[ / / / / / / / / / / / / / ] [ dir / acme / animu / arepa / ausneets / sonyeon / tacos / vg / vore ]

/islam/ - 8ch Masjid

Certainly the promise of Allah is true. Let not then this present life deceive you.
Name
Email
Subject
Comment *
File
Password (Randomized for file and post deletion; you may also set your own.)
* = required field[▶ Show post options & limits]
Confused? See the FAQ.
Embed
(replaces files and can be used instead)
Options

Allowed file types:jpg, jpeg, gif, png, webm, mp4, pdf, pdf
Max filesize is 16 MB.
Max image dimensions are 15000 x 15000.
You may upload 3 per post.


"Allah is but one God. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs." [4:171]

File: b05e81c502c6e46⋯.jpg (17.62 KB, 300x281, 300:281, ShaykhAbdulWahhab.jpg)

c74b09  No.21564

What does /Islam/ think of Wahhabi aqeedah?

I've seen varying opinions here, I hope you guys give some actual discussion beyond

>oy vey wahhabi terrorist

like I usually get when discussing this topic.

I know ibn Abdul Wahhab (RA) is a controversial figure enough, he wasn't perfect but he hardly did much wrong.

4f1359  No.21566

File: 5185a5a8bb7f2c6⋯.jpg (109.33 KB, 600x885, 40:59, kitabattawhid.jpg)

>What does /Islam/ think of Wahhabi aqeedah?

You mean athari aqeeda?

>I know ibn Abdul Wahhab (RA) is a controversial figure enough, he wasn't perfect but he hardly did much wrong.

>I've seen varying opinions here, I hope you guys give some actual discussion beyond

>oy vey wahhabi terrorist

like I usually get when discussing this topic.

This is going to be a quality thread based on actual discussion of Sheik-ul-Islam's works or it's going to be locked.

https://www.missionislam.com/knowledge/books/tawheed.pdf


c74b09  No.21567

File: 0274111f1f208c3⋯.pdf (381.14 KB, Removal of the doubts.pdf)

>>21566

>You mean athari aqeeda?

No, there are differences, salafi aqeedah is a thing, but yeah you could just say Wahhabism is just athari aqeedah with other things on top of it.

>This is going to be a quality thread based on actual discussion of Sheik-ul-Islam's works or it's going to be locked.

Yeah hopefully inshaAllah.

Here's a good book by ibn Abdul Wahhab RA


c74b09  No.21568

>>21565

Stop this, it's the worst attack on Wahhabism I've ever seen, Saddam's government unironically claimed ibn Abdul Wahhab (RA) and the Saudi family are Jews.

If you listen to reports from Saddams government for religious guidance you might want to reconsider the basis of your religion.


4f1359  No.21571

File: d26b6a9977252d7⋯.jpg (151.17 KB, 612x612, 1:1, daleel.jpg)

>>21567

>No, there are differences, salafi aqeedah is a thing, but yeah you could just say Wahhabism is just athari aqeedah with other things on top of it.


c74b09  No.21572

>>21571

I haven't done a lot of research on individual differences to be honest with you akhi, it's just what I've heard, the differences are pretty small tho.


c74b09  No.21573

>>21571

Wait nvm, I was wrong lol


4058d1  No.21574

Sheik Abdulwahab died before the invention of the camera. Who is that dude in the picture, OP?


c74b09  No.21575

>>21574

Uh I think it's one of the Saudi Ulama in the 1800s, common depiction of Abdul Wahhab RA however.


c74b09  No.21577

>>21574

Ok just looked it up, it's a depiction of him, but not him, not of Saudi Ulama either.


7c7e20  No.21580

Fuck Muhammad.

Fuck Allah.

Fuck Islam.

Fuck you.

Any questions?

(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

4f1359  No.21582

Ha. Good observation I never thought of that. It was always weird how there were multiple visages and some people imagine Abdul-Rahman bin Faisal as the sheikh.


365488  No.21583

>>21564

A bit rough for my tastes. I appreciate the Salafi and all, but their beliefs on Islam are sometimes harsh. I also tend to cringe when any school of thought claims to be "Islam perfected". Islam was perfect long before Wahhab was born.

That said, Muslims don't call it "Wahhabism" any more than we call ourselves "Mohamedanist".


8692ed  No.21584


0439a8  No.21587

wahabis killed muslims and got into power with the help of the UK


4f1359  No.21588

>>21587

hello old friend, eid mubarak. u still on twitter? send me a message if so.

Please look into the history of the three saudi states. The British tried to wipe out the saud and ahl as sheikh by backing the hashemites and ottomans against them for more than two centuries. The west didn't switch sides until their victory was assured. And what ended up happening was the hashemites began rebelling against the degenerating ottomans too - alongside the Sauds.

