/islam/ - 8ch Masjid

Marriage in Islam is defined as being between a man and a woman. Robots don't count because they aren't actually women, so marrying a robot wouldn't be valid. Although since they aren't actually women, using them for sex wouldn't be fornication.

I guess you could claim that it's a distraction, and that time spent banging an anime robot could be spent on something more productive. Outside that, I don't think there are any rulings on the matter.

Currently robots either look like embed related or creepily uncanny, so we have a long time before it becomes an issue.

>>25301

I find the idea ludicrous and extremely lonely sounding.

>>25302

That would be masturbation with accessories. Thinking that it would be acceptable because of some obscure loophole like that is not reasonable.

>>25307

For that we'd have to define what a human is, which is an interesting question in itself. There are a few qualities that humans have that come up in Islam:

>Being a descendant of Adam (AS)

Robots don't fit this. You could claim that them being created by humans is similar, but it's a massive stretch

>Having a soul

We don't know how to make a soul, or how to give one to something.

>Having free will

AIs do a decent job mimicking this. Whether it's good enough is debatable, but they can at least pretend.

>>25310

Machines aren't created using DNA. You could use something like IVF to create a descendant of Adam (AS) but that's a person, not a robot.

From an Islamic standpoint, souls do exist. You can't just throw the idea out if you're talking about it from an Islamic point of view. Think of a soul as a guarantee of existence beyond death, a unit of human life to which good and bad deeds are associated with. A robot without a soul is no more human than a toaster.

Free will in Islam is defined as being able to choose between doing something good or bad. For example, angels don't have free will. They do good because it's what they do, and they have no say in the matter. We get to choose, so when we enjoin good and forbid evil we are demonstrating our true beliefs. AIs can do this well enough, but they'll need a lot more processing power to reach our level.

>>25310

So you got a chance to throw your little tantrum, how good for you. Now f*ck off.

>>25307

>Would that be a woman?

No.

>>25310

So, you learned about Islam from /pol/ memes? I'm sure this makes you the most knowledgeable person here, right?

>>25311

They're called biological machines. Robot didn't even mean machine before Isaac Asimov made his first story, and later on he even made stories about biological robots.

So making a sex bot through IVF and f*cking it wouldn't be haram?

Ok, can you show me why I'm wrong when it comes to souls? Nobody knows if we exist after death, it's a one way street.

So you think robots can gain free will, when they get enough processing power?

>>25318

I actually heard about it when these Trucks Of Peace, from the religion of Peace started showing up in my country.

>>25319

>Nobody knows if we exist after death

Quran 56:83-87

Quran 23:99-100

Quran 3:102

Death is not an end and all will be judged.

>>25321

>Trucks of Peace

/pol/ meme

>Religion of Peace

/pol/ meme

>>25322

>Uses passages from old book with as much proof to back it up as the bible

Mate, I'm going to need more than a handful of written words from a time that though magic existed.

>Says "islam is a religion of peace" is a pol meme

So was I wrong when I said that?

>>25323

You do realize that you're on a Muslim board, right? Did you not notice that? Qur'an is the holy word of God. Maybe you thought we were LARPers? There's a board for LARPing >>>/islamicstate/

And, yes, your meme phrase "religion of peace" is wrong. We are a religion of submission to God, which isn't always peaceful any more than anyone is always peaceful. I suppose Amish people could be considered the "Religion of Peace" since they don't even hit back when struck; but that's not us. We aren't the aggressors, but we do defend ourselves when attacked. As for using trucks to run down and murder innocent people, that's against Islam's code of ethics. Yes, some Muslims have done it; but they didn't do it because Islam commanded them to do it.

>>25324

Well you're honest, and I can respect that.

>>25319

I'm not well versed on Asimov's work. The only one I've read is The Bicentennial Man, and that was ages ago. I don't think the robot in that one was biological, although he tried to become closer to humans.

IVF only lets you fertilize an egg outside a human body. It's used for things like genetic cloning. You have to put the fertilized egg back in a woman for it to actually grow, and at that point adding mechanical parts wouldn't work out. Theoretically if you had an artificial womb and a way to safely augment the fetus you'd have a cyborg, and those are human.

What I'd be interested in is if someone were to grow human stem cells into neurons (if that's possible yet) and make an artificial biological brain. An android powered by that would have some interesting implications.

As for free will, we're already capable of teaching a robot how to make decisions based on different situations. We already use AIs to solve boring tasks like recognizing objects in pictures. More complicated tasks require more processing power and more information to train with. If we gave an AI enough power and information we'd have something that at least resembles free will.

>>25327

Let me explain what I meant, Humans and all other biological life-forms are machines, you're a machine, I'm a machine, we're all biological machines.

>>25327

http://transhumanity.net/biological-machines/

>>25302

>Marriage in Islam is defined as being between a man and a woman.

I was researching this and it says nothing about the bride and groom having to be human. However, there are rules about not being able to marry animals. So can it be fair to say robots do not count as animals?

I could be wrong this is what I've just read from Islamic websites. I am also the OP. I was born into a "muslim" household but my parents never taught me much so I am starting to learn more as I grow up. Alhamdulillah I am learning much

>>25329

I'm not sure what you're trying to do. Are you trying to use transhumanism to disprove Islam or use Islam to justify transhumanism?

