TUI programs have benefits of their own, like smaller size, less code (less bugs), and the ability to run anywhere, including inside terminal multiplexers. You can quit X11 and reattach your session at the console. Nowadays consoles are often framebuffers and able to run SDL programs, but if a program is linked against X libs, it won't work. But TUI stuff will. That's why I avoid X programs as much as possible, so I don't become too dependent on such a bloated environment. The running joke for me is that X is a library for running Firefox. It's about the only thing I really need it for. If I could remove my occasional need for Firefox, I'd literally live in the console all the time and never even bother to install X.

>>890710

>less code

untrue, unless you directly code against x.org or Windows

>run anywhere

on the architecture and OS they were compiled for

>Nowadays consoles are often framebuffers and able to run SDL programs

Doesn't that ruin the whole purpose?

And it DOESN'T WORK over ssh.

>X is a library for running Firefox

You have Wayland now. So step ahead into the bright future instead of glorifying character abuse.

>>890721

ncurses is small, compared to the average X library. And we're not even talking Gtk or Qt levels of bloat.

I know SDL doesn't work over ncurses. SDL was just to say X programs are totally useless outside of X. And if you're going to run Firefox in Wayland, it will need X libs.

Besides, I don't give a shit about Wayland anymore than X. It doesn't solve any of my problems. I want TUI programs, since those run everywhere.

>>890684

>The console buffer was also never meant to to do tui. I'm pretty sure it's damn inefficient inside a window.

I can watch vlc straight from a console framebuffer with no X or wayland in pure 1080p 60fps on a intel hd GPU while compiling libreoffice. Get rekt.

Android doesn't actually use Java. They just ripped off the API and called it their own. In fact they didn't even call it their own, they just said, "we use Java".

>>890381 (OP)

>Clojure? Scala? Kotlin? All use Java API's as well, Oracle has destroyed the entire ecosystem in one fell swoop.

No, these are not Java clones; they just run on the JVM, and Oracle is fine with that. These are not similar to what Google did with their bizarro-Java.

>>890381 (OP)

Good. The tech-illiterate judge in the first case should have ruled in Oracle's favor in the first place.

>>890754

They use the Java API, they're not JVM bytecode compilers.

>>890514

>the "standard" where "the code is the spec" which has no acceleration in devices except maybe some Google phones is better than the established world standard which plays fine on any device made in the past couple decades

OK

>>890782

Java is such a terrible language though. It sucks Android defaults to it and the NDK is being pushed to the side.

>>890801

Then what will Fuchsia use? Go? That seems worse.

>>890821

Go is much much better then java. Atleast with Go you are rid of garbage collection and assured some more memory safety. Granted everything by jewgle is botnet so Go is a polished turd compared to the steaming pile of bullshit java is.

>>890822

Fair points and lol.

Go is nowhere near primetime or as useful

this is going to be hilarious to watch

>>890757

>They use the Java API, they're not JVM bytecode compilers.

The opposite of this is true.

>>890522

it's better on the only measure that matters on the internet, quality/size. vp9 is literally half the size of x264 for the same quality. it's comparable to x265 though. i don't get the hate x265 receives for licensing issues, no licensing fees exist if the video produced is made available to the public for free, and it encodes 2-3x as fast.

x265 licensing fees only applies if your selling the video, IE encoding services or physical media, or paid streaming/downloads.

>>890732

>Firefox in Wayland, it will need X libs

Chromium has Wayland support since v50.

Well, I can't cure your autism.

>>890856

I think the fees also apply to advertisement which is the primary source of money for videos on the internet.

>>890856

even this site contains advertisement, which means we can't use it because license fees

>>890856

aside from that browsers don't support it either

>>890890

Honestly who needs a DE now? The only GUI platform you need is a web browser. All other tasks can be handled by the cli. If you need a standalone "app" with a GUI, use node webkit or electron.

>>890890

>display server

>"subverted"

Can Terryfags leave? They're all cuckchan nocoders

>>890890

If you honestly believe that Wayland solves nothing new, then you shouldn't care about what happens because by your assessment, it's not going to do anything new!

>>890890

>>890898

This. Wayland is NOT a window manager not even a display server. Wayland is a protocol "that specifies the communication between a display server [...] and its clients"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayland_(display_server_protocol)

It get's rid of X and moves the task of rendering to the window manager.

If you don't like any of the currently available Wayland compositors, you'd help everyone by making another one(there are never enough. Linux is all about choice.TM)!

>>890958

>android apps

You could use C inside of Java or with the NDK.

If you only want your app to run on android, fine, use Java(It's the best language for the task since Android was coded in Java which is why they are already working on a new OS). Otherwise use C or another language which isn't such a pile of shit.

Free Pascal is also an option:

http://www.lazarus-ide.org/

>>890898

>They're all cuckchan nocoders

Hey friend, this entire board is pretty much nocoders. This thread, like most, is a pretty good indicator.

>>890968

i'd use the NDK if i knew how the GUI worked within C, but it all seems like xml that is interpretted at compile time by eclipse with the java sw.

>>891010

I'd just use a gui lib tbh.

>>891014

those exist?

>>891015

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_platform-independent_GUI_libraries

CTRL+F/F3 android

>11

There are probably a lot more but since I don't know shit about phones you have to search them yourself.

>>890963

Oh right, let's just conveniently put all the work onto this "window manager" and pretend the problem goes away just like that, POOF!

Meanwhile GUI software isn't getting any smaller, nor are GUI libraries or desktop environments. No, now the new trend in adblocking is virtualization to bypass browser API. Shit's gonna get even bigger and hog more memory, not get leaner!

Meanwhile, I'll be over in a text console browsing in Lynx or something like that which doesn't need all kinds of GUI shits. All this new shit is danker than Microsoft DOS.

>>891020

>this "window manager"

You still don't understand what it is.

It's a description on how programs are supposed to DIRECTLY interact with windows manager (with Wayland: window manager=display server=Wayland compositor)

You don't even understand the fucking concept and when explained you complain about it.

GUI programs can be less than 200KB. You can't generate code from nothing.

There are in fact cases in which the CLI program is larger than the GUI variant of the SAME program.

For example the LoadOrder viewer in the Sysinternals suite. ~30KB

>>891024

*window manager

>>891024

> There are in fact cases in which the CLI program is larger than the GUI variant of the SAME program.

That sounds like some really shitty code m8. But in any case, it still doesn't remove the GUI overhead that you relocated into some other component to pretend it disappeared. Do you Wayland people work for the Federal Reserve, by chance? They're also famous for conjuring stuff out of thin air.

>>891028

That example was a Windows program and no I don't work on Wayland.

>GUI overhead

Yes GUI's normally use more RAM but if you use framebuffers and so on you already HAVE a GUI of your own.

I'm pretty sure that if you smash images on top of each other on your framebuffer you can build windows and so on.

Just rewrite your Firefox to run in framebuffers already and stop hating on GUI stuff.

>>891024

It's like everybody forgot about tcl / tk which would let you make gui programs in a couple kb,

>>891217

>It's like everybody forgot about tcl / tk

to be fair, that amnesia was intentional and likely alcohol induced on the part of tcl/tk users

>>891217

You can't even compile a plain stdio hello_world.c in 2 KB today, unless you go through lots of effort. For that matter, even just a simple "return 42" doesn't fit.

http://www.muppetlabs.com/~breadbox/software/tiny/teensy.html

Now 30-some years ago, things were different. You could actually make GUI stuff on Amiga that was small and tight. That ship sailed long ago though.

>>890822

>Atleast with Go you are rid of garbage collection

Either top shitpost or we should finally burn this shithole to the ground