>>365488

>I also tend to cringe when any school of thought claims to be "Islam perfected". Islam was perfect long before Wahhab was born.

Yes "today I have perfected for you your religion." I don't think any sheikh has ever claimed to have perfected Islam, please show if I am wrong. That would be a concern. What ibn abdul wahhab ra tried to do was make the worship and understanding of the muslims as close to perfect as possible. And since we all make mistakes even the mashayakh we all strive for perfection but all fall short.


c74b09  No.21594

File: c5ae594cc597262⋯.pdf (195.28 KB, The Uthmani State and the ….pdf)

>>21583

I don't think any Wahhabi or Salafi claims their shuyookh have perfected Islam, nobody thinks ibn taymiyyah or ibn abdul Wahhab have personally fixed any "problems" with Islam, rather they believe they are the closest to correct fiqh, aqeedah etc. and without bida'ah.

Also IDK what do call Wahhabi thought in Arabic since I don't speak Arabic, so I just call it Wahhabism for simplicity.

>>21592

Saudi Arabia doesn't recognise Israel.

Saddam's Iraq wasn't a Muslim nation, neither is anything there now.

Read .pdf related on the Ottoman state.


c74b09  No.21595

>>21588

>alongside the Sauds.

The Saudis didn't participate in the Arab revolts as far as I know.

>>21587

t. saddam


4f1359  No.21596

File: 8b3cc224ef2a072⋯.jpg (Spoiler Image, 98.26 KB, 1024x745, 1024:745, IMG_1768.JPG)

>>21594

>Also IDK what do call Wahhabi thought in Arabic since I don't speak Arabic, so I just call it Wahhabism for simplicity.

It'd be better if you called it the manhaj as-salafiyya or salafi dawah. Also, just to get this out of the way: Salafiyya is inter-madhab not anti-madhab.

>>21592

>Wahhab might not have been a Jew,

This is the best thing you can say about the sheikh? Have you even read any works by him? Please guard yourself from your tongue.

This is not a board for discussion of politics and personalities. This board is for discussing Islam. If you want to criticize the Sheikh ul Islam then use the links provided and cite him and then make an argument against him. If you keep making attacks on him and those who read his teachings that lack substance I will delete your future posts.

>but modern day Wahabbis are pawns of der juden.

Who is not a pawn of der juden then according to you...? There are legitimate criticisms to be made of the current Saudi family but you don't even seem to know what they are.

>They came to power by betraying the Ottoman Caliph and sided with the British kuffar.

The Najd was never even part of the Ottoman khilafah. The Ottomans betrayed Islam... they were in RIBA DEBT to the Europeans. If the Ottomans avoided Riba maybe they would still be around today. A "khilafah" that is based on riba debt to European central banks... have some shame at least.

>They also assist the Israeli Secret Intelligence Service.

Every country in the region has talks overt or covert with everyone else in the region. Grow up, stop acting like a poltard.

>If they stopped helping Zionists and actually sided with Muslims and helped unite Islam then maybe they would be cool.

First, Saudi family =/= the end all be all of Salafi dawah.

You don't seem able to have a religious discussion so you want to turn this into a political one. I'm not going to let you do that, this is /islam/ not /pol/.

>But until then they are on the side of the Zionist juden kuffur and attack other Muslims for money.

Saudi Arabia was against the invasions in Iraq and Afghanistan. Iran supported those invasions and used them to fight sunnis, not Saudi Arabia. I mean, you're not even able to have a thoughtful political discussion - no wonder cracking open a book/pdf is an insurmountable task for you.

And also, funny how you mention only Israel, not Syria. Assad has killed 10x as many muslims as have died since 1948 in fighting against Israel... if you're not a poltard larping here you're doing a damn fine imitation.


c74b09  No.21597

File: b141d95d18dccad⋯.pdf (1.31 MB, The Ẓāhirī Madhhab (3rd_9t….pdf)

>>21596

>It'd be better if you called it the manhaj as-salafiyya or salafi dawah. Also, just to get this out of the way: Salafiyya is inter-madhab not anti-madhab.

There are 2 positions on madhabs from Salafis, a friend of mine said the sheikh at his masjid called madhabs bida'ah, he disagrees though.

I know it's a minority position among Salafis, I think any madhab is good, they all have positions that I'd agree and disagree with, I like the Hanbali and the near non-existant dhahiri (Book related).


4f1359  No.21598

File: 6bee5444dad174a⋯.png (456.72 KB, 653x375, 653:375, tabloid.png)

ANY POLITICAL POSTS / PERSONALITY DISCUSSION WILL BE DELETED STARTING AFTER THIS POST


4f1359  No.21599

File: 7f25578f62df3f0⋯.png (181.6 KB, 681x568, 681:568, imammalikhadswag.png)

>>21597

>There are 2 positions on madhabs from Salafis, a friend of mine said the sheikh at his masjid called madhabs bida'ah, he disagrees though.