Also OP here. I remember hearing its permissible to marry jinns? Is this true?

>>25333

Humans can't see jinns, so no.

>>25332

Nether, I'm trying to make a loophole for sex bots in islam.

>>25334

He's asking if it's permissible, not possible.

>>25337

kek, sure.

>>25335

There is no loophole for sex bots in Islam. Go try /christian/. They have as many loopholes as they have denominations.

>>25336

And I answered: No. You can't marry what you can't see.

>>25338

Islam is based on intention. Malicious intention can ruin good deeds, or things that otherwise wouldn't be worth anything. In other words, finding a loophole closes the loophole.

>>25338

So, since you can't find a loophole for sex bots and you don't believe Islam to be God's perfect religion, then you can move along now.

>>25339

It actually depends on whether you consider genetically altered humans to be animal or not. If not, all you have to do is get a fetus, alter it's DNA so it grows faster, and somehow implant in it's brain some way to make it lust and loyal to you and only you. It's a descendent of Adam, it has a soul(you guys think humans have souls), and it would have as much free will as other traditional muslim women.

But at this point we're talking in hypotheticals, and you'd use up less money buying one of those middle eastern slaves.

>>25343

>It actually depends

Thanks for proving my point now go back to >>>/pol/

>>25340

Mate, all religions will get loopholes if enough time passes, and technology gets better.

And let me explain to you the difference between permissible and possible.

In america, it is permissible to marry a mermaid because there is no law against it. But it's impossible to marry a mermaid because they don't exist.

>>25344

Do you consider genetically altered humans to be animals?

>>25345

In Islam it is both impossible and impermissible to marry Jinn. I'd quote Quran to back that up, but you don't believe Quran so there's no point. Also, in America, marriage laws vary from State to State, so there is no "in america X".

>>25346

The delineation between humans and animals isn't so simplistic in Islam. A genetically altered human would still be a human. There is a vast difference between manipulation and creation. God creates, man manipulates. Again, I'd quote Quran, but …

>>25347

I believe their are rules that the Quran tells people to follow, what you said was a strawman. The in america bit was an analogy.

>>25348

It's not a strawman. You have literally admitted in this thread that Quran is not a valid source for Islamic viewpoints.

>>25349

I said it's not a valid source for what's real and what isn't, like souls. There is no proof for souls.

>>25350

Then there is no point in providing quotes from it.

>>25352

This is correct. We have virgin wives that want lots of kids, we dont need hoe-bots. Muslim wife is best wife.

>>25353

To each their own, I'd like my wife to have freedom.

>>25354

Wives in Islam have freedom. You're asking for a pre-programmed robot and you talk of freedom?

>>25356

Wives in islam have as much freedom as dogs do, minus the chance of getting raped if they got out.

>You're asking for a pre-programmed robot and you talk of freedom?

No, in most cases, unless we're talking about clones and such.

Do you think robots should get freedom?

>>25360

24:31 And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms, and not to reveal their adornment save to their own husbands

4:11 Allah chargeth you concerning (the provision for) your children: to the male the equivalent of the portion of two females,

>>25361

>Lower their gaze

The verse before asks the same of men

>Draw veils over bosoms

That's to break up the shape of the cleavage. It also lets women wear clothes with dipped necklines while staying modest.

>Not to reveal their adornment

Flashing your tits isn't highly regarded in the rest of the world either.

The second verse is specifically about inheritance. A man

gets more because they then spend the extra amount on marriage. 4:4 encourages men to spend a lot, which evens out any advantage.

>>25357

Your /pol/ is showing again. Also, nice screencap of a talk Al-Sarsawi was giving about the early days of Islam and the difference between how the Arab Pagans treated their women and how Muslims treated their women.

The quote you paused and screencapped is talking about how the Pagans treated women. Oh, sorry, did you think nobody here actually watched things like that? We're not LARPing and we see through your ruse before you even post it.

>>25358

>Do you think robots should get freedom?

No. That's stupid.

>>25363

I fallow the Satanic Bible's teachings/morals.

>Nobody is forced to do anything.

Mate, some of the countries that have Shria Law and make it illegal to burn the Quran have laws in place that force this.

I apologize if I misrepresented what the Quran said, can you correct me, and show me why those quotes are taken out of context?

>>25364

I'm actually more of a /liberty/ guy.

I'm sorry if I did get that wrong, I just grabbed it from google images. But would you like me to send you links on how Muslims should beat their wives? it's like how you'd beat a dog.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39K9K1T7wvg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8o-cBkvU5g4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ue9KAm7kvzo&t=9s

I'm glad we agree on robots.

>>25365

2:282 is about financial matters. The second woman is there to testify that the first hasn't been forced into giving a false witness.

4:176 is about inheritance, just like 4:11

>>25368

You're a failure when you give up on yourself. Look up the ketogenic diet, it's great for losing weight.

>>25370

Thanks for pointing out the obvious, what's you're point? It's still unfair.

>>25367

>>25366

>>25365

See: >>11001

>not intended as a place where Muslims must defend themselves or their religion from outsiders

You stated:

>>25335

>I'm trying to make a loophole for sex bots in islam

Now you've turned it into "lol look how you savages act" and how your perception of Islam is "unfair"to women, without paying attention to the Sunnah.

If you want to ignore the Sunnah >>>/modernislam/

If you want comparative religions >>>/rel/