Are you sure? Maybe he said that TAQLID to a madhab was a bida'ah. We should only have taqlid for Allah swt and Muhammad saws. Even if he said that, that is ultra minority…

>I know it's a minority position among Salafis, I think any madhab is good, they all have positions that I'd agree and disagree with

Same.

>I like the Hanbali and the near non-existant dhahiri (Book related).

I like Dhahiri too. There seems to be an effort to revive this madhab. A lot of muslims in the west are attracted to dhahiri because they think it is some lost liberal school with andalusi history… then they find out it is anything but liberal - lol.

I'm "maliki" but I have sat at the feet of Hanbali-Salafi shuyukh that studied for decades in Mecca and I also go on long trips with my dear Hanafi brothers in Jaamat at tabligh. I am most comfortable with Deobandis and Salafis on most things. But I ``feel`` closer to - and am - Maliki. I don't have to choose between salafiyyah and the maliki fiqh. Madhabs are literally just for jurisprudence. One of my favorite things about maliki fiqh is that Imam Malik avoided hypotheticals. When people came to him for rulings and sharii commentary he always asked "has this happened or is this happening?" If not he refused to hear the matter. Hanafi fiqh became very speculative but the dar ul uloom (Deoband) regrounded it in my opinion.


365488  No.21600

>>21599

> I am most comfortable with Deobandis and Salafis on most things.

You radical, you. ;)


4f1359  No.21601

File: 575f840c6f1d8e3⋯.jpg (101.43 KB, 640x640, 1:1, IMG_2530.JPG)

>>21600

SubhanAllah LOL. Eid Mubarak my lovely bro. Hug x3.

My "full circle" moment was at a 3-day ijtema. We're all camped out in the masjid - napping and praying and having lectures and eating/cooking desi food - basically Woodstock for muslims. Well I had come after work and was thobeless. The tablighi brothers from Saudiyya gave me a sympathy thobe, lol. May Allah reward them.


c74b09  No.21602

>>21599

>Are you sure? Maybe he said that TAQLID to a madhab was a bida'ah. We should only have taqlid for Allah swt and Muhammad saws. Even if he said that, that is ultra minority…

Yes, I'm very sure those were his words.

>I like Dhahiri too. There seems to be an effort to revive this madhab. A lot of muslims in the west are attracted to dhahiri because they think it is some lost liberal school with andalusi history… then they find out it is anything but liberal - lol.

I didn't set out researching it from liberalism, it's very appealing in many respects but would be pretty hard to revive.

I don't think there is anything wrong with speculation in fiqh, if it comes up one day it would be useful, for whatever hypothetical issue.

Matami Deobandis are cool.

Ibn Muqbil (possibly mis-spelled) and these two: "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abu_Abd_al-Rahman_Ibn_Aqil_al-Zahiri", "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abdul_Aziz_al-Harbi" are modern dhahiris.


4f1359  No.21603

>>21602

>I didn't set out researching it from liberalism, it's very appealing in many respects but would be pretty hard to revive.

Yeah, I mean philosophical liberalism not modern political "liberalism." I don't want to inject non-Islamic terms into a discussion of fiqh - just wanted to point out something I've seen. And not saying anything about you either.

Now one thing I do distinctly recall was a claim that Dhahiris interpreted the word "Uff" from Surah al-Isra ayat 23 to be literally "Uff." As in do not literally say the word "Uff" to your parents.

This was disagreed with by the other people of then and now who use(d) it as an example of Dhahiris rejecting qiyas. Other Imams like Bukhari and Hanbal rejected qiyas too but overtime qiyas became mainstream in ahl as Sunnah-even Hanbali fiqh.


c74b09  No.21604

>>21603

Qiyas is allowed by them under really strict scenarios IIRC, if the reason is stated then it's permissable.


4f1359  No.21613

File: 168e36a8d96214e⋯.jpg (661.67 KB, 1024x1948, 256:487, ibnsaaba.jpg)

>>21604

I'll checkout that pdf you linked more later, inshaAllah.


9f0fcf  No.21618

File: 0cb387183ed7637⋯.jpg (125.56 KB, 571x700, 571:700, 86076362_large_5101.jpg)

I'm much more drawn to Tasawwuf than to the strictest interpretations. Muhammed (pbuh) would be horrified seeming the bestial brutality of some Wahhabis.


5d097e  No.21911

I don't know much about Wahhab but blaming him for the terrorism in the world today is like blaming Jesus for the Inquisitions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tU90AaKsGm8




[Return][Go to top][Catalog][Nerve Center][Cancer][Post a Reply]
Delete Post [ ]
[]
[ / / / / / / / / / / / / / ] [ dir / acme / animu / arepa / ausneets / sonyeon / tacos / vg / vore ]